Tips For Defeating Zelda

[Artmastercorey]

Hello I play Toonlink mostly. I am having trouble against good zelda players online( I feel she is one of the hardest matchups in the game. High tier).

A few things Im having trouble with

1.) -That teleport move zelda does. I played someone who spammed it and it was hard to react. Even when I knew it was coming and held shield down it was too late. It travels so fast. Not sure if it was because its online, but if I was falling from the air it was like a free kill everytime for her. Its alittle unpredicatble aswell , atleast greninja has a shadow on the ground to let me know where its coming but her's is like nearly instant and no sign. My solution was to try to mix my game up/ be more difficult for her to read but its still a hard move to react to even when I know its probably coming.

2.) -Power shielding. I played the most amazing player online who was able to powershield literally every move projectile, normal attack, anything. I never even seen pro players videos of this happening to this extent. It was so hard to get a single attack in (even when mixing it up) because they power shield/retaliate and if they made a mistake nayru's love would help them. It was like my attacks didnt exist.

3.) -Grab range. She seems to have same grab range as a tether-grabbing character but thats invisible. I try to play the spacing game and even run away when I see she's going for a grab but still kept getting grab. I was confused. I see on one of these threads she has some kinda of crazy pivot grab range.

Overall it seems zelda has a lot of tools that are hard to defeat for me. I feel I shouldnt be getting grabbed when she's so far away from me, that up b teleport move I feel shouldnt be so hard for me to get hit with even when im prepared for it, and power shielding is just something that makes her that much more of a beast. All the zelda characters are pretty hardcore in this game but if you guys who specialize in zelda gameplay have any tips that would be appreciated!

 

[F.u.j.i.n Age: Inquistion]

Don't approach and learn to shield.
You have 3 projectiles and a z-air sis, why are you getting constantly grabbed by one of the slowest characters in the game?
Your spacing game must be atrocious.

If you're honestly having that hard of a time with Zelda, then you must be pretty bad at this game.

 

[Artmastercorey]

come on man, atleast give me a mature/thoughtful response that can help in some way besides you must suck. I wanted to reply with some kind of retaliation but that solves nothing and i dont want to stoop to that level. Anyway I dont see why people say zelda is slow. She isnt slow at all in my opinion, just like some heavy characters in this game arent really slow either outside of walking speed. Its really not a character specific matchup thing as much as it is zelda's toolset and dealing with them is what Im asking. Its not as simple as "hey you got moves, why are you having trouble" sort of thing

Perhaps it was my fault for not explaining it simply enough but things like projectiles and zair work on a typical good zelda player but the "great" ones its a simple power shield. That;s why Im here to find solutions. Most zelda players 've encountered dont play as incredible as this person who was just a great smash bros player but even so I find some of zelda's moves difficult to deal with in general like her fast teleport. It could just be a wifi issue. But judging from the first reply perhaps this thread should be closed in fear of coming off a someone who is just upset over zelda rather than someone who wants a genuine discussion on tactics that counter her.

You can close this thread moderator. Thanks

 

[GdspdUblkprzdnt]

Don't approach and learn to shield.
You have 3 projectiles and a z-air sis, why are you getting constantly grabbed by one of the slowest characters in the game?
Your spacing game must be atrocious.

If you're honestly having that hard of a time with Zelda, then you must be pretty bad at this game.

Jeez, man. What are you like 14? Take your tumblr gifs elsewhere if you're just going to be a douche to strangers.

 

[Alacion]

Not sure if this is the case, but every Tink I face on FG is very trigger happy when it comes to projectiles which I think isn't the way to deal with Zelda. She doesn't really have a lot of options to deal with your superior aerials and zair really gives Zelda a hard time.

Generally though, it's more about fighting the player than the character. Does Zelda powershield a lot? Maybe consider grabbing. Does Zelda Nayru's a lot? Shield or step back then grab or punish. Does Zelda grab a lot? Stay back more. Just a few things to ponder.

I faced a Tink that always tried to read my rolls which worked a few times, but then I adapted to it and things began to become more and more one sided.

Fuujin does have a point in that Zelda is, objectively, a poor character. You were probably facing a Zelda that has better fundamentals. To be honest Farore's Wind is fairly easy to shield on reaction. Should practise that a bit.

 

[Zylach]

It does sound like you're a victim of the online's lag. If you say that you're shielding FW and not getting it out in time, it's probably a wifi issue more than it is your own. That said, you should still practice and understand the timing for FW since that's one of Zelda's main kill moves and, if you aren't shielding it most of the time, Zelda players will try and hit you with it as often as they can.

Another issue that you bring up is just how skilled this other player was compared to yourself. When you're facing really skilled players (no matter the character they use) don't expect to switch one thing up and win. It's great that you came here for advice. That shows that you wanna get better but it sounds more like you're asking us how to counter this Zelda in particular and it doesn't sound like it was Zelda that was giving you problems, but the player on the other end who really understood how you play and read your actions better than you read his.

To actually offer some substantial help here, as Tink, your projectiles and aerial game are what you'll want to abuse against Zelda. If the player is powershielding all of your projectiles, that's good. That means you're forcing a Zelda player to approach you. Zelda naturally doesn't want to approach you. However, that means you have to know when she's actually gonna go in and probably grab since she doesn't have many other options. That takes a keen eye and good observation of your opponent. There isn't any advice I can give you on specifically when a particular Zelda player will choose to go in on you when they're approaching by Pshielding all your projectiles. When you have the other player's pattern down, especially a Zelda player, she'll be relatively easy to punish compared to many other characters since she is pretty slow compared to the rest of the roster when it comes to endlag for moves and also movement speed.

If you're still having trouble with FW in a lagless environment, you just have to practice timing your shielding properly against it. It has a noticeable startup which means you have time to react (offline anyway) so timing it should be easy to pick up. Once you shield it, you have a ton of time to follow up with whatever you want since her endlag on FW is atrocious. Also, if you're having trouble against Nayru's Love, you'll wanna learn how to bait it, shield it, and punish it since it has a lot of endlag as well. If Zelda uses NL every time you go in, start foxtrotting towards her to force her to use it then punish.

I hope this helps.

 

[Meek Moths]

Hello I play Toonlink mostly

you deserve it...you deserve everything

 

[PGH_Chrispy]

Responding specifically to Faore's Wind, if it's really problematic, I believe there is a way to select your opponent on 3DS and have an icon representing their location, effectively showing which direction Faore's Wind is heading.

 

[Meek Moths]

^thats the reason why i only play wii u only

oh and also its better

 

[Meek Moths]

wrong thread ._______.

 

[Mocha]

Fujin pls.

Then you guys complain about the Link threads?

 

[F.u.j.i.n Age: Inquistion]

Fujin pls.

Then you guys complain about the Link threads?

I mean I'm sorry but....
These queens coming in here acting like Zelda is such a threat.
Someone has to tell them the truth.

They need to get a lot better.

 

[Lil Puddin]

I mean I'm sorry but....
These queens coming in here acting like Zelda is such a threat.
Someone has to tell them the truth.

They need to get a lot better.

In all honesty... This is very true. Zelda is a scary character but only when she gets reads. Nearly all of her attacks have punishable end lag and she is so easy to juggle. It's almost like Sakarai designed her to be a character that people can play against to learn about shielding and punishing with ease. So being bad against Zelda, even after a lot of fights, means the person gets burned and never learns for themselves. Which is OK. It's nothing to be ashamed of. But... They still need to get better.

I won't offer tips tho. Zelda is so easy to destroy, giving anyone tips on how to exploit her many weaknesses would be blasphemy since I'm a Zeldoo main. :C

 

[Amiracle]

Approach her

 

[Latte]

All you have to do is wait for her to FW off the edge and kill herself

 

[waluigithewalrus]

All you have to do is wait for her to FW off the edge and kill herself

Yep, pretty much that. I tried Zelda for a time but the number of SDs convinced me that she wasn't a good secondary for me.

 

[Phenomiracle]

Practice your damn fundamentals.

Nope.

Not saying anything to help you.

 

[Lil Puddin]

Yep, pretty much that. I tried Zelda for a time but the number of SDs convinced me that she wasn't a good secondary for me.

Using Zelda as a secondary or main is basically asking for a challenge no matter what. lol

 

[Macchiato]

Gorl nobody can defeat zelda.

 

[2004Zilla]

If you can shield when Zelda uses Farore's Wind you've practically won.

 

[Lil Puddin]

If you can shield when Zelda uses Farore's Wind you've practically won.

Or pretty much just learn how to shield in general. Unless she uses a tilt. You do not want to try and punish those directly.

 

[*JuriHan*]

Force her to approach, maintain a lead... etc. She has very limited and unsafe approach options and has to take risks when on the offensive. Also, she is very vulnerable in the air due to being floaty and light. Not playing her ground game gives you an advantage as well. I think a character's n-air cancels out Din's Fire as well. Shield when she warps and punish.

 

[Macchiato]

But yew can't beat Zelda, yew just SD when yew see her

 

[Linq]

There are some weaknesses that FW has that TL can take advantage of.
First, if Zelda or her target is off the ground, Farore's Wind will travel a set distance. Imagine a giant ring around her, representing the "danger zone". While you or she are airborne, anywhere inside or outside this ring is safe--you are only in danger if you are ON the ring. As TL is rather floaty, you can stay in the air for basically your whole approach, keeping you safe.
During the approach, you can toss a bomb at her, allowing you to come in with a fair or nair without the risk of getting grabbed (if she does grab, she gets a bomb to the head). Wavebounced arrows and TL's zair are also nice approach tools.
Use of the boomerang or bow requires caution, as if she activates FW and you are not already holding shield, you will be hit. If you read a FW, keep in mind that there is a single frame of vulnerability before her hitbox comes out, so if a bomb is falling in her target position, she will be hit and set up for an u-smash. An easy way to do this and be safe is z-drop the bomb from exploding height then back roll. If the FW comes out, you will be safe even if you mistimed the bomb drop, and TL's roll speed can allow you to punish faster than waiting for shieldstun to wear off.
Some of this is theorycraft, as I have not gone against a good Zelda with TL, but just keep the ring danger zone in mind and you can come up with some of your own techniques.