The MBR average tiers

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Gilgamesh

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Well, we MBR guys have all given our personal view of tiers, and respectful member Eoraptor has made an average out of them. Here it is, the average tier, made out froma ll the tier views in the MBR:

4.9 Sheik
4.8 Falco, Fox
4.4 Marth
4.1 Mario
4.0 Zelda, Samus, Luigi
3.9 Peach
3.8 Dr. Mario
3.5 Ice Climbers, Ganondorf
3.4 Pikachu, Link
3.2 Captain Falcon, Young Link
3.1 Jigglypuff, Ness
2.9 Yoshi, Donkey Kong
2.8 Roy
2.1 Kirby
1.8 Mr. Game and Watch
1.6 Pichu, Bowser
1.3 Mewtwo

Thanks eoraptor. I didn't check the calculating but i'll trust your math here. And now, you lowly rats, discuss.
 

PorCorpWis

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The only problems I have with it are that Mewtwo and Bowser should switch positions, Captain Falcon should probably be rated a bit higher, and Yoshi is probably better than DK (although I don't play either of them much). But that list is remarkably accurate in my opinion.
 

Gilgamesh

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Heheh i don't like it either, it's just the statistics speaking. You know i'm a fervient Mewtwo defender and one of the few people i know that can play him well. Howerver, other than being clearly better than bowser and G&W, i accept that mewtwo belongs to the low tiers, just not the "bowser tier" at the very bottom.
 

Scamp

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Let's see.

Yoshi should be much higher, and the Marios should be together. I don't know how anyone could place a character between the Marios in terms of tier rankings.

Also, something Gilgy forgot to mention, the score for Zelda is debatable as many people put Zelda with Shiek when making their tiers. Thus, Zelda would probably be ranked a bit lower overall.

Where are all the Roy defenders at? Roy sucks! Hehehehehe.
 

Mew2King

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I agree for the most part, BUT WHAT ARE YOU DOING PUTTING MEWTWO AT THE BOTTOM, HE SHOULD EASILY BE AT THE TOP IF YOU USE HIS FULL POTENTIAL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



Other than that, it's pretty darn accurate, but Mewtwo should be WAY up there at the top.
 

jv3x3

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Yeah, our average aint too bad. Marios closer, Zelda way down (i posted about this in the MBR, her score is inflated), yoshi up, mewtwo up a little. But Mew2king, top tier is simply insane, he is bottom tier at best. Full potential, lol, his potential is very limited in 1 on 1's.
 

Gilgamesh

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Yes, mewtwo isn't nearly middle tier. And remember, that tier isn't perfect and of course i have little disagreements. AND IT'S NOT MINE! it's the sum of all fears... i mean.. the sum of each MBR people's tiers. This is because some jerks here didn't realize that..
 

Veg

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Its fun beating people with the LOWEST/MY FAV character. I mean comon, he may suck, yes he does, but hes the COOLEST character in the game. But ya hes in the lower tier. With bowser and G&W.
 

Gregory

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MEWTWO AT THE BOTTOM? one more reason i hate these teir ratings....

Honestly, i cant see mewtwo being the worst. Seeing as how he has the greatest evasive move in the game ( up B ) he can get out of pretty much any sticky situation. He also has a good midair forward A , a rocking good B move, and TWO KO throws, up and back. How can a guy who has such ownage throws be at the bottom? ? oh the confusion....
 

PimpLuigi

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yeah it doesn't make sense that mario/doc luigi aren't together. Also i think falcon should be a bit higher. I definately agree that Mew should be at the bottom though, all the characters have good moves, Mew just has the least useful ones, unless it's a
contest of "run-away-fairy" in which Mew would win all the time.

-Pimp
 

DaXIthR

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Roy fan...

Checking in.

This list is bull.

I'm out.

Let me rephrase that - it surprises how much agility and speed is respected over power and knowck out strength.

I'm sure Zelda makes a great coin character or bonus character. And even that she's much better in a 3-player stock game...but it all comes down to style.
 

sharkboy013

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I think the only Roy defenders are me and Gilgamesh. Of course hes gonna be low.

I think I was the only one defending Yoshi in there, so can't say much on that.
 

my<dsmbr

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mario fan -

I dont exactly understand the math in the tiers in your first post, gilgamesh.

personally, i favor Mario. there is no exact weakness to define in him, save the meteor smash which takes far too long to execute.

can someone please tell me why Shiek is at the top?
she kind of seemed a little awkward (my playing style, i guess) to me, kind of weak.
 

SSB:M Rules

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My current fav. char. is Yoshi! I started playing him yesterday , and I can pull of some basic combo's now. The best thing I like about him is his aerial moves. He has a meteor smash just like mario , but I don't agree with 'my december' ( btw Linkin Park rules the world!!! ) about mario's meteor. I think it's a very nice meteor and it's also a good use for comboing. Okey , it's not as good as Falco's down A but it's still usefull I think.
 

BladeMeleeRoy

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Ok, how is Roy supposed to be at the bottom at the list. I al least thought he would make top 10!:mad: . I guess the statistics do not lie. But I will build Roy's repetation as a great character.:D
 

NJE789

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that tier seems a little biased, but not irrelevent..

I'm not surprised with what I see. I mean, aren't the top tiers also the characters that just so happen to be winning tournaments as well? I decided to practice with Sheik a little...
I've come to 2 possible conclusions:I need more practice, or this is some kind of joke, probably used to deviate other players from using the REAL top tier..
..or not. I did notice she has good speed and her moves do flow very well into each other, though her smashes shouldn't be used until the opponent has taken significant damage, which is a general good rule to follow with some characters, but she still seemed weak, like I said, speed is all she has, her rapid A<Marth's counter, her chain.. not exactly "deadly", really just a decent edge-gaurd, her needle storm<just jump over it, her aerial attacks come in here<marth's sword reaches long before her kicks do... that's enough.
This is how I tier characters, their ability to counter or defend against other attacks without having to use stupid sheild or dodge techniques, while at the same time being able to dish it out when the time's right. Marth excels here. Don't deny it.
 

Qinopio

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I'd have to agree with the people that place Mewtwo higher. Not top tier, but higher than he is. Maybe on the level of DK.

Yoshi got the shaft a little, also, IMO.
 

Gilgamesh

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Argh, some idiots still don't understand that this tier list isn't my creation, it's just the statistics (sort of like a poll) of the average between the MBR members' tier lists. This is what came out. I never said i fully agreed to it.
 

PorCorpWis

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Gilgamesh, don't get too upset. It takes quite a bit of experience (or a bit of intelligence) to understand teirs, and the majority of the posters don't qualify either condition. Just laugh at them all.
 

Gilgamesh

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I guess you're right. I will not lose more time explaining stuff over and over. I'll just enjoy a good flaming and laughing like in the ol' times.
 

Shadow Nataku

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Hmm...interesting Mewtwo/Roy ranked much lower than I would have thought.......hehe the funny things that can happen in averages.........

Now excuse me for a quick screaming session......

*exits room and many a cursing is heard*

Okay I'm calm.......
 

Jish11988

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First of all, I know that tiers are meant to mean how good a character is at its best, not just personal opinons, but I have a little problem with G&W. Unless someone can really explain why he is so bad, the only thing I see wrong with him is his lightweightness, and maybe the fact that his moves don't "blend" very well. He has great aerial attacks, along with very good others (except his down smash, bleh) and great vertical recovery. His speed is also rather good, I'm not stating this a fact but I think its at least as good as Mario's. People often brand him as SLOW. Ganondorf is slow. Bowser is slow. Zelda is slow. Game&Watch is not slow. He's not exactly the fastest character, but jeez, give him some credit.
 

PorCorpWis

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Game and Watch is only moderately fast in a game ruled by speed. His moveset isn't that great compared to many others. On top of that he's extremely lightweight. Fox can KO game and watch with a C-stick upsmash at around 60 percent on Final Destination, which has a pretty high roof.

Yeah, you say, Jigglypuff's decent and she's lightweight. G&W doesn't have a move that compares to Pound or Rest...

And Shadow Nataku, it's not mistake that Roy and Mewtwo were rated so low... the "funny" thing that happened is that almost everyone beleives they aren't very good...
 

ssbm_kings

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I only have a few problems with the tier list.

Mewtwo and bowser should definitely garuntee be on top of G@W. Game and watch have way to much lag in his moves. He's light, and he can't seem to hit anyone. I would put roy with marth because it's not that much different. Roy have power, while marth got juggling skills. Speed is a slightly different. They shouldn't be posted up that high. The links should be on the bottom. They got no good knock out move and it make it difficult to killl people. Link best knock move is probably the Up b and that is hard to get people. Only works when you edge guard. Young link is just hard to kill people with. His down a in the air probably the best and that is so easy to predict. Everyone says yoshi should be higher and i agree. That's right that sheik should be in first place. Falcon should have been higher too. He is way better then gannondorf. Gannon is slow and his good points don't make up for his slowness. I don't see any reason why falcon is lower then gannon. Ice climbers is definitely above mario too. Well that's just my opinion.
 

Gilgamesh

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Yeah, unfortunately there's a tendence in the back room to put bowser and G&W above mewt in the tiers, while i disagree with that. It's all pimp's fault, i hate you *runs away crying*

I'm a roy defender, yet i agree he isn't very good. Just as mew, he's one of the chars i play for fun. He still has potential, so i would set him in the middle-upper tier. But there's roy hate in the air.

I have other minor disagreements, such as Ness (he should be higher) then again i'm very biased towards him. I also think sometimes that Samus should be top tier, if it weren't for that fox and falco...
 

Veg

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i think instead of making character specific tiers, make like 4 different groups. Then put people in the groups.

(i'm just using the list on page one!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

Example:

Strongest characters:
Sheik, Falco ,Fox ,Marth.

Stronger characters:
Mario ,Zelda ,Samus, Luigi ,Peach, Dr. Mario.

Average characters:
Ice Climbers, Ganondorf, Pikachu, Link, Captain Falcon, Young Link, Jigglypuff, Ness, Yoshi, Donkey Kong, Roy.

Below average characters:
Kirby, Mr. Game and Watch, Pichu, Bowser, Mewtwo.


Then just put characters into those catagorys.
 

NJE789

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Why does everyone underrate Ganondorf?

I'm not even going into that, but I think I can help save a lot of spam here. Before anyone makes comments on characters they obviously haven't figured out how to even use yet, they should atleast read some of the posts about them and try it out for themselves, I've made posts about the right way to use some of Ganondorf's and Marth's moves, and if you try them out and use what I posted, anyone will rate both of them in the upper tier area.
 

Xenesis

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Mewtwo!
Bottom!
Why!!!!!
I really dont see why Mewtwo deserves the bottom of the list...
he has insane defensive skils and (debatably) the best throws in the game. All his moves have uses. Another think a lot of people fail to realise is that the knockback of his smashes increases with higher percentages much faster than say falco or fox. His up throw can KO on some levels at 50% (oh wait, too many people only play final destination and use it as the know all end all for character skills discussion)

I think you people dont like him because he has a defensive style, rather than being pure combo until they are at 300% and shove them off the edge.

I pity the person who thinks mewtwo is the worst character

He deserves A higher rank than at least game and watch god forbid. I mean G&W is laggy, light and has the most pathetic evasion in the game.
 

ssbm_kings

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For one reason that gannondorf suck is because he is basically the same moves as Falcon but he is way slower. Falcon got no weakness as i can see. All his moves are power and none are weak. Same thing with gannondorf but gannondorf is incredibly slow. His warlock punch is beyond useless. Falcon punch is a lil faster and with some luck you might get it off while gannondorf, it is impossible to hit someone with it.

I don't know how you guys rated Mewtwo below G&W but i guess that is how it goes. I agree that Samus should be higher too. Even though her projectiles can be reflected.

I am bias against ness, too. I don't think he's a good character period. An easy way to get rid of ness is when he try to get back in, just hit the shock thingy and then he's dead. Don't even have to spike him or anything. His smash down and up is just useless. His only good move is probably his bat and his PK fire. He got good air game, but thats it.

With roy, you don't need an air game. Just stay to the ground. All his ground move is powerful. His air down a is a spike for all you people that don't know that. Kind of useless move because you got to hit at the right spot. I don't get how Marth get rated that high. I personally think they should be in the group with yoshi and Mario.

Kirby should be able to rank at least with jigglypuff, or even better. He got a good air game, he can float more, and his ground game is stronger. He can imitate people move. That is useful when the opponent is samus or fox when you can just abuse the range shot. Jiggly is strong too. I would put her up with Mario. She basically got a good ground game, a good air game, and basically it's very hard for her to fly out and not come back. He sleeps just own. You can KO people when there at 50 percent which is kind of crazy.

Pikachu should be rated a lot higher then he is. He is strong. His smash up can compete with fox. His right smash can compete with fox. His down b is just nasty when you edgeguard(except mewtwo). His shock is annoying. His down a in the air is an easy way to get out of getting juggle in the air. His up a in the air is not all that great, but it get's the opponent over the edge so you can edgeguard. Pichu should be on the bottom. He got no range at all, he's useless. It's almost nearly impossible for him to get close to someone and not get hit.

I know it's not your creation, but you should take a re poll on this. Well that was long and I'll shut up now.
 

NJE789

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N00bs... coming in here and...

Ganondorf's warlock punch? That's the best argument you could come up with against his speed? That move is worthless, sort of a joke about the about the hapless cpu.. always walking right into it.. Ganondorf doesn't need the move period, so you can't use that as an effective point in your argument. sniff*sniff*.... ..Is something starting to burn in here?
 

Dogysamich

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Dang Gilga - and u were yellin at me for "kickin a dead horse"

----

I think ima have to say this cause i finally atleast got some people to agree on this.

Tryin to argue these tiers and what you think should be changed will get you nowhere, because in the end, nothing'll be proven, and everybody is just gunna be mad at each other.

That's why i just droped it a while back - I dont believe these are anywhere near "right" but, arguing was just makin matters worse than they really were.

------

If you dont like the tiers, that's cool, but let it go.

If you do, kool...... but let it go.

It's already been proven that arguing will go down to nothing but a flame war.
 

ECVlion

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4.9 Sheik
4.8 Falco, Fox
4.4 Marth
4.1 Mario
4.0 Zelda, Samus, Luigi
3.9 Peach
3.8 Dr. Mario
3.5 Ice Climbers, Ganondorf
3.4 Pikachu, Link
3.2 Captain Falcon, Young Link
3.1 Jigglypuff, Ness
2.9 Yoshi, Donkey Kong
2.8 Roy
2.1 Kirby
1.8 Mr. Game and Watch
1.6 Pichu, Bowser
1.3 Mewtwo
Hmm...there seems to be a few problems here, in my eyes.

Marth is a bit high...he really isn't THAT good. I get this feeling that there were 3 or 4 people in the MBR who were just a little biased towards Marth. Roy, on the other hand, got the shaft here, and really should be raised a little, maybe to the Young Link levek.

Mewtwo at the bottom? A whole three points away from Bowser? I think that's a little unfair. M2 is bottom tier, but not THAT far below civilization.

Mario, Luigi and Doc should be placed equally.

And what exactly do the numerical values mean? Does it mean, say that Falcon is twice as good as Bowser, or that Mario is nearly twice as effective as Kirby?
 

Gilgamesh

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Hmm...there seems to be a few problems here, in my eyes.
Marth is a bit high...he really isn't THAT good. I get this feeling that there were 3 or 4 people in the MBR who were just a little biased towards Marth. Roy, on the other hand, got the shaft here, and really should be raised a little, maybe to the Young Link levek.
Mewtwo at the bottom? A whole three points away from Bowser? I think that's a little unfair. M2 is bottom tier, but not THAT far below civilization.
Mario, Luigi and Doc should be placed equally.
And what exactly do the numerical values mean? Does it mean, say that Falcon is twice as good as Bowser, or that Mario is nearly twice as effective as Kirby?
I think i'm going to cry.....

*cries*
 

Trillian

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Many people don't seem to realize that while the actual FIGHTING of Sheik is better, all Sheik players transform to Zelda to return. Somehow I don't see Sheik being that far up with her abysmal recovery. Could it be the that MBR people forgot about that? Zelda PLUS Sheik could be at the top, but not separately.
 

Gilgamesh

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Originally posted by Trillian
Many people don't seem to realize that while the actual FIGHTING of Sheik is better, all Sheik players transform to Zelda to return. Somehow I don't see Sheik being that far up with her abysmal recovery. Could it be the that MBR people forgot about that? Zelda PLUS Sheik could be at the top, but not separately.
Not necessarily. That was some time ago, but now sheik's vanish is getting the attention it always deserved. Now the Zelda option is used ONLy when vanish positively, absolutely, cannot get you back. Actually in all other cases, Vanish is plain better. In fact, she's got one of the best recoveries there are there, added to the zelda option. Anyway you have a good point.
 

Veg

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Teir, its like a rankings, but just a fancy word i guess. The list shows how some people rate the characters from best to worst.
 
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