The Help Black Waltz Stop Being a Scrub With Marth Thread

Black Waltz · Oct 22, 2007

Betrayed · Oct 22, 2007

As an aspiring Marth player myself, I'd be glad to help however I can.

I'll edit this post later after I watch a few videos, in the mood to play some smash myself at the moment.

DGMavn · Oct 23, 2007

Grab more during the Marth ditto.
JCGrab-punch-fthrow-JCGrab...fsmash and edgeguard from there. Nice combo to finish it off.

$ick · Oct 23, 2007

Be careful as to who's advice you take on these forums. Lots of newbs =/ Fthrow can easily be DI'd as to not get fsmashed. :laugh:

ConnorTheKid · Oct 25, 2007

I just watched the latest match, all I can say is, less dash attack, more shffl fairs and shdfairs

Black Waltz · Oct 25, 2007

ty for the advice dudes. i screw up my shdfs ALOT when i play against humans.

Irow · Oct 27, 2007

Alright, you need to stop using the D-air so much. A much more effective way to attack is with a SHFFL F-air. In Marth dittos, grab more. At low percentage's in can lead into a tipper, just watch your opponent's DI. Against a good player, you most likely won't get it in, so watch out. Marth has an effective tech chase game, so you can try that as well.

Against Sheik, it's a good thing that your being aggressive, but again don't use the D-air so often, it will get you killed against a better Sheik. Try spacing your double fairs better. On another note, try keeping Sheik above you, you'll have an easier time controlling the match.

Pou · Oct 28, 2007

I agree with that guy above me.
Sheik above marth is the same thing as the sheik screaming "I want to get hit!!"
But when she's not above you, work on the spacing, cuz sheik dsmash is so **** annoying when it hits you ><

L.O.P.L. · Oct 29, 2007

No down-smash. And those dair have a lot of lag cut down on them because they can be easily shield grabbed. You should only use it for spikes and ken combos. But every now and then you could use it.

Save your jumps until the end. That way you cover more distance and you have are less vulnerable to edgeguarding/edgehogging. When you are knocked out DI first toward the stage to stop the momentum!

Also you need to improve your chaingrabbing on fast-fallers. Chaingrab a few times into u-tilts and space out for the tipped f-smash. You will need to practice that. Although upthrows from low-percentage into a u-smash or a f-smash look pretty they aren't the right choice majority of the time. The u-tilt sets up very nicely for a tipped f-smash.

Black Waltz · Oct 30, 2007

Irow said:
Alright, you need to stop using the D-air so much. A much more effective way to attack is with a SHFFL F-air. In Marth dittos, grab more. At low percentage's in can lead into a tipper, just watch your opponent's DI. Against a good player, you most likely won't get it in, so watch out. Marth has an effective tech chase game, so you can try that as well.

Against Sheik, it's a good thing that your being aggressive, but again don't use the D-air so often, it will get you killed against a better Sheik. Try spacing your double fairs better. On another note, try keeping Sheik above you, you'll have an easier time controlling the match.

When someone is behind me at close proximity and i have my shield up, i use the dair to get them away from me. or should i use something else?

L.O.P.L. said:
No down-smash. And those dair have a lot of lag cut down on them because they can be easily shield grabbed. You should only use it for spikes and ken combos. But every now and then you could use it.

Save your jumps until the end. That way you cover more distance and you have are less vulnerable to edgeguarding/edgehogging. When you are knocked out DI first toward the stage to stop the momentum!

Also you need to improve your chaingrabbing on fast-fallers. Chaingrab a few times into u-tilts and space out for the tipped f-smash. You will need to practice that. Although upthrows from low-percentage into a u-smash or a f-smash look pretty they aren't the right choice majority of the time. The u-tilt sets up very nicely for a tipped f-smash.

for chaingrabbing, is there a specific way to pivot more quickly to grab someone behind you?
most of the time i usmash is because i mess up utilts, lol.

Dreadlord Santa · Oct 30, 2007

Um... no? Pivot grabs are only used when someone is more or less directly on top of you. If they're behind you, just dash in their direction into a JC grab. You really only need to pivot around... 23-25%? I think? Something like that. If you were just asking about the fastest way to pivot grab, there's really only one way to do it - dash in one direction, quickly dash in the other, and grab. Speed is really only determined by how far you dash, so... if you're missing grabs, just reverse your direction faster next time.

When someone's right in my face while I'm playing, I generally either a.) grab, or b.) backwards momentum shffl fair, which is actually a huge mouthfull come to think of it. I don't know how else to describe it, but it's a lot faster, and while it might not be better for comboing if you don't tip with it, at least you won't be as easily punished.

L.O.P.L. · Oct 30, 2007

Black Waltz said:
most of the time i usmash is because i mess up utilts, lol.

There is a really easy way. Just slightly point your analog stick but not enough that it would jump. You just direct it up half way simply. And you got yourself some u-tilts. To change directions while doing u-tilts what you can do is hold it slightly up and sideways.

Hope that helped. I hope I was clear.

Irow · Oct 30, 2007

Black Waltz said:
When someone is behind me at close proximity and i have my shield up, i use the dair to get them away from me. or should i use something else?

There are a lot of options you have when a person is behind you. You can either try to dash away, wavedash away, roll (Roll is effective in some cases, but only use if you can't wavedash too well). If they're really, really close, do a standing dodge when they attack. You'll have a chance to attack with a smash or a grab. Dair is normally a bad idea to get them out of the way, but you can use it to surprise your opponent a couple times. Another good idea is to make sure a person is never behind you. Marth's priority lies in front and above him. When you play Marth, you have to do your best to keep them away from your body, but close enough to hit with your sword. Dair is slow, weak, and ineffective on the ground. There is almost always a better way to hit a person behind you. And remember, keep your opponent in front of you or above you. Marth is pretty fast, and has amazing range.

Black Waltz · Nov 8, 2007

2 new vids added.

Irow · Nov 8, 2007

Alright, that's a lot better!

You're using the Dair a lot more effectively, and it shows. Props on your SHDF's, and the spacing with the tips.

However, there's something I think you need to learn how to do. It's to Fair while DI'ing away. In alot of cases, it helps keep your opponent at the tip, and it works well against a character like Fox. You need to work on following up with your combo's as well.

Try practicing the Dair spike with Marth more, that needs some work.

You're getting better, but I think you need to find some more people to play with. Playing against somebody who is a lot better than you will improve your game a lot.

Fortress | Sveet · Nov 8, 2007

if he attacks with a dair and you want to look awesome, jump and press L/R and you will get spiked into the ground you were standing on and tech, easily able to lag punish.

Black Waltz · Dec 9, 2007

YES, finally new vids are up. cort=best inspiration.

Irow · Dec 11, 2007

It's looking good. First of all though, you need to work on some mindgames. Your Marth is playing very predictable. Through a lot of the matches I saw, your opponents caught on pretty well.

Another thing, stop walking into shieldgrabs and such. If your opponent has their shield up, don't try to fair it. Grab it. This brings me to my next point. Grab more. A lot more. Throw your opponent off balance with grabs.

A tip against Shiek: When she does she teleports and you're on the ledge, the moment she starts her teleport, roll back/waveland on to the stage and fsmash that hoe. You don't need to be trying the more flashy tricks. You want to be efficient, not flashy.

If you keep on doing the nair ledgehop, you're gonna get punished a lot. You need to mix up other types of get-ups. Sometimes even rolling will catch your opponent off guard.

Other than that, work on stringing your aerials better.

Tangy · May 10, 2008

I freakin suck at this game. =P

The Help Black Waltz Stop Being a Scrub With Marth Thread

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