Ubers: Discussion/Q+A/Creative Moveset

[mood4food77]

magikarp is the number 7 lead in ubers

discuss

 

[Terywj [태리]]

magikarp is the number 7 lead in ubers

discuss

I think with Jolly and an EV spread of 244 HP / 12 Atk / 252 Spd with Splash is the most effective set Magikarp can run.

-Terywj

 

[mood4food77]

well according to shoddy stats, magikarp was the 7th most popular lead
remember it does learn bounce and has swift swim and flail

what makes it even better:

APR 2010 UBER USAGE
| 27 | Qwilfish | 1713 | 5.27 |
| 28 | Magikarp | 1702 | 5.24 |
| 29 | Seaking | 1676 | 5.16 |
| 30 | Sharpedo | 1656 | 5.10 |
| 31 | Feebas | 1652 | 5.08 |
| 32 | Remoraid | 1648 | 5.07 |

 

[Terywj [태리]]

Poor Sharpedo. That shark gets no love from anybody.

-Terywj

 

[mood4food77]

i have to admit, it's a pretty good prank

 

[Riddle]

Magikarp ran CB and a lonely nature 100% of the time.

Lets get this thread back active though.

Palkia is an absolute beast. I truly believe he is the number 1 most effective pokemon in ubers right now. Between countering kyogre hitting for an absurd amount of damage on everything and havin only one weakness he is quickly beccoming indispensible to me. My only problem is his lack of bulk, but then it struck me. Palkia IS bulky he just doesn't have any sets that run more defense investment than 4 HP. I think a defensive Lum/Haban Berry Palkia could really cause some problems in Ubers. He sacrifices some attack power/speed (Lusterous Orb/Choice Scarf) but he could really do well.

I don't know exactly what set I'd run but I'mma do some calcs later and see what I can come up with.

 

[Pink Reaper]

Someone went to work on the ladder lol.

Sort of like when i carried Bronzong's lead usage >_>

 

[Riddle]

It was a group of french smogoners who did it as an April Fools joke. There is a tradition in france involving paper fish or something on april fools day and so they all got together and laddered on April 1st. Some of the matches were played through, some were just quit out of.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

It was a group of french smogoners who did it as an April Fools joke. There is a tradition in france involving paper fish or something on april fools day and so they all got together and laddered on April 1st. Some of the matches were played through, some were just quit out of.

I suggest we do something similar about our PokeCenter's icon - Starmie / Slowbro.

-Terywj

 

[Circa]

Poor Sharpedo. That shark gets no love from anybody.

-Terywj

You mean apart from me, right? It's my favorite 3rd gen Pokemon.

Starmie can actually do something in Ubers if it's used as a late-game sweeper. Just don't pay attention to it as a Rapid Spinner at all and you should find it to be something good for you on more than one occasion.

 

[kirbyraeg]

Slowbro can do whatever the **** he feels like...just not in ubers. 80 SpDef, no speed, AND being weak to dark, ghost, electric, grass, bug...maaaaaaaaaaybe slowking could set up trick room/nasty plot up to do something, but that's really pushing it.

 

[Wave⁂]

Slowbro is probably OHKOd by Water Spout, lol

 

[CRASHiC]

I say we take Bidoff to Ubers.

 

[Gates]

Maybe if you learn to spell it right we might.

 

[Riddle]

I say we take Bidoff Aggron to Ubers.

Fix'd .

 

[Terywj [태리]]

Fix'd .

Actually, I wouldn't mind doing this. With Aggron's power we would have a legit reason to do so.

Now which set would we use...

-Terywj

 

[kirbyraeg]

Aggron would definitely need sandstorm support just to weather resisted special hits, and the few physical hits in the tier come from pokemon like groundon and garchomp as well as something like bulk up dialga who could just set up in its face. I don't think it would work.

 

[Gates]

I think CB and RP are the only real choices for Aggron. The moveset seems obvious - Head Smash (for STAB), Outrage or Ice Punch (for Dragons Outrage would be better, for Groundon Ice Punch would be), Low Kick (everything in Ubers except Mew and Wobbuffet weigh a ton), and something else (Rock Polish or a move that it would use on a CB set).

Honestly though, Aggron just has too many weaknesses. Fighting is not too big a deal, but ground and water are since two of the most common pokemon are Groudon and Kyogre. His low special def and HP also limit his usefulness a lot.

 

[mood4food77]

doesn't mewtwo always carry aura sphere?

so fighting is a pretty big weakness
his typing screws him over big time

 

[kirbyraeg]

There is one thing aggron could do actually, and that is run metal burst.

Think about it:

Aggron @ Leftovers/Chople/Shuca

252 HP/252 SpDef/4 Def
Careful / Rock Head

Metal Burst
Focus Punch
Head Smash
Shadow Claw/Magnet Rise

Oh dat potential

Spoiler

aggron has no potential in ubers

 

[Wave⁂]

I think Substitute / Head Smash / Earthquake / Focus Punch is the best it can do. Attempt to force a switch (lol), set up a Sub, hit stuff.

 

[Gates]

I forgot that Aggron has Shadow Claw.

Still is **** though.

 

[Circa]

What the **** are you guys talking about?

Aggron@Life Orb
Adamant/Rock Head
252 Atk/8 SDef/248 Spe
- Rock Polish
- Head Smash
- Low Kick
- Ice Punch

You guys clearly don't know what the **** you're doing in Ubers. Riddle and I made an Aggron team after I was inspired by a post in the Snorlax Room made by CRASHiC, and I do believe Riddle hit what was it, somewhere around 1450 CRE? Not too ****ing bad, all things considered. And no, Aggron wasn't deadweight on the team. It wasn't too uncommon for me to log onto AIM and find a message from him saying how he had swept an entire team with this guy. It does basically require Boba Fett support, but so does the deadliest set-up/mixed sweeper in Ubers, so that's not really saying much.

We were going to post a RMT for it on Smogon and here once either he or I actually hit the top 50, but due to my lack of interest in competitive Pokemon altogether at the time and him I believe getting a little bored with the team, it never occurred.

 

[Riddle]

It peaked at 1493 CRE. Think about it though. The only real thing that can stop RP aggron is groudon so if you can weaken that you have a good sweep going for you. It OHKOs lugia easily and forry cant do **** to it and is 2HKO'd. I swept entire teams with it all the time.

 

[kirbyraeg]

I know though that there's plenty of scarfed revengers that would be able to force out aggron easily enough: even though you're set to outpace every non-boosted pokemon bar deoxys-s I don't see how you'd muscle through teams with it without having reliable ways to eliminate things like scarfed palkia and garchomp who will easily continue to force you out. A full-health wobbuffet can also come in safely after a sacrifice and counter or encore to get around rock polish pp stalling. Also if it gets burned by anything, including a defensive mewtwo which takes 75% max from LO head smash, its sweep is over. I guess I can see how aggron would be able to sweep given favorable conditions, but those things seem kind of difficult to manage; the other player just needs to know what to sacrifice to deal with it.

Then again, anything that has rock polish and a stab rock move can sweep in ubers, right? Even relicanth could use a rp+head smash set, put a bit more of its EVs in spdef, hit the same speed mark, and run around with stab water backing up his sweep.

 

[supermarth64]

If you ARE planning on using CB Aggron in ubers, it's extremely helpful to run some sandstorm support. That way Palkia's Spacial Rends only do 1/3 damage and Scarfogre's Ice Beam does like 20%. Unfortunately, Tyranitar's the only good uber sandstormer, so 2 4x Fighting and 2 2x Ground and Water weak mons on your team is really limiting. That's what you get for using Aggron though.

 

[Riddle]

I know though that there's plenty of scarfed revengers that would be able to force out aggron easily enough: even though you're set to outpace every non-boosted pokemon bar deoxys-s I don't see how you'd muscle through teams with it without having reliable ways to eliminate things like scarfed palkia and garchomp who will easily continue to force you out.

Wobbuffet kills scarfers.

A full-health wobbuffet can also come in safely after a sacrifice and counter or encore to get around rock polish pp stalling.

You can bait an encore and then head smash to 2HKO. And if wobbuffet isn't at full health (very likely in late game) you can just kill it.

Also if it gets burned by anything, including a defensive mewtwo which takes 75% max from LO head smash, its sweep is over.

Again, these things are unlikely to be at full health.

I guess I can see how aggron would be able to sweep given favorable conditions, but those things seem kind of difficult to manage; the other player just needs to know what to sacrifice to deal with it.

If you dont reveal it until late you can weaken counters and manage a sweep easily.

Then again, anything that has rock polish and a stab rock move can sweep in ubers, right? Even relicanth could use a rp+head smash set, put a bit more of its EVs in spdef, hit the same speed mark, and run around with stab water backing up his sweep.

Except Relicanth cant do **** like OHKO Palkia with Head Smash.... Aggron has much higher attack.

What your saying is true for any sweeper. DD rayquaza cant sweep with scarfers still around. SD quaza cant sweep with dialga still alive. Its true for any sweeper. No sweeper is foolproof.

 

[Circa]

I know though that there's plenty of scarfed revengers that would be able to force out aggron easily enough: even though you're set to outpace every non-boosted pokemon bar deoxys-s I don't see how you'd muscle through teams with it without having reliable ways to eliminate things like scarfed palkia and garchomp who will easily continue to force you out. A full-health wobbuffet can also come in safely after a sacrifice and counter or encore to get around rock polish pp stalling. Also if it gets burned by anything, including a defensive mewtwo which takes 75% max from LO head smash, its sweep is over. I guess I can see how aggron would be able to sweep given favorable conditions, but those things seem kind of difficult to manage; the other player just needs to know what to sacrifice to deal with it.

I'm not entirely sure what your point is by saying 'this Pokemon loses to scarfers and this random assortment of different Pokemon'. Basically anything that isn't scarfed itself or carries priority loses to scarfers, and each Pokemon has a random assortment of different Pokemon and sets that can take them out as well. And arguing 'lolwobbuffet' is dumb. Wobbuffet ****s over every non-mixed, non-boosted attacker in Ubers; and with correct prediction it takes out the mixed ones as well. I'd also like to point out that both Wobbuffet and physically bulky Mewtwo are done if you've managed to set up SR and even one layer of Spikes (which REALLY isn't hard to get up in Ubers, I might add) as well. A single Head Smash and it's guaranteed that they're done for the game, as the next time they switch in they're killed by entry hazards. And when considering the fact that Physically Bulky Mewtwo and Wobbuffet are typically used as a centerfold (or if not a centerfold, it's at least a huge player for the core) and gateway for the centerfold respectively, it's kind of a big deal. Or it's at least a much bigger deal than just losing a simple Aggron, am I right?

Also, you do realize that Wobbuffet does TWO things for Aggron? Wobbuffet is the ultimate 'support' Pokemon in terms of getting something else in safely, and it's also the biggest Scarf killer in the game. And really, those are the two things that Aggron really needs in Ubers. The only other things that really threaten Aggron at that point are Groudon and Deoxys-A.

Then again, anything that has rock polish and a stab rock move can sweep in ubers, right? Even relicanth could use a rp+head smash set, put a bit more of its EVs in spdef, hit the same speed mark, and run around with stab water backing up his sweep.

Relicanth lacks the power and Steel-typing. Despite what you may think, those are two of the most endearing qualities about Aggron that other RP users lack. The two other big ones are the base 50 Speed, as it lets Aggron go Adamant and still outpace Mewtwo after a single RP, and the type coverage. Rhyperior can never boast the speed portion (as well as the Head Smash, obviously), as even when running Jolly it still loses to Mewtwo. And Aggron's type coverage is something that Relicanth can never touch. Between the lower attack and the inability to run Low Kick > EQ for Dialga, as well as being forced to use Waterfall in the last slot due to the overall lack of movepool to begin with (meaning it can't do **** to Groudon, sunlight says hi), it really is just the worse choice.

EDIT: I hate big posts. ****ing ninja'd.

 

[CRASHiC]

I need advice on how to set up Rayquaza+ Salemence properly.

 

[Gates]

If you're running the Double Dragon strategy the rest of your team has to be Lugia counters pretty much. The Scizor+Wobbuffet combo is good for this and you'll probably need Wobbuffet on your team anyway to clear stuff out. Scizor doesn't necessarily have to be used, any strong Pursuit user will do. TTar is a Pursuit user who can beat Lugia head-on. Taunt Mewtwo and Darkrai give Lugia headaches if she doesn't pack Toxic to prevent extended sweeps. Anything with Toxic can outlast Lugia specifically, but if she's partnered with Blissey it won't be too much of an issue for her, meaning that you should take out Bliss if you want to try this approach against Lugia. Stealth Rock is also a must.

 

[Riddle]

The double dragon strategy is mediocre but if you must use it make sure you have answers to what gates said as well as scarfers such as chomp. Wobb is completely necessary. Also make sure to run max speed on mence to tie witth palkia