Ultima Ness?

[CbGreiga]

Is it just me or is Ness too easy to combo with in SSB64?

 

[Surri-Sama]

not to easy, ness does have a solid combo base but if you look at kirby and Captian falcon his combos arnt THAT easy, DJC gives him a good edge but Yoshi also has this, i wouldnt worry so much about Ness's Combos as i would his prority =.=

 

[Winston]

EVERYONE is easy to combo with in ssb >__> (compared to the other games)

Captain falcon takes the cake for easy combos though.

 

[smash64]

nope ness is not pretty easy to combo with unless you have this wierd gift from god that make you combo with him on your first time using him xD

 

[Surri-Sama]

nope ness is not pretty easy to combo with unless you have this wierd gift from god that make you combo with him on your first time using him xD

this is a good point that makes mine eayer to prove xD

When i see people JUST START playign ssb, (which still happens =.=) if they try ness, they have no CLUE what to do, but if they try kirby, they can play ok and actually do 3-4 hit combos from the start...and as for falcon, his combos are easy, but kirby has easy combos vs all chars, most Falcon begginers do not know how to combo light wieghts and thats why he gets a rep for being "bad agesnt light chars" BOGUS

 

[chuckj]

EVERYONE is easy to combo with in ssb >__> (compared to the other games)

Captain falcon takes the cake for easy combos though.

I dont think Samus and DK are easy for combos. At least if you talk about real combos, not couting samus d-air- b-air for example. I know you said "compared to other games" but I'm just saying what I think hehe ;p

 

[Surri-Sama]

why say this is easy compared to other games..thats like sayign ssb is easyer to combo in the real lfie boxing, its two diffrent thigns, the chalange of ssb combos is not just doign basics, its adepting and applying :\

 

[Thino]

Compared to falcon's , ness' combos are slightly harder

 

[Wenbobular]

why say this is easy compared to other games..thats like sayign ssb is easyer to combo in the real lfie boxing, its two diffrent thigns, the chalange of ssb combos is not just doign basics, its adepting and applying :\

Winston is comparing this to SSBM, in which it is far harder to combo due to more drastic DI.
You can adapt all you want to Falcon combos, but Uairs are still nigh impossible to DI out of.
It's not too hard to juggle people with DJC...I can't Fair combo worth beans though.

 

[chuckj]

Some people dont even know how to double-jump cancel very fast haha
And just dont say they're very bad players! I played some good ones, but surely they could be a lot better knowing this.

this post wasnt about combos sorry

 

[IGN Forums]

ness is one of the worst Super Smash Bros. character EVER!!!

 

[CbGreiga]

ness is one of the worst Super Smash Bros. character EVER!!!

I disagree wholly. Ness is an awesome char if you learn how to use him. His physical attacks are way above par and is great for juggling. PK Fire is great for vs. matches. PK Thunder is great for edge guarding. His Usmash and Dsmash are great for breaking crowds.Plus all his moves have a flow that is very useful. Although his recovery is lacking and he is a bit heavy he is a godsend and nintendo has acknowledged it.

 

[Thino]

I disagree wholly. Ness is an awesome char if you learn how to use him. His physical attacks are way above par and is great for juggling. PK Fire is great for vs. matches. PK Thunder is great for edge guarding. His Usmash and Dsmash are great for breaking crowds.Plus all his moves have a flow that is very useful. Although his recovery is lacking and he is a bit heavy he is a godsend and nintendo has acknowledged it.

you're being trolled my friend

 

[Surri-Sama]

I disagree wholly. Ness is an awesome char if you learn how to use him. His physical attacks are way above par and is great for juggling. PK Fire is great for vs. matches. PK Thunder is great for edge guarding. His Usmash and Dsmash are great for breaking crowds.Plus all his moves have a flow that is very useful. Although his recovery is lacking and he is a bit heavy he is a godsend and nintendo has acknowledged it.

lol this is not how i would describe ness but ok

Ness is very fast and is has very high priority with easy combos once you learn the nintendo slide, highest priority spike in the game and his 3rd recovery is fine if you know sweet spots

 

[Zantetsu]

Ness has both easy and hard combos. Easy ones involving mainly just uairs, dairs and up tilts. Harder ones involving uairs, fairs and nairs.

Sine most see the easy Ness often, heres someone playing a harder Ness http://youtube.com/watch?v=EZRWbnRP_pA

 

[Jacobcc]

ness is one of the worst Super Smash Bros. character EVER!!!

I wouldn't go as far as "The Worst". But he is pretty shocking. (see what I did there ).

 

[cam`]

his third jump is extremely readable and interceptable. if ness could reliably get back on the stage he'd be much better. also ness combos are sooooo boring.. djc uair/dair x50, or a fancy uair fair dair gimp

 

[greenblob]

I wouldn't say Kirby is an amazing combo character. Sure, his combos are easy, but very few of them are of decent length and even fewer are kill combos.

Also, for Ness' recovery, couldn't you just sweetspot? He's also invincible for much of his 3rd jump too.

 

[Wenbobular]

Harder said than done, sweet spotting the ledge.
You're also assuming that you're approaching from above.
That and facing a character with good recovery, they can easily intercept you during your lightning...for example, Captain Falcon Up-b away from stage = stock.
As for his invincibility, there's a very long time (in SSB terms) where Ness will just float, and in this period you can't fastfall or do anything really. Landing on the stage also creates quite a bit of landing lag.

 

[chuckj]

In my opinion Wenbobular is right. I dont think you are safe if you can sweetspot the ledge because his upB doesnt hit 'all the time', unless you play japanese version

 

[Wenbobular]

In my opinion Wenbobular is right. I dont think you are safe if you can sweetspot the ledge because his upB doesnt hit 'all the time', unless you play japanese version

Well no, what I meant is sweetspotting with Ness is much harder than sweetspotting with anyone else...although I suppose sweetspotting with Ness is the only sweetspot that grabs the ledge in the middle of the move.
The Up-b has a lot of priority, but it's very easy to hit you out of it during the time you're hitting your rear with the lightning.
If you miss sweetspotting then you're kind of dead if you miss to the low side. If you're too high...well...you're just kinda...sitting there.

 

[greenblob]

Is it really that hard to sweetspot consistently with Ness? Pika players do it all the time (I don't play Ness so I wouldn't know). Aside from Falcon's up B, it would guarantee that you make it back if you could do it consistently.

 

[chuckj]

Wenbobular the second thing I said wasnt reffering to you, it was my own opinion sorry ^^

greenblob controlling ness upB is harder than pika's upB. And you can hit the head in the wall sometimes and dont grab the ledge hehe

 

[greenblob]

I dunno, isn't that kinda like saying you can miss Jiggly's rest sometimes and get screwed? Yeah, when it happens it happens, but that's your fault and you should eventually get it down. But a pro Ness's input would be needed at this point, I think.

 

[Surri-Sama]

Harder said than done, sweet spotting the ledge.
You're also assuming that you're approaching from above.
That and facing a character with good recovery, they can easily intercept you during your lightning...for example, Captain Falcon Up-b away from stage = stock.
As for his invincibility, there's a very long time (in SSB terms) where Ness will just float, and in this period you can't fastfall or do anything really. Landing on the stage also creates quite a bit of landing lag.

yes, but your points about ness's recovery are about the same for everyones...minus pikachu having the best 3rd in the game =.=

and you dont have to approach from above to sweet spot =.=, you can sweetspot with ness on all dicrections (even perfectly horrizontaly if you know the EXACT spot )

 

[Wenbobular]

yes, but your points about ness's recovery are about the same for everyones...minus pikachu having the best 3rd in the game =.=

and you dont have to approach from above to sweet spot =.=, you can sweetspot with ness on all dicrections (even perfectly horrizontaly if you know the EXACT spot )

No...you literally can't sweetspot from below unless you're somehow at the exact distance from the ledge, and even then, you won't grab it automatically. You only grab it during PK Rocket coming from above going at a downwards angle toward the ledge.

At Sirhc, Ness's recovery isn't like anyone else's because it has even more startup time than Firefox, which is easy enough to edgeguard as it is.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PB6eNRG2gw8
Watch the amount of gimping here.
Some characters have very nice recoveries where the options are more varied. Ness has fewer options because trying to Up-b too close too the ledge just results in getting aerialed to the face.

 

[Surri-Sama]

No...you literally can't sweetspot from below unless you're somehow at the exact distance from the ledge, and even then, you won't grab it automatically. You only grab it during PK Rocket coming from above going at a downwards angle toward the ledge.

At Sirhc, Ness's recovery isn't like anyone else's because it has even more startup time than Firefox, which is easy enough to edgeguard as it is.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PB6eNRG2gw8
Watch the amount of gimping here.
Some characters have very nice recoveries where the options are more varied. Ness has fewer options because trying to Up-b too close too the ledge just results in getting aerialed to the face.

ok ok i see your point, with Hyrule though that start up doesnt really matter because you can climb the wall but i can see how in others it would hurt you

 

[_kSo_]

most Falcon begginers do not know how to combo light wieghts and thats why he gets a rep for being "bad agesnt light chars" BOGUS

ppl try to counter my falcon with jiggs, samus, or luigi

too bad I still beat them

 

[Zantetsu]

ppl try to counter my falcon with jiggs, samus, or luigi

too bad I still beat them

Nice cockyness there, koso.

 

[chuckj]

ppl try to counter my falcon with jiggs, samus, or luigi

too bad I still beat them

I think he said begginers and I believe you arent one

 

[greenblob]

ppl try to counter my falcon with jiggs, samus, or luigi

too bad I still beat them

My counterpick is having you play Pika/Fox

How high up do you have to be to sweetspot the ledge with Ness? I know that you can't sweetspot if you're directly below, but can you sweetspot when you're diagonally below?

I guess if all else fails, you can go straight at the opponent and hope that he tries to block it with an attack.

 

[Wenbobular]

Luigi vs. Falcon is like pitting a whale vs. a speeding torpedo ¬.¬
Jiggs is even worse...if you're forced to recover low, it's like...*blimpy hitbox*
Samus is umm...iono. *Dair Dair Dair*

 

[_kSo_]

Nice cockyness there, koso.

being confident wins you 60% of the battle, my friend

the reason I wanted to say that was because i knew you would respond and say that I was "cocky."

the truth is, that statement wasn't in any way "cocky" as you put it

I didn't point out anybody in specific, I didn't place myself above anybody or any players

I was simply stating that beginner falcon players can't deal with light characters

I was saying that when people try to counter my falcon with light characters and I still beat them, it's saying that my falcon is NOT a beginner's falcon

 

[Surri-Sama]

being confident wins you 60% of the battle, my friend

the reason I wanted to say that was because i knew you would respond and say that I was "cocky."

the truth is, that statement wasn't in any way "cocky" as you put it

I didn't point out anybody in specific, I didn't place myself above anybody or any players

I was simply stating that beginner falcon players can't deal with light characters

I was saying that when people try to counter my falcon with light characters and I still beat them, it's saying that my falcon is NOT a beginner's falcon

yes im pretty sure you just confirmed what i said and nothing more

as for counters if my main (pika) cant do it, id NOT go with Fox he is so easy to setup with Falcon (imo leave me alone Vex) but perhaps Mario, if you know how to Uair wioth Mario Falcon can be put into some awkward spots

 

[Zantetsu]

being confident wins you 60% of the battle, my friend

the reason I wanted to say that was because i knew you would respond and say that I was "cocky."

the truth is, that statement wasn't in any way "cocky" as you put it

I didn't point out anybody in specific, I didn't place myself above anybody or any players

I was simply stating that beginner falcon players can't deal with light characters

I was saying that when people try to counter my falcon with light characters and I still beat them, it's saying that my falcon is NOT a beginner's falcon

The point is, your bragging about a falcon. Falcon's combos are all the same and you just need to get the weight down of every character. Give somebody a month or 2 with falcon and volah, they can do falcon combos on any character.

 

[Thino]

The point is, your bragging about a falcon.

I think hes bragging about himself , not "a falcon"

kso > a falcon

 

[_kSo_]

The point is, your bragging about a falcon. Falcon's combos are all the same and you just need to get the weight down of every character. Give somebody a month or 2 with falcon and volah, they can do falcon combos on any character.

yes, falcon combos are easy....congratulations, i think you are the 29387492874th person to have told me or anybody on this forum that...

let's come to a perfect understanding that if you know how to combo every character in the game with a certain character (in this particular argument, c. falcon), then you are pretty much GOD right?

no

combos with anyone against any other characters are easy. Falcon's just happen to be more straightforward, and less awkward unless ness or yoshi

but let's not forget about mindgames, shall we?

Isai says this to everyone all the time, and it's the only advice he ever gives out

"Don't Get Hit"

Why? well, because simply put, at the hands of any mediocre player, you will be combo'ed to death.
This brings me to my next point. How is it you prevent yourself from being hit? well you would have to use MINDGAMES and spacing to ensure that you don't get hit first by your opponent.

Because of falcon's weight and size, he is a good combo bag for anyone, and on top of that, he is incredibly easy to edgeguard. This makes room for mistake, in case someone is somehow unable to kill falcon with their combo, they can still kill him essentially because of the fact that he is so easy to edgeguard

All in all, Falcon is a difficult character to play at high levels because he requires so much fine tuning in spacing and mindgames

yes, he is easy to use at lower levels and probably can destroy other lower level players, making one think that they are better than they actually are

Seeing as you are one of the people who thinks that, I can only safely assume that you yourself are a low leveled player. In that case, my apologies, I thought you were actually someone good

 

[Zantetsu]

yes, falcon combos are easy....congratulations, i think you are the 29387492874th person to have told me or anybody on this forum that...

let's come to a perfect understanding that if you know how to combo every character in the game with a certain character (in this particular argument, c. falcon), then you are pretty much GOD right?

no

combos with anyone against any other characters are easy. Falcon's just happen to be more straightforward, and less awkward unless ness or yoshi

but let's not forget about mindgames, shall we?

Isai says this to everyone all the time, and it's the only advice he ever gives out

"Don't Get Hit"

Why? well, because simply put, at the hands of any mediocre player, you will be combo'ed to death.
This brings me to my next point. How is it you prevent yourself from being hit? well you would have to use MINDGAMES and spacing to ensure that you don't get hit first by your opponent.

Because of falcon's weight and size, he is a good combo bag for anyone, and on top of that, he is incredibly easy to edgeguard. This makes room for mistake, in case someone is somehow unable to kill falcon with their combo, they can still kill him essentially because of the fact that he is so easy to edgeguard

All in all, Falcon is a difficult character to play at high levels because he requires so much fine tuning in spacing and mindgames

yes, he is easy to use at lower levels and probably can destroy other lower level players, making one think that they are better than they actually are

Seeing as you are one of the people who thinks that, I can only safely assume that you yourself are a low leveled player. In that case, my apologies, I thought you were actually someone good

LMFAO. Every falcon I have faced, even you, is just grab spam. I'm not saying thats a bad thing but falcon has to be the worse character to use for mindgames.

Seeing as you are one of the people who thinks that, I can only safely assume that you yourself are a low leveled player. In that case, my apologies, I thought you were actually someone good

I'll be honost and say I do suck at ssb64 at the moment due to me playing melee so much =\

---

Now lets just forget about this and move on >_>

 

[NJzFinest]

LMFAO. Every falcon I have faced, even you, is just grab spam. I'm not saying thats a bad thing but falcon has to be the worse character to use for mindgames.

Grab spam? You just let them come up to you and grab? >.<

 

[SuPeRbOoM]

falcon ftw
...
ness ftl