[Updated 06/09/16] 19XXTE 0.11, ROM Hack (Working on Console!)

[Morin0]

I'm pretty sure it's possible to do by editing the ROM data base file (.rdb) file. How exactly? I'm not sure entirely sure. I'll look into it.

Notepad.exe

I think it's a matter of opening it up and adding an entry to it. Not using PJ64KVE might help too.

 

[Cyjorg]

Notepad.exe

I got that much. The problem is making sure that it stays up to date. Every time I make a change to the rom, the checksums and name changes meaning the .rdb will have to be updated again. I also know that KnitePhox was having difficulties making it work even though he's done it before.

 

[Morin0]

I don't know much of the technical aspect of things, but is this patched in the same way Madao patched the ROM to make the Quickmatch SSB ROM? If it's not, then @ Madao might be able to give some insight.

 

[uCooL]

Is it possible to make a wii WAD version of this?!

 

[KnitePhox]

yeah there is, once you patch the rom, inject it into a Sin and Punishment .wad file using this tutorial

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dESgwPlPaTg

you gotta get the sin and punishment wad on ur own though

 

[Armanderp]

This is amazing dude! Also, some of the icon stages are a bit buggy. Like, I select the Battlefield stage but it brings me to Corneria. As I was trying out all the stages I found out the one that selects Battlefield is when I click the Saffron City stage.

 

[Cyjorg]

This is amazing dude! Also, some of the icon stages are a bit buggy. Like, I select the Battlefield stage but it brings me to Corneria. As I was trying out all the stages I found out the one that selects Battlefield is when I click the Saffron City stage.

This has been fixed already. Download the 0.5.2 Code Set (19XXTE.txt), drag the file into the 19XXTE Patcher folder, and follow the instructions again.

 

[divekicked]

Another suggestion if you don't mind,

This is amazing dude! Also, some of the icon stages are a bit buggy. Like, I select the Battlefield stage but it brings me to Corneria. As I was trying out all the stages I found out the one that selects Battlefield is when I click the Saffron City stage.

Are you trying that in training? because that's already known and being looked into. It should work fine in vs mode though, if patched correctly.

Edit: nvm, it's already been answered

 

[Madao]

I don't know much of the technical aspect of things, but is this patched in the same way Madao patched the ROM to make the Quickmatch SSB ROM? If it's not, then @ Madao might be able to give some insight.

If using PJ64k, you have to edit the RDB. Unless there's going to be constant updates, it's probably better to just manually edit the RDB, rather than write a program that edits the RDB.

 

[kevs]

just installed this on a sin and punishment wad and it works great. awesome work!

 

[Cyjorg]

just installed this on a sin and punishment wad and it works great. awesome work!

Is there a reason that the Sin and Punishment wad is better?

 

[AthensHorseParty]

Yeah, don't play battlefield.

Is this really true guys? I've been trying to get it to happen all day, like playing against cpus with fireflowers and trying my hardest to DI into the stage but I can't get it to work. I never noticed it happening playing against polygon team in my speedrun either. Anybody got video footage of it?



AND WHILE WE"RE TALKING ABOUT DREAM HACKS...
Has anybody ever explored hacking the CPU's AI to make it less ****ty? Not in any major way but just simple stuff like not missing really easy tech's, DIing when they're not at the edge of the stage, acting out of hit stun at the soonest possible frames etc etc... maybe even making it so the computer attacks you offstage instead of running away and letting you recover for free. Some of us don't have any friends and can't play netplay right now.

 

[tehz]

I finished the easy half of the use polygons/metal mario/giant DK code today. Instead of crashing at the results screen, your character is reverted to the non-crashing version:

Now, for the hard half: letting you switch your character to the polygon, metal, or giant variant. Did anyone else know that R and L moved you right and left on the stage select screen? Why does anyone need 4 different ways to input left or right? Thanks sakurai.

 

[Morin0]

Has there been any past progress on editing the CSS?

 

[Cyjorg]

1. Fix alternate stage loading for the training stages.
2. Fix Random function. It currently loads the original stages instead of the alternate stages.
3. Change position/zoom of the stage previews on the SSS.
4. Make a hype video that doesn't suck.
5. Add a feature for editing .rdb file.
6. Make a tutorial on how to play this on your Wii.
7. Figure out texture hacking...I refuse to believe it's not possible.
8. Look into the Widescreen Gameshark code.
9. Fix Battlefield?

Getting work done. Expect an update in the near future!

Also, can anyone explain the Battlefield glitch? I don't even know what I'm trying to fix.

 

[divekicked]

Also, can anyone explain the Battlefield glitch? I don't even know what I'm trying to fix.

I found this

battlefield's ledges are evil

if you try to DI towards the ledge, you go straight down rather than horizontal

If someone who knows more could chime in that would be good though, i have 0 experience with 64 battlefield

 

[KnitePhox]

good job, ****ing hacker.

...rdb file???

 

[Cyjorg]

good job, ****ing hacker.

...rdb file???

Working on that right now

 

[Kufy]

This looks awesome man, I've wanted to work on a mod like this for a long time, so I have a few ideas if you know how to implement them.

1. Remove the tornado from Hyrule
2. Stop the door from ever opening on Saffron

 

[AthensHorseParty]

There's actually nothing wrong with battlefield. It's not a "glitch" it's just that the way the ledge is designed if you DI into it you bounce off at a 45 degree downward angle due to the way the ledge is actually shaped. It slants out like that. If anything, Dream Land is the glitchy one because you tech into the side of the stage and get bounced upward and across the stage in a way that makes no sense.

It's all just arbitrary though. It's like complaining about Peach's Castle not having any ledges. Obviously it does make some characters recoveries worse but then so do a lot of stages.

 

[divekicked]

There's actually nothing wrong with battlefield. It's not a "glitch" it's just that the way the ledge is designed if you DI into it you bounce off at a 45 degree downward angle due to the way the ledge is actually shaped. It slants out like that. If anything, Dream Land is the glitchy one because you tech into the side of the stage and get bounced upward and across the stage in a way that makes no sense.

It's all just arbitrary though. It's like complaining about Peach's Castle not having any ledges. Obviously it does make some characters recoveries worse but then so do a lot of stages.

This makes sense, why do some people talk about it like it's a bannable offense then? It just seems like jank, but every stage has jank lol

 

[Cyjorg]

There's actually nothing wrong with battlefield. It's not a "glitch" it's just that the way the ledge is designed if you DI into it you bounce off at a 45 degree downward angle due to the way the ledge is actually shaped. It slants out like that. If anything, Dream Land is the glitchy one because you tech into the side of the stage and get bounced upward and across the stage in a way that makes no sense.

It's all just arbitrary though. It's like complaining about Peach's Castle not having any ledges. Obviously it does make some characters recoveries worse but then so do a lot of stages.

So like Melee ledges. Dumb but still playable for sure

 

[Morin0]

This looks awesome man, I've wanted to work on a mod like this for a long time, so I have a few ideas if you know how to implement them.

1. Remove the tornado from Hyrule
2. Stop the door from ever opening on Saffron

Those GS codes are already available.

There's actually nothing wrong with battlefield. It's not a "glitch" it's just that the way the ledge is designed if you DI into it you bounce off at a 45 degree downward angle due to the way the ledge is actually shaped. It slants out like that. If anything, Dream Land is the glitchy one because you tech into the side of the stage and get bounced upward and across the stage in a way that makes no sense.

It's all just arbitrary though. It's like complaining about Peach's Castle not having any ledges. Obviously it does make some characters recoveries worse but then so do a lot of stages.

Sorry, but this alone warrants not playing on Battlefield. Edgeguarding is such a big part of this game that if you are attempting to DI onto the stage to increase your chances of survivability and there is a high chance of you going straight down, thus nullifying this tech, that's not good. If Dream Land sent you downwards too, that wouldn't be good either. I think FD is like this too.

Jorgasms, if you were to "fix" Battlefield, it'd be editing the stage itself. I don't know if you know how to make those changes.

 

[AthensHorseParty]

Those GS codes are already available.



Sorry, but this alone warrants not playing on Battlefield. Edgeguarding is such a big part of this game that if you are attempting to DI onto the stage to increase your chances of survivability and there is a high chance of you going straight down, thus nullifying this tech, that's not good. If Dream Land sent you downwards too, that wouldn't be good either. I think FD is like this too.

Jorgasms, if you were to "fix" Battlefield, it'd be editing the stage itself. I don't know if you know how to make those changes.

Grabbing the edge is also a huge part of most of the cast's recovery but you can't do it at all on Peach's. I understand that a lot of people prefer the Dream Land only ruleset for this reason but again I think it's just arbitrary. Every stage has different properties that encourage different play styles. If you think that Dream Land is the best stage and that people should just only play on Dream Land then that's an argument but it's not an independent reason to ban a stage just because it has different properties when you DI into the edge.

I think the idea of stage strikes, bans in bo3 sets and DSR kind of negates these issues anyway. It affects the whole cast evenly except for maybe yoshi and pikachu who already has a godlike recovery anyway on every single stage. Are people really going to start playing Pikachu that much more just so they can get one win per set on BF in the hopes that the janky ledge DI is going to make their edge guarding slightly more effective?

 

[Morin0]

Grabbing the edge is also a huge part of most of the cast's recovery but you can't do it at all on Peach's.

This is not helping your argument lol. It's precisely why everyone's recovery gets worse except Pikachu and I guess Kirby.

If you think that Dream Land is the best stage and that people should just only play on Dream Land then that's an argument but it's not an independent reason to ban a stage just because it has different properties when you DI into the edge.

People prefer a DL only ruleset because DL is the most balanced stage. BF is a good stage except for the ledges. I don't think you understand the gravity of not having the option to DI towards the stage. What is one supposed to do when they are about to get edgeguarded? Not do anything about it? What about instances where you accidentally DI towards the stage at a low % and get put in a bad spot because of it? (Any player that knows what they are doing will instinctively move their stick towards the stage when they get hit.) This is all theory, though. I am open to trying out the stage first.

Every stage has different properties that encourage different play styles.

Yeah, I guess if you were to play on Hyrule, a more campy "play style" is needed to be successful there.

 

[tehz]

Not to add too much wood to this fire, but from my time ******* around with other people on console on BF, you can still get reverse ledge-DI that will send you upwards (but not really back on stage). And, it's not like getting regular ledge-DI is a spike straight down, so it shouldn't be too bad at low percents

What about instances where you accidentally DI towards the stage

I guess you could get put into a bad situation, like anytime you flub an input.

Also, from your other questions near:

1) I don't think anyone's looked into the CSS at all. I kinda want to look into it (or look into the debug menu) once I'm done with this current dumb code I'm working on, but I can't promise that anything will come out of it.

2) Unless Madao has figured something out, there's no way to edit stage geometry/collisions to fix BF's ledges (although I agree with you that they'd be better if they were rectangles than triangles).

 

[Morin0]

Not to add too much wood to this fire, but from my time ******* around with other people on console on BF, you can still get reverse ledge-DI that will send you upwards (but not really back on stage). And, it's not like getting regular ledge-DI is a spike straight down, so it shouldn't be too bad at low percents

Sure, you don't go straight down, but if you are at a high enough percent, you will not get back and will most likely die at the bottom. Everyone potentially becomes Ness if they try to DI towards the stage. It doesn't happen all the time, but it's still concerning that it can happen. DI'ing towards the stage gets more important the higher percent you are, and coincidentally, the higher percent you have, the easier it is for you to lose a stock because you hit the stage at the right angle to get sent towards the bottom blast zone.

I guess you could get put into a bad situation, like anytime you flub an input.

Maybe my example wasn't that good, but the difference here is that BF having the ledges it has is not a input error. If I am hanging on the ledge as Fox, and I want to let go of the stage to use his reflector, and I accidentally laser instead, that's an input error. If I am trying to make it back on stage and I DI towards the stage after getting hit in such a manner that the stage spikes me in a downwards angle, that's not an input error. Maybe. I've played on BF before a lot, and while the ledges are not the worst thing ever, it becomes a concerning matter when it comes to tournaments where there is emphasis on fair and balanced play. (It's why a DL only ruleset is supported.)

Also, from your other questions near:

1) I don't think anyone's looked into the CSS at all. I kinda want to look into it (or look into the debug menu) once I'm done with this current dumb code I'm working on, but I can't promise that anything will come out of it.

2) Unless Madao has figured something out, there's no way to edit stage geometry/collisions to fix BF's ledges (although I agree with you that they'd be better if they were rectangles than triangles).

I hope the CSS is easy to mess around with. It's times like these where I wish modding Brawl to be more like 64 is the more practical solution, but it's not.

 

[Armanderp]

Not sure if someone mentioned this, but there's a glitch in Training Mode. If you or the CPU dies five times, it says "GAME SET" like it was a legit match. You are also nullified during this screen so you have to reset your game.

 

[KnitePhox]

glad i dont use training mode

 

[trash?]

I hope the CSS is easy to mess around with. It's times like these where I wish modding Brawl to be more like 64 is the more practical solution, but it's not.

I might've mentioned this before ages ago when a 64-like mod was brought up, but even with brawl's comparative ease of modding, I don't think that losing a netplay source that nearly anyone with a toaster computer or greater can use would ever justify a switch like that

 

[Cyjorg]

(or look into the debug menu)

Debug menu you say? Does that exist?

 

[tehz]

Debug menu you say? Does that exist?

https://tcrf.net/Super_Smash_Bros./Debug_Menus

After seeing how 20xx used the debug menu system to do, like, everything, I wanted to see how the debug menus work. (Hopefully, a lot like Melee's which Dan has documented). There is also a literal Stage Select Debug menu, so understanding how that works would probably be the easiest path to "expanding" the SSS.

 

[Shears]

I think ledge DI is an important tech, and I think its a marker for someones improvement in the game. DI in general is a tech that is used to separate bad from good and good from great. Ledge DI, in my opinion, shows the growth of a player and takes them to the next skill level. We should be encouraging improvement and promoting advanced techniques. Stages that aren't DL, like BF, take away that tech and what we once had that separated the great from the good is now gone and the we've evened the playing field. An even playing field, in the sense that regardless of skill you can win, is a bad thing. We should be playing on a ruleset that promotes fair and neutral play but can consistently return results where the better, more skilled player wins. If you are not and advocate for DL only ruleset then you might as well not be an advocate for tournament seeding where the top seed plays the bottom seed and it goes in from there. Arguing for other stages is like arguing that the 1 and 2 seeds play each other early so the 7 and 8 seeds have a chance to make it far in bracket (its not fair you're better at ledge DI and better at the game than me and winning, we should play on a different stage that removes all tech so I can beat you with my worse skill and play style).

 

[AthensHorseParty]

That argument doesn't really make sense to me, Shears because ledge DI is just an important tool because of the way the DL meta centralizes certain playstyles. By opening the game up to more stages you're potentially opening the door for people to develop strategies that utilize other skills. BF is like DL with a harder ledge to recover on (there's also no "wall" to ride so it's not just the DI issue) and slightly higher platforms. So maybe people who excel at neutral game, spacing, and platform movement will have a little more success on BF. Trying to make the seeding analogy is totally bogus to me because you're essentially just picking something out of the current meta and giving it an arbitrary status of being the truest marker of skill. What if I think it's unfair that I can knock you off the stage and protect the ledge but you always get back bc you're so good at DIing through my edge guards? It's just arbitrary.

But the main thing is I think 64 players don't understand the way strikes and bans and DSR compensates for these issues anyway. As I said, because the ledge DI mechanic affects the whole cast equally with the exception of two characters, one of which is already the universally agreed upon best character, the only way it could unbalance the meta is encouraging people to play pikachu more. Except that A) pikachu already has a huge toolset that makes all of his matchups even or in his favor and B) if you're so concerned about not being able to recover with ledge DI specifically you'll just ban it and never have to play there in a single BO3 set, and never have to play there more than once in a BO5. You'd still have to lose two games either on your CPs or at the neutral and one of your CP's so you can't even argue it would skew results in a significant way because losing 2 games is the equivalent of losing a BO3 set anyway. Worst case scenario is just BF hardly ever gets picked and it's a moot point anyway.

EDIT: Also, if accurate skill => results is your reasoning to prefer a stage you should prefer BF over DL because as Tehz pointed out, it's still possible to get reverse ledge DI on BF with very precise positioning and DI inputs. Therefore it rewards skill differences more heavily than DL does.

 

[The Star King]

ledge DI is nice and all but I think its impact is overrated by these boards

 

[Morin0]

I'm open to try out BF and even FD more. Bring it.

 

[divekicked]

Well since bringing up the battlefield issue was mostly my fault i'd like to add my opinion. The way that people talked about BF made it seem like it was glitched rather than just jank ledges. If it just comes down the ledges being weird i don't think it needs to be fixed. That said, i can see why it's still a bannable stage. Also, is there any attempts at stage hacking for 64? I wonder if down the road there could be an alternate select screen (like what 20XX does)

 

[Cyjorg]

I'm not going to fix something that isn't a glitch when there are bigger things to be done. If you don't like it ban it like the other 6 illegal stages on the original rom.

Now, I may come back to it once I get 19XXTE to 1.0. Until then, discussing the legality of it is not for this thread. This thread should before introducing ideas, informing me of bugs, and further research.

Now, rants aside, I'll be releasing the 0.5.3 tonight (around 3a EST) which will include the random function bug fix and battlefield preview fix. The patcher will also be updated. It will now produce two roms one of which will include the most recent widescreen patch. In the future I hope to have it be a debug menu toggle but this is the best solution for now. Lastly, I'll be including updated Project64.rdb files so that you guys can play these over net play.

Unfortunately, I was unable to patch the Training Mode bug. After extensive testing I was unable to find the source of the problem. The stages are just "illegal" in both the original rom and this hack as shown by the Gameshark code.

 

[AthensHorseParty]

There are a few bugs with the results screen in team battle I've noticed too. Sometimes it reports the wrong team winning and I can't figure out why or what causes it. Other than that though it's seems to be a functioning romhack capable of having fun competitive matches on. We played it a lot at my friend's smash night the other night and now we're planning a tournament event using this rom thanks for making it.

 

[Cyjorg]

There are a few bugs with the results screen in team battle I've noticed too. Sometimes it reports the wrong team winning and I can't figure out why or what causes it. Other than that though it's seems to be a functioning romhack capable of having fun competitive matches on. We played it a lot at my friend's smash night the other night and now we're planning a tournament event using this rom thanks for making it.

I believe this has to do with timed stock matches. The game is determining who the victor is based on score instead of stock. I could patch this with ease but I'm going to make it more complicated because I don't want to break time matches as of now