The Ultimate amiibo meta is still completely crazy

[Amiibo Doctor]

In Smash 4 we pretty quickly figured out which amiibo were the best, and then filled out the tiers from there. Vanilla got skipped over completely because of that and everybody just used customs/equipment amiibo instead of vanilla. Now with Ultimate coming along vanilla's getting a second chance... and wouldn't you know it, it looks to be totally unpredictable.
Aside from Link being probably the best vanilla amiibo, and aside from Slow Super Armor and Super Armor being the best Spirits for the Spirits meta, there's really nothing that we know for sure about the competitive amiibo meta right now.

I personally think that's because of the balance of the game: the characters are pretty well balanced, and the AI is so significantly improved that it's hard to not have an amiibo that makes the most of its character. It's pretty clear there are some amiibo that are never going to make top tier due to AI issues (Inkling, imo Villager) hindering them from the more complex parts of their character, there's a pretty good chunk of the 70ish amiibo available to us that can win a tournament. Frankly, I'm pretty happy about that.

Is it just me or is the competitive amiibo meta going to stay a mixup game for a while?

 

[Mogisthelioma]

Amiibo can learn but they can only learn so much. I've never seen an amiibo dashdance or try to bait approaches with short opes. It's prety obvious the most they can do is read inputs, don't worry about it.

 

[Amiibo Doctor]

Amiibo can learn but they can only learn so much. I've never seen an amiibo dashdance or try to bait approaches with short opes. It's prety obvious the most they can do is read inputs, don't worry about it.

Have you trained in Ultimate? Amiibo dash dance so much it's a real problem. They're actually hella smart in Ultimate, and they get smarter as they go on (even past level 50!)

 

[Call_Me_Red]

I'm interested in seeing how good these amiibos are, any links to...competitive amiibo-ing?

Also, I remember in early Smash 4 when an amiibo took third place in a fairly big tournament. Anything like that happening this time?

 

[Amiibo Doctor]

I'm interested in seeing how good these amiibos are, any links to...competitive amiibo-ing?

Also, I remember in early Smash 4 when an amiibo took third place in a fairly big tournament. Anything like that happening this time?

Yeah, I can link you to some stuff.
Here's some VODs and exhibition videos: here
There's a bunch of links in every video that have other content as well. I've written a lot of the literature on the scene myself.

These days we keep human tournaments and amiibo tournaments separate, mostly for the sake of the humans. Amiibo are actually much harder to beat in Ultimate and if somebody entered an actually good amiibo in an Ultimate tournament, they'd likely make it to GF consistently. AI aside they also have a +20% attack and defense boost, which isn't as strong as it was in 4 but still noticeable.

 

[Manonymous]

Amiibo tournaments exist ? Man, I really want to see that now ! And are there already amiibo tournaments now ?

 

[MG_3989]

I’ve literally never even seen or used an amiibo match in Smash or any other game. I have trouble believing that they’d ever be good enough to not be three stocked by top level pros though if there was a mixed tournament

 

[Amiibo Doctor]

I’ve literally never even seen or used an amiibo match in Smash or any other game. I have trouble believing that they’d ever be good enough to not be three stocked by top level pros though if there was a mixed tournament

I'm not talking about submitting them to EVO necessarily (although I don't think they'd be three stocked), I was referring to smaller tournaments in general.

Amiibo tournaments exist ? Man, I really want to see that now ! And are there already amiibo tournaments now ?

Oh yeah, there's been amiibo tournaments for four years now. I linked a commenter previously to videos of two tournaments that I hosted, just scroll up. They're incredibly interesting to participate in.

 

[MG_3989]

I'm not talking about submitting them to EVO necessarily (although I don't think they'd be three stocked), I was referring to smaller tournaments in general.


Oh yeah, there's been amiibo tournaments for four years now. I linked a commenter previously to videos of two tournaments that I hosted, just scroll up. They're incredibly interesting to participate in.

Even at locals and weeklys people are really good at the game. Amiibos may be able to learn but they’re not true AI meaning they’ll always be exploitable because they aren’t thinking. I don’t think they’d stand a chance at a legit tournament even a weekly

 

[Amiibo Doctor]

Even at locals and weeklys people are really good at the game. Amiibos may be able to learn but they’re not true AI meaning they’ll always be exploitable because they aren’t thinking. I don’t think they’d stand a chance at a legit tournament even a weekly

Well, how about you have your opinion and I have mine.
I speak out of experience, by the way.

 

[Call_Me_Red]

Well, how about you have your opinion and I have mine.
I speak out of experience, by the way.

I don't think he's trying to be argumentative. A lot of us have never even considered amiibo tournaments and are honestly interested in how high level they are. I think I speak for most people in this thread when I say I'd love to see a professional player against a well trained amiibo.

 

[MG_3989]

I don't think he's trying to be argumentative. A lot of us have never even considered amiibo tournaments and are honestly interested in how high level they are. I think I speak for most people in this thread when I say I'd love to see a professional player against a well trained amiibo.

Yeah that’s pretty much where I’m coming from

 

[Amiibo Doctor]

I don't think he's trying to be argumentative. A lot of us have never even considered amiibo tournaments and are honestly interested in how high level they are. I think I speak for most people in this thread when I say I'd love to see a professional player against a well trained amiibo.

I really would like to see it, too, I think that'd be a fun time.
I responded that way because it's the sort of discussion that has no end until you see it in action, and I didn't want to spend the rest of the day arguing about it. Apologies to MG_3989 if that sounded harsh.

 

[DeKu Skrub]

Yo, Skylander cockfighting? Sounds legit.