The Ideal "4.0"

[PrincessAzula]

Zelda buffs and alternate costumes.

 

[andalsoandy]

-Revised stages (Shadow Moses,) and more if the expansion code works with random.
-
-Possibly in some fashion.
-More Alt costumes (focus sash )
-More characters besides the previous two mentioned.
-Some more cool easter eggs. We can never have enough.
-More wall jumping characters. I dunno why. I just would like that.
-Adventure mode modded from Subspace Emissary with a custom stage select. It's probably not possible but you'd think that they could just use the resources from Subspace and separate it into stages. The PMBR is magic and they can do magical things, so it's not completely off the table.
-cool stuff.

 

[Evilagram]

-Combo Counter, like in training mode.
-Super mode, like turbo mode, but lets you get final smash after dealing x% damage.
-More Characters
-More Alt Costumes
-More legal stages
-Give snake back the nikita, improve the tranq so it works on midair enemies, or at least 2 grenades. I'm so unhappy with 3.0 snake, everything that was cool about him got nerfed or changed and he deserved some of it, but the nikita was the last straw for me.

 

[King Bee]

A Ness balance patch. I mean, I can hope, right? It's only been over a year.

Please? I cry myself to sleep every time the changelist shows nothing for him.

 

[Bleck]

- An alternate costume for every character.
- A new character (considering the amount of work it'd take, it'd probably be unreasonable to expect more than one).
- Alternate and/or rebalanced Final Smashes.
- Balance changes.

 

[Meme]

To me it would be...
• More stages ones that would be nice even if it is Counterpick material.
• 1 Frame physics delay or whatever it is... fix
• Stage grapple/tethering a la Melee
• MOAR alternate costumes

 

[QQQQQQQ7777777]

-Revised stages (Shadow Moses,) and more if the expansion code works with random.
-
-Possibly in some fashion. You mean like
-More Alt costumes (focus sash ) They currently can't add in the Green Headband Jigglypuff (I believe that is what you're talking about) due to not having enough bones to work with
-More characters besides the previous two mentioned.
-Some more cool easter eggs. We can never have enough.
-More wall jumping characters. I dunno why. I just would like that.
-Adventure mode modded from Subspace Emissary with a custom stage select. It's probably not possible but you'd think that they could just use the resources from Subspace and separate it into stages. The PMBR is magic and they can do magical things, so it's not completely off the table.
-cool stuff. This I agree with

-Combo Counter, like in training mode. What iz dis Mahvel? Either way, the "Combo Counter" in training mode doesn't work like it's supposed to and something like this would have no point outside of Turbo Mode

-Super mode, like turbo mode, but lets you get final smash after dealing x% damage. I do not believe something like this is currently possible with the limitations of Brawl hacking.
-More Characters

-More Alt Costumes
-More legal stages
-Give snake back the nikita, improve the tranq so it works on midair enemies, or at least 2 grenades. I'm so unhappy with 3.0 snake, everything that was cool about him got nerfed or changed and he deserved some of it, but the nikita was the last straw for me. Wait.... what the.... You want them to give Snake the nikita back yet you also want them to improve the move they replaced the nikita with?

To me it would be...

• More stages ones that would be nice even if it is Counterpick material.
• 1 Frame physics delay or whatever it is... fix What do you think they have been trying to do for years now?
• Stage grapple/tethering a la Melee Fairly sure you can already do this.
• MOAR alternate costumes

Replies in red.

 

[The_NZA]

Replies in red.

You are one of the most aggressive posters I have seen in recent time. You need to tone it down, dude. For example:

WHen Meme said "1 Frame physics delay or whatever it is, fix" and you replied with "What do you think they have been trying to do for years now?", that was completely unnecessary.

The topic is called "ideal 4.0 build". People are going post things they think should be added or fixed and many of those things are obviously being worked on.

 

[QQQQQQQ7777777]

You are one of the most aggressive posters I have seen in recent time. You need to tone it down, dude. For example:

WHen Meme said "1 Frame physics delay or whatever it is, fix" and you replied with "What do you think they have been trying to do for years now?", that was completely unnecessary.

The topic is called "ideal 4.0 build". People are going post things they think should be added or fixed and many of those things are obviously being worked on.

Ok, I know I have a tendency to be a bit of an ***hat from time to time and I am working on it. Sorry if I offended anyone.

 

[Meme]

Replies in red.

I think my way of mentioning stage grapple is more on the way it is on Melee's "Wall Grapple", currently there only is tethering aka grapple beam/hook shot goes directly to the edge.

And they're obviously working on most of these... (From what I saw on the known issues on the bug section).

 

[Chesstiger2612]

My wishlist would be this:
- PAL Version!!!
- Further balance (Ness, Ganon, Dedede and Squirtle on focus)
- Add the top 3 to 5 characters "elected" in the Clone Engine Thread
- Summit M (Project M version with those 2 vertically moving platforms)
- More ATs that influence the game a little but add up and improve the gameplay (similar to like moonwalking, RAR, shield DI etc.)
(We need a thread for those I am sure some people have good ideas about minor new ATs)
- Some changes that negate port priority I hate that kind of unfair advantage
- Guess what game I want to play on PAL?
- Maybe slight engine changes but I am OK with that right now
- Space Mode: No Stage, everybody has infinte jumps (better not use your up-B :D)
- Dunno if this is a good idea but maybe some kind of ELO ladder
- AI improvements are sth we are all open to I think
- More training options like mentioned above (infinite shield, always spotdodging or so)
- Only if you have enough time but some kind of tutorial for new players that aren't experienced with smashboards or
alternatively like a glossar for techniques
- Also low priority, but a "book of combos" you did and you get the ~5 sec clip and theres data against whom and at which
percent and so on you did it (pretty utopic I know)
- Some new sound effects: Sometimes the brawl ones sound like not-fitting and the melee ones have bad quality sometimes
- Following stage list changes: Draculas Castle and Pokémon Stadium 1 change places (though we need more tourneys with row 1 allowed)
- Z for switching form normal to alternate coustume (and reverse) on character selection screen
- Option to choose random character out of a certain pool, similar to the stages
- More stuff that attracts new players community has to grow
- For tournaments etc.: Controller Commands available from CCS over a little window (its annoying to go back to options then to controller, and then to multiplayer again)
- I know you can do it indivudually, but add some more stagefitting music at some stages wouldn't harm
Of course, the much-work-little-effect stuff will be added last but, though it is long, this would be my list. More priority to things mentioned earlier imho. Thx for this thread good location to express your opinion :D.

 

[andalsoandy]

Replies in red.

Focus Sash Jigg's band doesn't have to move.

BTW her green costume might make a good base (extra bones apparently) but this is all off topic...

You are one of the most aggressive posters I have seen in recent time. You need to tone it down, dude. For example:

WHen Meme said "1 Frame physics delay or whatever it is, fix" and you replied with "What do you think they have been trying to do for years now?", that was completely unnecessary.

The topic is called "ideal 4.0 build". People are going post things they think should be added or fixed and many of those things are obviously being worked on.

He seemed justified from what I saw...

Maybe it's because it's all in red.

RED IS HATE

 

[DrinkingFood]

Ok, I know I have a tendency to be a bit of an ***hat from time to time and I am working on it. Sorry if I offended anyone.

don't apologize *****
asshats for the win

 

[NWRL]

No new characters. Balance and alt costumes.

 

[Jade_Rock55]

Give snake back the nikita, improve the tranq so it works on midair enemies, or at least 2 grenades

^At least one of these.

 

[Phan7om]

Goddamn... If I had to have an ideal PM, I would get so much hate because it goes against mostly everyone's dreams, but this is just my opinion so dont attack me.

1. Characters
- I feel that the PMBR should not make ANY newcomers, for characters I feel if anything Pichu is the only canditate.(And I dont even want him) Here is my reason for this. A lot of people want Issac to be in, so say he gets in. The PMBR doesnt have the tools to program major changes, it would just be basically taking Link/Marth/Roy/Ike and changing them with the clone engine. (Most likely Link since they cant give characters projectiles) This will result in them having pretty basic changes done to them to "change" them into a new character, and wont be as cool as most would probably want him to be. Then comes you fans. With every character speculation, people speculate which moves would go where and what they would do. When the final product comes out, there would be many complaints about his moveset... basically "His Down-B should be blah blah blah" or "I dont like what they did with blank, it should be blank" which would cause a large number of patches just to make the fans happy, which could take over a year to perfect ONE character. Same thing with balance. Half of you will complain saying that oh Isaac is broken, they should nerf him. While the other half will scream and complain about the opposite... never making a large portion of the PM community unhappy and not wanting to play it. Not to mention, it WILL make people hate PM more just from witnessing what they will do if people wine enough. If anything, they should release a new character, and never patch anything else after that (which will not happen). If anything, leave the newcomer speculation to Sakurai.

2. Alt Costumes
-Dont give a $h!t about this. Just add what everyone wants so that they stop complaining. Keep in mind the PMBR said that all alt costumes will be the SAME character. So no, we will not get any Rosalina alt costumes on Peach, etc.

3. Physics/Gameplay
-Make it exactly like Melee. I know "PM is its own game and all" but still. The frame delay needs to be removed, the sheild pushback should match melee, along with any other changes that I have missed.

4. Buffs/Nerfs/and Technical Skill seperation
-Im not going to sit here and type "blank character needs to be nerfed/buffed" cuz thats just dumb. People just really want their own character to be the best in the game. Im not saying this at all. In an ideal PM, characters are more or less 99% balanced (since 100% is impossible), only being seperated/counterpicked due to matchups.
-And for Technical Skills, the game shouldn't be as noob friendly. I dont want to put in 500+ hours into perfecting my gameplay and have to worry about this noob who just got the game that just spams *insert move here* and is being brought down to last stock. I know this has to do with the metagame evolving and all, but thats another thing that sepertates Melee from Brawl/PM is that they make certain things too user friendly. I was dissapointed when they made Cutter Dash easier because people kept complaining. With that logic, we might as well make waveshining, DACUS, sheild dropping easier, since all people have to do is whine.

5. Stages
-Am I the only one who is confused about this. Why is the top row in the front page banned at tournaments. All stages on the 1st page should be neutral/counterpicks.
-As for new stages, I want a competitively viable Mute City, Summit, Flat Zone, and Fire Emblem stage.

6. Neutral-Bs
-I made this its own section because, as a Kirby main, I shouldn't have to think about whether the other character's neutral b is good or not. This kinda goes along with balance too, as it wont just make Kirby a bit better, but a lot of characters better. I feel some moves should be tweaked slightly so that they are viable (not asking them to make it easier, I would much prefer them to make it more difficult). If you think this contradicts #4... you obviously missed the point.

And that is my little say on my idea of a perfect PM (4.0). I could make this 100x longer, going into specific details and stuff, but I think the idea is clear. As I said before, im not trying to offend anyone, its just my opinion... doesnt make it right/fact.

 

[GreenMunchkin]

Goddamn... If I had to have an ideal PM, I would get so much hate because it goes against mostly everyone's dreams, but this is just my opinion so dont attack me.

I personally agree with practically every part of your post, except...

-And for Technical Skills, the game shouldn't be as noob friendly. I dont want to put in 500+ hours into perfecting my gameplay and have to worry about this noob who just got the game that just spams *insert move here* and is being brought down to last stock. I know this has to do with the metagame evolving and all, but thats another thing that sepertates Melee from Brawl/PM is that they make certain things too user friendly. I was upset when they made Cutter Dash easier because people kept complaining. With that logic, we might as well make waveshining, DACUS, sheild dropping easier, since all people have to do is complain.

Why shouldn't all of those things be "noob friendly"? What harm actually comes from it if everyone has access to these techniques? I don't want to seem like I'm picking on you personally, but I see posts like this far too often (A.K.A. at all).
Wavedashing is the example I'll use. It took me weeks of practicing all-around technical skill for about an hour a day before I could properly wavedash. Even now, I'm not perfect at Ganon/Bowser wavedash, but I'm pretty darn good at it. Despite all that time spent, if I'm facing an opponent who started playing a month ago, I would much rather have them bring me to last stock while showing off incredible-looking tech skill than 4-stock them. It's a lot more rewarding to win a hard fight, no matter how long someone's been playing than it is to win without a challenge.

Or maybe I just don't complain enough.


...now then, onto the actual thread topic. The most ideal changes, in my eyes, are fixing all (or most of) the bugs with turbo mode, adding in Pichu (I think trading strength for self-harm is a neat mechanic with awesome possibilities,) making more stages (notably Summit and Flat Zone 2) neutral/tournament suited, and making Pikachu less incrediboring. He's just SO. DAMN. BLAND. I WANT to like him in this, but he is MIND-NUMBINGLY UNINTERESTING. /endrant

 

[Phan7om]

Why shouldn't all of those things be "noob friendly"? What harm actually comes from it if everyone has access to these techniques?

I see your point, I kinda made it look as if I wanted all the techniques to be difficult. I wasnt necessarily saying that. Techniques like WD, shield dropping, etc. should, idk, be more or less the same when it comes to difficulty to input. Im mainly talking about "spammable" moves. I actually agree with you where you said that you would actually much rather have them almost 4 stock you when they can show off a bunch of tech skill. What I meant is that I dont want to almost be brought down to last stock against a Fox who just spams Hyphen Smashes, or a Kirby that just spams Dash Attack. So acutally, I think we agree with each other much more that it initially seemed like.

 

[GreenMunchkin]

I see your point, I kinda made it look as if I wanted all the techniques to be difficult. I wasnt necessarily saying that. Techniques like WD, shield dropping, etc. should, idk, be more or less the same when it comes to difficulty to input. Im mainly talking about "spammable" moves. I actually agree with you where you said that you would actually much rather have them almost 4 stock you when they can show off a bunch of tech skill. What I meant is that I dont want to almost be brought down to last stock against a Fox who just spams Hyphen Smashes, or a Kirby that just spams Dash Attack. So acutally, I think we agree with each other much more that it initially seemed like.

Okay, yeah, I'll agree. Losing (or almost losing) to someone who plays terribly just because dat Hyphen Smash tho is kinda annoying. Just a misunderstanding, I didn't mean to come off as angry or flame-ish.

 

[Sixth-Sense]

- A brand spanking new menu, the normal brawl one is just kinda meh, i'd really like to see what they could do with their trademark purple color
- A much better victory screen, i understand they made it to resemble melee in the latest build but melee's victory sceen wasn't very great either, pretty bland actually, something more along the lines of ssb64
- Balance patches and fixes for characters, you know the usual (especially for DDD, ness and ganon porfavor)
- A new character, i personally don't care what they make, i just know it'll be pretty freaking amazing, although just one character since i think two would be way too much work just to then heavily change them in the future
- Melee tether mechanics, i now this is being worked on (i think) but i still get tired of the auto-lock on mechanic thats currently implemented, plus i would like to recover with link from below
- Melee SFX for certain moves like all electric attacks, sword swings, on hit sfx (except for Ike, god its hurts when he hits you) wind, audience, etc.
- perfect melee physics, i know this is being worked on but i would like this for the next release, especially that one dead frame thing
- Some more dynamic tourney viable stages, when you go to a tournament or watch the stream, everyone basically always uses the stages on the bottom row
- HD N64 stages, dreamland and hyrule temple look pretttty ugly compared to the other stages, at the very least give them better textures and backgrounds
- A working version of SSE?
- Better camera, in 3.0 the camera is much better than it was before and now i like watching PM vids more than melee haha, but i still think its needs to zoom in a little more and shake around more when you get hit or something a la melee
- a new mode for special brawl, idk what just give me something
- At least two alt costumes for every character that could have another costume, if they can't (like link or ganon for example) give the alternate costume more colors (i would really like this for wolf)

thats it for now, to tell you the truth i'm content with anything they throw at us, and considering how we want them to throw us a bone and they end up throwing grade-A imported Japanese steak at us in each release, i'm not worried at all

 

[ItsRainingGravy]

1. Ness buffs. Give Ness the ability to airdodge out of his aerial Psi-Magnet. It can already be kind of done by SH -> DownB -> Double Jump -> Air Dodge...but taking it a step further by removing the need to double jump would improve Ness's mobility.

2. King DeDeDe buffs. Holding shield when using side special could drop a Waddle Dee directly in front of him instead of throwing it forward. Doing this will allow for more waddledashing opportunities, and increase DeDeDe's mobility.

3. Luigi buffs. Slightly more aerial mobility, improved dash attack, or slightly faster Fireballs. Improved dash attack could be canceled on hit into other ground attacks, but not specials or grabs. The dash attack change is controversial, but the other two changes would be really nice.

4. Toon Link buffs. Give him the ability to Glide Toss his bombs on the ground, similar to how Diddy can with his bananas.

5. Fox Pal version nerfs. Or at the very least, slightly nerfed Up Air and Up Smash.

6. Falco Pal version nerfs. Or at the very least, slightly nerfed Down Air.

7. Ice Climber changes. Whenever Nana grabs someone, make her always use Up Throw. Also, more desynch options probably?

8. Other character buffs/nerfs for the characters that need them (I'll think of more over time)


9. Melee shield complete restoration.

10. Frame-1 delay removal.

11. Even more AI improvements (thank you, KingClubber).

12. Removal of the Rock portion of the Pokemon Stadium 1 stage.

13. New characters, though this isn't really necessary. Either Pichu or Isaac, if not both.

14. Further improvements to the new Project M launcher.

15. More alternate costumes. Please add Masked DeDeDe.

16. The addition of a vulnerable Wario Man as an eater egg character, similar to Giga Bowser.

17. More suggestions might be added over time.


Also, this isn't really a Project M 4.0 suggestion, but please update the projectmgame website. There are still a lot of inaccurate character pages, such as Sonic's new side special not being mentioned. That is all.

 

[andalsoandy]

Kirby needs a few new abilities from characters, like Wario's Shoulder Charge instead of Chomp, Maybe Ike's Side-B, idk. etc.

Just an idea.

 

[CardiganBoy]

Ok, lets see:

FEATURES:
-A Stage Expansion engine by the Project M, with at least 2 songs per stage.
-A "Virtual soundbank engine" wich will allow newcomers, and some alt. costumes have their own SFX and Voices without replacing any existing SFX.
-Melee Launch SFX

CHARACTERS:
-At least one newcomer.
-Melee's robotic SFX fow Samus dair, down smash, and ledge grab.
-Dark Suit, Light Suit, or/and Fusion Suit alts for Samus.
-Fixed expressions for OoT Link costume.

STAGES:
-Returning with or without the Stage Expansion Engine:

• Mute City
• Great Bay
• Brinstar Depths
• Kongo Jungle (Melee)
• Green Greens
• Yoshi's Island (Melee)
• Mushroom Kingdom I & II
• Venom

-Revamp Returning:

• Playable New Pork City
• Playable Donkey Kong
• Playable Bridge of Eldin

-Remake of the Smash64 Stages (Better textures, more details, 3D backgrounds)

OTHERS:
-So, if got so low possibilities of returning, at least include him as an in-game Cameo, maybe flying in the background of Hyrule Castle with the aid of Keapora Geabora?
-Redesigned new Menu with new background.

 

[Rᴏb]

New character
New menus
New textures
New CSPs
New SFX
Melee tethers
Light shielding
Nerfed recoveries
Nerfed spacies
Momentum delay fixed
Competitive stages that aren't boring as **** to look at

 

[XalchemistX]

The feature I want the most is bringing back grappling on the side of the stage.








.....and goku

 

[Vilain]

- Alt Costumes, at least 1 per character
- Melee modes
- New character, maybe Pichu or one of the clone engine poll top tier (Isaac ?)
- PAL version ?
- Ability to connect the game to your own game server in order to play online without lags, by typing your IP adress and password... no, just kidding

 

[Chzrm3]

Ooo, this is fun! :D

-
- A new character that the PMBR makes unique. Maybe Ridley, Isaac, or whoever else they really love. I just think they've gone so far and done so much to make existing movesets exciting (like Wario), I'd love to see how they tackle making effectively their own character. Plus, the idea of PM actually adding a new character to Smash is so exciting. I mean, my mind exploded when they announced Roy, and then that debris exploded again when they announced Mewtwo. I don't even know what'd happen if they announced someone new, but I think I wanna find out. : D
- The old stages back. I love the stages that the PM team made, but it's weird not having some of the sillier ones when a bunch of my friends are over and we just wanna mess around. Levels like and were always so fun to have derp matches on, haha. I'm not saying "remove the tourney-legal stages and add these back" - but I'd love it if the PM team could figure out a satisfying way to bring those crazy levels back, without losing anything. Maybe a Stage-Expansion engine, the same way they made a clone engine? I know there are separate mods that already do this, but they had some reasons for not wanting to use those.
- On top of this, some more retro stages would be nice too. I love having the N64 Hyrule temple back, that stage is one of my favorites now haha.

- Some more alt costumes would be sick! I know that's asking a lot, but they've done some really cool things with the alt costume engine. I'd love to see more tunic colors for Melee Link, costumes for characters like Zelda and Diddy that don't have any yet, etc.

Any engine improvements are icing on the cake. I know they're always working towards that, and the stuff that's still eluding them is incredibly difficult to nail down. Oh, and the craziest thing:

- If they could somehow release the clone engine so that the modding community at large could start using it. I know that's reeeeeaaally tough so I almost didn't even say it, but this is a wishlist, haha.

 

[DrinkingFood]

pichu isn't coming back
sure you could make him unique
you could make any character unique
point remains that if pokemon is getting another rep, there are better choices than pichu.

 

[MLGF]

Can... can we not start this here?

 

[C.Olimar788]

I'd primarily like to see a few more original stages, stuff like the custom Bowser's Castle that everyone loves and things like that. There are a few... lackluster stages that still could stand to be replaced as well, barring shenanigans to add more stages. I'm talking about Big Blue, mostly.

Extra characters would be amazing, but I can't see that happening for a while. I doubt they will add any more character until they can at least confirm that they're not in Smash 4, and I would think that right now the focus is more on fixing up balance issues (buff Ness plz plz plz) and making alternate costumes. Speaking of, an ideal Final Build would definitely have every character with at least one alternate costume. There's still a lot of great potential there, and it's all sorts of fun to have.

 

[OrangeSodaGuy]

Ok, lets see:

GOAT signature.

Really though, individual target tests and Melee tethers are my most wanted features. End-of-match bonuses would be great as well.

I'm a little concerned about the idea of releasing a clone engine that ANYONE could use. Sure, more characters is great, but if that opens the door for people adding all sorts of crazy characters that everybody might not have or know about, and that could make it tough for people to learn matchups and cause balance issues. I could be totally wrong on this, so if I am, please let me know-- how would tournament organizers be able to run things if that were the case? The idea of people being able to add whoever they want seems a little MUGEN-y for my tastes and could cause a lot of chaos in the long run unless very carefully handled.

Spoiler

As far as characters go, and I really hope this doesn't start another holy war...

Spoiler

trolling FTW. The game could use an underdog/troll character to spice things up, since PMBR doesn't really have a character to fill that niche. Plus the self damage mechanic could do a lot to give Pichu a unique flair all it's own. I was thinking it would also be neat if it had a mechanic similar to Kirby's plasma ability in superstar.
(spoilertagged for whoever's interested)

Spoiler

copypasta'd from another thread...
Pichu's Thunder Jolt (B), Agility (up B) and Thunder (down B) would be his most revamped moves.

Thunder jolt would have less range, but would be able to paralyze opponents like ZSS's Paralyzer. Pichu will take damage from using this move, but it can give you time to escape if you're in a bind.

Agility would feature three zips instead of two (each zip would be slightly shorter than one of Pika's). The move still does no damage.

Thunder would instead become Discharge. Normally, Discharge would be a VERY weak move. The more Pichu runs around (again, dashdancing FTW), the more electricity it will build up. When fully charged, Pichu will become electrified-- anything it touches will take damage, and Pichu will take damage itself until it uses Discharge. Discharge would look similar to Pika's Thunder except for one thing-- it travels horizontally! Instead of coming from the clouds, Pichu will discharge a gigantic thunderbolt from it's own body that would shoot straight ahead, decimating all that it touches! The question is: can Pichu live long enough to use it?

Also, I had a really silly idea. If Pichu got a final smash, what if it was Destiny Bond? A 20-second timer would appear above Pichu's head, and if it is KO'd before that timer runs out, whoever landed the killing blow will be instantly defeated! Imagine the salt this would cause in Team Matches!

EDIT: I'm pretty sure that Pichu can't use destiny bond. Would still be hilarious though.

 

[Mera Mera]

My ideal PM 4.0 would have:

1. A (or many) tournament friendly stage(s) per series:
We need a Fire Emblem, Zelda, Ice climbers, and Metal Gear Solid one off the top of my head. I'm really not a fan of the transformation transition for the fire emblem stage. They would make two good stages on their own. I'm not sure if there's tilting on the second part, but tilting if it's not random would be cool. I'd want some/a platform on that stage though.

2. In 1v1s, characters should always spawn in similar locations. Like, on battlefield people should spawn on the left and right platform or on the right and left on the ground. People shouldn't start at a disadvantage, especially now that we have Nana who will get off the platform with a delay possibly dying way early.

3. Shorten the percent range for guaranteed followups on grabs with the characters that have that, so that good DI leads to a tech chase or a possible (but not guaranteed) juggle. Guaranteed follow ups on fast fallers is okay I guess since it's their weakness. Sheik d-throw/b-throw in particular come to mind, but I'm sure there are others. Buffs to compensate would be reasonable. Edit: I'm more so okay with Ice Climbers guaranteed stuff from grab because Nana is somewhat easy to kill and it's kinda their niche.

4. Make woddle toss for DDD more viable and more important to his game. It's fun, silly as hell, and really adds character to DDD.

5. Isaac and a stage for him. I think he'd make for an interesting character, and you could mix in sword attacks from all the sword users and add some Earth specials.

6. If it were possible, maybe a tag team mode:
Where it's 1v1 but each person chooses two characters (call them A and B). You start as character A, and if you hit taunt right after grab, they grab their B character and then can throw them. After the throw the command from A you can DI the throw and then control B. B takes full knockback for his percent, but takes no damage and suffers no hitlag. Then A disappears Nana style keeping his percent and lives for when he comes back into the fray. If A and/or B are hit during the throw, B disappears (taking damage if hit) and A takes typical knockback/hitlag (if hit). Each character gets 2 lives, and have projectiles stay out during/after the character switch with no friendly fire. I don't know if it's possible but I think it would be a crazy fun mode.

 

[uCooL]

- More stuff that attracts new players community has to grow

I think theres already the double D enhancements on brawl vault for Zelda, Peach and ZZS, so were good on that point at least.

 

[XStarWarriorX]

Obviously fixing the bugs and adding some things plus balancing, but.

I'd like to see them use the clone engine to fill the 5 slots.

Someone like lyn comes to mind.

 

[_Ganondorf_]

All of you covered pretty much everything I would like to see except:

- A unique Ganondorf! I don't care if its a new character slot, a complete revamp of his moves or (my personal favorite) completely unique animations to him on every possible move that are more lore friendly but don't change his play style (except Warlock Punch, that has got to go).

(*Note: I posted this on the clone suggestion thread since they were talking about Ganon*)

There is a whole discussion in the Ganondorf thread about his meta game and changes. But I think all the moves/throws that are identical to Falcon can change to fit Ganon better but stay functionally the same (except ! Warlock Punch!) it probably wouldn't upset current Ganon mains (like my self) but a totally unieqe Ganon will be a dream come true! And I would still play Black Shadow for the moveset.

Here are some of my suggestions:

- When they finally change Warlock punch, they can use that animation (with the darkness affect and all) for his F-smash. Win-win

- Imagine Mew2's Up- smash... Good! Now imagine Ganon doing it but it's a strong 2 hits just like his current Up smash, win-win.

Imagine Ganon punching the ground like in OOT, now imagine it looking like Charizard's Down smash but with Electricity affect. It can function just like his current Dsmash as a 2 hit, or it can be changed. Win-win.

The rest of his cloned animations like Bair, Nair, Uair, grab animation and throwing animations, can all be changed to be more sluggish/brutish looking (like Fair and Dair) to fit Ganon better, also added darkness and lightning affect around his limb as he executes his moves would just add an extra flair and establish he is a wizard/magic user further (imagine Fair with a darkness trail like Wizard's Foot, it would be even more badass! Same with electricity around his arm during Bair).

These type of changes would most likely please both LOZ fans and Ganon mains, and if some of the moves can be improved in the process it would be even better (the smash gods know some of them need to be improved). Even with all this said I would still prefer Ganon/Black Shadow idea.

(*Part 2*)

I have a few other ideas, these changes are to make Ganon more unique NOT to change how he plays:

- Up Special: instead of grabbing the opponent like C. Falcon he can do a sort of a bear hug and possibly laugh maniacally while electrocuting the enemy. Also when Ganon blasts the opponent away and he gets "pushed back" the animation should look unique, currently its like CF's its very nimble and even a bit elegant. A more brutish animation showing Ganon's power/cockiness would fit better. Also his uppercut at the end should get a darkness trail affect, just so it feels more like a magical attack.

- Down Special: Now Wizard's Kick is amazing! And should not change functionally (unless its for the better lol) but aesthetically its very similar to Falcon Kick. Maybe instead of a kick, Ganon glides forward the opponent with his arm stretched in front of him palm open, at the end of his palm a darkness wave or ball is found and the darkness trail emits from the tip of it. This keeps the move the same but changes it aesthetics. (*Note* this move is on the bottom of my list that needs an aesthetic change, all his other cloned moves should be changed first)

- Bair: Currently Ganon has his left fist stretched out and his other tucked next to his chest, while his feet are crossed, this move looks way to nimble for Ganon. Instead his tucked right fist can be changed to having his elbow out and his hand open facing downwards, also his feet would be apart instead of crossed.

I have made "drawings" of my suggested animation and/or move changes, its not amazing since i had to draw it with a mouse but i think it gets the point across for those that have a hard time imagining it, also pay attention to the way his back, hands, arms and legs look in some of the pics, the hand are more open and the arms and legs are more spread apart while his back is more slouched forward in Up B, all to fit Ganondorf's character better. Same type of "style" could be applied to how his grab animation and throw animations look as well. http://s899.photobucket.com/user/Muzumush/embed/slideshow/Ganondorf move ideas

The more I think about these potential changes the more I want to see them happen lol.

 

[Joe73191]

Actually I think we have enough characters. I wouldn't ask for more characters. Sure the return of some missing stages would be cool. (who doesn't love great bay?) Turning stage hazards on or off would be nice so we can have back some of the old stage hazards when we want. What I would want in a 4.0 or whatever the final version was would be to continue the same idea as stock control into special versus. Where you can control which players and cpus are getting the buff. For instance allowing you to stay normal while your opponent is giant or metal or turbo or whatever you decide to do in special versus. Maybe final smashes for squirtle, ivysaur and charizard. Snake messages in shadow moses island for roy and mewtwo.Honestly the game is so perfect. I don't know what else I could want.

 

[ViewtifulHoe242]

improved stamina mode- being able to set stamina as high as possible, stamina mode with stocks
stages- stages with optional hazards
improved event matches- events that tailor to each specific character ( getting 5 different combos on sandbag with wolf, or five different sandbag combo strings with lucario in a certain time.)
sound- personally i couldnt care less but some people REALLY like the melee sound effects
music- we can already add custom music so idk, maybe the options to switch songs mid match?
MODES- some kind of tag in tag out mode using a custom version on poketrainers down b, or marvel style switching allowing us to have 2 on 2 matches or 3 on three matches one at a time. 3 players share 3 stocks and keep their damage when they switch out.
-hitbox mode?
-pal version
-ITEMS
-the inclusion on optional melee items. the homerun bat is trash in brawl
-adventure mode?
-non ******** ai that give up on life
- Overall a deeper, richer singleplayer experience.
COMBAT ARENA MODE
-make the player able to spawn enemies such as wire frames, sse enemies to fight against. (could be mega badass)

 

[Freduardo]

8 player online matches for four vs four teams.
Controlled Boss Battle mode - one player plays as one of the bosses like Rayquaza, Porky, Master Hand with HP against three players who operate as normal.
So so many more characters. Never end new! I want to be able to try every great psa from an sd card on a hackless wii.
More things like sword ganon
More easter Eggs

 

[PillsBuryDopeBoy]

8 player online matches for four vs four teams.

Wait do you mean 8 people fighting at once? because that would be very hard to implement (if it's even possible).

 

[QQQQQQQ7777777]

Wait do you mean 8 people fighting at once? because that would be very hard to implement (if it's even possible).

and we would need larger stages, a lot larger.