Things I Like - The Mafia Game - Game Over

[giraffelasergun]

Vote Count 2.5

Synchronicity(4): Kary, Chaco, Wam, Malakandra
Wam (2): Dark Horse, Synchronicity,
Malakandra (2): Boom Frog, Fontisian
Boomfrog (1): FrozenFlame

Not voting (2): Pythag, Laserguy
Day 2 Ends on Thursday the 17th at 5 PM CST. End of Day Countdown With 11 Alive, it takes 6 votes to eliminate

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Part of me thinks the wam/synchro crossvote is indicative of SvS? For wam voting synchro, I feel like most people had more ambivalent reactions to chaco pointing out a supposed scumslip, as opposed to wam who pretty much immediately agreed and sheeped him. If wam knew synchro is scum then it make sense that he would be more likely to believe it's an actual scumslip and would try to capitalize to avoid looking hesitant to push scum!synchro. I could also see synchro’s 180 on wam to be reflective of the very different situation that synchro is in, between being in a position to shift votes off of wam at EoD to receiving suspicion toDay, especially when they’ve faced blowback for their earlier push attempts this phase. I think wam's synchro vote is easier to see as SvS than the synchro -> wam but that vote also makes very little sense in general.

What makes you think Wam sheeped Chaco? I feel like they would make more effort to avoid voting one another if it was SvS...

Boomfrog’s play feels very different from his D1 play. Honestly seems a lot better tbh, I feel like he was basically a nonentity yesterDay.

Is this a town read? What do you like about him other than just being more active?

 

[Wam]

If sync flips mafia the below from flame looks bad to me. It definitely has hints of distancing and probing for another wagon.

It does mean the team is unlikely to be sync, boom, flame.

alright all caught up

Vote: Boomfrog

synch wagon is tempting but idk if it's better than going wam/boom at this juncture, need to sleep on it though I'm super tired and getting mentally lazy

updated reads

good guys prob:

1. Fontisian (Replacement for Gorf)
2. Kary
7. Pythag
4. Chaco

meh:
5. Dark Horse
12. Malakandra

can go:

3. LaserGuy
10. Synchronicity (Xivii and Bessie Hydra)
8. BoomFrog
13. Wam

 

[Wam]

fontisian

Can you explain the progression below

I want to yeet Boom.

We're not masons. I think it's towny for you to ask? I'm not clearing him for role reasons, I just feel like he's town.

Mala is just generically scummy. You made a point earlier about him rescinding his vote if he actually gave a ** about hammers, and I agree that's scummy. I do think his eod screaming felt towny, even though I'm not supposed to trust my feelings there. I kind of hated him ending up on Frozen, felt kind of lile how I just couldn't argue him into voting Frozen in Midnight because he didn't want to be there. He made this huge point Yesterday about logic versus feels with Wam v. Somi, and I kind of hate it? The stuff before he realized he'd be the deciding vote, because iirc we talked about how to lay out the causes of those feelings and the logic stuff the day before, and he didn't apply any of that, he just made a show about his logical conclusions versus his feelings. I liked his start of day, I think. Like, I understand the feeling of "**, we let the scum get away, and it's my fault for being indecisive, we need to kill him" and it felt genuine.

Vote: Mala

Olive branch. Frozen can handle Boom, maybe.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

weird that the guy who ends up hammering is asking questions like this before the wagons really start to take their final form

I think posts like that suggest it can't be Boom + Wam. Boom doesn't seem to care very much which waggon he ends on.
I think if Wam is scum, it's most likely with Sync and fonti. But from the Sabrar kill I just feel like it's WIFOM and Wam is probably town at this point.

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

What makes you think Wam sheeped Chaco? I feel like they would make more effort to avoid voting one another if it was SvS...

He literally quoted chaco’s post, said “I agree,” and voted the same person as him in what world would that not be considered sheeping?

I agree that in most circumstances it would be weird for scum to cross vote like that but if wam legitimately thinks it’s a scumslip and they’ve both been receiving a lot of pressure so far I could see them pulling out some hardcore distancing

Is this a town read? What do you like about him other than just being more active?

It’s a “slightly less scummy than before” read. He felt super passive EoD outside of the hammer and it feels like he’s trying to take more direct action today

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

I like the fact that wam pointed out fonti’s malak read though, it feels super hedge-y for someone who ends up voting mala afterward.

Mala receiving votes from Synchro, Boom and Fonti is not exactly a great set of endorsements

 

[#HBC | Kary]

He literally quoted chaco’s post, said “I agree,” and voted the same person as him in what world would that not be considered sheeping?

I'm pretty sure that Wam was giving Sync the side-eye before that though? Why are you only looking at the vote?

I agree that in most circumstances it would be weird for scum to cross vote like that but if wam legitimately thinks it’s a scumslip and they’ve both been receiving a lot of pressure so far I could see them pulling out some hardcore distancing

I feel like no-one has ever correctly identified SvS interactions before a flip happens. What do you make of #932 if they're buddies?

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

I'm pretty sure that Wam was giving Sync the side-eye before that though? Why are you only looking at the vote?

I see some stuff here and there but it feels like he was way more focused on pushing FF/Fonti before the slip. I also just think it’s weird that pretty much everyone else seemed to be either ambivalent about the scumslip or had the opposite reaction and started townreading synchro for the notes.

I feel like no-one has ever correctly identified SvS interactions before a flip happens. What do you make of #932 if they're buddies?

I mean I was scumreading both of them before the cross vote so i’m probably going to be biased in considering SvS.

I don’t really see what makes 932 so implausible if they’re both buddies? It seems far more concerned with trying to discredit the idea that the somi wagon was shady rather than justifying a wam town read.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

I see some stuff here and there but it feels like he was way more focused on pushing FF/Fonti before the slip. I also just think it’s weird that pretty much everyone else seemed to be either ambivalent about the scumslip or had the opposite reaction and started townreading synchro for the notes.

I felt like their vote was more OMGUS motivated, reminds me of their scumread on me from Day 1. Feels consistent at least.

I mean I was scumreading both of them before the cross vote so i’m probably going to be biased in considering SvS.

I don’t really see what makes 932 so implausible if they’re both buddies? It seems far more concerned with trying to discredit the idea that the somi wagon was shady rather than justifying a wam town read.

That post gives me defensive vibes, trying to persuade people of something, and I don't see why you would feel defensive with your partner.
I guess you have a point that it doesn't answer the question at all.

What's your read on BoomFrog / fonti ?

 

[Synchronicity]

Boom turns around and shades me with a weak generic reasoning. Felt like maybe they didn't want the attention from me, but also felt like it could be them giving the answer they think Xivii wanted to hear.

I think this is correct.

 

[Malakandra]

I also don't get how anyone can possibly think you're town.

touché

Like if this actually concerned you then you just wouldn't vote haha.

This is so dumb. Since when is voting someone and not wanting them to get hammered mutually exclusive? Sure I could see this argument if my vote put them at L-1, but L-2? No way. I asked to not hammer because Chaco looked very eager and there was HBC on there. I know for a fact last game we had multiple people voting placing people at stuff like L-1 without wanting a hammer. Hell, Chaco straight accidentally hammered someone last game because he was voting at that time, but he still didn't want people to hammer.

Ahh, gotcha, so I took the bullet for you and saved you from potentially looking scummy?

Not really, lets say I was not in game and was spectating. Everything else is the same but this time its say, Ninja who is taking my role here. If you do the same move in this scenario, I view it as a town move, because your needlessly putting yourself in sus if you are scum. i can see it being a scum move if both you and Ninja are scum, and you think you can handle the sus better than Ninja can. But since I know I'm not scum, that scenario can't be it.

Okay let me break this down. The name was not changed. It was written in such a time and way that the stream of consciousness you see is real, but when he churches it up and throws in a shotgun scum team he messed up. To anyone saying they were wrote in advance, why would they be when they’re in a hydra and openly chat with one another about their notes and reads? So yes they may have taken notes when doing a supposed redive into the game, but that defeats editing the name in slot. Regardless the way it’s been handled since I jumped on it doesn’t feel right to me.

Alright, I guess that makes sense. For my original point on this, I think its entirely possible that they could have just put Fonti down, because thats what they associated the slot with, but the notes were about gorf. I don't think this in it self is very telling, however I agree the reaction has been suspicious.

Malakandra Look at the inconsistencies since I highlighted that portion. “I edited it in, but didn’t edit it back, but I started reading from page 10 back so I already knew it was Fonti but as I’m reading I leave it Gorf”. I thought Xivii did Gorf/Fonti set up as well?

I saw that as well when Boomfrog mentioned it, thats a lot worse than your original point I feel. Also, I've noticed a lot of frustration about this from the synch slot, feels like a thing that was mentioned earlier about being frustrated about being caught for the wrong reasons to me.

doesn't scum!boom have real motive to just guarantee the misyeet knowing somi is town and if wam is scum? forcing the somi misyeet provides WAY less info to town then being forced to bus wam D1 and giving us a papertrail to parse

Yes. This is true and why I'm not as solid on Boom. However, this to me in the only scenario in which the boom vote switch is sus, which makes it totally predicated on Wam flip. Which is another reason he is near top of my do not yeet, because if we yeet Wam and for some reason he flips town, I'm more sure on it not being boom.

 

[#HBC | Dark Horse]

I felt like their vote was more OMGUS motivated, reminds me of their scumread on me from Day 1. Feels consistent at least

I guess I could see that, but regardless of the vote itself he’s still the only person outside of Chaco who seemed adamant that it’s a scumslip

That post gives me defensive vibes, trying to persuade people of something, and I don't see why you would feel defensive with your partner.
I guess you have a point that it doesn't answer the question at all.

I don’t think it’s that unlikely of a post for synchro to make, it would be in scum!synchro’s best interest to downplay the likeliness of scum on the somi wagon if they themselves are scum on the somi wagon

What's your read on BoomFrog / fonti ?

They’re both in my scumpool, I think fonti’s the scummier of the two

 

[BoomFrog]

don't ever remember you expressing a strong sabrar townread at all D1 which makes all these likes feel TMI. What's with this pattern bro?

This whole case is kinda **** and falls apart at your first point. Maybe you should have read some of my posts if you are going to make a case on me?

Sabrar - Real Sabrar. I'd been wondering where he'd gone. Nice to finally see him again.

Very (actual) top of my first reads list. This is a hard meta read. Sabrar and I are both old xkcd players and have played a bunch of games together. His style this game was VERY town!sabrar indicitive and Syncro can confirm that (and had the same read D1).

if you were so into everything sab had to say, why not more direct engagement with the slot in an attempt to coalition build with him?

Different boards, different styles, no reason to announce to scum "this guy is my hard town read, so you're going to have to shoot him because I'll never yeet him." I followed Sabrar when it mattered at EoD.

if EoD1 was really two town wagons though then killing Sab actually is the perfect way to frame wam for double misyeet and savvy scum would have known that also hmmmmmm

Don't hurt yourself patting yourself on the back.

is this scum!boom trying to pressure flip using his own lack of pro town play this game and using it as a weapon to deflect attention from the fact that he isn't playing particularly pro town and impugn slots attempting to sort him?

I expect to be one of the main wagons EoD toDay, that hasn't changed. But don't you agree that Mala having me so high on their list is weird and concerning?

late aggro aimed at laser. LG spooked and cosigns an NK on sab hearing **** like this maybe?

This wasn't aggro on LG and LG knows it. That's just a cheeky Sabrar joke.

Also, you never answered my request at the start of D2. Can you please tell me what you thought of my progression on you D1? Give me a timeline from your pespective. I don't need quotes or references or anything.

Lastly, if Wam is town half your case falls apart. Do you think I'm still scum if wam is town?

 

[Synchronicity]

I think it could be Boom + Mala + {Wam/Chaco/Laser}

Fonti, an alternative explanation for this:

I liked his start of day, I think. Like, I understand the feeling of "****, we let the scum get away, and it's my fault for being indecisive, we need to kill him" and it felt genuine.

is scum Mala + scum wam. The scum team may have anticipated the how bad the EoD made wam looked and intended to come into the day hard pushing him. Supporting this is the way Mala's case was entirely built on the premise that Wam was already scum. So thinking that wam is already likely done for, the team decides to bus/distance while pinning me as his scummate.

#HBC | Kary I can't for the life of me understand your obsession with me not voting Frozen. Do you think Frozen is town? If not whey do you think scum!me didn't vote him?

 

[Synchronicity]

" the how bad the EoD made wam looked " sorry for the typos I'm still waking up lol

 

[Synchronicity]

Vote: Malakandra

 

[Malakandra]

I think it could be Boom + Mala + {Wam/Chaco/Laser}

Say you yeet me today, I flip town, where does town you go from there?

" the how bad the EoD made wam looked " sorry for the typos I'm still waking up lol

Morning Mafia is the best way to wake up lol. I've been waking up and immediately reading the thread while eating breakfast for the last few game days. Actually helps my mind get into gear faster.

 

[Malakandra]

Say you yeet me today, I flip town, where does town you go from there?

sorry this is confusing, what I'm trying to say is how much of this is based on me? I know part of your laser is I havent interacted with him, is boom similar because of my read of him?

 

[BoomFrog]

Also, this. This is so gross. Dude, I'm talking about the weight of reputation as it relates to /reading/ Frozen, it's not some random moaning or commiserating. Why are you offering "support" but not factoring **** into your reads?

I never used "Pro Frozen is better then this" as part of my reads. That's never been a factor. In fact, I said I'd guess frozen is an easy missyeet, and that is factored into my reads. My frozen meta is based pretty much on just the last two games I've played with him.

To be clear, this is the problem. Boom was focused on his townreads and people he wanted to townread him back (scum motivation), and didn't care about where his scumreads were voting (town motivation).

¯\(ツ)/¯ I was more certain my town reads were town then that my scum reads were scum. I think that explains all of my EoD behaviour if you really consider it in that light.

One last thing. This is wrong. Scum!Hydras take notes not just to post them later for towncred but to better get their heads in sync, so they look town and consistent in their posting in the thread.

I've never played hydra, but that makes sense. I'll give the notes less weight.

 

[BoomFrog]

I think it could be Boom + Mala + {Wam/Chaco/Laser}

Again with the theory that I'm leading a scum team that is self destructing on D2. Why would I be spearheading Mala right now in this scenario?

 

[Chaco]

That scum pairing makes zero sense Synchronicity and is completely outside generally PoE. Support how that makes sense, please.

 

[Chaco]

General hydra’ism on Smashboards isn’t what Fonti suggests either though, BoomFrog , it’s generally both people posting on the account as they feel and discussing stuff in a private chat as well. Look back and look how often people used to forget to post from their hydras in archive. I’ve hydra’d several times and the only time I tried more fluidity was with JungleFever and we were scum. But still posted independently. However the fact that it’s culture there, may be superseding culture here since it’s a mixture. Would also explain the lack of content D1 from a generally more active Xivii. And you can attribute a lot of these posts to Xivii I believe, from posting style, which would be more indicative of Bessie notes in the background.

 

[Chaco]

D1 Sync reads don’t match up to what I’m seeing D2 at all. The only consistency was on Fonti/FF and now they are on Malak, who was townread by them D1. If anything I think Mala’s better toDay than yesterDay.

BoomFrog What’s your scum team thoughts? If you posted it already my b, I’m multi tabbing pages back.

 

[Chaco]

I can’t see a scum team where Wam fits, fwiw. Any possible route for him is cancelled out with how the rest of the team would be compromised.

 

[Chaco]

#HBC | Kary Between Fonti, Mala, Boom: who would be scum that fits your other scumreads?

Pythag I need interaction with you. Who is your town core?

 

[Chaco]

Wam Can I somehow get a link to your most recent town play?

 

[Wam]

Wam Can I somehow get a link to your most recent town play?

I have no idea it was on xkcd. Bessie? Synchronicity

 

[LaserGuy]

Catching up from p27

I don't have any. And even if I did, I wouldn't go along with this since I think it's against the spirit of the game. It should never be provable that you have notes or communication. There should always be room for doubt / the idea that they can be fabricated.

That being said, if you believe I'm capable of fabricating the notes I've already provided, then scum!me could just do the same thing here.

Yes, but the point of the operation was to test whether you had the notes readily available and see if your processing was consistent. While I wouldn't normally ask for someone's private notes, you voluntarily entered them into evidence. But anyway, I feel this may be a discussion that's more appropriate to be had in postgame, so I'll agree to let it lie for now. But I also don't think that I can trust the notes as much as I was inclined to since I can't verify anything further.

I think his town read of Mala is yucky. And his town read of somi.

Flipping for info isn't always the best, but there are circumstances where it is, and this is one of them.

I really don't like this flip flop on wam.

Right. Easy to miss when scanning EXISTING notes. Not easy to miss when writing notes. That means the notes really existed before toDay. Either sync made fake notes from day 1 with the intention of posting them for town cred or they are real.

So why do you think that this is definitely a townslip? Why couldn't they have made the notes earlier, but still be scum?

 

[Chaco]

Yeah I figured it might be difficult to get. I just wanna check some things.

 

[Wam]

I like the fact that wam pointed out fonti’s malak read though, it feels super hedge-y for someone who ends up voting mala afterward.

Mala receiving votes from Synchro, Boom and Fonti is not exactly a great set of endorsements

I get the impression mala is reasonably new? Is it people looking for an easier lynch?

 

[Chaco]

I get the impression mala is reasonably new? Is it people looking for an easier lynch?

What leads you to believe Mala is new?

 

[LaserGuy]

Wam You were Town in B99.

 

[LaserGuy]

Nevermind, no, I think you replaced out as scum?

 

[Chaco]

LaserGuy If Wam is scum here, what partners make sense with him?

 

[Wam]

Nevermind, no, I think you replaced out as scum?

Just double checked i was replaced early day 1 as I read a spoiler. Role was mafia strongman.

 

[Pythag]

I can’t see a scum team where Wam fits, fwiw. Any possible route for him is cancelled out with how the rest of the team would be compromised.

so wam wont fit just because it would mean that everyone else on the scum team is playing poorly?


Chaco my town core has been slowly changing.

frozens list I found myself agreeing a lot with

alright all caught up

updated reads

good guys prob:

1. Fontisian (Replacement for Gorf)
2. Kary
7. Pythag
4. Chaco

meh:
5. Dark Horse
12. Malakandra

can go:

3. LaserGuy
10. Synchronicity (Xivii and Bessie Hydra)
8. BoomFrog
13. Wam

And I like his vote on boom.

I don’t necessarily agree with synch or Fonti, (in the frozen list) but that’s me shooting from the hip right now.My lunch break is over. I’ll be back on later

 

[Malakandra]

I get the impression mala is reasonably new? Is it people looking for an easier lynch?

This is my third game of forum mafia, 2nd game as town. I have played Voice Chat hidden roles games in the past, Secret Hitler, Blood on the Clocktower, Coup mainly, more recently among us.

My first town game was really bad it was sumting sumting

Then I played scum, and did a lot better, it was midnight ops

 

[Malakandra]

For the easier yeet part, i think one of the only two good things I did in Sumting, was not get yeeted by coming out of my shell for a bit and posting openly. I don't think I'm that much of a push over yeet target as town, but I was very prone to letting myself get pocketed early in my first game I'd say. Take my self meta for a grain of salt and read the games if you want.

 

[Malakandra]

I am interested to see your response to Chaco on why you thought I was new, I don't remember mentioning it this game yet. Wam