Up smash spike?

[Mushroomring]

I read that this is possible near the edge but I dont know how to make it work. anybody know?

 

[Tenki]

It's random.

The up-smash has a series of hits that hit your opponent toward the center of gravity (Sonic). If their % is high enough, those small hits might knock the enemy out of Sonic. If all of that is true, then you'd have to 'tip' your target with the upper part of sonic's u-smash (not the last hit), or just get lucky and hope the guy DI's upward during the combo hit.

 

[thecatinthehat]

It's not random at all....
You just have to hit with the right hit boxes, at the right percentages. Unfortunately, this is incredibly situational. But this is constantly repeatable in training.

 

[Browny]

if you upsmash when immediately between your opponent and the ledge, provided the enemy is in a certain % range, it will spike them off the stage. if you wanna test it, try vs Game and watch on any % between about 60 and 100.

yes its situational, but when it works against characters like ness and mario, theres no way they can recover

 

[Kit-Tsukasa]

It's like Roy's u smash in melee. Certain frames/hitboxes spike the enemy instead of sending them up.

 

[Trillion]

Ok i've done it before, but not in a real match because it is very hard to set up and once your opponent knows about it its even harder.

practice it like this.

Step 1.) Stand near the ledge. Lets say your on FD and you are on the right hand side. You need to face the ledge, then have your opponent stand close behind you and they must be about 50 - 80% i believe for most characters.

Step 2.) Do an upsmash. Use up on your c-stick and hold down on your analog stick.

Step 3.) As they get caught in the up smash, move your control stick in a counter clockwise motion. (I believe its counter clockwise, it may be clockwise but im about 90% sure it counter clockwise.)

Step 4.) Your opponent gets shot out at a downward trajectory.

If you actually managed to get this in a match, most characters can still easily recover. As of right now, I think it could be good against DK or Bowser or characters with bad recoveries like those, but otherwise its rather useless. Hope this helps.

 

[Browny]

you dont have to move the control stick in a circle, i corrected that in a thread i made about this a while back... it just so happened that while i was testing it, everytime i did the circle thing, the enemy was in the % range and every time i didnt move it, they were outside the % range.

 

[Orange_Soda_Man]

EASY WAY TO DO UP SMASH SPIKE!!!!!

I just figured this out after growing tired with not getting the other method to work.
Similar damage range (50-80), but instead of facing towards the outside of the stage with the opponent inside, face the opponent. Up smash, and as you do, rapidly tap down on the control stick. I've done it multiple times.

EDIT!!!!!
facing doesn't matter! towards, away, BOTH SPIKE!!!
(does this make sonic tier 1 yet?)

 

[ROOOOY!]

Anyone care to test what OSM is saying?

 

[Tenki]

That's interesting, tapping down. And considering that magnificentmarth said something along the lines of having DI (from the Sonic), it might have validity, so test plz :D

What thecatinthehat said is correct, about hitboxes. The Usmash hits people going across Sonic, so if you do Usmash so the opponent is caught in the upper-left edge of the smash, they go down-right (until the last hit, which sends them upwards). But at the same time, what I said was kinda true too- if you do U-smash so your opponent is "inside" Sonic, then they get hit in 'random' directions, depending on their DI and placement.

I was fighting against my brother, who was using Ness, and he tried to d-air me from inside the level while I was standing by the left edge of FD. I did U-smash and both of us made contact with each other. I took the hit, while he got sent flying down-left, and the hitstun left him too far to recover XD

 

[TwinkleToes]

I don't think the DI thing has any real substance behind it... I tried it out myself and there's really no indicator that it helps.

I was testing to see what characters this would work on and and what ranges.
The things I found were:

1. The characters need to face a certain way (mostly face to face, but sometimes as with Yoshi it will be back to back or some other variation).
2. It will always spike to the opposite side the enemy started on (so to spike off the stage you need to be closest to the edge).
3. For some characters it will never work (mostly characters Sonic has an easy time with anyways due to their large hitboxes).
4. The normal damage range where this works is somewhere between 50-100%, but some characters like Wario have really small ranges (42%-47%).
5. Your opponent's vertical position is a factor, although I cannot exactly predict what will cause the spike to succeed and what will cause it to fail. It does seem that being level with Sonic is the best way to get this to work.

As I said before, Sonic has so many possibilities of attack and defense, but they all work in their own unique situations and I think this is another example of that. If you think you're going to be able to spike smash opponents left and right once you figure this out you're wrong. It is very difficult to get the spacing right both in relation to the edge of the stage and your opponent. However, like many of Sonic's tricks, when you pull it out of the bag it can have a great effect both because of it's intrinsic merit and because of its unexpected nature. For example, if you can land this correctly on a Marth that's near the edge and immediately follow up with an edge hog, Marth will be too far below the stage to recover. And in some situations, even if you don't bother with the edge hog he will fail to get back to safety.

I might go over this a bit more carefully later (really get into the numbers). I'm thinking this would go well with the gimp guide I'm working on. Although, that whole thing is looking to be a huge list.

 

[Orange_Soda_Man]

That's it. I'm getting a video of this somehow.
Here's EXACTLY what I did:

Went to FD in training mode, chose mario as the test subject.
battered him around until he was at 50-80, using up smash and tapping down repetitively to see if there were variations that could work before then.

Mario is usually at 51-54 when this first starts to work.
Yes, he lands opposite of you. Kindof. if it goes mario-sonic-edge, then mario will be spiked. if it goes sonic-mario-edge, mario will land center-side of sonic. Facing doesn't matter.

When I DON'T tap down continuously during the animation of up smash, mario gets sent upward. I haven't tested this against anyone else yet though.

 

[Browny]

this has been discussed before

http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=161132

ignore my OP since its wrong and my video is gone since it was so wrong lol.

anyway moral of the story is, DI on the sonic users part is not neccesary. you dont need to tap down, rotate the stick or anything. this has been tested a lot on my part.

 

[Orange_Soda_Man]

How can DI not be necessary? When I don't use it, it doesn't work. When I do use it, it does work!
Maybe it auto-sets it for you if you're near the edge, and rotating the control stick off-sets it; for a more accurate test, try using it near the center of the stage.

 

[TwinkleToes]

Orange, positioning can matter. If you're a little too close or a little too far from your opponent it might not work. dj seems pretty sure himself which reassures me in my testing also. I can always make it work without the tapping. If there's a character/percent that you think you can only get by tapping let me know and I'll see if I can do it without tapping.

 

[Orange_Soda_Man]

I'm done trying. If I can get it to work, then that's good enough for me. if it's happening for some other reason, then that is one amazing coincidence.

 

[Trillion]

DISREGARD EVERYTHING IN MY PREVIOUS POST! lol
sorry for the misinformation.

im kinda suprised to hear that pressing stuff on the analog stick doesnt matter. like Orange Soda Man said, i'm also only able to make it work by making the analog stick do stuff. But i havent gotten to play much lately since im at college without my wii so I'm also glad to hear that you don't have to face away to get the spike. It was way to obvious what I was looking to do when I tried to make it happen. I could mind game my bro toward the side of the stage, but facing away for the up smash made it really hard. thanks for the info

 

[Browny]

I'm done trying. If I can get it to work, then that's good enough for me. if it's happening for some other reason, then that is one amazing coincidence.

are you blind!!!

ive exaplined it no less than 3 times in this thread. it will happen EVERY TIME, under the right circumstances

 

[Orange_Soda_Man]

you've talked about the move twice, not thrice btw.
So I need to tap the control stick, big deal. I can still get the move to work. You're not going to tell me how to play.

 

[Browny]

if you upsmash when immediately between your opponent and the ledge, provided the enemy is in a certain % range, it will spike them off the stage. if you wanna test it, try vs Game and watch on any % between about 60 and 100.

you dont have to move the control stick in a circle, i corrected that in a thread i made about this a while back...

anyway moral of the story is, DI on the sonic users part is not neccesary. you dont need to tap down, rotate the stick or anything. this has been tested a lot on my part.

uhuh.

you DO NOT need to tap the control stick. no one is telling you how to play, but why would you bother tapping the control stick down since it has no effect whatsoever?