Sunrise, Sunset - Isaac for Smash Ultimate #GoldenSunday

[THE 6r]

Hope y'all have your 50 Cent memes ready, because who needs to wait for Thursday when we have incontrovertible proof of Isaac right here?

I didn't listen to 50 Cent before this thread.

I listen 50 Cent almost daily now.

 

[RileyXY1]

It's about time Fighter 5 is revealed, and it seems we'll find out on Thursday. I already have my alarm set! I don't think it will be Isaac, but who really knows.

The biggest problem I have with Isaac with a post-Pass fighter is that there's no guarantee that he comes with a stage/music. That might be a deterrent to making him a fighter to Sakurai and the team, but I have to believe that they'll figure it all out and put our Golden Boy in Smash!

I think that Isaac will come with a stage and music if he gets in because Golden Sun is a series that hasn't had a playable character before.

 

[Isaac: Venus Adept]

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This artist on Twitter made this Isaac piece mirroring the pose Sakurai is doing in the upcoming livestream. Gave me a good laugh especially after seeing all the crazy theories people are coming up with about it

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[Sabrewulf238]

It's about time Fighter 5 is revealed, and it seems we'll find out on Thursday. I already have my alarm set! I don't think it will be Isaac, but who really knows.

Fighter #5 is almost certainly not Isaac, or any other assist trophy/spirit.

I guess there is the chance that we'll have the reveal of a post-pass character (or a tease similar to when Mewtwo was announced)....and really it's anyones guess who that would be.

Personally I'm not going into this stream with any expectations. (aside from that we're getting a character reveal)

 

[Diddy Kong]

Hope y'all have your 50 Cent memes ready, because who needs to wait for Thursday when we have incontrovertible proof of Isaac right here?

What was the thing about the 50 Cent meme again over here? I was here before when it happened , but I don't remember how it came to be. Nevertheless I enjoy it.

 

[Cadillac]

Y'all ready for it?

 

[THE 6r]

View attachment 257670
Y'all ready for it?

My body is ready

 

[Billybae10K]

I'm hyped for Fighter Pass 5, although I do hope we get some information on how the fighters beyond the pass will be handled - I don't even need a hint as to who they are, just knowing if we're getting stages/music, etc is enough for me.

 

[Xenigma]

I'm hyped for Fighter Pass 5, although I do hope we get some information on how the fighters beyond the pass will be handled - I don't even need a hint as to who they are, just knowing if we're getting stages/music, etc is enough for me.

What I'm hoping for above anything else is any sort of nod towards the Assist Trophy characters. Granted, I don't expect him to confirm any specific characters, nor do I really expect him to say anything about ATs (I'm certainly not expecting Isaac/Waluigi/etc to be fighter 5), but even something as simple as saying they've considered community requests for upcoming characters would be very exciting.

 

[Sabrewulf238]

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I feel like the word "Oracle" is an interesting word to use.

Do we know of any front runners who have psychic/pre cognitive abilities?

 

[Xenigma]

I feel like the word "Oracle" is an interesting word to use.

Do we know of any front runners who have psychic/pre cognitive abilities?

Oracle is an advanced class in Golden Sun, and there is the Oracle's Robe armor, but it's a stretch regardless.

Weirdly, the franchise that comes to mind for me when you say "Oracle" is Halo. The robots like 343 are known as "oracles", and there's even a level in Halo 2 simply called "The Oracle". That being said, I have no idea why he'd use the 3 pose as a clue, nor does Master Chief feel especially likely to begin with. There's also the Zelda series with Oracle of Seasons/Ages, but that seems like a very random part of Zelda history to pull Fighter 5 from.

Of course that could just be reading too much into the word choice of a translation, not Sakurai himself. Instead, you could try ruling out characters that have nothing to do with oracles, prophets, and psychic powers in general, which I'd think notably eliminates Steve and Dante. I'd love to see some more guesswork as I'm not 100% on what the current speculation targets are, and between Sakurai's pose in the picture and this new tweet, we finally have something to work with in these final hours!

(EDIT: Not to get excited over nothing, but psychic powers sure would fit with Golden Sun. I still don't think that's what it is, but may as well dream a bit, right?)

 

[THE 6r]

Oracle is an advanced class in Golden Sun, and there is the Oracle's Robe armor, but it's a stretch regardless.

Weirdly, the franchise that comes to mind for me when you say "Oracle" is Halo. The robots like 343 are known as "oracles", and there's even a level in Halo 2 simply called "The Oracle". That being said, I have no idea why he'd use the 3 pose as a clue, nor does Master Chief feel especially likely to begin with. There's also the Zelda series with Oracle of Seasons/Ages, but that seems like a very random part of Zelda history to pull Fighter 5 from.

Of course that could just be reading too much into the word choice of a translation, not Sakurai himself. Instead, you could try ruling out characters that have nothing to do with oracles, prophets, and psychic powers in general, which I'd think notably eliminates Steve and Dante. I'd love to see some more guesswork as I'm not 100% on what the current speculation targets are, and between Sakurai's pose in the picture and this new tweet, we finally have something to work with in these final hours!

(EDIT: Not to get excited over nothing, but psychic powers sure would fit with Golden Sun. I still don't think that's what it is, but may as well dream a bit, right?)

Dante IS the heavy target considering this tweet

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[NessAtc.]

Dante IS the heavy target considering this tweet

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This would constitute a breach of NDA. If it has to do with Dante in Smash, they literally just leaked it themselves

 

[Xenigma]

Dante IS the heavy target considering this tweet

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I was aware of this, which is why I mentioned him as notably not having psychic powers, at least not that I know of. Unless this is Sakurai's way of acknowledging the tweet (and thus people now predicting Dante), I think we can safely rule him out, and that's pretty dang interesting in my view.

 

[Sabrewulf238]

Oracle is an advanced class in Golden Sun, and there is the Oracle's Robe armor, but it's a stretch regardless.

Weirdly, the franchise that comes to mind for me when you say "Oracle" is Halo. The robots like 343 are known as "oracles", and there's even a level in Halo 2 simply called "The Oracle". That being said, I have no idea why he'd use the 3 pose as a clue, nor does Master Chief feel especially likely to begin with. There's also the Zelda series with Oracle of Seasons/Ages, but that seems like a very random part of Zelda history to pull Fighter 5 from.

Of course that could just be reading too much into the word choice of a translation, not Sakurai himself. Instead, you could try ruling out characters that have nothing to do with oracles, prophets, and psychic powers in general, which I'd think notably eliminates Steve and Dante. I'd love to see some more guesswork as I'm not 100% on what the current speculation targets are, and between Sakurai's pose in the picture and this new tweet, we finally have something to work with in these final hours!

(EDIT: Not to get excited over nothing, but psychic powers sure would fit with Golden Sun. I still don't think that's what it is, but may as well dream a bit, right?)

I did think about that in regards to Golden Sun (what with psynergy sort of being like psychic abilities), but I'm pretty sure that's a very strong case of "seeing what you want to see".

Interestingly I did some research on tvTropes a while ago and two most noteworthy games that came up were...

1. Legend of Zelda Oracle of Ages/Seasons (Link confirmed!)

2. Phantasy Star Online 2 (apparently there is a fleet of colony ships in the second game called "Oracle")

So that kinda feels like a dead end.

 

[FlawedAI]

It's more than that "oracle" was just used as part of the translation rather than being an intentional choice by Sakurai. Still, I guess it's worth speculating about.

 

[Sabrewulf238]

I'm sure someone has already done this but google translate says that Sakurai was saying...

"If only one body can be guessed, maybe a prophet ...?"

I'm sure it's not accurate but at least it does seem like the meaning stills points towards someone being capable of predicting the future.

 

[Xenigma]

Y'know what, this is the juiciest bone speculation has gotten in ages, so I'm going to waste a bit of time on this. Assuming these are deliberate clues, here's our current criteria: character has psychic powers or otherwise has a vision, and there should be some connection to the number 3. I'm going to do a quick survey of the characters in the comments of the stream announcement's Smashboards article as well as top threads here in Newcomer Speculation and see if any of them fit the bill.

First, here's a bunch of notable characters that I don't think fit those clues, in no particular order: Dante, Steve, KOS-MOS, Elma, Travis, Geno, Doomguy, Ryu Hayabusa, Crash, Shantae, Agumon, Andy, Sora, Professor Layton, Dixie Kong, Bandana Dee, Reimu

Here's the weird part: I don't think anyone fits those two clues very well, so I don't have a strong prediction for tomorrow. Still, here are the ones I think fit the best:

Byleth - Three Houses is one of the more obvious "3" connections. As for the psychic angle, one of the plot points is their "revelation", which is close enough in my book. A Nintendo character doesn't really fit the third party theme we've had throughout the Fighters Pass, but I think Byleth remains plausible.

Isaac - One of the few characters that has a clear-cut psychic connection with Psynergy, at least in terms of powers like telepathy, mind-reading, etc. "3" is a stretch, but you could go with angles like three games or missing out on 3 Smash games. I admit this may be me seeing what I want to see, and like Byleth he fails the third party test, but I think Isaac works well enough to consider.

Master Chief - It's probably foolish to follow the "Oracle" translation closely, but that's an important term in the Halo universe. I'd also argue the original Halo trilogy is by far the most famous part of that franchise, so there's a semi-plausible 3 there. Perhaps more importantly, he's an extremely famous video game figure from a third party that already has a character in the Fighters Pass. I think he's worth considering.

Phoenix Wright - Maya and the Fey clan are all spirit mediums, which fits the psychic mold well enough, and there's little doubt the original trilogy is the most famous part of the Phoenix Wright series. Both are admittedly stretches, but he's one of the few characters I can fit to both clues with relative ease, and he's a third party like the rest of the Fighters Pass, so that makes him plausible to me.

That's all I've got right this second. If I had to guess among those four, I think it's going to be Phoenix Wright, but really all this exercise has convinced me of is that I'm going to be surprised one way or another. Tune in tomorrow when I'm completely wrong about all of this.

 

[SonicLink125]

There’s this Artifact Theory going around that’s pretty interesting. The picture of Sakurai was cropped out of the presentation video for the thumbnail. Very interesting.
Here’s a stretched out theory: The green/brown color could be earth since Isaac is an earthbender technically. lol

 

[Xenigma]

Too funny not to share: one Redditor has a dream

 

[Pinguino21v]

I'm sure someone has already done this but google translate says that Sakurai was saying...

"If only one body can be guessed, maybe a prophet ...?"

I'm sure it's not accurate but at least it does seem like the meaning stills points towards someone being capable of predicting the future.

Shulk confirmed!!

Too funny not to share: one Redditor has a dream

Outside of the funny side, that kind of post getting that massive follow up is what make the community aware of Golden Sun, it's what we need.

 

[Isaac: Venus Adept]

Too funny not to share: one Redditor has a dream

Lol I actually won't even be mad if that happens

 

[Billybae10K]

Too funny not to share: one Redditor has a dream

Screw it - I'ma believe in this beautiful dream.

 

[Nazyrus]

That's one hell of a dream, not gonna lie!

 

[Isaac: Venus Adept]

Seeing Isaac included in this just reminds me how much Isaac in Smash discussion is going to ramp up again for post pass fighters and I'm all here for it

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[NessAtc.]

I highly doubt the Sakurai picture's actually gonna even mean anything, but if it's Isaac it's likely his shoulder strap or glove

 

[Nazyrus]

So uhh… I talk with NoA still, not in private chat anymore but somewhere else where he obviously can't talk of delicate details anymore as he used to in private, but anyways, he told me tonight that he learned who it is JUST today (thats how hidden this freaking FP5 is guys), and it's someone that "hasn't leaked yet", and that he is surprised that it hasn't yet. Take that as you will… I honestly don't know how to feel myself and i'm not gonna exclude too many characters from my mind, i just find interesting he told me that in such way, specially now since every freaking character we can think of has been fake leaked on 4chan or memed to hell at this point. *scratches my head* Welp i'm definitely not sleeping tonight lol, gonna play games to kill time i guess. Let's hope it's just not someone underwhelming ( which i doubt because they are hyping this way too much with talking about the character in the presentation just as it is being revealed at the same time )

 

[Cadillac]

So uhh… I talk with NoA still, not in private chat anymore but somewhere else where he obviously can't talk of delicate details anymore as he used to in private, but anyways, he told me tonight that he learned who it is JUST today (thats how hidden this freaking FP5 is guys), and it's someone that "hasn't leaked yet", and that he is surprised that it hasn't yet. Take that as you will… I honestly don't know how to feel myself and i'm not gonna exclude too many characters from my mind, i just find interesting he told me that in such way, specially now since every freaking character we can think of has been fake leaked on 4chan or memed to hell at this point. *scratches my head* Welp i'm definitely not sleeping tonight lol, gonna play games to kill time i guess. Let's hope it's just not someone underwhelming ( which i doubt because they are hyping this way too much with talking about the character in the presentation just as it is being revealed at the same time )

If it's someone that 'hasn't been leaked yet'... then I don't have a clue. It might even be an indie.
Can't wait to see the reactions.

 

[FlawedAI]

So uhh… I talk with NoA still, not in private chat anymore but somewhere else where he obviously can't talk of delicate details anymore as he used to in private, but anyways, he told me tonight that he learned who it is JUST today (thats how hidden this freaking FP5 is guys), and it's someone that "hasn't leaked yet", and that he is surprised that it hasn't yet. Take that as you will… I honestly don't know how to feel myself and i'm not gonna exclude too many characters from my mind, i just find interesting he told me that in such way, specially now since every freaking character we can think of has been fake leaked on 4chan or memed to hell at this point. *scratches my head* Welp i'm definitely not sleeping tonight lol, gonna play games to kill time i guess. Let's hope it's just not someone underwhelming ( which i doubt because they are hyping this way too much with talking about the character in the presentation just as it is being revealed at the same time )

If it's someone who hasn't leaked yet... I have no clue. Lloyd and Phoenix haven't been "leaked" right?

One of my friends and I were talking about it, and he said he heard a rumor that the character is a GBA character, which would be nice, but I haven't heard this anywhere else. Even then, it still applies to Phoenix Wright (who I think is the most likely character, tbh).

 

[Nazyrus]

If it's someone that 'hasn't been leaked yet'... then I don't have a clue. It might even be an indie.
Can't wait to see the reactions.

If it's someone who hasn't leaked yet... I have no clue. Lloyd and Phoenix haven't been "leaked" right?

One of my friends and I were talking about it, and he said he heard a rumor that the character is a GBA character, which would be nice, but I haven't heard this anywhere else. Even then, it still applies to Phoenix Wright (who I think is the most likely character, tbh).

All i can deduce from what he said, or imply with my own logic, is that if he is surprised that it hasn't leaked yet, it's a big enough character that could easily been leaked, yet it didn't… So if anything, hopefully, at best, it's not a literal who character (?) I dunno.

I've been talking with friends about what do we consider "not leaked yet"… does it mean not leaked textually? or via pictures/videos like the mii situation? or both types of leaks? Either way, it hasn't been leaked, and apparently it's shocking that it hasn't, that's the only solid part i really take from what he told me. I just hope it's worth waking up at 9 am in the morning for me lol

 

[Xenigma]

Gotta say, I love that Fighters Pass 5 is looking to be a total surprise. My favorite Smash announcements tend to be the ones that we don't see coming like Joker and Bayonetta, so I'm excited that we're less than nine hours out and know basically nothing. I have faith whoever Sakurai has in store will be worth the wait, even if it's not exactly who I want, so bring it on!

(Y'know, especially if it's actually Golden Sun like that fever dream Reddit post. It won't be, of course, but what if?)

 

[ZelDan]

A franchise I always lowkey wanted to get playable representation and think is kinda slept on is Contra..I don't recall seeing them in any leaks, or being discussed much at all.

And while Contra hasn't exactly been as fortunate as other franchises in terms of popularity/sales/recognition/whatever, It's still pretty huge as far as retro franchises go and it has had a good amount of games throughout the years, so I could still see it being "big" enough where nobody leaking it could be considered strange.

Can't say I'm totally aboard the leak train right now considering past shenanigans, but I figured I'd humor it atleast in case it does end up legit.

 

[FlawedAI]

I really hope that whoever it is didn't get leaked. I hate going into a Smash reveal thinking "oh, yeah, those leakers were right". It happened with Simon, it happened with Kencineroar, I don't want someone like Dante to be spoiled for me. (Also, the DMC Twitter saying to pay attention to the 16th is weird to me, since that would break NDA if it was Smash, right?)

 

[Pinguino21v]

Of course it hasn't been leaked, we would know if it had. The question is "has he been the object of a fake leak?".

In that case, indeed, it narrows down the possibilities, Geno and Doomguy first (Mii costumes "leak").

If it is a big character nobody expecta, strange it hasn't been leaked, and with a westerner appeal (considering Sakurai tweet in English is something), I can still see several contenders: Blizzard, League of Legends, Sony, maybe Crash (was he in a fake leak?)...

 

[Icana]

What am I doing. So the fifth fighter is getting unveiled tomorrow, and I find myself now pouring through Golden Sun remixes and videos on youtube, and feeling sad along the way. That Smash direct in 2018 hurt so hard, man! I've never felt so depressed watching something like that ever before. I felt down the whole way through that direct, I could barely pay attention to anything else being talked about. Our hopes were soooo strong.

As much as it hurt though, those hopes, even if bred from fake leaks, hints, etc, brought out our true numbers, helped us find our voices, and Golden Sun enjoyed more conversation and publicity during that time than it has in forever. At the start of Ultimate speculation, this thread was limping. Today, we're over a thousand pages strong, and still going, even if we've lost our peak of 200 people between users and guests being on this thread at once. The fact we even got there is testament to the passion you guys had.

We want to see Golden Sun shine again. We need Camelot and Nintendo, both, to want the same. The Takahashi Bros burned out on making the Golden Sun GBA games, and chose to stick with the sports titles (Mario and We Love Golf), whilst Nintendo had no producer interested in continuing Golden Sun without Camelot Software Planning. That was the stated and implied situation between the Lost Age and Dark Dawn --a game the Bros. stated to have had to relearn how to make RPGs while developing. Today, we're hoping that their next game is not another Mario Golf, especially in light of games like Golf Story pushing forward with something special once held exclusively by Camelot's handheld Mario sport outings.

If Fire Emblem, a franchise that died in the west on the DS, and was then revived on the 3DS can happen, so too can Golden Sun, which was once popular all around the world on the GBA, see success once more. It's themes are still very popular today. The elements, alchemy, medieval fantasy, cute collectable creatures, all still hot, or even hotter, today. Despite those shared themes, Golden Sun still stood out and stands out today. The title is still very unique from RPGs and TV shows that bask in those themes and standardized field and battle systems. Intsys continued to fight for Fire Emblem when hope became glimmer. We need Camelot to renew their spark and try again. We also need Nintendo's producers to see opportunity. I very much believe there is one here, despite my clear childhood fueled bias, because it happened before, and it went beyond the initial attraction to the games graphics. The games developed a fandom because their were more than just sight and sound. Their was also promise, potential, and a future. A 'to be continued' as it were. Our dreams were fueled for what Golden Sun could look and play like on Game Cube at the time. How the battle system can evolve to better flesh out its unique ideas. How and when the long awaited showdown with Alex would be like. What exactly did the Wise One mean by some power of the Golden Sun now residing with Isaac (and some with Alex we presume). The ingredients to excite the imagination was all there.

Now, Dark Dawn happened, but for the moment I don't want to talk about how it failed to succeed the first two, being released eight years later with a new generation having been born and grown up (both in-game and in the real world). Their were lessons to learn here, and I hope they were taken.

I'm looking forward to seeing the next Smash character, but at this point, only Golden Sun content can grab my heart. There isn't anything else gaming has that I hold as dear and have missed so much. I hope the golden sun, once more, shines bright! Soon!

 

[Qeomash]

I hope that whomever we get tomorrow is a good character that will make people happy.

I also hope that we get some news on what's coming for the next characters that's good news for Isaac.

 

[Cadillac]

About 5 hours left.
Guess I'll read a book.

 

[Isaac: Venus Adept]

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This artist is making a fan comic about Golden Sun. Definitely worth keeping an eye on

 

[KoopaSaki]

I guess with fighter 5 coming later today, we best expect the next Nintendo direct in February. I am rallying hard on that redditors fever dream all cause If BillyBae10k is rallying it, THEN SO AM I!

 

[Sabrewulf238]

I actually had a thought about something like that a while ago as well.

Since we had Isaac and Felix as the protagonist of the first two Golden Sun games.....it might make some sense if the protagonist for the fourth game is a child of Felix instead of Matthew again.

That would be wild though.

Sakurai: Fighter #5 is....this person you've never seen before!