Super Dedede Jump's spike as a kill move

[SalsaSavant]

As we all know, the SD3J has a spike on it's downward part, but it's super risky. Most of our kills with it are on accident, and we usually kill ourselves in the process. Right now, that property is more a part of a "funny moments" montage then an actual strat.


Well, I've been toying around with it, and I've gotten one or two kills deliberately with it, without killing myself. I apologize for my lack of video equipment, but what I do is run to the edge, use it with forward momentum, and have just a small amount of time where I go downward before canceling it, and then shift my momentum to the ledge. The timing has to be precise, both in hitting the opponent and when you cancel. It also comes at the expense of most of your potential gimping time, but if you're using it, the opponent is likely in a position you're less good at gimping from anyway.

So, does anyone think that, if mastered, it could be a useful tool in high level play? Even if it's a once a match surprise move? Or is it too risky and precise, or do we have better, more reliable gimping options?

 

[cwjakesteel]

What I do is fall off the ledge, do a few jumps away from the stage, and then come back to the stage with a super jump, and then I spike the opponent while he's trying to get back to the stage. whether they air dodge or not, I always press up in accordance with the amount of lag there is, and free fall back to the edge.

 

[Tortilla Noggin]

Whilst I've had some luck pulling this off whilst actually above a ledge and sure to land on it when my opponent is clearly not, I believe this may be risky due to a weakness that the Super Dedede Jump has.

I discovered, entirely by accident by flubbing an input whilst fighting against my Dedede Amiibo, who was coming at me with the Super Dedede Jump, that a powerful enough up-air will not only break through the stomp, but it can also launch and kill you if your percentage is high enough. This definitely always works (though, see below) with Dedede versus Dedede, but I don't know who else is capable of doing this.

This has seemingly become more difficult to time correctly as of the most recent rebalancing patch (I could pull it off consistently prior to 1.0.6), but it can still be done, and it may make this sort of strategy potentially risky.

 

[axelalexzander]

Whilst I've had some luck pulling this off whilst actually above a ledge and sure to land on it when my opponent is clearly not, I believe this may be risky due to a weakness that the Super Dedede Jump has.

I discovered, entirely by accident by flubbing an input whilst fighting against my Dedede Amiibo, who was coming at me with the Super Dedede Jump, that a powerful enough up-air will not only break through the stomp, but it can also launch and kill you if your percentage is high enough. This definitely always works (though, see below) with Dedede versus Dedede, but I don't know who else is capable of doing this.

There's a lot that beats Dedede's Stomp, I don't think it has any higher priority than Bowser Bomb. That's the other issue with trying to spike with it.

I personally have only tried going for it on rare occasions. And that's only if I'm up a stock and am at a high percentage where I don't lose much if I happen to SD. Very rarely though am I in a position where I think it's worth going for.

 

[Putuk]

Most of our kills with it are on accident,

 

[Thee Incubus]

I love going for that spike. Heres a small highlight vid with some of those. I am pretty consistant with it. The trick to not dying is go for it when they are recovering high back to stage. Note the peach spike from the vid. https://youtu.be/gyx_ZMoL34A

 

[Arrei]

On this topic, I was wondering about how the Jump spike synergizes with sticking Gordos on the ledge? I rarely have time to use any real followups when I successfully pop my opponent up with a ledge Gordo, but what if I simply floated around below the edge and tried to spike them after popping them up? Would the Gordo still being there screw up the spike?

 

[Jatayu]

I actually tried that when this thread was made. By the time you recover from the endlag of gordo throw, the super dedede jump would take you to around here.

Apologies for the gargantuan size.
Now I didn't use any jumps before using SD3J so it could be higher, but even then, you would have to descend after they hit the gordo, hit them, then cancel to grab the ledge. Sound a bit precise to me. I would just stick with up-tilted gordo edge traps or ledge-sticked gordo then forward smash.

 

[Arrei]

I'm mainly interested in its possibility as a game finisher on the last stock if you can't stick the Gordo, get back up, and prep an Fsmash in time. Jumping off, sticking the Gordo, and then stalling below the ledge with jumps until the right time to strike. I'd imagine there's a very good chance of dying after pulling it off, but if it's actually able to kill then it wouldn't matter on the last stock as the opponent can't evade you during the Gordo's hitstun. But the question is whether or not the Gordo still being there will prevent the spike from killing?

 

[Jatayu]

It certainly seems possible and I'm sure gordo will stick around long enough. Bit skeptical considering gordo sticking is rather finicky, but with enough practice looking at Soul Train's guide, it could be an excellent tool.

 

[Arrei]

What I meant was, if you spike the opponent into the Gordo that is still lingering around on the ledge, will it overwrite the spike's downward knockback with another minor pop-up, or will it still be able to kill? I'm not entirely certain how getting hit while already being launched is calculated, is the spike strong enough to overwrite the Gordo?

 

[Jatayu]

When they get hit by the gordo when recovering low or on even level with the ledge, they'll be knocked away from the ledge and in turn, the gordo, so you won't have to worry about that. Now that everything's been figured out, I kinda want to see this in action. It looks absurdly complicated and precise especially when it's a human recovering, but kudos to anyone who pulls it off.