The problem that's dogged me since Smash 64...

[Ryusuta]

Currently, I'm having a bit of a struggle on Smash 3DS for one simple reason... I have a very hard time with the final hit.

See, I feel I'm pretty strong in terms of neutral and comboing, but onced the percents are racked up, I feel almost incapable of getting that last move in on a competent opponent. On top of that, my gimping game has never been all that fantastic in general simply because I often feel too meek to commit on a chase. When I do so, I can never time it just right so I land a hit before or after their dodge, which more often than not switches the roles and causes ME to go on the defensive.

What's worse, sometimes it gets me desperate and I occasionally spam a kill move a couple of times trying to get a hard read rather than a setup. And I know it's not the right way to play, but sometimes in the heat of the moment it just kind of happens. Even if I vary the timing on kill attempts and chases, I always seem to whiff because I never seem to quite line up for where they come out of an air dodge or whatnot.

So, what do you do to keep your cool when you're in the lead and fishing for a kill or a gimp? (If it helps, I use Yoshi, but I've been experimenting with others as well, so I mostly want GENERAL advice that I can carry to multiple characters.) How do I keep myself at an advantage and keep the opponent from guessing my kill attempts so easily? What should I practice in order to fix this glaring flaw in my style?

 

[Jaxas]

Currently, I'm having a bit of a struggle on Smash 3DS for one simple reason... I have a very hard time with the final hit.

See, I feel I'm pretty strong in terms of neutral and comboing, but onced the percents are racked up, I feel almost incapable of getting that last move in on a competent opponent. On top of that, my gimping game has never been all that fantastic in general simply because I often feel too meek to commit on a chase. When I do so, I can never time it just right so I land a hit before or after their dodge, which more often than not switches the roles and causes ME to go on the defensive.

What's worse, sometimes it gets me desperate and I occasionally spam a kill move a couple of times trying to get a hard read rather than a setup. And I know it's not the right way to play, but sometimes in the heat of the moment it just kind of happens. Even if I vary the timing on kill attempts and chases, I always seem to whiff because I never seem to quite line up for where they come out of an air dodge or whatnot.

So, what do you do to keep your cool when you're in the lead and fishing for a kill or a gimp? (If it helps, I use Yoshi, but I've been experimenting with others as well, so I mostly want GENERAL advice that I can carry to multiple characters.) How do I keep myself at an advantage and keep the opponent from guessing my kill attempts so easily? What should I practice in order to fix this glaring flaw in my style?

Honestly, my advice is just don't try to force it. That was what I had to do; basically stop worrying about getting the kill (though obviously there are times when you need it NOW).

Otherwise, try to watch for patterns and punish those. Landing lag is always a good one, I've found - as a Lucario main, Full Charge Aura Sphere nets me a ton of kills if timed right while an opponent lands just a bit away from me.

 

[Shaya]

Well, usually those characters can maintain things which are safe to do otherwise until the opportunities arise to get the kill. Some of that bread and butter stuff for a lot of characters is still ever potent.

In yoshi's case he can abuse his aerial mobility to force the opponent to fear neutral air and back air, while also being able to immediately jab on landing, and single jab seems to be a very potent, if not guaranteed kill set up for Yoshi (as I've seen from tournament play: Jab 1 -> Up Smash). Dash attack them and then bait an air dodge into up air? Yoshi may be hard to control in the air, but it's because of the speed he does so, practise controlling your character more and hopefully you'll find being able to capitalise more often.

For a lot of people, baiting air dodges into the ground is a pretty solid way to land a kill move. Bait air dodges in scenarios where it'll lead them into being on the ground before being able to aerial/air dodge again, voila!

 

[<π]

Play a character with a kill throw, everyone sheild when they are afraid they will die. Kill throws give you so much leverage when you get to high percents; they are a huge threat,

Learn to punish errors, and watch for bad habits so you can punish those.
When ever I get close he sheilds. When ever he sheilds and I don't do anything he rolls towards me.
When ever he is on the edge of the stage he jumps on stage.
When ever he fails a tech he does a get up attack.
When ever I short hop he air dodges.
I can create these situation and punish them on reaction for a kill.

You have to learn to bait and punish, and figure out what people are doing and why. Thats general.

Yoshi specifically has a BUNCH of kill power. Usmash, and uair are solid quick kill options. that you can use to punish rolls air dodges and wiffed attacks. You can out right beat a lot of approaches with yoshi's usmash. so if you think your opponent is going to commit to an aerial usmash him for it!

 

[SaltyKracka]

Your problem sounds like a luxury compared to characters where you always have to work just to even land a hit.

 

[<π]

Honestly, my advice is just don't try to force it. That was what I had to do; basically stop worrying about getting the kill (though obviously there are times when you need it NOW).

Otherwise, try to watch for patterns and punish those. Landing lag is always a good one, I've found - as a Lucario main, Full Charge Aura Sphere nets me a ton of kills if timed right while an opponent lands just a bit away from me.

SOrry this may end up being a double post... But I JUST~ saw this and had to say something...

Force your kills. Make it your mission to get a kill. the longer he keeps his stock the more damage he puts on yours. You WANT as big a lead as possible going into that next stock. The "let it ride: metality cost me tons of games in brawl and melee, you have to take calculated risks sometimes in order to get a bigger pay off. It wasn't until I started play this game again until I realized how important stocks are I guess. In brawl specifically, as a sheik main, I'd be winning, literally ahead 100 percent on a stock but I'd play it safe because: 'hey... If I guess this read wrong (and I'd normally be guessing right I just hate risk) I might take damage if my dacus doesn't work; I might input it wrong, and well these needles are guaranteed damage right?'
Sure I'd get my opponent to 180 percent and die at 100 because I was waiting for my shield safe options to magically net me kills, or I was waiting for my opponent to give me some error (and at high levels, at least in FL they aren't just dropping tech, or making unreasonable commitments) That early gambled dacus would have gotten me a kill if I guess right and at best <20 damage. That was DEFENITELY a risk worth taking. Instead I'm down a stock and they get to build damage on while while up a stock.

And please don't get me wrong; by this I don't mean only use your kill moves once they are in kill range. I mean safely apply pressure in a way that will net you a kill. Push on their shield to force reactions. feign approaches and even errors to force reactions. You want to figure out how to put them into a poor position so that you can move onto the next stock. If you end up killing with a tilt you could have taken the stock sooner, and likely taken less damage too.

 

[Ryusuta]

Genuinely, thank you all for your advice and suggestions. It's generally not easy to explain things on such a wide subject, so I'm really grateful for such thoughtful replies. I'll keep working. HOPEFULLY I'll find a local scene in Washington and I can get more practice that doesn't involve Ladders or For Glory. Time will tell!

 

[Espi]

If you whiff a kill move, it's like giving away your trap card. So people will be avoiding specific scenarios which lead to that KO. Also I'd be down to play some Smash 4, I live just North of the border in Canada, so the lag won't be bad lol.

 

[LancerStaff]

As a Pit main, I understand what it's like not being able to finish somebody off. Usually the hardest part for me. I'll typically play it safe and get to a KO % for a faster move, only bringing out the more powerful ones when it's really safe or utterly hopeless.

Biggest thing that's helped me in both Brawl and 4 is understanding my KO moves. How they work, when they KO, their maximum reach, yaknow. And figure out ALL of them. Stuck in some crazy situation where he's 20% above your average kill move? You'll want to know when your tilts KO.

 

[Ryusuta]

If you whiff a kill move, it's like giving away your trap card. So people will be avoiding specific scenarios which lead to that KO. Also I'd be down to play some Smash 4, I live just North of the border in Canada, so the lag won't be bad lol.

Sure! If you have AIM, Skype, or Steam, you can message me on one of those sometime. (I'm pretty much Ryusuta everywhere and am currently using this avatar.)

 

[MadKraken]

I've learned to take a sort of passive approach to doing what I can rather than pushing at my body to accomplish something it can't. You know how in real life, you can look at something that's up high and sort of know whether or not you could jump and touch it? That's because your brain has the ability to subconsciously calculate what you can and cannot do any given time. Listen to this sense specifically when playing a match. Do what you know you can do at any given point. You'll find yourself backing off when your fingers get clumsy and landing solid moves that you're confident you can make. Of course, it's still necessary to push your boundaries when practicing, but this helps me out in matches I care about.

 

[Kinetik07]

Try going to training mode, set the damage to 100 and set the cpu to 'run'(srsly, try it, they will evade you, not just run)

You can use this to practice getting in that kill move, but it's very hard. Besides the fact that it's a cpu which means it's random and they won't have patterns you can easily read like players, they are playing purely defensively.

I think the situation that's causing you problems is just after you've been killed and the enemy is at a high percent, am I right? The thing is, you gotta look at it from their perspective. You're invincible and they're about to die, it's pretty much 2nd nature to play purely defensively much like that cpu set to 'run'.

Reading the opponent is a lot easier when they are going after you rather than away from you, naturally. That's because there's only one place that you are in and an infinite number of places you are not in.

Here's what you do: turn off percent display in options to force yourself not to look at it for now(obviously, you'll still know cuz of rage effect) and don't immediately try to go for the kill with a slow move like a smash, most times it will get read and avoided in that situation(or countered once you're out of invincibility). Wait for them to go on the offensive again and read them, then crouch cancel or something.

 

[Cruncher93]

It's understandable that you find it hard to get the final hit done, after all:
1. Only a few of your moves kill, so while you can use almost all your moves sub-100%, most of them gain you nothing now. What's the point of down-throw when you can't follow it up with anything? Back-throw could set up an edgeguard at least. Or why use your n-air when your opponent was damaged enough to be killed before? There is no gain in doing many of your moves if they don't kill or set up a kill.
2. The moves meant to kill usually are more difficult to hit with, smashes are slower, back-air (often a killmove) is predictable, often slower than other aerials and sometimes has smaller hitboxes than other aerials.
3. Your opponent knows he can die with his next mistake, so he probably uses less risky moves and is extra cautious.

So yeah, killing can be difficult unless every other move of your character kills easily.

Suggestions:
-Don't fish for the finisher, observe how your opponent tries to avoid you and adapt accordingly
-Sometimes you have to bring your opponent even higher in % so you can use a faster, weaker killing move instead of your stronger ones
-Mix it up! Throw your opponent up one time and try anti-air, then away from the stage the next time. Find out which move puts your opponent in a situation he can't deal with

 

[cardboardowl]

the trick is to really know what kills and when it kills and what it takes to kill it

For example, Utilt on megaman kills most mid weight people around 90 with a sweet spot. I know that if they are trying to land and i perfect shield an aerial, I can utilt for free and get the kill.

Know specific situations and you won't have to "look" for a kill. they will just come.

 

[Jackson]

I'm a Sheik player, and finishing stocks is a major problem for an otherwise fantastic character. I feel you.

 

[BombsOnBombs]

I'm a Sheik player, and finishing stocks is a major problem for an otherwise fantastic character. I feel you.

A lot of Shiek kills are going to come from sweet spotting your bair or gimping people off of the stage. Sometimes you're going to have to sit near the edge and wait to kill your opponent with bairs, and while it sucks, it's the downside of being Shiek in a world without edge guards lol.

 

[Jackson]

A lot of Shiek kills are going to come from sweet spotting your bair or gimping people off of the stage. Sometimes you're going to have to sit near the edge and wait to kill your opponent with bairs, and while it sucks, it's the downside of being Shiek in a world without edge guards lol.

I feel you, haha

 

[luigijerk]

This is the worst smash for you since kill moves are so important, and medium strength moves are very hard to kill with.