Video Game Mafia 2 - End of Line

[giraffelasergun]

I got sick yesterday but I feel mostly better now.

The reason was that it was really funny to get people to kill Tom for no reason.

Vote: Raxxel.

Would go UP or Maven if it comes down to it, but I think raxxel is the most likely scummer right now.

 

[Xivii]

Hi, I'll catch up later tonight/morning.

Well that sucks

Unvote: Tom

Nice to see you too!

 

[Pythag]

I got sick yesterday but I feel mostly better now.

Vote: Raxxel.

Would go UP or Maven if it comes down to it, but I think raxxel is the most likely scummer right now.

What an incredibly safe statement.

UP and Raxxel are lynch bait.

KEvin and GLG...my eye's on you. Though I think GLG is scummier currently.

vote GLG

 

[Z25]

Hi, I'll catch up later tonight/morning.

Nice to see you too!

Welcome to the game!


For the vote today I’d be fine with rax, but maven is honestly someone I’d lynch too. If he’s gonna **** around like that and not care about potentially lynching a town slot for no reason, then I’d rather him not be in the game if he’s gonna act like that.

If we actually do have to vote soon for once like TK just implied, then I guess I’ll put a vote down for now in case I’m not here before deadline.

Vote: Rax

 

[Z25]

What an incredibly safe statement.

UP and Raxxel are lynch bait.

KEvin and GLG...my eye's on you. Though I think GLG is scummier currently.

vote GLG

Interesting, you think Kevin and GLG could be scum?One of them setting the lynch up?

Do you think they would both be scumates or just one of them is?

Personally so far I haven’t had much issue with Kevin’s content. Some of the points made against rax seem reasonable imo.

I don’t like that they were scum reading Tom despite no activity, but they are new. However they have played pretty well previously all things considered so I don’t want to fully put faith in them being fully town yet with no good reason.

Granted thanks to mavens BS there wasn’t to much to follow to get good reads from.

Actually what do you think of mavens actions? Would you consider him worth lynching if he’s sabotaging town like this?

 

[Pythag]

Interesting, you think Kevin and GLG could be scum?One of them setting the lynch up?

Do you think they would both be scumates or just one of them is?

Probably just one.

Personally so far I haven’t had much issue with Kevin’s content. Some of the points made against rax seem reasonable imo.

The same Rax that got super tripped up on his words and was scum read the entire last game who turned out to be town?
Or UP who seems to both overthink and overshare.

I don’t like that they were scum reading Tom despite no activity, but they are new. However they have played pretty well previously all things considered so I don’t want to fully put faith in them being fully town yet with no good reason.

I get the mistake made by being too liberal with the word 'scummy' I don't hold that against them. I was voting Tom and I didn't necessarily find Tom scummy, I'm just not about to get nailed by lurkers. You made a good point about Tom not lurking, because he's not posting anywhere on the site. I liked that, and now that he's replaced, I have no reason to go for him.

Granted thanks to mavens BS there wasn’t to much to follow to get good reads from.

Aside from how everyone reacted to Maven, Tom and the subsequent voting?
IT generated discussion, and honestly, a still think a Tom lynch would've told us some stuff.

Actually what do you think of mavens actions? Would you consider him worth lynching if he’s sabotaging town like this?

[/quote]

It's pretty funny. Maven even kidna considers himself worth lynching over it. With how everyone was acting, if tom flipped towm, it would've been the funniest D2 lynch in the world as everyone would've come at him and he would've just said 'i thought it was funny' (and he would be right). I tip my hat to the man.

 

[Raxxel]

**** this.

Vote Maven

What an annoying waste of time.

Anyway, welcome Xivii!

 

[Z25]

Probably just one.



The same Rax that got super tripped up on his words and was scum read the entire last game who turned out to be town?
Or UP who seems to both overthink and overshare.



I get the mistake made by being too liberal with the word 'scummy' I don't hold that against them. I was voting Tom and I didn't necessarily find Tom scummy, I'm just not about to get nailed by lurkers. You made a good point about Tom not lurking, because he's not posting anywhere on the site. I liked that, and now that he's replaced, I have no reason to go for him.



Aside from how everyone reacted to Maven, Tom and the subsequent voting?
IT generated discussion, and honestly, a still think a Tom lynch would've told us some stuff.

[/QUOTE]
These are some fair pints. I do agree heavily on the Utopian part. Like I said earlier I haven’t seen anything bad from them. Outside of mixing terms up earlier, but that can be an easy mistake as well.

As for maven there were reactions, but I didn’t really notice anything that really helped from them. It did give us some activity though which is better then not. I’m going to re read stuff and see how I feel about the vote in the morning again. Right now I don’t really fully hate or like Kevin’s slot but it’s not bad. I haven’t done much of a look at glg though. It’s getting late here though so I’ll unvote. I’ll look at glg again and see where to go. From what I saw I don’t thing there’s anything now to truly point to one person as a better lynch then another but I’m going to re read

unvote

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Vote Count 1.10:
xivii - ? (Red Ryu)
Utopian - ? (Thirdkoopa, Dooplissity)
Kevin - ? (?)
Giraffelasergun - ? (Pythag, ?)
Maven - ? (Raxxel)
Thirdkoopa - ? (Kevin)
Raxxel - ? (giraffelasergun)
Undecided - ? (Z25, xivii, Maven, Utopian)

With ? alive it takes ? to lynch. Deadline is in ? hours.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Aw... What a pity. Everyone's votes are everywhere.

I'll move mine with you all for whoever you want to lynch. Unless it's me. Def not lynching me.

 

[Dooplissity]

Fun vote count.

I don't have time to fully reevaluate but I'm ok with anyone on the Tom train earlier.

 

[Dooplissity]

Theo, vote for UP.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Theo, vote for UP.

I already am.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

You all may submit your night actions during the day.

 

[KevinM]

Ha.

Also I ****ing told you all.

It’s almost like my first post was Maven always plays this way and I wasn’t going to lynch Tom

 

[KevinM]

Can we just lynch Raxxel? if we aren’t voting off the mod which is the correct action I would rather go Raxxel first

Sounds good?

vote Raxxel

 

[KevinM]

100% willing to go back to TK if people are into that

 

[Raxxel]

Can we please agree Maven is an easy first lynch? You look at what he's posted so far and tell me that isn't damn near Brindor tier content.

What an incredibly safe statement.

UP and Raxxel are lynch bait.

KEvin and GLG...my eye's on you. Though I think GLG is scummier currently.

vote GLG

If I may, what reasons do you have for wanting to lynch GLG currently? Also, is your rationale towards Kev scum similar to mine or do you have separate reasons to believe Kev is sus?

 

[Raxxel]

100% willing to go back to TK if people are into that

Why do you want to kill TK? We kill the mod it's damn near likely we lose information or possibly end the game entirely. If the game ends with scum alive I'm pretty sure that's a win for them too. Why is this such a popular choice?

 

[Maven89]

Why do you want to kill TK? We kill the mod it's damn near likely we lose information or possibly end the game entirely. If the game ends with scum alive I'm pretty sure that's a win for them too. Why is this such a popular choice?

Can we please agree Maven is an easy first lynch?

 

[Maven89]

Aside from how everyone reacted to Maven, Tom and the subsequent voting?
IT generated discussion, and honestly, a still think a Tom lynch would've told us some stuff.

With how everyone was acting, if tom flipped towm, it would've been the funniest D2 lynch in the world as everyone would've come at him and he would've just said 'i thought it was funny' (and he would be right).

This guy gets it

 

[Maven89]

We should lynch a player day 1 instead of mod. Player will give us information

 

[Pythag]

Can we please agree Maven is an easy first lynch? You look at what he's posted so far and tell me that isn't damn near Brindor tier content.

How do you mean easy?
scummy?
Easy to pick?
Easy because multiple people were upset with him already, so you just want people to hop on?


it’s not Brindor tier at all.
1. Maven has played before
2. He was more active
3. It’s funnier.
4. It actually generated something rather than ire.

If I may, what reasons do you have for wanting to lynch GLG currently? Also, is your rationale towards Kev scum similar to mine or do you have separate reasons to believe Kev is sus?

Kev is scummy to me because he’s pushing UP and you early.

GLG said something that kinda pinged me earlier, and his position on the Raxxel wagon looks bad to me. It’s almost like GLG knows that everyone is ok with these lynches because Kevin has given them his blessing, so no ones going to find it scummy, and he doesn’t have to give much reasoning for why he’s on it.

either kev is scummy for starting this, and glg is just a hapless voter, or Kevin is behaving normally, and glg is trying to get in on the idea that people might be just trusting Kevin and his lynch pool.

i would doubt that both of them are scum.
I think glg is scummier, so I’m voting for him.

 

[Dooplissity]

Why do you want to kill TK? We kill the mod it's damn near likely we lose information or possibly end the game entirely. If the game ends with scum alive I'm pretty sure that's a win for them too. Why is this such a popular choice?

vote raxxel

This suggests you're either not paying attention or have a scum role pm. I'm ok with losing either, but my money is on #2.

 

[Dooplissity]

Would love to hear more thoughts on GLG though, I had him at pretty hard town so I'm surprised to see him on scumlists.

 

[Raxxel]

How do you mean easy?
scummy?
Easy to pick?
Easy because multiple people were upset with him already, so you just want people to hop on?


it’s not Brindor tier at all.
1. Maven has played before
2. He was more active
3. It’s funnier.
4. It actually generated something rather than ire.


Kev is scummy to me because he’s pushing UP and you early.

GLG said something that kinda pinged me earlier, and his position on the Raxxel wagon looks bad to me. It’s almost like GLG knows that everyone is ok with these lynches because Kevin has given them his blessing, so no ones going to find it scummy, and he doesn’t have to give much reasoning for why he’s on it.

either kev is scummy for starting this, and glg is just a hapless voter, or Kevin is behaving normally, and glg is trying to get in on the idea that people might be just trusting Kevin and his lynch pool.

i would doubt that both of them are scum.
I think glg is scummier, so I’m voting for him.

Interesting rationale. I don't quite agree however with it being early to push for anyone, I think it's been almost a week of this now and the impressions are setting in.

Also, I guess that's fair enough with the Maven reasoning, he certainly has gained my ire but maybe I'm being cranky. He generated discussion for sure. My biggest problem is his lack of his own content to judge, since most of it was playing up to one big joke. But you're right, not quite Brindor tier despite the trolling.

vote raxxel

This suggests you're either not paying attention or have a scum role pm. I'm ok with losing either, but my money is on #2.

Not paying attention TBH, as I mentioned before, I feel the setup will unravel as time moves forward, so I've been focused on scumhunting rather than solving it, so I may have glazed over some discussion of a TK lynch then. Tell me what I missed that gives us some suggestion of the outcome of a TK lynch. I'm suggesting possibilities and risks here.

 

[Z25]

I posted this earlier in the the read but with the maven stuff going on I think it got overlooked.

I mentioned about a quarter of the way through the day that I thought maven May have received a similar pm that told him he had to vote Tom.

This is obviously not true.

While all that was happening, TK gave me full clarification on the pm i recieve(which I posted earlier but I’ll post again) that another player not him as the mod like I thought sent me a pm with the simple message

“You must Lynch Utopian Poyzin Today”

I thought it was some weird gimmick but after hearing from our mod that someone sent this,

Pythag s points of the lynch for UP being setup are very interesting and might actually hold truth to them

 

[Pythag]

Wait,
You got a pm from the mod (Not TK)

that told you 'you must lynch UP today?'

 

[Z25]

Wait,
You got a pm from the mod (Not TK)

that told you 'you must lynch UP today?'

Yes, it was sent by TK, but when I posted about this in the thread earlier, The actual non game TK came and clarified the pm wasn’t from their in game forms, but another player

 

[giraffelasergun]

GLG said something that kinda pinged me earlier, and his position on the Raxxel wagon looks bad to me. It’s almost like GLG knows that everyone is ok with these lynches because Kevin has given them his blessing, so no ones going to find it scummy, and he doesn’t have to give much reasoning for why he’s on it.

either kev is scummy for starting this, and glg is just a hapless voter, or Kevin is behaving normally, and glg is trying to get in on the idea that people might be just trusting Kevin and his lynch pool.

i would doubt that both of them are scum.
I think glg is scummier, so I’m voting for him.

I stated reasoning for why I was down for a raxxel lynch a couple of days ago:

They theoretically put tom at 5 votes earlier today when no one really seemed ready for the phase to end, their vote on you(being doop) was also weird because you were at the time the claimed Cop Quadruple voter and they voted for you based off of half of the claim. I would much rather do an inactive but I also just wanted to have some read out there, too much of the discussion today has been about the setup.

Vote: KevinM

I think you are chalking up Raxxel's scummy behaviors as being a new player, and while that may be the case, I don't think you can totally write off a player's actions because they are new.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Xivii sup it’s been a while. Take your time and give me some reads.

Vote: Raxxel

slot needs to go.

 

[Z25]

Logically speaking, since someone sent me the pm I mentioned, I really doubt that same person would have gone out here to push Utopian themselves.

At least it seems unlikely. Which in that case it would be worth looking at things with this in mind to see who might be a messenger.

In voting today though, I want to put down a vote in someone I think may have actually sent that message:

Vote: maven


He’s experienced enough to know it be easier to get someone to push a lynch on a newer player and he was already out here trying to push people for lols. Which I don’t find funny just dumb.

However knowing that maven can actually play this game well when he wants to, trying to set up another lynch feels possible to me seeing how he has played before. So I’m sticking with that for now.

Although I’m still like 80 percent sure the phase is never going to end unless we do something specific because this is like 4 days now and that’s seems way to wrong. Plus TK accepted night actions which makes me think there’s something important there.

I don’t know though it’s pretty hard to take any good guess at this point

 

[UtopianPoyzin]

“You must Lynch Utopian Poyzin Today”

I know that you stated this earlier, but wasn’t it against the rules to quote stuff from PMs?


Regardless, what do you think that message shows about the person who sent it? Is it sent by town to lynch me given that I’m scum, or is it sent by an anti-town role to mislynch me toDay?

 

[UtopianPoyzin]

Logically speaking, since someone sent me the pm I mentioned, I really doubt that same person would have gone out here to push Utopian themselves.

At least it seems unlikely. Which in that case it would be worth looking at things with this in mind to see who might be a messenger.

In voting today though, I want to put down a vote in someone I think may have actually sent that message:

Vote: maven


He’s experienced enough to know it be easier to get someone to push a lynch on a newer player and he was already out here trying to push people for lols. Which I don’t find funny just dumb.

However knowing that maven can actually play this game well when he wants to, trying to set up another lynch feels possible to me seeing how he has played before. So I’m sticking with that for now.

Although I’m still like 80 percent sure the phase is never going to end unless we do something specific because this is like 4 days now and that’s seems way to wrong. Plus TK accepted night actions which makes me think there’s something important there.

I don’t know though it’s pretty hard to take any good guess at this point

Never mind I completely missed this message and I’m not even sure how that’s possible. I catching up scrolling down, and I was concerned when I saw the use of quotations for mod info.

 

[Z25]

I know that you stated this earlier, but wasn’t it against the rules to quote stuff from PMs?


Regardless, what do you think that message shows about the person who sent it? Is it sent by town to lynch me given that I’m scum, or is it sent by an anti-town role to mislynch me toDay?

I was allowed to give out the information about the pm, I always check for clarifications.

As for who sent this. I really can’t see it be a town role. It was sent right as the phase started.

What townie in their right mind would deliver a message like that with no content for reads? I thought little of it at first because TK delivered it to me, so I thought that was them writing this and there was a reason for me to do this because the host bought it up.

When TK said it wasn’t them that wrote I think, it got me thinking on motivations and who could have wrote it.

I’d say it’s definitely from an anti town role. It would have made some sense to come from the mod giving the crazy setup but with it being given by someone else, it would make no sense for a townie to do this.

It’s definitely someone trying to push your mislynch, which is why I haven’t had any problems with your content really. I don’t see you being scum or any scum mates sending this like that. It be a bold move if town went for you day one and killed you because of a teammate or your request.

It’s to risky a play for scum to do. Maybe an indie but I can’t say I’ve ever heard of a third party messenger. Usually scum will have one.

If it’s a townie messenger the messenger will usually use this role to broadcast info they learn or to prove their role easily to the town, not to force a lynch. Messenger type roles also normally get announced in a thread. I don’t know if there’s a name for someone whose role let’s them send them through Pms only, so I’ve just been using messenger as an easy term. As I haven’t seen anyone be able to do it through pms in any game I played.

That aside, as I said this role is very likely anti town imo. I’d be willing to wager scum more likely has this role then say an indie. But I don’t have enough info to truly know right now. These actions taken by whoever it is should be something we consider going forth in the game though.

 

[Xivii]

Vote: Nabe

There's no discernible pattern regarding the '?' so it's likely the double vote ability of a player. I doubt it's the case, but there's also some possibility it's an invisible player. Nabe, Strongbad, and Werekill all expressed interest in the game but didn't officially join. I want to test if one of them can appear in the vote count.

As for who to lynch today, I'd like for either Theo or Ruy. We have to lynch Theo at some point and I'd rather it be when we have some leeway than during crunch time. The longer he is in the game, the more problematic he becomes because each active individual has more influence over the game as it goes on. There are two reasons for this: First, role actions are more efficacious as player count decreases, mainly because targetability becomes more precise. The most salient example is kills (vig, nk). As the game goes on, the killer is able to more precisely hit someone that would be beneficial to them. Additionally the fewer players there are, the more influence a kill has over a game. It's dangerous to keep Theo around until later in the game because not only may he have is own abilities, but we will have to choose between lynching him and another player, guaranteeing that at least one scum player (Theo or other) survives to use an action. Secondly, individual voting power also increases as player count decreases. Since Theo's votes aren't necessarily town-aligned, it's risky to have him alive late game.

One last thing to say about Theo, I suspect from his "betting" comment that he is a marker or gambler who wins if he either guesses correctly who is alive at the end of the game or predicts a certain number of lynches correctly. From my experience with markers, if they win, their victory supersedes all other factions.

Regarding Ryu, I think that his reasoning for scumreading Z25 is poor. Z25's explanation was satisfying but Ruy is still pushing it. I'm also suspicious of the fact that Ryu has no interest in Theo. In past games, Ryu has been gung-ho about lynching indies as soon as possible. Theo flat out claimed 3P and Ruy hasn't reacted to it.

 

[Raxxel]

Vote: Nabe

There's no discernible pattern regarding the '?' so it's likely the double vote ability of a player. I doubt it's the case, but there's also some possibility it's an invisible player. Nabe, Strongbad, and Werekill all expressed interest in the game but didn't officially join. I want to test if one of them can appear in the vote count.

As for who to lynch today, I'd like for either Theo or Ruy. We have to lynch Theo at some point and I'd rather it be when we have some leeway than during crunch time. The longer he is in the game, the more problematic he becomes because each active individual has more influence over the game as it goes on. There are two reasons for this: First, role actions are more efficacious as player count decreases, mainly because targetability becomes more precise. The most salient example is kills (vig, nk). As the game goes on, the killer is able to more precisely hit someone that would be beneficial to them. Additionally the fewer players there are, the more influence a kill has over a game. It's dangerous to keep Theo around until later in the game because not only may he have is own abilities, but we will have to choose between lynching him and another player, guaranteeing that at least one scum player (Theo or other) survives to use an action. Secondly, individual voting power also increases as player count decreases. Since Theo's votes aren't necessarily town-aligned, it's risky to have him alive late game.

One last thing to say about Theo, I suspect from his "betting" comment that he is a marker or gambler who wins if he either guesses correctly who is alive at the end of the game or predicts a certain number of lynches correctly. From my experience with markers, if they win, their victory supersedes all other factions.

Regarding Ryu, I think that his reasoning for scumreading Z25 is poor. Z25's explanation was satisfying but Ruy is still pushing it. I'm also suspicious of the fact that Ryu has no interest in Theo. In past games, Ryu has been gung-ho about lynching indies as soon as possible. Theo flat out claimed 3P and Ruy hasn't reacted to it.

The only issue I have with this is that I feel killing Theo day 1 is so neutral that there is no way to get much of a read off the voters.

However, after some consideration I do feel I exaggerated the possible consequences of it. We do need to kill Theo, and unless TK deliberately set him up as a trap to kill us all, it's not likely the game will end if we lynch TK. We also can't be losing any more information than we already have, we have just about nothing. Still on the fence of course for my aforementioned reason but Xivii's explanation makes sense. I do apologise for being careless by the way and not reading everything properly. My reckless nature was what caused a loss back in Jungle Republic, so I need to be better about jumping out windows. If we really agree on lynching Theo/TK then I would consider hopping on the wagon despite my aforementioned reason, risking a possible town lynch when we have a safer one right in front us may be too much in a small game like this.

A few other thoughts, I never addressed this but Pythag I don't believe in GLG being scummy. I think he's just an aggressive townie, similar to me.

Ryu definitely reads a bit scummy, I agree with Xivii. His attempt to label a "scumslip" off Z comes off dishonest. Not voting him yet though.

I've calmed down about Maven. His content annoyed me, but I think Pythag was right that it brought much needed discourse.

Kev is probably less scummy than I've probably made him out to be tbh. My main reason was his odd defense of Tom, but I think it's appropriate now in response to what Maven was doing. I don't believe early scum reads make someone scummy either as I said earlier. He still has done a few odd things like the accusation of a contradiction that wasn't present, but my scum read on him has softened.

So with that said,

Unvote

Going to see what comes next and act from there. If the TK wagon starts again I'll more than likely hop on that. I want to hold off from voting for any other player for now, even Ryu because I don't believe I have enough to be fully confident in lynching him. Next vote I make I'm committing to however, which is why I will be patient.

 

[Pythag]

Ryu definitely reads a bit scummy, I agree with Xivii. His attempt to label a "scumslip" off Z comes off dishonest. Not voting him yet though.
.

Interesting. I'm gonna mull that one over

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Regarding Ryu, I think that his reasoning for scumreading Z25 is poor. Z25's explanation was satisfying but Ruy is still pushing it. I'm also suspicious of the fact that Ryu has no interest in Theo. In past games, Ryu has been gung-ho about lynching indies as soon as possible. Theo flat out claimed 3P and Ruy hasn't reacted to it.

Did he flat out claim indie?

 

[UtopianPoyzin]

I know most of you aren't used to the mod playing... that's correct that we operate as two different entities.

I can't be any other alignment other than Third-Party (or a betting win-condition) since if I was directly Town or Scum that would break the game.

Vote count coming.