Wavedashing- Stop complaining that it is gone.

[DeathNote]

I have noticed that many people complain that Wavedashing is gone and that the game has become a lot less competitive as a result. I think that complaining about the loss of wavedashing is equivalent to being horrendously stupid. Let's see why

First we shall look at the definition of wavedashing

Wavedashing is the most fundamental undocumented advanced technique in Super Smash Bros. Melee. It is a unforeseen programming "glitch" in the game that occurs when a character air dodges into the ground--they slide according to their friction attribute. This technique speeds a character up immensely, allowing them better movement and allowing better performance of techniques.


Now I would like you all to take a look at the 19th word. For those who don't wish to count, the word is "glitch"

Now let us take a look at the definition of the word glitch

n : a fault or defect in a system or machine [syn: bug]


Look at the words fault, and defect.

As you can see wavedashing was a fault in the systems engine.


See where I am getting with this? It was an unintentional fault with the game engine, A MISTAKE. Let's say Nintendo released a game without testing it. It would have many unwanted glitches and bugs. Nobody would like that game would they? Didn't think so. Gamers naturally want as few glitches in the game as possible. So why are people so upset that a glitch was taken out of a game?

Don't complain about something that was never meant to be in the game. It doesn't make sense to complain about it.

 

[J0K3R]

<3 topic poster xD

 

[Tyr_03]

It's not really a glitch so much as an exploit in the physics engine. And more importantly people complain about not having wavedashing because it offers another movement option in melee which allows for less predictable approaches/retreats and in general makes the game faster. Drives me crazy that it's so hard to change your momentum in Brawl. Either way nobody really cares if it was intended to be in the game. It was in the game and it's part of what makes melee such a great competitive game. I love Brawl but at the moment it is nowhere near as competitively viable as melee and I completely understand why some people have trouble swallowing some of the changes that were made.

 

[DeathNote]

Still why complain that they took it out. It was never meant to be there in the first place.

 

[theONEjanitor]

no one who takes competitive gaming seriously is still complaining about wavedashing.

and pleaaseee quit with the wavedashing is a glitch argument.

that myth got old 7 years ago. its not a glitch. its not unforseen. it was added into the game intentionally. the only thing unforseen was that people would actually use it so often as a technique.

 

[RBinator]

I thought complains about lack of wavedashing died before you dug up the grave to address something that might not needed to be addressed anymore.

With that said, I wonder, do you believe L-Canceling to be a glitch in Melee or intended?

 

[Darkslash]

Hmm are there any sources apart from Other players that Wavedash is not a glitch? any official Word from Sakurai or any other person or persons on the Dev team? L-canceling i know is official, but i never heard of WD being officially a real Advnctch

 

[Enoch-Fox]

most of which are just glitches anyway
most of which are just glitches anyway
most of which are just glitches anyway

hint: physics = not a glitch

 

[Junpappy]

Wavedashing- stop making threads about it

Seriously. It's gone. This isn't melee. Why even talk about it at all?

 

[mugwhump]

Very good point OP, I entirely agree.
I always hold the developer's intentions above all else when playing a game.
In fact, just yesterday I was playing Devil May Cry 2 and thought it was absolutely awful. But then I remembered the developers having said in an interview that they intended the game to be fun, and I immediately started enjoying it!
The developers really do always know best!

 

[FalconPunch]

No one is complaining about Wavedashing you ****ing ******. BTW it's not a glitch. When you airdodge and then come into contact with the ground, you are supposed to slide. It's part of it's physics. If you didn't slide it be a glitch. Saying they intentionally made airdodges non-directional to take out wavedashing because it is a glitch is like saying they made Up-B auto-teleport intentional because going past the ledge was a glitch.

 

[The 5th Horseman]

Seriously. It's gone. This isn't melee. Why even talk about it at all?

*Hands cookie* TY!

 

[Sasori's_Shadow]

Because wavedashing (and other advanced techs that were removed) added a whole lot of depth to the game and generally sped up gameplay. Plus, very few of these techniques if any at all were naturally advantageous alone, so they did no harm to anyone. For the techniques to be of any use at all you needed to learn and understand their use, then practice putting them to that use in a competitive match. The advanced techniques were just like any other technique, only harder to learn/use, thus the phase: "advanced technique." They did nothing but enhance gameplay, and that's why you'll hear complaints.

It could also be argued that wavedashing isn't a glitch either, though it's semantics really. The sliding animation that ensues after you air-dodge into the ground was almost certainly intended. That animation even had a programming name; it was dubbed "wave land special" by the designers.

But in reality, the complaints about wavedashing stopped a while ago. I don't know why you had to dig this up. You didn't even have a really valid argument against wavedashing anyway.

 

[Zankoku]

Wavedashing - stop thinking that people are still openly complaining about it.

 

[LemonManX]

Whilst I agree with what the topic creator is saying, I don't agree with making a thread about it. You realise by making a thread *****ing about people complaining about the loss of wavedashing is just as bad as them making threads to ***** about it being gone.

Jeez.

Besides, if there are any new advanced techs to be learnt in Brawl... we'll probably start discovering them soon.

 

[Lattice]

i agree with sasori. i feel that even if wave dashing was a glitch, that doesn't automatically justify it as an unfavorable aspect of the game, and it certainly made things faster, more intense, and gave players the potential to basically reach the peak of their mental and physical capacities to test their hand-eye coordination. this was part of what made melee so much fun.

nevertheless, i don't think anybody can justify brawl having wave dashing as clearly the game was not made to be as fast or as intense. it's a much easier game for people who don't have the twitchy reflexes required for competitive melee play, and the floaty physics and lightning-fast recovery times evidence that.

i don't know if many people here will know what i'm talking about with this reference, but what happened with brawl is not unlike what happened to team fortress classic when valve released TF2. they completely dumbed the game down, adding in more factors of luck while detracting from the game speed and advanced movement techniques which have effectively turned the game into something entirely different than the original.

i think really it boils down to the fact that ATs may be amazing for competitive and progressive gamers, but for the average kid who wants to sit down and think he's really good at the game because he can whack a final smash ball around and dominate his grade school friends, ATs are useless, and Nintendo's sales are not coming from people who wave dash.

to the OP -- you are right in saying that people should not complain about wave dashing being absent in brawl, but you are wrong in believing that wave dashing did not add a fundamentally essential aspect of competitive melee gameplay. without wave dashing, the game would not have been nearly as intense or technically demanding which was the driving force of its prolonged survival in the first place. what other games do you know of that a significantly large group of people still play after 7 years? i believe that ATs, such as wave dashing, are largely responsible for the game's survival, and the absence of them in brawl will likely cause the game to become boring far faster.

 

[RBinator]

Very good point OP, I entirely agree.
I always hold the developer's intentions above all else when playing a game.
In fact, just yesterday I was playing Devil May Cry 2 and thought it was absolutely awful. But then I remembered the developers having said in an interview that they intended the game to be fun, and I immediately started enjoying it!
The developers really do always know best!

I see what you did there.

I'm just waiting for new ways to "break the game" to be discovered and have a wave of scrubs rushing in everyday to talk about how said technique breaks the game, is a glitch, and more, just like how it was in Melee.

 

[JediSange]

lol... I would like to disclaimer that I hate wavedashing from a "professional" gaming stand point. It is NOT intentional (I say this because no one can provide documented proof otherwise). The TC is correct, but bringing it to life was a bad idea as this is a new game.

However, since it has been brought up I would like to say that every game will have glitches/exploits/ect. Whatever name you call them, they are in there. Brawl will have its own when it comes time.

To the people who were saying Wavedashing is all this and that and about depth and competition... You all don't play games competitively. IE: You are not gamers, you are smashers. There is nothing wrong with this, but it is a bit of a pretense to think that because "pro" melee has Wavedashing that it is something "pro-like". What I mean by this is simply that most games played on a professional level are there because of their balance (IE: no tiers?). Stop bashing the TC for saying that Wavedashing being taken out is a good thing. That is his opinion. If you disagree, say so and stop flaming. It IS a good thing that wavedashing and L-canceling got taken out. Not only for the online, but also just to balance the game they way they meant it to be (power vs speed).

Sorry for the wordy post O.o

 

[JediSange]

@lattice: Speed and intensity are not always directly related. Just because Brawl isn't as "fast" speed wise doesn't mean the reflexes aren't the same. You really can't say what Brawl is or isn't made for since you're not a dev. Also, your whole last paragraph is pretense. I can name several games that have people playing after that long. Let's use Counter Strike as an example. Also, you're putting wavedashing in a very high respect. Is that all you could do? Fast falling, L Canceling? Those weren't more fundamental and useful you think? Sure, wavedashing was important... but you couldn't kill the best players if you knew how to wavedash without knowing FFing or Lcanceling. /rant

@mugwhump: Why the sarcasm? People aren't saying that because the dev. intended it to be something means you should ENJOY that. You are intitled to your opinions of what the developers made, but in the same respect the developers have a right to make what they want. It's obvious that WDing wasn't an intentional addition... anyone who thinks otherwise is just rambling words they heard from others.

 

[The Kitchen Sink]

Honestly I don't see much merit in wavedashing in the first place. Granted, the versatility of moving quickly yet still having full access to all your ground moves is nice, but...it's not a big deal, really. Rolling works just fine. It's fast and you're invincible. You can spam that to get around if you hate dashing. Why need to be moving while attacking? Ah well. But yeah, this is Brawl. Shut up about wavedashing.

 

[Enoch-Fox]

spacing

10char

 

[Noypi_GjD]

Honestly I don't see much merit in wavedashing in the first place.
Granted, the versatility of moving quickly yet still having full access to all your ground moves is nice, but...it's not a big deal, really. You just explained why it was so important.

Rolling works just fine. Strongly Disagree

It's fast character dependent on speed, predictable,and you're invincible for a short time while having no quick option for an attack.

You can spam that to get around if you hate dashing.
Why need to be moving while attacking? Because my opponent is not just standing around?

Ah well. But yeah, this is Brawl. Shut up about wavedashing. Agreed

This topic should not have been made. Beating a dead cow kid.

 

[Junpappy]

What I mean by this is simply that most games played on a professional level are there because of their balance (IE: no tiers?).

What the ****? You think most games played on a professional level don't have tiers? I can sort of agree if you're talking about ALL video games (which would be stupid to compare to smash in the first place) but most FIGHTING games that are played competitively are NOT balanced.

 

[Rx-]

As you can see wavedashing was a fault in the systems engine.

This is only true for people who consider wavedashing a "glitch."

Pro players almost never complain about the loss of wavedashing; the only people complaining are scrubs who think they are 4w3s0m3.

 

[PurpleStuff]

Wow, this thread is so awesome. It's like this - All of the intelligent people who ever had anything to say about Wavedashing (for or against it) have already said their peace, and they've just stopped talking about it. Live and let shut the hell up, they've all discovered. But every once and a while a couple of people who obviously have no idea what they're talking about (and don't let me make you feel bad, because after all this is just a game, so who's the one that should feel bad? Me [who knows all this worthless crap], or You [who knows worthless crap about worthless crap]?) come about and make threads about it. It doesn't matter which side you choose, you're merely fodder for the fire if you create or even respond to one of these threads.

And I'm dancing on the flames.

 

[Mama]

Lol wow. I'm proud of the Smash Board community right now. (not sarcasm keep reading) It seems that people understand that posting in stupid ill informed threads like this is pointless. I'm actually glad the only people posting in this thread are scrubs. The better players wont waste their time like I will so don't take my post for granted.
I'm just going to say one thing. Spacing.

If you don't know what that is then you don't even deserve to be debating wave dashing. I could also post about it being a glitch but thats been argued to death and not even I will waste my time talking to a brick wall with its mind made up.

EDIT : PurpleStuff beat me to it >.> and read my mind <.< lol.

 

[mugwhump]

@mugwhump: Why the sarcasm? People aren't saying that because the dev. intended it to be something means you should ENJOY that.

But the OP's sole argument against wavedashing is that it was a glitch. Thus, including me, there are TWO people saying that because the dev. intended it to be something means you should ENJOY that. You're outnumbered, so surrender now!

 

[COMMOFDOOM]

skill is a glitch.

 

[WastingPenguins]

Deathnote: Lolz you haven't been around Smash Boards very long, have you. I gotta say though, you make quite a compelling argument..!

 

[Valken]

So the whole point is that it's pointless to complain because it was never meant to be there in the first place.

Understanable.

I agree.

Then you of all people should understand that it is pointless to complain about people complaining about something that shouldn't be there to begin with.

Defeats the purpose and makes you look worse than them.

It's gone, forget about it. It will never hurt you again. I promise.

::Holds out hand::

Come on, let's get some Ice Cream.

 

[COMMOFDOOM]

Deathnote: Lolz you haven't been around Smash Boards very long, have you. I gotta say though, you make quite a compelling argument..!

tbh i consider us new.

 

[Handorin]

You are all wrong. It (Wavelanding rather) is still in the game. It is just a lot harder and not as effective to use. Ive done it, but who cares? I didnt really benifit from it.

Let's look at the OP's definition.
"It is a unforeseen programming "glitch" in the game that occurs when a character air dodges into the ground--they slide according to their friction attribute."

Airdodging is still in the game. It is not directional though. So basically you have to traveling in a direction toward the ground (mainly from a fall).

 

[mikeHAZE]

i like the part where a bunch of randoms who joined this year and never played competitive Melee think they know what they're talking about.

 

[JediSange]

i like the part where a bunch of randoms who joined this year and never played competitive Melee think they know what they're talking about.

Wow, high horse? The date someone makes their SWF Account and their skill are directly related? I'd rather be a "random" and stay as such than be an arrogant a**hat. Just because someone made their account yesterday or a month ago has no merit on their skill. For all you know, it could be an old-school SWF guy that made a new name, or it could be someone who has just read the forums (since no reg. is required to read the AT post in Melee) and decided to become more active now that brawl is out.

Stop undermining people just because they didn't nerdgasm years ago and post 3k+ times. GG.

 

[pika-power]

I have noticed that many people complain that Wavedashing is gone and that the game has become a lot less competitive as a result. I think that complaining about the loss of wavedashing is equivalent to being horrendously stupid. Let's see why

First we shall look at the definition of wavedashing

Wavedashing is the most fundamental undocumented advanced technique in Super Smash Bros. Melee. It is a unforeseen programming "glitch" in the game that occurs when a character air dodges into the ground--they slide according to their friction attribute. This technique speeds a character up immensely, allowing them better movement and allowing better performance of techniques.


Now I would like you all to take a look at the 19th word. For those who don't wish to count, the word is "glitch"

Now let us take a look at the definition of the word glitch

n : a fault or defect in a system or machine [syn: bug]


Look at the words fault, and defect.

As you can see wavedashing was a fault in the systems engine.


See where I am getting with this? It was an unintentional fault with the game engine, A MISTAKE. Let's say Nintendo released a game without testing it. It would have many unwanted glitches and bugs. Nobody would like that game would they? Didn't think so. Gamers naturally want as few glitches in the game as possible. So why are people so upset that a glitch was taken out of a game?

Don't complain about something that was never meant to be in the game. It doesn't make sense to complain about it.

Great post. One small thing.

No one does complain about wavedashing in paticular. Where is one thread that has been posted on in the last day, that contains someoone purely complaining about the lack of wavedashing. I have only seen things complained about in general.

 

[mikeHAZE]

Wow, high horse? The date someone makes their SWF Account and their skill are directly related? I'd rather be a "random" and stay as such than be an arrogant a**hat. Just because someone made their account yesterday or a month ago has no merit on their skill. For all you know, it could be an old-school SWF guy that made a new name, or it could be someone who has just read the forums (since no reg. is required to read the AT post in Melee) and decided to become more active now that brawl is out.

Stop undermining people just because they didn't nerdgasm years ago and post 3k+ times. GG.

did you play competitive melee? were you good?

and yes i know it's kind of dumb for a person to think that date > skill, but for the most part the people who say that they're glad it's out don't understand the importance had in Melee. The majority of the people in this thread/ OP have no idea what they're talking about or were just terrible at melee so they decided that since they get ***** by advanced moves that iit's good that their out.

 

[RBinator]

Stop bashing the TC for saying that Wavedashing being taken out is a good thing. That is his opinion. If you disagree, say so and stop flaming. It IS a good thing that wavedashing and L-canceling got taken out. Not only for the online, but also just to balance the game they way they meant it to be (power vs speed).

Actually, I believe the two main reasons why this topic is getting heated the way it is because, one, a dead horse was brought back to life, and two, the TC calls wavedashing a glitch as a fact without anything to back it up. Heck, your sentence saying that it IS a good thing that wavedashing and L-Canceling was removed sounds like a fact, not opinion. Just because something is a glitch doesn't automatic mean it's a bad thing. New advanced techniques will be discovered in Brawl and soon all the scrubs will complain about how it's a glitch and ruins the game.

Nowadays, some people are talking about Brawl in general isl currently not as advanced as Melee, not about how one or two techniques are missing. The meta game hasn't have time to take off yet to know how Brawl will really stand compare to Melee.

 

[Demon_machinE]

Hey, OP, you're a fool. People don't like DETRIMENTAL glitches in games. Like the IC freeze glitch, for example.

Glitches that improve the game are awesome. And wavedashing did just that.

So shut the **** up.

 

[Taymond]

The landing frames were added to address the problem of how the game engine should cope with a player airdodging into the ground. If these special frames weren't created, then airdodging into the ground would be pretty similar to airdodging into a wall, you'd just kinda slide along there, still in your airdodge animation, and then have a presumably awkward landing afterwards. So the developers added special frames to cope with this. You can't really accidentally create new frames to deal with a problem.

That said, nobody's really whining anymore. I see plenty of "shut up about wavedashing" threads these days, but you know what I never see? "where the **** is wavedashing?" threads. Now I know this is a bit of an overstatement, there are threads that still appear about wavedashing's removal, but most of them are just lame jokes upon closer inspection, at this point, and there are more anti- threads than those. The bulk of the community was annoyed, because its removal took further depth out of a new installment already seriously lacking. It hurts to see Brawl simplified so much when we think about what it could've been. But we got over it, we let it go. Time for you to do the same.

 

[meatpopsicle]

original post= fail.

nuff said.