Social Swamp's Social Thread 3 - And now, the end is near, and so I face the final curtain...

[Frostwraith]

Embarassing?

Dude, Bayonetta's entire character and design is based on a woman's power fantasy. That woman drew her.

It's not some "hurrr durr men want boobs" kind of thing. It's the kind of woman she wanted to be.

Reminds me of this interview with Hellena Taylor (Bayo's VA) I've read a while ago where she says "She is the women all women would love to be and no woman is."

Here's the source by the way: http://nintendonews.com/interviews/hellena-taylor-voice-bayonetta-interview/

And now, I really am off.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I know that.

That's why she's a parody of an average man's idea of sexy, and not actually the average man's idea of sexy.

If it's a parody...

Embarrisingly blatant attempts at sex appeal are a Bayonetta thing

Than is it actually embarrassing?

 

[aldelaro5]

Ok, i know and even stated that Paper Jam is clearly partially rushed and the minigames number were a clear indications, but still loved the game.

I stated that there were other reasons that says this, I never truly detailed them because.....they are a bit more technical.

I am in a discord of Paper Mario speedruns and as a joke, a pj channel was there, but it stayed there. So I checked it a bit and I realised that the game is inherently broken.

no seriosuly, the engine is based on DT whcih already sucked a lot in colisions, but IT'S EVEN WORSE! Like clips are now almsot easy to do and having a trio that you have all your characters linked together basically allows to clip into a lot of places and to skip lots of stuff and etc..... Basically, broken engine, you can;t patch that lol.

Even worse, the cutscenes management really sucks, like triggering a map laoding when it normally trigger a cs, but not in a situation where it shoudl really be, it gives you control DURING THE CS and that allows weird stuff......even laoding to the map you were......at a failsafe location.......

But now i learned today that ......omg these programmers are sooooooooooooooooooooooo bad!

basiclaly, IT HAS SPOILERS, but this......

Spoiler

Is jsut.....I can;t get over how bad this is.

let me explain you what I think happened which seems to be agreed with the other people in the group when i talked about it.

The game woudl use a stack.....it;s jsut a list when you only touch the first element so you pull it out or you place one on top. The game woudl have a stack to know what exactly is going on right now. If you are int he game......then there isn;t going to be much, but say you trigger a battle or you enter a minigame, well soemthign would be put on top. They do this so that you are laoded in another thign and when you exit it, the game pulls that item out and you come back to the last item you were int he stack which normally is the game.

cool, so that allows the game to know what to do if you exited and normally the game wouln;t allow to have a minigame and a boss battle at the same time int he stack, they do soem protections for this to not happen which would force you to jsut exit before having a chance to do it......

no.

This game has a broken engine so it is possible to get out of the minigame without exiting it, this is show at the beginning of the video, the person got back to the overworld without exiting the game. So the minigame was never pulled out of the stack, but you are not in a minigame....whcih shoudln;t happen normally.

Now, the idea is that what if you start a battle then? Well, the battle woudl be put on top of the stack like it normally shoudl do so what gives?

Well, if you exit the battle, of course it woudl get pulled out......and then?

Well, the thing is supposed to exit to the tittle screen so not only it ends the battle, but it also ends the last item in the stack which NORMALLY is the game itself, because normally, you have the game and then the battle so that;s how the game knows to got to the tittle screen.

But remmeber that we have one item that shoudln;t be there: the minigame. So let;s recap:

• triggers the minigame, gets added on top of the stack
• end the minigame prematurely so stack is unchanged, but you can control in the overworld like normal
• trigger a boss battles, it gets added to the stack
• return to tittle screen, removes the battle and the last item which is the minigame

so what happens?

Well it returns to the prvious items which is......

the game......

OMG AT THIS MOMENT I YELLED INT HE CHAT OF WTF AND YELLIGN TO GO AWAY!

Look, this is ridiculously broekn lol and you know what is even more hilarious?

Why the game woudl even think you beat the boss?

The ONLY possible explanation was wel you exited the battle without actually exiting the game so the game HAD to assume you actually ALREADY beat the boss until it woudl have proof you didn't........which is what happened here.

Ok guys, I know quite a bit on programming I even take classes and I cannot understand how this dumb design decision was done! WHY WOULD YOU ASSUME SUCCESS ON BATTLES??? you normally woudl do the opposite, you woudl assume failure until you prove that it succeeded it logically make sense but here?

idk man......

Like I still like pj as a game,but god, if you start to check the programming.....god bless.....it;s awfull......

 

[Coricus]

With Bayonetta, her legs are just stupidly long in proportion to the rest of her body. And due to the black clothes, a lot of people call her "Spider Legs".

Well I know someone that would go for that.

Spoiler: Maybe slightly too big

He's. . .kind of used to this.

 

[Z25]

...But they don't have any particular trend for designing characters.

They make them differently depending on the kind of game they are making.

You know....just like any sensible developer.

They made W101 after all. And have made licensed things before.

Hell, they're making Star Fox: Zero. Their redesigns for the characters don't look especially sexual there.

I dunno it feels like you are pulling this out of nowhere. Embarrisingly blatant attempts at sex appeal are a Bayonetta thing, not a Platinum Games thing.



They have a decent amount.

But not much because they are niche.

Reason being that people don't actually widely find them that sexy.

Again, I already addressed the differences. As I said, if PG made a KI it will most likely take heavy influence from the artstyle of Bayonnetta. The W101 wouldn't work because it's to cartoony. Bayo has the best comparison but it be toned a bit so the artsyle would be more associated with the Ki U art style. Also I agree with swamp here.

Embarassing?

Dude, Bayonetta's entire character and design is based on a woman's power fantasy. That woman drew her.

It's not some "hurrr durr men want boobs" kind of thing. It's the kind of woman she wanted to be.

Also she is not a parody by any means really. My point was the artsyle change and the huge popularity of KI would lead to r34. Unlike what you mentioned, KI is not niche and has more room for that with how the characters were already designed in uprising.

Anyway, as I said it wouldn't matter at all to the core of the game. It was merely an observation I made, that wasn't meant to be taken as a jab, or bad, or trying to sound wrong by any means.

 

[Kingslime304]

You know, I kinda want an Earthbound 64 Lucas attire alt. (With his alt. haircut) in Smash now.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

This isn't directed towards anyone, but it's something I've been noticing for the past few months.

I'm a Conservative Protestant Christian.

How are a lot of you more prudish about sexuality than me?

 

[Champ Gold]

This isn't directed towards anyone, but it's something I've been noticing for the past few months.

I'm a Conservative Protestant Christian.

How are a lot of you more prudish about sexuality than me?

They're young adults in the modern digital era of multimedia where sex and violence is very bad and shouldn't ever been shown in any entertaining light.

"My feelings end where your enjoyment begins"

I'm a conservative Christian and I don't mind it (heck I support it, it's nice to be positive about something that occurs in nature) and it just leans that way due to that of the words of Mr. Mackey

"Sex is bad, M'kay"

 

[Z25]

This isn't directed towards anyone, but it's something I've been noticing for the past few months.

I'm a Conservative Protestant Christian.

How are a lot of you more prudish about sexuality than me?

That's a question I can't answer. But I to am a Christian who follows the beliefs, but I am not prudish at all. I don't see a problem with it most of the time. Very rarely does it can taken out of control in games or other media.

 

[Icedragonadam]

So I've been playing on the 3ds version of Umbra Clock Tower and I'm wondering if the 3 angels appear because I haven't seen them yet.

 

[ChikoLad]

If it's a parody...


Than is it actually embarrassing?

Well kinda.

Parody or not, the element of sexuality is there.

 

[Curious Villager]

So I've been playing on the 3ds version of Umbra Clock Tower and I'm wondering if the 3 angels appear because I haven't seen them yet.

I don't think so. Only the grunts as far as I know.

I think that's alright since the big ones are pretty distracting. Especially the one with that huge face....

 

[ChikoLad]

Again, I already addressed the differences. As I said, if PG made a KI it will most likely take heavy influence from the artstyle of Bayonnetta. The W101 wouldn't work because it's to cartoony. Bayo has the best comparison but it be toned a bit so the artsyle would be more associated with the Ki U art style. Also I agree with swamp here.


Also she is not a parody by any means really. My point was the artsyle change and the huge popularity of KI would lead to r34. Unlike what you mentioned, KI is not niche and has more room for that with how the characters were already designed in uprising.

Anyway, as I said it wouldn't matter at all to the core of the game. It was merely an observation I made, that wasn't meant to be taken as a jab, or bad, or trying to sound wrong by any means.

How would KI take influence from Bayonetta in terms of art style?

The two games have completely different tones.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Ya know, it's kind of odd how Christians became the "anti-sex" group.

The Bible and Torah are VERY positive about sex.

Yeah, it gives rules and how it needs to be done but it celebrates it everywhere.

For example...

• Wives and husbands are advised not to deny the other sex if they can help it.
• Married couples are told that sex draws them together and will make them happy in several verses.
• There is a poem that states all the physical things a husband finds attractive about his wife. It then does the same thing from the wive's perspective. Apparently she likes "legs like pillars." It calls these feelings beautiful.
• There is literally a chapter where Solomon is gushing about how great boobs are.

I don't know how we became so anti-sex. The Bible and Torah are trying to say that if you obey the rules, you should go nuts.

 

[Champ Gold]

Well kinda.

Parody or not, the element of sexuality is there.

Okay. So what? She's a character who builds on being an all-powerful witch who is hot sexy and she knows it.

It's not like they are doing this to appeal to anyone. I mean multiple women design and were proud of what came of Bayo but why do you wanna say that's all irrelevant or it doesn't matter because she's that way? Why can't she be what people love her for?

 

[Curious Villager]

I don't think they would shift the art style for Kid Icarus too far away from the one in Uprising. I recall there being a prototype Kid Icarus game that went with more realistic and "mature" proportions by some company which Nintendo shot down so I'm not sure if they would approve to a Kid Icarus game looking like the Bayonetta games....

 

[ChikoLad]

Okay. So what? She's a character who builds on being an all-powerful witch who is hot sexy and she knows it.

It's not like they are doing this to appeal to anyone. I mean multiple women design and were proud of what came of Bayo but why do you wanna say that's all irrelevant or it doesn't matter because she's that way? Why can't she be what people love her for?

...When did I say any of this was a bad thing?

 

[Swamp Sensei]

...When did I say any of this was a bad thing?

You called it embarrassing.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

This isn't directed towards anyone, but it's something I've been noticing for the past few months.

I'm a Conservative Protestant Christian.

How are a lot of you more prudish about sexuality than me?

I'm a pervert with standards. I'm also Catholic.

I still think there needs to be some "let's no go there" stuff, no matter what the rating. Bayonetta is probably one of my favorite characters because she's not actually sexualized, but is used properly while being sexy. Nor is she a parody of sexualization either. I think that's honestly an excellent thing we need to see more of. Only other character I can think of that actually seems that way is Mileena in the Mortal Kombat reboot. Despite the poorly done clothing(or lack of, when you meet her before she can properly even put on clothes, since she just got out of a test tube, literally), she is in complete control of how she acts. She does use her sexiness as more of a "so I can destroy you", but that makes sense for her character. It's not "sexy for the sake of being sexy" either. It has a purpose. I wish more of the characters had that in the MK series. Sadly everybody else in the reboot had terrible clothing that made no damn sense.

 

[Wario Bros.]

Finally gotten around to a computer after the DLC. It's GEWD!

- Both are really fun. Bayonetta is a little hard to master for me but I like her better.
- It's cool to see the Hands/Core get affected by Witch Time.
- Umbra Clock Tower is a bad*** stage!
- Bayo's up-air is GODLY UNBROKEN when it comes to the Credits minigame.
- Corrin is fun too.
- I REALLY can't help but smile big time when I see Kirby dual wielding Bayo's guns.

I'm happy how the DLC ended.

Soooooooooo... when's the next batch of DLC coming out?

 

[Kingslime304]

I think the Warlock punch looks WAY COOLER than the Falcon Punch, the Warlock looks like your gaining all magic for a simple yet STONG punch (Same for the Falcon Punch but....), I give it a plus for him using the back of his fist when punching.

 

[Z25]

How would KI take influence from Bayonetta in terms of art style?

The two games have completely different tones.

Tones yes, but I could easily see their being a balance between Ki U's artsyle and that of Bayo's. Both have realistic looks( Bayo's more so), which Is why I feel they would tone down the style of bayo's but still upgrade that of Ki's. Like how the artstyle for shin megama tensei X FE takes more from SMGT then FE. This I could see being the case here for Ki, but still very less realistic then bayo's.

As stated a more mature concept of KI was planned but shot down for wii. We don't know exactly why though. Sure it could be the artsyle, but we don't know.

My statements are only based on how I could see a PG made KI game look, that never meant that I that's how it would look indefinitely.

 

[Chrono.]

It's starting!

 

[Deleted member]

This isn't directed towards anyone, but it's something I've been noticing for the past few months.

I'm a Conservative Protestant Christian.

How are a lot of you more prudish about sexuality than me?

Well, this obviously isn't directed at me.

Ya know, it's kind of odd how Christians became the "anti-sex" group.

The Bible and Torah are VERY positive about sex.

Yeah, it gives rules and how it needs to be done but it celebrates it everywhere.

For example...

• Wives and husbands are advised not to deny the other sex if they can help it.
• Married couples are told that sex draws them together and will make them happy in several verses.
• There is a poem that states all the physical things a husband finds attractive about his wife. It then does the same thing from the wive's perspective. Apparently she likes "legs like pillars." It calls these feelings beautiful.
• There is literally a chapter where Solomon is gushing about how great boobs are.

I don't know how we became so anti-sex. The Bible and Torah are trying to say that if you obey the rules, you should go nuts.

I don't think the problem has been sex itself, but the problem some have is sex outside of marriage and the well, more kinky stuff rather than what makes the babies.

Though I'm not gonna go too detailed into this as I'm a athiest who has some rather strong feelings about religion as a whole.

 

[ChikoLad]

You called it embarrassing.

Which can be a light hearted, positive term.

Tones yes, but I could easily see their being a balance between Ki U's artsyle and that of Bayo's. Both have realistic looks( Bayo's more so), which Is why I feel they would tone down the style of bayo's but still upgrade that of Ki's. Like how the artstyle for shin megama tensei X FE takes more from SMGT then FE. This I could see being the case here for Ki, but still very less realistic then bayo's.

As stated a more mature concept of KI was planned but shot down for wii. We don't know exactly why though. Sure it could be the artsyle, but we don't know.

My statements are only based on how I could see a PG made KI game look, that never meant that I that's how it would look indefinitely.

Uprising wasn't realistic, it had a mostly cartoony anime look, especially on the characters. It's more comparable to Pokemon's art style than anything else.

The key thing to pay attention to is the characters' eyes. They are rounded and cartoony, not sharp and realistic.

Spoiler

 

[Kingslime304]

FG makes the CSS great.
Miis ruin it with every dlc character here.
Miis ruin CSS Confirmed.

 

[Z25]

It's starting!

Is this an in game change, or photoshop?

Because I saw Derrick from gamexplain post this exact picture on Twitter earlier, and the poster implied it was a photoshop to show how easy the roster could have been reorganized by Nintendo.

 

[Wario Bros.]

Thanx everyone :) Enjoy playing Bayonetta in Smash :D

— 無職? 神谷英樹 Unemployed? Hideki Kamiya (@HidekiKamiya_X) February 4, 2016

You know I am, Kamiya!

 

[Swamp Sensei]

more kinky stuff

Actually...

Kinky stuff is probably fine, biblically speaking.

The Bible and Torah say nothing about how the sexing is done. It just gives some quick no-nos to a couple of things like sex out of marriage.

 

[Chrono.]

Is this an in game change, or photoshop?

Because I saw Derrick from gamexplain post this exact picture on Twitter earlier, and the poster implied it was a photoshop to show how easy the roster could have been reorganized by Nintendo.

It's from SMB123 last I checked.

 

[Deleted member]

I saw a topic about stages some pages back and I want Dragon's Gate because FE7 is making me sad all it gets are some tracks

This is very late but yeah, that chapter is regarded as one of the most obnoxious ones in FE7.

Which one? 26 or 26x?

Spoiler

I kinda liked 26 despite the fog of war
And I do like how Ursula technically shows up out of nowhere and bolts you

26x tho...
Seriously, **** this chapter
Limited movement, never-ending reinforcements, bersek staff, getting stuck in the middle of the water and having Heath travel the entire map to take a unit out of it
And especially, **** Sonia
Bolting makes it impossible to even approach her without stalling her uses and that wouldn't be a problem if there wasn't a bunch of enemies near her
I even had to worn out her Ice tome with Nini's Grace+Barrier so I could even hope to damage her safely
Then, I decide to slowly damage her so Nino can deal the finishing blow and get a ****ton of experience and when she goes down to 2HP....
Lv 20 Eliwood with a 10% crit decides it's a good time to cheat the RNG
AT LEAST I got to promote Matthew, about ****ing time
Now I have two Assassins and a Thief
When can I get another Fell Contract?

And from what I can gather from the chapter's ending... is Sonia a Morph?

 

[Bananija]

Ya know, it's kind of odd how Christians became the "anti-sex" group.

The Bible and Torah are VERY positive about sex.

Yeah, it gives rules and how it needs to be done but it celebrates it everywhere.

For example...

• Wives and husbands are advised not to deny the other sex if they can help it.
• Married couples are told that sex draws them together and will make them happy in several verses.
• There is a poem that states all the physical things a husband finds attractive about his wife. It then does the same thing from the wive's perspective. Apparently she likes "legs like pillars." It calls these feelings beautiful.
• There is literally a chapter where Solomon is gushing about how great boobs are.

I don't know how we became so anti-sex. The Bible and Torah are trying to say that if you obey the rules, you should go nuts.

That is because during middle age, people had a lot of babies because of careless sex and they usually abandoned them. Therefore, the Catholic church was like "Who man! We can't let all those babies without a family." So they forbade sex before mariage to stop the growing orphan population.




And than it degenerated to what we know today.


And that is why Catholic are know as team anti-sex : because they didn't want the babies to be abandonned.

 

[Curious Villager]

Is this an in game change, or photoshop?

Because I saw Derrick from gamexplain post this exact picture on Twitter earlier, and the poster implied it was a photoshop to show how easy the roster could have been reorganized by Nintendo.

Not really Photoshop. @smb123w64gb rearranged the Character Select Screen in his game I believe.
https://twitter.com/smb123w64gb

 

[Champ Gold]

Actually...

Kinky stuff is probably fine, biblically speaking.

The Bible and Torah say nothing about how the sexing is done. It just gives some quick no-nos to a couple of things like sex out of marriage.

Which is the only thing that matters. Fidelity is awful and benefits no one in the long run.

It's why I laugh at the Ashley Madison leak and watched how people went ballistic over it when it's sort of karma going to a website dedicated to CHEATING ON YOUR SPOUSE.

Same with open relationships. Those at awful and is just this:

"I wanna have sex with someone else and still reap the benefits of being your boyfriend while I fool around with other guys"

 

[kylexv]

It's starting!

It's gotta be a hack
They somehow made it look worse

EDIT: This is better:

Spoiler: Roster

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Fidelity is awful and benefits no one in the long run.

Do you mean infidelity?

Because this clashes with the rest of your post.

So they forbade sex before mariage to stop the growing orphan population.

Interesting bit of history, but I am fairly certain the Torah and Bible (or what was written down at the time) both said that pre-marital sex was bad because the Catholic Church became big...

They probably cracked down on it hard due to the orphans though.

 

[Deleted member]

Actually...

Kinky stuff is probably fine, biblically speaking.

The Bible and Torah say nothing about how the sexing is done. It just gives some quick no-nos to a couple of things like sex out of marriage.

Yeah, that's true, the bible does have some pretty "kinky" stuff in it. And yet there's some people that are really against of any form of sex not traditional like let's say oral, because... Well, sometimes people just make things out thin air and find an excuse like the bible to back it even if it doesn't say so. Just human nature, really. And I'm not saying it's a religious thing, it's done a lot for many different things, just a way of getting the things you want.

(My posts today are all probably wonky from anxiety I had today from my sign language class, not that this stresses me out, having a civil discussion relaxes me if anything.)

 

[Chrono.]

It's gotta be a hack
They somehow made it look worse

It is.

That's why I said "it's starting", they're not done yet.

 

[Zynux]

Bayonetta has a pretty low amount of R34 for the kind of character she is.

A game being developed by Platinum Games would in no way effect the amount of R34 it gets. It's guaranteed to get some regardless though, such is the nature of R34.

Hell, Dead or Alive girls don't even get much.

Bayonetta's fanart usually consists of action shots or posing. She has very few Rule 34 compared to most.

DOA has a decent amount, Ayane & Kasumi in particular has a lot. Dead or Alive 5 in particular jumped up the artwork output a lot.

>Bayonetta
>Dead or Alive girls
>There's no R34

Can't say I'm surprised. After all, they're already sexualized to the point there's no need to make lewd art of them. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

. . .I guess people don't want fanservice handed to them on a silver platter, they just want to use R34 to corrupt things they see as innocent.

Nintendo characters in general have a huge output of Rule 34.

Characters like Princess Peach, Rosalina, Midna, Samus & Pokemon characters have such an insane output of art that they are only outdone by anime characters in terms of Rule 34.

I'm going to assume that for fanartists it's no fun to create sexy art for characters that already flaunt their sexuality.

Embarassing?

Dude, Bayonetta's entire character and design is based on a woman's power fantasy. That woman drew her.

It's not some "hurrr durr men want boobs" kind of thing. It's the kind of woman she wanted to be.

This reminds me of the Polygon review of Bayonetta 2, which complained about the sexiness of the main character. Or another Polygon review complaining about Dragon's Crown, even though the VA for the Sorceress likes her a lot.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Well, sometimes people just make things out thin air and find an excuse like the bible to back it even if it doesn't say so. Just human nature, really. And I'm not saying it's a religious thing, it's done a lot for many different things, just a way of getting the things you want.

Yep.

If you're looking for evidence of one thought, you will find it somehow. You just may need to take things out of context to do it.

It's a rampant problem with people that have self esteem issues. They find reasons why people don't like them.