Unused upsmash application?

[Dabuz]

So, i was at ktar5 and during a MM vs. a falco player, i noticed something very interesting about olimar's charged upsmash: whenever falco illusioned into me when i was charging upsmash, i would get hit BUT the charged upsmash would be set off and hit falco during his side-B. This happened a few times in the set, each time, i did not try to time my upsmash nor did i release the charge before being hit, because the upsmash hitbox would come out 100% of the time when i was hit during charge. I can't test this ATM, but based on this, i have a theory that, at least for olimar's upsmash, if not all his smashes, being hit while charging causes the pikmin to desynch in a way and do its attack IF the pikmin is not killed or outprioritized. If anyone could test this out and post results, that would be very useful.


Short version without background: See what happens if just olimar is hit while charging an upsmash


Specific things to try out for starters:

mk's dair
diddy z-dropping a banana
marth's dtilt at close range
wario's bike

 

[RichBrown]

O______O

This would be incredible, can't wait to see the results of this.

 

[Dabuz]

O______O

This would be incredible, can't wait to see the results of this.

if you help test, you will see results faster :3

 

[Dnyce]

vid?
probably just a pikmin rocket

 

[MiniTroika]

I'll test it out either today or tomorrow and I'll let you guys know

 

[Tin Man]

Oh wow, i'll try looking into this a little as well

 

[Dabuz]

I only got to test this theory against wolf, and all his attacks were hitting pikmin away along with olimar. Only thing i forgot to get tested was whether his blaster would hit a yellow pikmin away

 

[Asa]

i can't get this on falco by just charging it

 

[Dabuz]

Are you sure your not getting hit by the first third of falco's side-b hitbox duration? Because the first third has invincibility frames. Are you charging with full or almost full health pikmin? Is falco hitting you at your body and not the top of your helmet?

 

[Tin Man]

I tried this outside the 1/3rd length and it didn't seem to work. I'll try and report back with a more detailed analysis.

 

[Asa]

Are you sure your not getting hit by the first third of falco's side-b hitbox duration? Because the first third has invincibility frames. Are you charging with full or almost full health pikmin? Is falco hitting you at your body and not the top of your helmet?

i'm facing falco when i use the usmash

not during the invincibility frames

unsure if the pikmin was full health, i'll try again this week

 

[Dabuz]

Sorry to say this, but my theory is wrong.

After re-testing this, i could not get it to work again either, so i experimented and realized why is seemed like upsmash was auto-coming out is because. i was releasing my upsmash in panic right before i was hit by a couple frames, but because the hitbox from falco's side-b was not connecting until falco was right past olimar, it looked like there was no time for me to have released upsmash, hence why i thought upsmash was going off because olimar was hit. In reality, falco's delayed hitbox and me releasing the A button on instinct upon appearing to be hit was what really happened. Sorry for getting everyone's hopes up :/


TL;DR: falco's weird delayed side-B hitbox made it seem like olimar was releasing upsmash upon being hit, but that was not the case




Only other thing i found out which might be worth noting is that if an attack hits a charging pikmin, but the hitbox reaches the pikmin before olimar, the pikmin's hitbox will VERY SLIGHTLY delay the incoming attack. for example, mis-spaced falco's jab will hit a pikmin during the upsmash charge and give olimar just enough time to release the charge and hit falco. Its situational, but if someone can force opponents to mis-space their attacks so they just hit charging pikmin, olimar can makes big punishes. (No one will expect to have to DI an attack right after they connect with a hitbox )

 

[Tin Man]

Seems like it might be worth noting.

 

[MiniTroika]

It's simply timing. If you let go before Falco hits you, the pikmin hits Falco away and you get hit by the Side B. Interestingly enough, the only Pikmin you don't need to time is purple. Any time while the attack is out will simply beat it.

 

[wwwilliam0024]

What Dabuz said is very sexy when applied to purple pikmin!

Charge an Usmash with a purple pikmin, jab it (just the pikmin, dont hit olimar) as the pikmin flies off, release the Usmash, watch the pikmin Usmash where it was sent flying :D.