Sunrise, Sunset - Isaac for Smash Ultimate #GoldenSunday

[Confirmation]

Honestly I feel like this tweet is a big rip to pretty much everyone standing. If Nintendo is involved with DLC it's probably going to be exactly like Smash 4's minus the returning chars: 3rd parties plus 1 or new reps for brand new releases.

Golden Sun got handed a raw deal presswise last time. I doubt Nintendo would suddenly go the 9 yards to put a character in Smash as DLC.

Which sucks tbh

 

[Frosty Pops]

Trust me, I’m far from seeing things as the worst case scenario.

My point is that this does not increase chances for ISAAC. This doesn’t mean we won’t see another protagonist take the fighter slot if a new GS is announced.

Each GS game features a new protagonist. Golden Sun 4 would likely do the same as it’s predecessors. Yes. Isaac is the popular choice. But for DLC specifically they would want to draw attention to the game that’s coming out not to a character from a game that came out nearly 20 years ago.

Yes. Isaac is the fan choice. But Golden Sun fans would still eat up whatever protagonist they do put in. As well as drawing in new fans.

It’d be different if Isaac was base roster. People don’t have to pay extra. But as DLC, it would work, if remakes were planned.

The issue I have with that is that Isaac is an Assist Trophy. If they decided to make him a fighter (ESPECIALLY before the game goes gold) they would have scrapped his AT altogether in favor of a fighter. Even if that fighter would be introduced later on.

But I’m done. I’ve said my piece. Everyone’s free to believe whatever they want.

It would just be a shame if everyone started believing Isaac was one of the five DLC characters and then it’s revealed he isn’t.

I would be fine with that as long as they look good and use earth psynergy.

 

[Quetzal77]

Well that just means we need to send stuff to Nintendo and not Sakurai anymore

This is the best approach. Sakurai's Twitter is his personal account, so in theory he sees everything that people tweet at him and if he's been getting bombarded with requests it's understandable he's annoyed. But Nintendo's account is run by a social media team, most likely not just one person, and while they obviously can't make a decision on what happens with the actual games, they can definitely pass information on to higher ups as far as what fans are talking about.

 

[TempestSurge]

I wouldn't be surprised if the hypothetical new GS protagonist was another straight up Isaac clone after Matthew. Plus they'd be able to have an easy 'Isaac alt' with the DLC given that Isaac is the rep that the majority recognizes and has been putting their support behind for Smash.

 

[SPEN18]

I wouldn't be surprised if the hypothetical new GS protagonist was another straight up Isaac clone after Matthew. Plus they'd be able to have an easy 'Isaac alt' with the DLC given that Isaac is the rep that the majority recognizes and has been putting their support behind for Smash.

lol it could be just like the Links where they're technically all different characters but they look almost exactly the same.

 

[NoOtherPersona]

I was warning my friend that when dlc comes it'll probably be half perfect or lackluster or just straight up disappointing and if really it's just business decisions that make up these character choices and not fan demand well then I'm glad I didn't blindly spend the money on the 24 pack because that's really stupid lol you probably bought Steve and you dont even know

 

[Frosty Pops]

Right final honest character intros Ultimate edition *wink*

Inkling: Making a mess!
Daisy: Peach color pallet came to life!
Dark Samus: Samus transforms once a month...
Chrom: Cause we didn't have enough FE reps!
Ridley: Gets cut down to size.
Simon: Whipping some ***!
Richter: Simon Street Fighter edition.
Ken: Ryu Street Fighter edi....wait a minute!
K. Rool: Crocodile obesity.
Isabelle: Awww she is to cute to hurt anyone.
Incineroar: Fuzzy Captain Falcon on roids.
Pirhana Plant: Biting Mario's *** since Mario Bros.

 

[MeatOfJustice]

Punch-Out is more likely than F-Zero and Kid Icarus both. But I think F-Zero is semi likely, and definitely more likely than Kid Icarus at this point.

I wasn't saying F-Zero was more likely than Punch-Out!!, I agree with you.

And there's an advertisement I'm worried about. I don't know who made it, but there's a picture explaining what to do on Sunday that should remove the Smash related things due to the last announcement. We don't want to obtain infamy for pushing Isaac in Smash (and specially Sakurai) when it's probably the worst moment possible.

 

[N3ON]

So we twisted these tweets into somehow not being bad news yet?

 

[StrawHatX]

So we twisted these tweets into somehow not being bad news yet?

I think we’ve gone into the “Must be a new unannounced GS game we don’t know about and a new GS protagonist will be DLC to promote it” phase. It would be nice....

 

[JaidynReiman]

I think we’ve gone into the “Must be a new unannounced GS game we don’t know about and a new GS protagonist will be DLC to promote it” phase. It would be nice....

What are you trying to argue? That people think GS's only chance is with a new game, or that people are stretching to try and come to this conclusion?

Because pretty much everyone is arguing that there's little-to-no chance of GS DLC at this point. Some people (myself included) are merely proposing the possibility that Isaac could be DLC and they want to tie it into a new GS game, not a single person is trying to say that WILL happen, and I absolutely object if you're trying to argue this.

So we twisted these tweets into somehow not being bad news yet?

I really have a hard time seeing what you're trying to argue. Based on what I see at face value it sounds like you're saying the tweets are bad news, and you're wondering if people are trying to twist it to mean the opposite. (Which really hasn't happened for the most part.)


The tweets tell me that Nintendo is going to do what favors them the most. And that, to me, is focusing on first-party characters that are either popular enough to sell, or that can tie into new games, and third-party contracts (which cost a lot of money) may be considered if the contracts in question can benefit Nintendo in some way, but if there's no benefit to Nintendo at all they probably won't happen (which IMO kills Geno and "Granblue Fantasy" character).

 

[GoodGrief741]

So we twisted these tweets into somehow not being bad news yet?

Not me, I’ve turned into the new Xeno at this point.

 

[TheSpaceKing12]

I think we’ve gone into the “Must be a new unannounced GS game we don’t know about and a new GS protagonist will be DLC to promote it” phase. It would be nice....

Considering the video that i'm currently drafting for Golden Sunday. I am ALL OVER that phase. Don't care if it leads me into a massive ditch. I'll take anything I can get.

 

[NoOtherPersona]

So we twisted these tweets into somehow not being bad news yet?

I feel some what neutral it could mean they listened or it could mean they listened but selectively

 

[StrawHatX]

What are you trying to argue? That people think GS's only chance is with a new game, or that people are stretching to try and come to this conclusion?

Because pretty much everyone is arguing that there's little-to-no chance of GS DLC at this point. Some people (myself included) are merely proposing the possibility that Isaac could be DLC and they want to tie it into a new GS game, not a single person is trying to say that WILL happen, and I absolutely object if you're trying to argue this.



I really have a hard time seeing what you're trying to argue. Based on what I see at face value it sounds like you're saying the tweets are bad news, and you're wondering if people are trying to twist it to mean the opposite. (Which really hasn't happened for the most part.)


The tweets tell me that Nintendo is going to do what favors them the most. And that, to me, is focusing on first-party characters that are either popular enough to sell, or that can tie into new games, and third-party contracts (which cost a lot of money) may be considered if the contracts in question can benefit Nintendo in some way, but if there's no benefit to Nintendo at all they probably won't happen (which IMO kills Geno and "Granblue Fantasy" character).

I’m not trying to argue anything. I think the best chance we have is that there is a new Golden Sun project on the horizon that leads to a character from the series getting in.

I’m saying I think that’s what a lot of people are hoping to be true now.

 

[Deleted member]

So we twisted these tweets into somehow not being bad news yet?

It's the Smash Bros. community. We're always assuming stuff. If Sakurai sneezed on a ham sandwich, we'd assume that meant something.

If Nintendo told him who they wanted, this might mean Nintendo had a very specific mindset as to who they wanted, which could mean no third-party fighters, as perhaps most of the third-party fighters were Sakurai's ideas.

 

[KoopaSaki]

We certainly need to shift our focus over to a new golden sun game given those tweets Sakurai has provided us with. We now need to rally for a golden sun remake or golden sun 4 on golden Sunday. We best be marking sure not to request Isaac in smash too much now as well.
I for one see the fact that Nintendo choose out the list for potential dlc fighters as a glimmer of hope for a golden sun rep be it Isaac or a protagonist in golden sun 4 if we get that. I’m hoping hard for that scenario for dlc season 1 but of course will accept any other outcome regardless.

 

[TheSpaceKing12]

We certainly need to shift our focus over to a new golden sun game given those tweets Sakurai has provided us with. We now need to rally for a golden sun remake or golden sun 4 on golden Sunday. We best be marking sure not to request Isaac in smash too much now as well.
I for one see the fact that Nintendo choose out the list for potential dlc fighters as a glimmer of hope for a golden sun rep be it Isaac or a protagonist in golden sun 4 if we get that. I’m hoping hard for that scenario for dlc season 1 but of course will accept any other outcome regardless.

Isaac in smash should be a footnote in the overall message that we're trying to send out.

 

[Gioka]

So we twisted these tweets into somehow not being bad news yet?

To be honest there just isn't enough information to either get our hopes up or kill them completely.
I think Nintendo wanted to get a hold on decisions this time around because Furukawa has a more marketing oriented standpoint and tbh I don't think Smash 4's DLC helped Nintendo a great deal, Corrin was the only new first party addition in DLC, with 3 veterans and 3 third party newcomers which surely costed a great deal that most likely was paid through part of the DLC packages earnings, specially considering Cloud as they have already said Square Enix is pretty expensive to work with. Then fast forward to Smash Ultimate and we got a new third party franchise heavily represented with Castlevania having 1 fighter, 1 echo, an AT, a stage, bosses and a lot of songs,we got additions in an echo and AT for Street Fighter, AT for Bayonetta, AT for Megaman series + update to Megaman's Final, additional AT for Sonic, the Rathalos. I mean it certainly can't be cheap. Imo what this means is that they will try leaning to more Nintendo characters for the DLC pass

 

[JaidynReiman]

To be honest there just isn't enough information to either get our hopes up or kill them completely.
I think Nintendo wanted to get a hold on decisions this time around because Furukawa has a more marketing oriented standpoint and tbh I don't think Smash 4's DLC helped Nintendo a great deal, Corrin was the only new first party addition in DLC, with 3 veterans and 3 third party newcomers which surely costed a great deal that most likely was paid through part of the DLC packages earnings, specially considering Cloud as they have already said Square Enix is pretty expensive to work with. Then fast forward to Smash Ultimate and we got a new third party franchise heavily represented with Castlevania having 1 fighter, 1 echo, an AT, a stage, bosses and a lot of songs,we got additions in an echo and AT for Street Fighter, AT for Bayonetta, AT for Megaman series + update to Megaman's Final, additional AT for Sonic, the Rathalos. I mean it certainly can't be cheap. Imo what this means is that they will try leaning to more Nintendo characters for the DLC pass

And if the last part is true, that could help Isaac. But tbh, I was always predicting 3 Nintendo and 2 third-party anyway. I guess maybe it could wind up being no more than 1 third-party (though that wouldn't go well with Vergeben's statements).

 

[Icana]

Just saw the tweet on Go nintendo. Wow. I feel if Sakurai felt compelled to reply about the DLC character choices, our voices have been reaching him. Well, the Smash fans' voices at any rate, I can only ponder how much of the noise were from Isaac/Golden Sun fans.

Anyway, I'm feeling pretty confidant Elma from XenoX is getting in if Nintendo of America have any sway in this. I think they're going to push for 'diversity'. Personally, I'm hoping for no more Fire Emblem, but... a new one's coming out soon on Switch. Nintendo may be in full marketing mode and decide to push a character from that upcoming game. Also, a new core Pokemon game is coming next year. And of course there's Monolith Soft's new IP.

Ugh, it's hard to envision how Golden Sun can prevail here, unless it becomes decided that Camelot's next game, after Mario Tennis Aces, is indeed a new Golden Sun game. Then maybe, Nintendo might feel compelled to have a rep from that series in Smash.

 

[MonkeyDLenny]

Greetings from the Banjo thread

I'm really hoping you guys get something good out of this. Morale has somehow sunken even lower than before on our end. I hope at least one of us is happy by the end of this

 

[NoOtherPersona]

Greetings from the Banjo thread

I'm really hoping you guys get something good out of this. Morale has somehow sunken even lower than before on our end. I hope at least one of us is happy by the end of this

Our sun hasn't burned out and I can only hope your passion for the Bear and bird never goes out push on my friend with determination

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

So we twisted these tweets into somehow not being bad news yet?

If I learned ANYTHING from watching the science channel, it's

"I reject your reality and substitute my own"

Science is truly great

 

[QcSlayer]

Hey, can someone explain to me what the heck is that stuff on Camelot product page?
http://www.camelot.co.jp/public-wpFIu30X/?page_id=212

If I remember correctly the GS trademark did talk about phones.

Can't we conclude that if the trademark contained phone related stuff, Camelot was the one to ask Nintendo to renew it early?

 

[Gioka]

Greetings from the Banjo thread

I'm really hoping you guys get something good out of this. Morale has somehow sunken even lower than before on our end. I hope at least one of us is happy by the end of this

Thank you! However I don't think you should fall into despair just yet, maybe there is some kind of deal between Nintendo and Microsoft for Banjo Kazooie

 

[TheSpaceKing12]

In some relatively positive news. I just played Smash Flash 2 for the first time in about 4 years with a friend. It took about a good hour to get my official gamecube controller adapter set up to play on my PC. But once we did it was a really fun experience. I mainly wanted to try it out because I had heard Isaac was in it. More specifically, I was told he sucked in it. I gave him a shot and ended up really enjoying him. My friend had never heard of Isaac and we talked about Golden sun during the fights. It was quite a decent few hours.

 

[MonkeyDLenny]

Thank you! However I don't think you should fall into despair just yet, maybe there is some kind of deal between Nintendo and Microsoft for Banjo Kazooie

Minecraft, the multi-billion dollar empire would disagree....

 

[Gioka]

Minecraft, the multi-billion dollar empire would disagree....

Sakurai said he would pick the ones feasible. I think BK has better moveset options tbh and Minecraft would fit more as a stage given the nature of the game. All I am saying is keep pushing until the end, I am rooting for you guys to finally get them back home

 

[Silo777]

At this point our hope is in the hands of this trademark renewal meaning something. Either smash or a new game. Or, if all the planets align at the same time, it’s both. I think it has to mean something, given the circumstances surrounding it.

Anyway, I heard a theory that after Mario Tennis Ultra Smash, Camelot may have wanted to start on a Golden Sun game, but due to Ultra Smash’s painfully mediocre reception, Nintendo thought otherwise and wanted them to do Mario Tennis again and do it right. Ultra Smash released in 2015, so I can see how Isaac could’ve made it into base if that was the case.

There’s nothing to really back it up other than some Golden Sun references in Aces and Camelot comparing it to Golden Sun in an interview, but it’s an interesting thought.

 

[FantastiqueFran]

Minecraft, the multi-billion dollar empire would disagree....

This is true, but Steve would most likely be a semi-Link clone. Banjo’s got a chance, let’s just hope that Nintendo and Microsoft don’t go full corporate mode.

 

[Muirkat]

I mean, if Isaac was going to get in it was always going to be in a 2nd season if we got it. There was no way it would be this first year.

I think we'll be getting several "seasons" of DLC. It makes sense for them to continue to support this game for several years to come (especially since I get the feeling that this will be the last Smash for many many years). Only making a single fighter pass is honestly just leaving money on the table.

 

[Sabrewulf238]

Looking at the latest Sakurai tweet and looking at who the top reply to that tweet is is a bit surreal. It feels like we're directly having a dialogue with him.

If nothing else at least you can't say he's not aware.

I don't think it's a bad thing necessarily but I do think it probably points towards the 5 dlc characters not including Golden Sun. (or maybe Nintendo demanded Matthew to be playable instead of Isaac, that's the only way I could see that happening honestly... I think it would be strange for Sakurai to pick Matthew over Isaac)

 

[KMDP]

Sorry I didn't know haha

One or two videos isn't so bad, it's better to link to the videos if you're going to post a lot of them.

Looking at the latest Sakurai tweet and looking at who the top reply to that tweet is is a bit surreal. It feels like we're directly having a dialogue with him.

If nothing else at least you can't say he's not aware.

I don't think it's a bad thing necessarily but I do think it could point towards the 5 dlc characters not including Golden Sun. (or maybe Nintendo demanded Matthew to be playable instead of Isaac, that's the only way I could see that happening honestly... I think it would be strange for Sakurai to pick Matthew over Isaac)

Didn't really think much of it, but yeah, that is sort of bizarre seeing Sakurai's post atop an "Isaac for Smash" user.

 

[TheSpaceKing12]

Looking at the latest Sakurai tweet and looking at who the top reply to that tweet is is a bit surreal. It feels like we're directly having a dialogue with him.

If nothing else at least you can't say he's not aware.

I don't think it's a bad thing necessarily but I do think it could point towards the 5 dlc characters not including Golden Sun. (or maybe Nintendo demanded Matthew to be playable instead of Isaac, that's the only way I could see that happening honestly... I think it would be strange for Sakurai to pick Matthew over Isaac)

the explanation for matthew over Isaac is very simple.
They reluctantly green lit GS4 in 2016 or so. Right around the time the roster was being decided. Isaac was a front runner. Camelot and nintendo explained to him that Isaac isn't the hero of the upcoming game, and that his role would be limited as with the direction the series took following dark dawn. That Isaac's inclusion would be awesome for the long term fans, but not do much in terms of promotion for a new golden sun. Promotion that such a game desperatley needs in order to avoid falling down the stares and blowing up like dark dawn did.

Basically in this version of events, camelot is setting up Matthew to be the true long term hero of the franchise. and Nintendo knows it has to be matthew in order to get copies of GS4 off store shelves. He would take the slot of this games blatant and shameless promotion character. But I don't think the vast majority of people would care. As at this point the golden sun fandom is so insanely starved for content just about anything with meat on the bones will do.

 

[Yellowlord]

Well guys: no matter what happens in the end, I won't give up on Isaac, especially when he means a whole lot to me and many others, even coming from someone who hasn't played his games yet but has strong intentions of doing so at some point.

Despite the initial AT situation we went through, I honestly still think this might be his strongest chance in years: it all depends on what happens in the next few months.

 

[LegendOfDragoon]

the explanation for matthew over Isaac is very simple.
They reluctantly green lit GS4 in 2016 or so. Right around the time the roster was being decided. Isaac was a front runner. Camelot and nintendo explained to him that Isaac isn't the hero of the upcoming game, and that his role would be limited as with the direction the series took following dark dawn. That Isaac's inclusion would be awesome for the long term fans, but not do much in terms of promotion for a new golden sun. Promotion that such a game desperatley needs in order to avoid falling down the stares and blowing up like dark dawn did.

Basically in this version of events, camelot is setting up Matthew to be the true long term hero of the franchise. and Nintendo knows it has to be matthew in order to get copies of GS4 off store shelves. He would take the slot of this games blatant and shameless promotion character. But I don't think the vast majority of people would care. As at this point the golden sun fandom is so insanely starved for content just about anything with meat on the bones will do.

If the project IS Golden Sun 4, it's already doomed to fail. Nobody, and I mean Nobody is going to want to jump into the series in the midst of a cliffhanger with no real way to catch up to speed. If it's Golden Sun 4 and not a remake of the originals first that could very well be the death knell for Golden Sun as a series.

 

[SonicLink125]

Looking at the latest Sakurai tweet and looking at who the top reply to that tweet is is a bit surreal. It feels like we're directly having a dialogue with him.

If nothing else at least you can't say he's not aware.

I don't think it's a bad thing necessarily but I do think it probably points towards the 5 dlc characters not including Golden Sun. (or maybe Nintendo demanded Matthew to be playable instead of Isaac, that's the only way I could see that happening honestly... I think it would be strange for Sakurai to pick Matthew over Isaac)

Now that you mention it, wasn't there a text leak awhile back that mentioned that Nintendo wanted Matthew as a PC instead of Isaac?

It would be interesting if it connected to that tweet that said we should focus on Matthew for DLC instead. Hmm???

 

[ZelDan]

Now that you mention it, wasn't there a text leak awhile back that mentioned that Nintendo wanted Matthew as a PC instead of Isaac?

It would be interesting if it connected to that tweet that said we should focus on Matthew for DLC instead. Hmm???

Nah, stick with Isaac since that's where all the momentum is right now.

The way I see it, If we push for Isaac/Golden Sun enough and Sakurai notices it and really doesn't want to promote Ats, maybe instead he'd give us another GS character like Felix of Matthew anyways as a compromise.

 

[Sentinel07]

Now that you mention it, wasn't there a text leak awhile back that mentioned that Nintendo wanted Matthew as a PC instead of Isaac?

It would be interesting if it connected to that tweet that said we should focus on Matthew for DLC instead. Hmm???

Would you happen to remember where you saw or heard this? I'm curious.