There are no exploding containers

[Shiny Ivysaur]

Or rather, there are, but we can turn them off. Lets imagine a time where Sakurai has just confirmed this, that exploding boxes can be removed. All clear on that exploding containers may or may not be deactivated has not been confirmed in any way? Good. Now back to dream land.

So guys, now that we can turn off exploding containers, will we have to review item allowability? Post a list of all items (and variations) that you think should be banned. If they all seem to random to you, place a "ALL ITEMS BANNED" line at the bottom of your post. I'll start.

Gooey Bomb: Allowed
Cracker Launcher: Maybe
Crates and Barrels: Allowed
Exploding crates and barrels: Banned
Sliding Boxes: Banned
Banana peel: Allowed
Bumper, Smoke Ball, Franklin Badge: Allowed
Pitfall: Banned
Spicy Curry: Banned
Golden Hammer: Banned
Beam Sword: Maybe (Seriously, that's really freaking long)
Fire Flower: Allowed
Freezie: Allowed
HR bat: Maybe
Party Ball: Allowed
Exploding Party Ball: Banned
Mushrooms: Banned
Bob-omb: Banned
Koopa Shell (Green): Allowed
Smart Bomb: Allowed
Team Healer: Allowed
Dragoon: Allowed (If you can manage to get all 3 parts without getting hit enough to lose them or be KOd, you deserve it.)
Smash Ball: Allowed
ATs & Pokeballs: Banned

 

[mushroomedmario]

hmm i'd personally love items to be allowed in the competitive scene, i own with them....i hope there are some tourneys that allow items now

but i doubt it

 

[Aminar]

Why are pitfalls banned? Why isn't the Franklin Badge? Personally I'd say that we need more play exp. before knowing whats broken and not.

 

[TaurToph]

If we just keep SOME items i think it can add both depth and FUN to the game.

 

[Eaode]

Okay, you can say we should reevaluate the state of items in competitive play, because exploding containers can be switched off. That probably would have happened anyway.

But you really can't start making baseless claims about the brokenness of certain items without considerable amounts of competitive playtime with them.

 

[UltiMario]

I would want us to tun off Boxes, Capsules, ect in all. Only leaving an occasional Smashball Flying around.
Ooh, and Maybe the Bumper While we're ar it. That'd be awesome :3

 

[limitbreak]

Smashballs would have to be banned in serious tournaments. Some of them are just too over powered.

 

[Rhubarbo]

If there is an AT/Pokeball switch, those should be considered as well.

 

[Moo2]

No items. In case you guys don't remember, ice climbers is ice climberS. its plural. they can pick up two items.

For serious competition, no items except maybe a smash ball. For not-so-serious tournies, maybe items.

 

[SSJ4Kazuki]

Curry = SUPER banned
Cracker launcher = VERY banned
Fire flower = easy damage + trapping hitbox = banned


That's my two cents

 

[mushroomedmario]

No items. In case you guys don't remember, ice climbers is ice climberS. its plural. they can pick up two items.

For serious competition, no items except maybe a smash ball. For not-so-serious tournies, maybe items.

than if they're your opponent it would be your job to make sure they don't get two items...

 

[JayceMJ]

I doubt many items would be allowed in tournies. At most I think traps (Flipper, Bumper, Pit Fall, Land Mine) and weapons that give a smallish buff (Lip's Stick, Star Rod, Parasol) or very specialized (Mr. Saturn, Smoke Ball, Screw Attack) will be allowed. I do find it exceedingly annoying that there isn't a pick up button seperate from the attacks button but dems is the works.

Items that are just immediate buffs that you can still pick up items with such as the Franklin Badge will probably be banned. Any explosive (aside from the land mine and especially ones that can explode before you pick up) or overly powerful item like the hammers, dragoon, smash ball, pokeballs, the new fire flower, the cracker launcher, ect will likely be the first out of tournies.

PS You should probably change the title to match the topic. "What if there were no explosive containers?" would probably be better fitting and a lot less misleading.

 

[AnusNinja]

I'm gonna be honest.

I think items are needed this time around.

The game looks so good because of all that mayhem... no wavedashing, no l-canceling, none of that crap. There is so much to offer with all the new ATs and Pokeballs, and even just new items - turning them off seems like you're taking away a good chunk of the new material.

Something just isn't right about that.

 

[BraveDave88]

I'd be happy if just Smash Balls were allowed in tourneys. Really, the only truly broken one so far seems to be Bowser's. But I acknowledge that it's going to take some serious playtesting before ANYTHING is decided about that. I recall the people running around saying DK's final smash sucked and that it was just another indication of how unfair Smash Balls were. Well, turns out they were wrong there, I think our perceptions will be changed when Brawl finally comes out.

 

[:034:]

I agree. I see no problem with items without the exploding crates, though we should ban some really strong items.

Gooey Bomb: Allowed.
Cracker Launcher: Banned. Meta Knight killed Bowser at 90% with this. Bad stuff.
Crates and Barrels: Allowed.
Exploding crates and barrels: Banned.
Sliding Boxes: Allowed.
Banana peel: Allowed.
Bumper, Smoke Ball, Franklin Badge: Allowed.
Pitfall: Banned.
Spicy Curry: Banned.
Golden Hammer: Banned.
Beam Sword: Banned. Unless it turns out to be weak.
Fire Flower: Allowed.
Freezie: Maybe.
HR bat: Banned.
Party Ball: Allowed
Exploding Party Ball: Banned.
Mushrooms: Banned.
Bob-omb: Banned.
Koopa Shell (Green): Allowed.
Smart Bomb: Banned. If you ban Bob-omg, might as well ban the stronger version.
Team Healer: Allowed.
Dragoon: Allowed with the same reasons.
Smash Ball: Allowed, though on very low if you can item switch on certain items.
ATs & Pokeballs: Maybe.

 

[Santini]

That is really awesome (but I wonder why they even put those exploding things in from the start)

Without this randomness, plus the smash ball and the new item catching aspect, the tourney scene will really require an entire new attitude about items. They're completely different from Melee. So it will be interesting to see what happens.

But personally, my first thought is still to turn them off. I like 1v1 no gimmicks. But as I've never played this very different game, I may be just a babbling idiot trying to hold on to the past.

 

[GreatClayMonkey]

I agree. I see no problem with items without the exploding crates, though we should ban some really strong items.

Gooey Bomb: Allowed.
Cracker Launcher: Banned. Meta Knight killed Bowser at 90% with this. Bad stuff.
Crates and Barrels: Allowed.
Exploding crates and barrels: Banned.
Sliding Boxes: Allowed.
Banana peel: Allowed.
Bumper, Smoke Ball, Franklin Badge: Allowed.
Pitfall: Banned.
Spicy Curry: Banned.
Golden Hammer: Banned.
Beam Sword: Banned. Unless it turns out to be weak.
Fire Flower: Allowed.
Freezie: Maybe.
HR bat: Banned.
Party Ball: Allowed
Exploding Party Ball: Banned.
Mushrooms: Banned.
Bob-omb: Banned.
Koopa Shell (Green): Allowed.
Smart Bomb: Banned. If you ban Bob-omg, might as well ban the stronger version.
Team Healer: Allowed.
Dragoon: Allowed with the same reasons.
Smash Ball: Allowed, though on very low if you can item switch on certain items.
ATs & Pokeballs: Maybe.

I think thats a ptetty good list. As long as all items with a random factor are off or broken items they need to be off too *cough currry cough cough*

 

[Norm]

ya i would like to play in a tourney with items I'm better with them as i use them as part of my strategy

 

[Xanderous]

No thanks. Random = bad.

 

[Dantarion]

The original arguement that tourney people had against items(RANDOMNESS) still stands, even in brawl.

Remember, tournaments are played with money on the line, and having Random Item A fall from the sky to give your oppenent a victory is something that tourney rules are created to try to fix. I mean, the whole point of the tourney rules is to make smash like tekken, where the only thing you can really blame is yourself for losing, and there is no random aspect to it, except for the few characters who have moves with random outcomes(Peach turnips and Fsmash, Luigi side B),

 

[Xpressions X]

I think this thread really misses the point as to why items are not allowed in tourneys. Its not just because of exploding crates or broken items, imagine if you will that you are at the edge of a stage and you are about to do a quick smash to edge-gaurd your opponent so that they don't come back, but your attack never comes out in fact ur character is just standing there and your opponent makes it back on the stage safely. What happened?! Well a Mr. Saturn spawned at the same time you tried to attack and you picked it up instead of attacking. This is not only rediculous because of the fact that you didn't get to attack but at the same time your opponent usual gains the advantage.

Professional smashers want to put raw character against raw character and see who wins without there being any excuses such as "you only won because that beam sword spawned right next to you, and if it spawned next to me I woulda won" or " ****, I went to go do a dash attack but when I attacked a capsule spawned and I picked it up instead thats why you got that advantage."

Honestly though, These post have been coming up alot so maybe everyone who wants to go to a items smash tournament should join together and make one. Find other people that smash near you go to a local tournament together and request that the matches are item matches.

 

[Percon]

I think this thread really misses the point as to why items are not allowed in tourneys. Its not just because of exploding crates or broken items, imagine if you will that you are at the edge of a stage and you are about to do a quick smash to edge-gaurd your opponent so that they don't come back, but your attack never comes out in fact ur character is just standing there and your opponent makes it back on the stage safely. What happened?! Well a Mr. Saturn spawned at the same time you tried to attack and you picked it up instead of attacking. This is not only rediculous because of the fact that you didn't get to attack but at the same time your opponent usual gains the advantage.

Professional smashers want to put raw character against raw character and see who wins without there being any excuses such as "you only won because that beam sword spawned right next to you, and if it spawned next to me I woulda won" or " ****, I went to go do a dash attack but when I attacked a capsule spawned and I picked it up instead thats why you got that advantage."

Honestly though, These post have been coming up alot so maybe everyone who wants to go to a items smash tournament should join together and make one. Find other people that smash near you go to a local tournament together and request that the matches are item matches.

Not that I don't agree with you, but I think there are a few things wrong with what you said.

First, you can't pick up items while dashing. In fact, I think you need to be standing still. (I think, it's been a while since I played with items...) So that capsule wouldn't get in the way, really (so long as it's not exploding)

Same goes for the smash attack on the ledge - I don't think you can pick up an item if you're doing a smash attack. Even if you can, a "quick smash", for me at least, it done via cstick, so I wouldn't pick up that Mr.Saturn.

That doesn't mean items don't have their flaws, though. Having a bumper or a flipper spawn right next to you when you're edgeguarding someone is fortunate. Though, with the new airdodge mechanics and really good recoveries from everyone, I think it may not be as broken as it seems.

We'll have to see. There's no way to be sure until we experience it.

 

[youngtweety]

I am a little confused. Please help out a poor noob =p

When was "you can turn off exploding containers" confirmed and how?

 

[bluekitsune13]

"Real men use items"

 

[TheMagicalKuja]

^Laughable.

Also LAWL at people forgetting why items were ACTUALLY banned in the first place. While items do equal random, there was NOT a convincing case to banning them until the exploding container issue came about, as said by the mods themselves.

 

[Xpressions X]

Not that I don't agree with you, but I think there are a few things wrong with what you said.

First, you can't pick up items while dashing. In fact, I think you need to be standing still. (I think, it's been a while since I played with items...) So that capsule wouldn't get in the way, really (so long as it's not exploding)

Same goes for the smash attack on the ledge - I don't think you can pick up an item if you're doing a smash attack. Even if you can, a "quick smash", for me at least, it done via cstick, so I wouldn't pick up that Mr.Saturn.

That doesn't mean items don't have their flaws, though. Having a bumper or a flipper spawn right next to you when you're edgeguarding someone is fortunate. Though, with the new airdodge mechanics and really good recoveries from everyone, I think it may not be as broken as it seems.

We'll have to see. There's no way to be sure until we experience it.

Your right about the smash attacks I was thinking of what happens when you just press A and I mixed it with smashes, my bad . However when you first start up your dash attack and an item spawns you end up picking the item and walking with it instead of pulling off the attack,, this usually happens when you try to dash attack close to your opponent (I hope you get what I'm saying).

 

[Percon]

Yeah, yeah, I get ya. It's just been a while since I played with 'em. Ya know... I think I'm gonna go play a few item games RIGHT NOW. On flat zone.

Though items will almost certainly be banned at some point, I'm playing with 'em until the community as a whole says "no more items".

 

[ripman3]

If you want to play with items then just don't play with professionals.

I personally love items in free for alls and team battles because it increases the mayhem exponentially; but I would rather have them turned off in one on ones, because one on ones are more about having complete focus on beating your one opponent and not having too many distractions.

 

[Xpressions X]

Lol, yea that's what I did!

 

[Mad555]

Why would you ban mushrooms?

 

[iron blade]

Gooey Bomb: Allowed.
Cracker Launcher: Maybe.
Crates and Barrels: Allowed.
Exploding crates and barrels: Banned.
Sliding Boxes: Allowed.
Banana peel: Allowed.
Bumper, Smoke Ball, Franklin Badge: Allowed.
Pitfall: Allowed.
Spicy Curry: HELL NO.
Golden Hammer: Banned.
Beam Sword: Maybe.
Fire Flower: Maybe.
Freezie: Maybe.
HR bat: Allowed. Anyone with half a brain can avoid it, but you can still try.
Party Ball: Allowed
Exploding Party Ball: Banned.
Mushrooms: Banned.
Bob-omb: Banned.
Koopa Shell (Green): Allowed.
Smart Bomb: Banned. Almost as broken as Curry.
Team Healer: Allowed.
Dragoon: Allowed.
Smash Ball: Allowed.
ATs & Pokeballs: Banned.

 

[Brenco55]

all items banned

 

[ARX-7 Arbalest]

hmmm as annoying as being killed by a trick container or capsule is...id miss them because thats one of the things i loved about smash. the sheer randomness of when ur hit by/u hit a container/capsule, u dont kno if it'll explode or not.

admit that some matches have ended great because someone got KO'd by a trick capsule