The True Arena - Kirby MU Discussion "Weeks" 10/11: Ness, Meta Knight, Lucario and Lucas

[Togii]

I'm just sharing my knowledge with the Yoshi MU from tournaments, including friendlies. I am aware that Kirby can barely approach Yoshi in the air, or n-air through his jabs and all that jazz. Honestly, it just doesn't feel like a terrible matchup. Then again, maybe I shouldn't share my personal opinion on things. I know it's a bad MU, but should it really be 30:70 in Yoshi's favor?

Yes.

 

[Dee-SmashinBoss]

doubt it lol.
Sparky going to EVO or anything?
I think we still need more people participating, and its surprising how other boards are providing next to no help and Sapphire is advertising that we are discussing that MU, seriously do none of them even bother to help?

 

[Sparky15]

Sparky going to EVO or anything?

Sorry, but I generally can't go out of state. I'm just trapped in Michigan... On that note, even though I feel like I'm 9 years late -_-, good luck at EVO, Togii.

 

[Bribery]

Shouldn't the Yoshi ratios for default and customs be switched, or at least be the same? It's currently 35:65 in default and 30:70 for customs. I can't imagine the MU getting worse for Kirby with customs on since Yoshi doesn't really improve with them while Kirby does.

 

[SapphSabre777]

Shouldn't the Yoshi ratios for default and customs be switched, or at least be the same? It's currently 35:65 in default and 30:70 for customs. I can't imagine the MU getting worse for Kirby with customs on since Yoshi doesn't really improve with them while Kirby does.

Yeah, I can see that. It does seem a bit nonsensical. Of course, it will probably be worse without customs, but if everyone is okay with it, I'd be more than happy to flip-flop it.

Also, I assume everything has died down thanks to EVO, because the Boards are less populated than a ghost town right now. Not a problem at all, just a bit surprised at the activity and such.

 

[RedNova]

Also, I assume everything has died down thanks to EVO, because the Boards are less populated than a ghost town right now. Not a problem at all, just a bit surprised at the activity and such.

I thought it had been like this for the whole week. I really wish to see more activity in the Kirby boards.

In the meantime, I'm gonna work in the Falcon analysis when I get back home.

 

[Underhill]

It's already been discussed, but discussing a few slight things here and there wouldn't hurt, especially if they are things that haven't been touched upon. And it is not a dumb question in the slightest. ^^

Ok. Well, I don't have any useful information about the match-up right now since I don't know everything about Sheik, but I do have a couple of replay videos to show about me fighting a sheik player as Kirby if its allowed. I was doing friendies with him.

 

[SapphSabre777]

Ok. Well, I don't have any useful information about the match-up right now since I don't know everything about Sheik, but I do have a couple of replay videos to show about me fighting a sheik player as Kirby if its allowed. I was doing friendies with him.

Replays will be just fine. ^^

 

[Dee-SmashinBoss]

so if boards are going to be inactive for a bit, should we discuss these MUs later? or at least discuss them on more active boards? I bet shiek threads may still be active

 

[SapphSabre777]

so if boards are going to be inactive for a bit, should we discuss these MUs later? or at least discuss them on more active boards? I bet shiek threads may still be active

I think a free discussion period for the next couple of days would be a nice thing to do with this absence of activity with EVO. Going over to other active boards and such would be a nice way to draw out all sorts of information. I know this is something those YouTubers would do, but "Like" if you agree with this idea of a few days of free discussion?

 

[Wintermelon43]

I think a free discussion period for the next couple of days would be a nice thing to do with this absence of activity with EVO. Going over to other active boards and such would be a nice way to draw out all sorts of information. I know this is something those YouTubers would do, but "Like" if you agree with this idea of a few days of free discussion?

Yeah, we could do it duing EVO, and dicuss thet matchups that people did, if somebody would want to dicuss it.

 

[Togii]

I know this isn't matchup stuff, but I figured I would report my Evo results. I got sent to losers by a Luigi on my 2nd match, then got beaten by him again in loser's finals of my pool. In other words, I hate the Luigi matchup even more now lol

 

[Wintermelon43]

I know this isn't matchup stuff, but I figured I would report my Evo results. I got sent to losers by a Luigi on my 2nd match, then got beaten by him again in loser's finals of my pool. In other words, I hate the Luigi matchup even more now lol

What pool were you in, I missed yours, so when evo finishs I want to be able to watch yours on the past broadcasts

 

[Togii]

What pool were you in, I missed yours, so when evo finishs I want to be able to watch yours on the past broadcasts

My pool wasn't streamed at all, unfortunately. Idk what pool I was in, you can search my tag on the Evo brackets.

 

[Altair357]

Puffballs of a feather, I suppose. I also lost to the same Luigi twice. Made it to like, losers' semis or something.

 

[Mazdamaxsti]

Sorry I haven't been posting MU discussions, I'm at camp. I will def start in 8 days tho.

 

[Underhill]

Replays will be just fine. ^^

Can't give to you from Youtube because I don't have a account, but I can sent a few to you if that's ok with you.

 

[SapphSabre777]

Can't give to you from Youtube because I don't have a account, but I can sent a few to you if that's ok with you.

Well, I don't have a capture card of sorts, so I cannot translate a replay to a video, sadly. However, I'm sure there are a few people around here that can record or capture the footage. @ Mazdamaxsti , didn't you say you had a capture card?

 

[Togii]

Well, I don't have a capture card of sorts, so I cannot translate a replay to a video, sadly. However, I'm sure there are a few people around here that can record or capture the footage. @ Mazdamaxsti , didn't you say you had a capture card?

I have one. I think my Wii U ID is Togii, if you want to send the replay my way.

 

[Underhill]

I have one. I think my Wii U ID is Togii, if you want to send the replay my way.

Ok. The matches aren't much, but I hope they help.

Edit: Are you sure it's Togii on the Wii u because the ok sign is not coming since your id is five characters and has to be at least six?

 

[Underhill]

Well, I don't have a capture card of sorts, so I cannot translate a replay to a video, sadly. However, I'm sure there are a few people around here that can record or capture the footage. @ Mazdamaxsti , didn't you say you had a capture card?

I found one at Walmart and they cost $20 for the wii. If you're thinking of buying one, then that's the best place to go because I don't think they have them anyother store, but I may be wrong since I don't live in your city.

 

[SapphSabre777]

I found one at Walmart and they cost $20 for the wii. If you're thinking of buying one, then that's the best place to go because I don't think they have them anyother store, but I may be wrong since I don't live in your city.

A $20 Wii U Capture Card? That's a steal! Forgive me for this, but I'm going to run off and see what you mean. XD

 

[Underhill]

A $20 Wii U Capture Card? That's a steal! Forgive me for this, but I'm going to run off and see what you mean. XD

Yup. Good luck at Walmart..

 

[SapphSabre777]

I hope you guys are enjoying EVO and the free discussion. Just a reminder that tomorrow we discuss our characters for the week.

 

[Mazdamaxsti]

Well, I don't have a capture card of sorts, so I cannot translate a replay to a video, sadly. However, I'm sure there are a few people around here that can record or capture the footage. @ Mazdamaxsti , didn't you say you had a capture card?

I do but I'm not at my wii u for another week

 

[Dee-SmashinBoss]

We are going to put the MU ratios on the OP after a few more people discuss on them right?
I mean, we should have like.....3+ ratios from different people, maybe even include players who actually play that character.
You know, just so we dont have like 1 or 2 opinions on a MU and have their ratios be the real thing.
I would rather not believe a MUs ratio unless there are at least a few people who give some knowledge, but thats just me.

 

[Sparky15]

While there's still time for free discussion... how about some tech skill I discovered by my own? Here's a vid of it demonstrated at 5:08 and 8:50. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MIYjZQxMV0 I call it "Pluckdashing", which is preforming an inital dash, then buffering a Pikmin Toss and then another inital dash. This is excellent for follow-ups, positioning, spacing, and zoning. Definitely makes the Olimar MU much easier, I'd like to say it's in Kirby's favor at that point. I do have other matches to show these off, but those were before the 1.0.8 patch, despite that Olimar and Kirby were generally not entirely different between all of the patches. Just let me know and I'll link those, too.

 

[RedNova]

While there's still time for free discussion... how about some tech skill I discovered by my own? Here's a vid of it demonstrated at 5:08 and 8:50. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MIYjZQxMV0 I call it "Pluckdashing", which is preforming an inital dash, then buffering a Pikmin Toss and then another inital dash. This is excellent for follow-ups, positioning, spacing, and zoning. Definitely makes the Olimar MU much easier, I'd like to say it's in Kirby's favor at that point. I do have other matches to show these off, but those were before the 1.0.8 patch, despite that Olimar and Kirby were generally not entirely different between all of the patches. Just let me know and I'll link those, too.

Wow... Did you seriousl discover that on your own? It's really useful! I'm gonna try and learn it now, too bad it's only for the Olimar matchup

 

[Togii]

While there's still time for free discussion... how about some tech skill I discovered by my own? Here's a vid of it demonstrated at 5:08 and 8:50. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MIYjZQxMV0

Holy ****, that game 1 was brutal and a showcase of why I feel Upper Cutter is necessary for Kirby.

...although you basically Upper Cutter'd to take game 2 LOL

That aside, this is really cool, and you show its practicality throughout the match; especially with dsmash, it just seems to cover so much area with the sliding hitbox. Definitely gonna try to practice this.

 

[Sparky15]

Wow... Did you seriousl discover that on your own? It's really useful! I'm gonna try and learn it now, too bad it's only for the Olimar matchup

That aside, this is really cool, and you show its practicality throughout the match; especially with dsmash, it just seems to cover so much area with the sliding hitbox. Definitely gonna try to practice this.

Thanks! Just keep in mind that it isn't free after copying the Pikmin Toss, and the fact that it takes quite a bit of effort to obtain it. And yes, Hyper_Nova, I did discover this after messing around the day after a Midwest tournament. I just did it by pure accident. XD Now let's ALL hope that this won't get eliminated by any of the upcoming patches.

 

[SapphSabre777]

@ Sparky15 Gotta love glorious findings through accidents. ^^

Anyways, I hope you guys enjoyed the free talk period and EVO, because it is time to get back down to business! This week, we discuss: Sonic&Captain Falcon! Does Kirby have what it takes to take on two of the fastest beings alive, with or without customs? Discuss!

 

[Wintermelon43]

Sonic's 40:60, and Captain Falcon's 60:40 IMO. But my matchups ratios don't matter anyway so.....

 

[Underhill]

While there's still time for free discussion... how about some tech skill I discovered by my own? Here's a vid of it demonstrated at 5:08 and 8:50. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MIYjZQxMV0 I call it "Pluckdashing", which is preforming an inital dash, then buffering a Pikmin Toss and then another inital dash. This is excellent for follow-ups, positioning, spacing, and zoning. Definitely makes the Olimar MU much easier, I'd like to say it's in Kirby's favor at that point. I do have other matches to show these off, but those were before the 1.0.8 patch, despite that Olimar and Kirby were generally not entirely different between all of the patches. Just let me know and I'll link those, too.

That was a interest tech, man. Congratulations on both winning the bracket and showing off a new Kirby tech.

 

[SapphSabre777]

Sonic's 40:60, and Captain Falcon's 60:40 IMO. But my matchups ratios don't matter anyway so.....

They are only irrelevant if you don't give some sort of evidence. There is no gain, only loss, to invalidate someone based upon just the person making the analysis. Please compile evidence from matches you have played throughout rather than lamenting about why your ratios don't matter, because they can matter through a little effort by getting evidence.

 

[Sparky15]

I have a lot of experience with Captain Falcon, so I'll make the best of it.

Captain Falcon is can obviously KO us with a majority of his moves, most notably Raptor Boost, back aerial, back throw, up aerial, or the Knee. And it's still kind of difficult to avoid getting combo'd by him even though Kirby's light. Also, Captain Falcon has better mobility and range to space Kirby out. And his edgeguarding can be brutal, solely on the high knockback of his tools, like his up tilt, both hitboxes of the down aerial, and back aerial. Aside from that, he can be juggled by Kirby's own up tilt, edgeguard him pretty well due to his average recovery, and Kirby can crouch under his jab, grab, and the late hit of his dash attack. The fact that he can duck under his grab is essential for spacing with Kirby and forces Falcon to use his other tools, which can still be potentially dangerous.

Kirby has to be careful when fighting Falcon due to his power. As mentioned, Kirby's crouch is his main approach, especially in this MU. You can utilize this by punishing whiffs like Kirby's down tilt, up tilt, or other moves depending on the attack Falcon misses. While Kirby has a good time edgeguarding him offstage, that doesn't mean you can be outright reckless anywhere. It is best to edgeguard offstage him when he is below the ledge and get as many ledge trumps as you can. Going offstage while Falcon is above the ledge could possibly result in getting meteor smashed by an aerial Raptor Boost, so it's best to wait onstage to see what his recovery option is and occasionally throw out some hitboxes. Besides edgeguarding, Kirby has a bad time KOing Falcon because of his fast falling speed and somewhat heavy properties, meaning that he can take a bit of punishment and use it effectively via Rage. That's not to say that all of Kirby's smash attacks can't KO for up to 150%, but Falcon can survive the knockback of them for up to around 100% at best. Kirby's Rage can boost this further for even earlier KOs.

In the long run, Kirby will be crouching for the most part, forcing Captain Falcon to mainly use his aerials as spacing tools. Kirby will try his best to push Captain Falcon offstage for gimps, while simultaneously racking up his percent to KO percents for his smash attacks. However, Captain Falcon can juggle Kirby and finish it with a Knee, land a hard-hitting back aerial, or meteor smash Kirby offstage. He just generally has more KO power and range than Kirby, giving the puffball a tough time to compete against that. I feel like it's 60:40 in Falcon's favor.

 

[Wintermelon43]

They are only irrelevant if you don't give some sort of evidence. There is no gain, only loss, to invalidate someone based upon just the person making the analysis. Please compile evidence from matches you have played throughout rather than lamenting about why your ratios don't matter, because they can matter through a little effort by getting evidence.

Well, as I said, I don't know how to put it into words, plus I suck at actually playing for some reason. Although, I posted my ratios with myself knowing I'm not counting....

 

[RedNova]

Well, as I said, I don't know how to put it into words, plus I suck at actually playing for some reason. Although, I posted my ratios with myself knowing I'm not counting....

You don't have to be excellent at the game, you just need to know the character. If you don't know how to phrase it, you can use the template in the first post

 

[Wintermelon43]

You don't have to be excellent at the game, you just need to know the character. If you don't know how to phrase it, you can use the template in the first post

I honestly don't even know how to word it for pro-cons, I suck that bad

 

[Togii]

I honestly don't even know how to word it for pro-cons, I suck that bad

Idk about the others here, but if you don't know how to analyze the matchup and you know you're not good at the game, I would prefer you just lurk the thread instead of attempting to post ratios/analyses.

I will post my C. Falcon analysis tomorrow, along with possibly Sonic.

 

[Wintermelon43]

Idk about the others here, but if you don't know how to analyze the matchup and you know you're not good at the game, I would prefer you just lurk the thread instead of attempting to post ratios/analyses.

I will post my C. Falcon analysis tomorrow, along with possibly Sonic.

But, I can tell what I think it is in my head, but I can't get it out of my head, hence why I suck, and why I can't word it. That's why I still post it