The ULTIMATE KONG--Dixie Kong's Barrel of Support Buddies

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So, for what it’s worth I did PM loz18 to ask if he had heard anything about Dixie and he said:
“I don't know but I think she will be an Echo of Diddy for two reasons. Diddy's attacks were changed to not include his tail so that may point to a change in pattern to fit Dixie. And the DK series is having an increase in representation so it makes sense. I'm not confirming it but there you go...”

I know he doesn’t know for sure but the fact that he thinks she is in makes me feel even more confident.
Wait, who is loz18?
 

Marcello691

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As far as importance goes, yes, Dixie goes above and beyond. But in a game where newcomer derivatives all follow the newly-set up Echo brand, asking for Dixie to be an exception and be a semi-clone with a wishlist of things she HAS to do feels weird when other Echoes aren't 100% faithful either (with Dark Samus having potential of her own as shown in the AT, and Daisy being the best example of her using stuff she never did to fit the Echo predicament)

Importance has little to do with it in my opinion. Clones and derivatives all play by the same Echo rules and so far I have little reason to believe that Dixie would need to bend those rules in order to be in the game.



I've noted the difference of Daisy's "Using moves she was never associated with" and Dixie's possible "Not using moves she's directly associated with" before, and that's a viable complaint. But now that Helicopter Spin is back on the table thanks to Chrom, I feel it is not inexcusable for Dixie to use Diddy's moveset because aside from Rocket Barrel, nothing in there is really exclusive to Diddy (Like Monkey Flip and Banana Peel aren't Diddy's signature moves)! The weird part would come when Dixie's abilities wouldn't take a front seat, but with Helicopter Spin UpB I feel that'd be good enough for a clone.

Her personality has all room to shine through in the animations still.

That said, if Dixie turns out to be fully unique, I wouldn't complain. With Smash Ultimate movesets being much less gimmicky than Smash 4's, she can truly be a great momentum-based playstyle.

But if she's a Diddy derivative, then she's gonna be an Echo. (Or, at least, it'd piss me off if she would suddenly be a semi-clone)
When Daisy was revealed I just thought WTF! Only main characters and characters that are important to their series or ones that are somehow important to Nintendo's history make the cut. So you should be thankful and honored a character like daisy ( a copy of peach and literally a spin off character like waluigi) made it into the game.
I don't understand why you should be pissed off if Dixie is an original fighter or semi-clone. She is a beloved and important character from her series and now that k.rool is in the game it would be really hilarious if she isn't in the game. I mean she was once planned for brawl, she is popular enough, has appeared in tropical freeze and dk is still underrepresented in smash.

And Metroid probably haven't got a new stage yet because metroid other m was the latest game in the series to be considered for smash and there was already a stage based off (of? Sorry, English is not my first language) that game in smash 4. Samus returns for 3ds was likely neglected because smash Ultimates roster and etc was finalized at end of 2015. So tropical freeze should be 100% represented in ultimate.
 
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Sakurai's dad.

What else did this individual leak?
Ah ha! You’re so funny Reila! Ha! Ha!

No, really. I can’t stand you.


Anyway I’m going to cheer for Dixie one more time, if she doesn’t make it, even with Dlcs, I’ll definitely give up. Forever.
 
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Loz18 is one of the leaker that said Simon Belmont and Ridley would be in the game, if i'm not mistaken
Ah. I haven't been keeping up with leaks and stuff so I was wondering who that was. While he got Ridley and Simon, he seems to have had partial info if he didn't just get lucky, so his take on Dixie seems to be speculation.
 

Reila

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Ah ha! You’re so funny Reila! Ha! Ha!

No, really. I can’t stand you.
Oh, poor you. Feel free to put me in the ignore list in that case.
I think he also leaked the Heroes vs villains theme from the k.rool reveal trailer
I see. It does seem to be a theme so far, though I wonder if there is any other villain they added to Smash Ultimate.
"Definitely King K. Rool from Donkey Kong and Majora’s Skull Kid.

"Majora’s Skull Kid. "

Oh man, this would be so good. It is so not happening ;-;
 
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BluePikmin11

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The bigger question is whether or not she was planned from the beginning or if she was planned late in development as an echo. She might be planned Brawl-esque style similar to Wolf and Toon Link. We might have a situation where both semi-clones and echos were planned for this game. I believe Dixie is important enough to her franchise to be given special treatment and be planned in the initial roster plan, sort of like Isabelle in a sense.
 
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IDK when we'll get the next direct, but my educated prediction is that Sakurai will go into detail about K. Rool, like he did with Inklings, Ridley and Simon. Since he showed up at the end there wasn't time to go into the specifics with him, so the next direct is likely the time to expand. He'll cover his moveset, go into his design, point out how popular he is and then segue to other things, and if Dixie's in the game, this will currently be the best time to show her. Will she be an Echo or Unique? IDK, but if she doesn't show up then it's time to worry, as at that point she will have missed 2 big opportunities to be revealed. Hope won't be lost, but it will be in jeopardy.
 

SenSx

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It's a bit sad that some people do not want here if she is an echoe.
If it happens, it means they can't do any better for her right now, and it is better than nothing.
You will find me not thankfull enough, but despite the incredible K.Rool announcement, I still think the roster screen will look weird with only DK, Diddy and K.Rool.
She is one of the last missing All Star characters, and we don't have many iconic females to begin with.
I still think she should have been there alwready, in my opinion, she is much more Iconic than Rosalina or Daisy (no disrespect for those characters, and Rosalina is my favorite female character from the Mario serie), but Dixie was playable in a game that is still considered one of the best 2D platformer of all time, if not the best : DKC2, and she is the star of DKC3.
Let's go Dixie ! Even as Echoe !
 
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VeemonTamer

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Random thought but imo Diddy should of been added in Melee, K Rool Brawl, Dixie WiiU or something along those lines. I think it's kinda crazy we are just now getting more DK representation. Don't get me wrong I'm beyond greatful I'm just a bit baffled by the timing of it all. I'm happy the fandom stepped up and made as much noise as it did to get more representation in the game. Dixie has gotta be on the way too.
 

SenSx

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I just want to add, that even as an echoe, she will still be Dixie.
She could be a mix of Diddy and DK to make her more unique, she'd have here own voice, taunts and maybe some animations and sligth changes.
I'd enjoy that.
But apparently we haven't seen Diddy's final smash yet, maybe I'm wrong.
That worries me a bit, because I hope we won't see Dixie showing up, that would disconfirm her immediatly.
But hopefully, they would have showed that early not to make us hope in vain for too long.
 
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IDK when we'll get the next direct, but my educated prediction is that Sakurai will go into detail about K. Rool, like he did with Inklings, Ridley and Simon. Since he showed up at the end there wasn't time to go into the specifics with him, so the next direct is likely the time to expand. He'll cover his moveset, go into his design, point out how popular he is and then segue to other things, and if Dixie's in the game, this will currently be the best time to show her.
I totally agree with you. Maybe that's why they didn't show Dixie at the end of K rool's trailer.
 
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I totally agree with you. Maybe that's why they didn't show Dixie at the end of K rool's trailer.
Yea, I feel safe in saying there's a follow up coming, since Inklings got surprise-revealed at the end of a presentation and then given focus in the next (along with other content). If Sakurai does go into detail with K. Rool's incarnation, we'd not only get Dixie's greatest time to shine but also Sakurai could highlight how much attention he's giving the DK series this time. Maybe show us the remastered stages, a new stage, DK items and ATs and, almost as important as Dixie, address the neglected music from the series! So far we have 2 new remixed tracks from DKC; I'm sure Sakurai's heard the Jungle Level complaints and he's definitely the type to address criticisms, so this is gonna be an interesting Direct we have coming.

That said, I wanna point out that I LOVE this game already. It has so much going for it and effort put into it that it's straight up mind-blowing. I know people have their seats reserved for the DLC train, but even without Dixie and Rayman I'm gonna be very happy with the base game.

I'll probably buy them if they're DLC though.
 

cybersai

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Since all Dixie really needs is her helicopter hair spin and her hair throw, I'm fine with a lot of her other moves being loosely based on Diddy.

Echoes proved they have unique animations, so either way Dixie will have her own girlish charm to her moves and won't look exactly like Diddy when she's fighting or standing or whatever.
 

pepiux

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Some food for thought regarding all this "Dixie can totally be an Echo", or the new one "Dixie can be an Echo now because her Up-B can be changed". These ideas are thrown around simply because she CAN be an Echo, but not because she SHOULD be.

Just like Parallel_Falchion Parallel_Falchion said, and I agree 100%: it is more than likely that none of the currently shown Echoes would've made it into the game as unique fighters. Yes, they are popular, and yes, they COULD be unique, but we must not forget that this game concentrates several important factors regarding a character, which include history with Nintendo, relevancy, etc. While these Echos have had roles in previous games, I honestly don't think ANY of them (bar perhaps Chrom in Sakurai's eyes) have contributed enough to their respective series to be considered for the game in a scenario where Echoes did not exist.

Think about it, Sakurai said Lucina was lucky she got in, and we can safely assume Dark Pit was added late to increase the roster number. Daisy, while an important character and highly popular, has never made a big jump like other Mario characters and be playable or have a major role in a bigger game other than spin-offs. Do we seriously think Richter would've made it as a unique character? Not with Simon Belmont's importance. Similarly, Dark Samus is not important enough to the Metroid series and is thwarted by Ridely as a main boss. Chrom got simply upgraded because Echoes are a thing.

The point I'm making is that all Echoes so far got in because they CAN BE echoes AND they are popular with fans, but certainly NOT because they are important and relevant enough to the Nintendo universe.

I simply cannot see Sakurai giving her the full Echo treatment, or have only her Up-B changed. Dixie can be an Echo and is popular enough, yes. HOWEVER, her contributions to Nintendo are of a different caliber, being the face of her own game and the co-star of perhaps the best game in the series, having a long history with Nintendo and being highly relevant due to the success of Tropical Freeze. She also did quite well in the Ballot I believe. She was also considered to be in Brawl, and I HIGHLY doubt she was thought of as a clone of Diddy there, as they were supposed to be a tag team. All other Echoes currently do not have these credentials. Dixie, in the worst case scenario, will be a Lucas/Wolf style of clone.

So please, think a bit before proposing the idea of Dixie being an Echo. Time constraints and roster size are a factor, yes, but I do not think they were a factor in deciding who would be an Echo back then in 2015: characters were put on the table and considered on their own merits. If Sakurai thought Wario was important enough to not be made into a clone back in Melee, I am sure he considered Dixie with the same eyes when deciding this game's roster, independently of who else got in.

TL;DR: Dixie is in a different category than all other characters who have got in as Echoes, who have only got in because they are popular with the fans but certainly not important or relevant enough in their own series to have made it as unique. There are some exceptions in the roster, and cases can be made for certain Echoes, but this is the main point I want to get through.
 
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So please, think a bit before proposing the idea of Dixie being an Echo. Time constraints and roster size are a factor, yes, but I do not think they were a factor in deciding who would be an Echo back then in 2015: characters were put on the table and considered on their own merits. If Sakurai thought Wario was important enough to not be made into a clone back in Melee, I am sure he thought the same of Dixie when deciding this game's roster.
This is a self-fulfilling prophecy.

People kept saying Dixie would be a Diddy clone since pre-Brawl and instead supported K. Rool because he would be unique. Sakurai might have taken it to heart and made it true.
 

pepiux

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This is a self-fulfilling prophecy.

People kept saying Dixie would be a Diddy clone since pre-Brawl and instead supported K. Rool because he would be unique. Sakurai might have taken it to heart and made it true.
This is what I'm afraid of. Everyone thinking she should be a clone and Sakurai thinking it's our wish. Don't think we should worry about it for now though.
 
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This is a self-fulfilling prophecy.

People kept saying Dixie would be a Diddy clone since pre-Brawl and instead supported K. Rool because he would be unique. Sakurai might have taken it to heart and made it true.
If THAT turns out to be the reason why she's an Echo--if she gets in as one--then I'm gonna be annoyed. Sakurai counting her out because her fanbases did would be sad honestly.
 

Luigi player

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I guess Dixie could get DKs upb if she's an echo of both him and Diddy? lol

would still be sad, but she's still possible. we know dk got a lot of attention now with k rool and dark samus was revealed later after ridley.. and since echos are basically thrown at us they seem to be easy to do. so we'll see.

I definitely still want to see her, but I'm still hoping for at least semi-clone.
 

pepiux

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I guess Dixie could get DKs upb if she's an echo of both him and Diddy? lol

would still be sad, but she's still possible. we know dk got a lot of attention now with k rool and dark samus was revealed later after ridley.. and since echos are basically thrown at us they seem to be easy to do. so we'll see.

I definitely still want to see her, but I'm still hoping for at least semi-clone.
Semi-clone like Lucas and Wolf is the perfect thing. If she's in, she will definitely be borrowing assets from Diddy, no question about it.
 
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I still think Dixie shouldn't be an echo fighter. I don't think giving her a ponytail recovery is enough to represent her properly. I still believe several of her moves should be her swing her ponytail, and that she should grab and throw people with her ponytail. Sakurai has done such a great job at representing these characters, he clearly understands the history of all of these characters, and for him to include a version of Dixie that doesn't attack with her hair just doesn't seem like something he would do.
 

DeltaSceptile

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I still think Dixie shouldn't be an echo fighter. I don't think giving her a ponytail recovery is enough to represent her properly. I still believe several of her moves should be her swing her ponytail, and that she should grab and throw people with her ponytail. Sakurai has done such a great job at representing these characters, he clearly understands the history of all of these characters, and for him to include a version of Dixie that doesn't attack with her hair just doesn't seem like something he would do.
Yeah, I doubt she’d ever be an echo, especially with the emphasis Sakurai put on how she uses her hair in her smash 4 trophy description.
 
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