Sumting Sumting Maifa | Game Over

[Sabrar]

Pythag
I understand what you're saying but you're not answering the question. For two scum to exist in that 3 you literally need 2 of your scum-scenarios to be true. Why is scum!Logic enough?

 

[Pythag]

Pythag
I understand what you're saying but you're not answering the question. For two scum to exist in that 3 you literally need 2 of your scum-scenarios to be true. Why is scum!Logic enough?

Oh, it's not!
I thought I explained that the 2 scum in that three was knee jerk, and I've moved away from the 2 scum in that pool specifically for those reasons.

 

[Malakandra]

Reading back through I noticed some post on him about Boom #1535 and #1858. I don't think scum logic would pass up a chance to try to get a lynch off on a PR nor defend him like this.

Its also makes sense in that he would know boom was town and is hoping people like you would go back and see that and think he is town for town reading him while planning to kill them later that night.

 

[Deadbananas]

Its also makes sense in that he would know boom was town and is hoping people like you would go back and see that and think he is town for town reading him while planning to kill them later that night.

If they would of been able to lynch boom they could of killed fonti that night and got two PR's. I think that would probably be more important to them.

 

[Malakandra]

IF they were able to lynch boom which was very unlikely. Sense he was revealed as a PR and there was the whole Handorin situation going on that was going to dominate the lynch. I don't think a scum team tries to push a boom lynch past a handorin lynch there.

 

[Deadbananas]

IF they were able to lynch boom which was very unlikely. Sense he was revealed as a PR and there was the whole Handorin situation going on that was going to dominate the lynch. I don't think a scum team tries to push a boom lynch past a handorin lynch there.

Fair enough, I guess I gave to much cred to the scum team thinking they could push anything.
I really hate thats its almost pointless to analyze the handorin vote, really screws over a main way of gaining info.

 

[Malakandra]

Now that you mention it I want to update that color thing Wiisp posted based off new info.

Final D1 wagons
Trisscar (1) - Spak
Deadbananas (1) - Sabrar
Handorin (6) - Z25, Xivii, Pythag, Jackrito, Bessie, BoomFrog
Z25 (6) - LaserGuy, Ranmaru, 3DSNinja, Malakandra, Deadbananas, Handorin
Bessie (1) - Trisscar

With logic not voting.

Blue being flipped town, green being people I believe strongly are town, mostly from claims and myself. teal being people I have town leans on, and Orange being scum leans.

I can see a scum team consisting of Logic, Pythag, Xivii and Bessie.
Sabrar shooting DB looks kinda obvious in hindsight but hindsight 2020.

I think I want to look more at the Toko slot since thats a lot of people that are town and I find towney on a most likely town wagon.

 

[Malakandra]

Bah, I'll read through the rest before DnD tomorrow and try to get a few posts out. Its late and the Ran V Xivii conversation is hurting my brain again.

 

[Trisscar]

Bah, I'll read through the rest before DnD tomorrow and try to get a few posts out. Its late and the Ran V Xivii conversation is hurting my brain again.

*literally exactly why I skipped it tbf XD*

 

[LogicoftheVI]

Anyone want to do a Vig vote today?

Its also makes sense in that he would know boom was town and is hoping people like you would go back and see that and think he is town for town reading him while planning to kill them later that night.

Why as mafua would I kill someone who would be helping to keep me from being lynched right now?
Like I get the idea but was killing boom worth losing someone who strongly town read me?

IF they were able to lynch boom which was very unlikely. Sense he was revealed as a PR and there was the whole Handorin situation going on that was going to dominate the lynch. I don't think a scum team tries to push a boom lynch past a handorin lynch there.

I wouldn't know what a scum team thought or wanted to do?
HOw am I supposed to defend against this type of hypothetical?

 

[LogicoftheVI]

Now that you mention it I want to update that color thing Wiisp posted based off new info.

Final D1 wagons
Trisscar (1) - Spak
Deadbananas (1) - Sabrar
Handorin (6) - Z25, Xivii, Pythag, Jackrito, Bessie, BoomFrog
Z25 (6) - LaserGuy, Ranmaru, 3DSNinja, Malakandra, Deadbananas, Handorin
Bessie (1) - Trisscar

With logic not voting.

Blue being flipped town, green being people I believe strongly are town, mostly from claims and myself. teal being people I have town leans on, and Orange being scum leans.

I can see a scum team consisting of Logic, Pythag, Xivii and Bessie.
Sabrar shooting DB looks kinda obvious in hindsight but hindsight 2020.

I think I want to look more at the Toko slot since thats a lot of people that are town and I find towney on a most likely town wagon.

Half of the votes on Handorin are from the scum team?
Is that the meta around here for scum to vote together like that?
Most places I've played mafia try to avoid votongn togegter and usual spread there votes.
Can you reevaluate as if mafia had spread out?

 

[Sabrar]

Why as mafua would I kill someone who would be helping to keep me from being lynched right now?
Like I get the idea but was killing boom worth losing someone who strongly town read me?

Because you have buddies who are scum-read by Boom? Mafia is not solitary, I don't know why you would forget this.

 

[LogicoftheVI]

I guess I am in claim territory.
I am a vanilla town.
I have no PR claim or information that will save me.

Because you have buddies who are scum-read by Boom? Mafia is not solitary, I don't know why you would forget this.

I didn't forget just like im sure you didn't forget I would have influence among my team.

 

[LogicoftheVI]

Jackrito considering you will more than likely be in the game tomorrow, how do you plan on reevaluating things when I flip town?

 

[LogicoftheVI]

Logic has a cleared town been pushing him for like 2.5 days,

Is it out of the realm of possibility that cleared/confirmed town has an incorrect read?
Is it impossible for a town to tunnel someone for days on end?

Logic hasn't really pushed anything and only been asking questions (again, I'm aware that's what I was doing)

On my home site I am often accused of asking meaningless questions (Jack should also no this karote is one who pushes this often).
That's how I play the game of mafia I ask people to talk about each other so other players can sort through the content to find discrepancies.

Logic has been pretty antagonistic in his tone, and almost aggressive at times over things that don't make sense to me.

Jack should know this is more in line with my town meta than my scum meta.
I have a very hard time faking emotion and as Xivii said earlier I'm not very aggressive as mafia (things I know I need to work on).
While I'm self aware of these things don't allchange and correct themselves in one game.

Jack can I ask you how well you know, or think you know logic's meta?

like scale of 1-10 stuff

I would say not very well he pushed me hard D1 in our last game together before mafia killed him N1 in an attempt to incriminate me.
I would say he knows when I'm not playing my strongest town game well tho.

edit: fixed a broken quote

 

[Jackrito]

Jack can I ask you how well you know, or think you know logic's meta?

like scale of 1-10 stuff

I would say a 7, its normally pretty easy to tell when Logic is town by now. No point have I felt that since his initial burst day one.

 

[Jackrito]

Jackrito considering you will more than likely be in the game tomorrow, how do you plan on reevaluating things when I flip town?

I do a full review on the game state and look more at the people I have being letting pass like Bessie and Spak. I also rethink my stance on Maka. I feel that my other scum reads still have merit though.

 

[Tsumugi Shirogane]

Agree to disagree prob. Mech is how I couch things so I don't end up going through literally every scenario in my head at once. Defining borders is one way the human mind solves problems, and if it happens to hinder your thought processes then I encourage you to ignore posts of mine that do so.

Anyway for those wondering, my plan was formed within about 10 seconds of seeing my Role PM and was based off metas from other mafia-inspired games. As I said before, I did not realize this particular audience would take it like I was yelling fire in a crowded theater. I dunno if the sheer amount of discussion generated helped or hindered more, though I'd like to think I kept the game from being a mostly quiet and boring affair at least, and helped town get more reads off it as well.
The plan was that, since my role had no specific powers and I knew there would be town roles that had them (unless this was an entirely vanilla game, which would be funny admittedly), I would pretend to be a role with important night abilities attempting to "medium bait" to get mafia to kill me off first with their night kill. Thereby giving the actual 'power roles' a chance to use them and report back the next game day, and hopefully advancing town's understanding of the setup in the process. Since a night kill seemed inevitable unless mafia decided to do something weird, this seemed like a reasonable way to divert it to do the least possible damage.

Annnndd, then everyone blew up like a baking soda volcano mixed with nitroglycerin. Must admit it's been a while since I mis-predicted an audience that badly, it's really interesting.

Also nice to see you aren't panicking today Logic, hope you can avoid it in future.

What exactly did you hope to gain from doing this? Clearly, it did not work or else you would be dead. Also, 9/10 times this kind of bait doesn't work because it is pretty obvious what your doing.

 

[Tsumugi Shirogane]

Why have you not done this before? Also I will tell you now if you are town it has hindered more and let to a uneeded distraction on your slot that has helped no one but scum to hide behind. Pushing you is so easy people can do it when they don't know what to do and hard to blame them.

This is slight the stretch, it is like triscc said, it all really depends on the audience. People handle this kind of thing in different ways and it was clearly not how he anticipated this time.

Town read:
I am reading Fonti as town independent of the Neapolitan claim, so not based on mechanics. I can follow her reasons for claiming her results when she did. I feel she has been has been trying to solve the game.

This feels like a major cop-out of a read. Not, exactly sure what this means but you were specifically asked for non-mechanical reads. Clearly this is a mechanical read.

Was ok with his content through the first half of D2. The first thing that really pinged me was the odd assumption that mods would probably a reroll if the game had all newbies on the scum team. Spak’s not a newbie so I can’t see how he would have thought this, or was making reads based on it. On my home site, if the roles and alignments weren’t distributed randomly it would have been considered a ******* game, and the mod usually made a statement about the random distribution in the OP. The thing that pinged me the more was that he kept pushing for the vig to claim on D2. In post #2114 he said he needed the vig to claim in order to clear Deadbanannas, which I get, but it didn’t need to be on D2. I also don’t like that in playing Wiisp’s game he added more categories which allowed him to hedge a little on his reads.

This is interesting.

Spak Why did you believe the game had to be rerolled, honestly, what even brought you to that conclusion. Who were you trying to defend with this logic?

What game are you talking about where spak hedged?

 

[Tsumugi Shirogane]

If they would of been able to lynch boom they could of killed fonti that night and got two PR's. I think that would probably be more important to them.

Logic is not the kind of person to hammer or vote without thinking, that is the problem we face here.

At the time what did a boom lynch have going for it?

 

[Tsumugi Shirogane]

Half of the votes on Handorin are from the scum team?
Is that the meta around here for scum to vote together like that?
Most places I've played mafia try to avoid votongn togegter and usual spread there votes.
Can you reevaluate as if mafia had spread out?

How come you come to this conclusion? With the knowledge I have at most I could maybe say Xivii and Pythag are scum on that train.

I guess I am in claim territory.
I am a vanilla town.
I have no PR claim or information that will save me.

I didn't forget just like im sure you didn't forget I would have influence among my team.

I don't have any issues with this post but I do believe this should be checked by the neopolitan cop.

Unvote

 

[Jackrito]

How come you come to this conclusion? With the knowledge I have at most I could maybe say Xivii and Pythag are scum on that train.



I don't have any issues with this post but I do believe this should be checked by the neopolitan cop.

Unvote

Who do we vote today then, and we can't leave everything to the Neopoltian cop who can die at anytime. This is the issue with this game from now on, anyone can just claim vanilla town and not have to worry about being lynched. Trisscar is who needs to be sorted by that or by the vig at least

 

[Trisscar]

What exactly did you hope to gain from doing this? Clearly, it did not work or else you would be dead. Also, 9/10 times this kind of bait doesn't work because it is pretty obvious what your doing.

It didn't work, because near EoD1 (god or was it EoD2... starting to lose track) a bunch of people started to push for me to be lynched, which most definitely is NOT something that would help town. So I ended up having to explain it all, and Jack and maybe one other person seemed to know what i was doing before I said so. Apparently it is not obvious in the slightest around here. XD

 

[Sabrar]

I didn't forget just like im sure you didn't forget I would have influence among my team.

Influence doesn't mean that you necessarily get to make the final decision. So asking why you specifically wouldn't shoot Boom is misleading.

Who do we vote today then, and we can't leave everything to the Neopoltian cop who can die at anytime. This is the issue with this game from now on, anyone can just claim vanilla town and not have to worry about being lynched.

Fully agree with this part.

Trisscar is who needs to be sorted by that or by the vig at least

I will take this into consideration.

 

[Malakandra]

Anyone want to do a Vig vote today?

I think this is a bad idea as now that everyone knows who the vig is the mafia can just kill the vig if they know he is targeting scum.

Why as mafua would I kill someone who would be helping to keep me from being lynched right now?
Like I get the idea but was killing boom worth losing someone who strongly town read me?

It could be like Sabrar said and you he could be pushing your buddies, but also as Xivii said boom was a good player and could of seen through what you were doing.

I wouldn't know what a scum team thought or wanted to do?
HOw am I supposed to defend against this type of hypothetical

Just providing reasoning to DB why a scumlogic would be defending boom.

Half of the votes on Handorin are from the scum team?
Is that the meta around here for scum to vote together like that?
Most places I've played mafia try to avoid votongn togegter and usual spread there votes.
Can you reevaluate as if mafia had spread out?

I don't know what the meta around here is, this is my first time playing.
I could see them voting together as Handorin could be an easy excuse but there are other possibilities I will entertain too.
If its spread out then I see it as Logic, Spak, one or two of the oranges on the Handorin, and if one then Ran most likely.
However that scum team makes less sense together than the one I stated above I feel.

 

[Malakandra]

All right, I've read through Cuth and Ran again. The main thing with Ran was the argument with Xivii and the push against Z25 (Fonti). I still feel like Ran comes from a town place with these as Z25 didn't have the best showing. Cuth was focused on Jack for a while d2 and also had a few posts that may explain his vote on Spak today before replacing out. Ultimately I still feel like the Toko slot is town and the two slots just had some pushes on town but its very hard to tell since the slot has changed every day and thus its hard to judge consistency of reads. I think its to the slots benefit that each new owner has focused on different people as it doesn't speak to an agenda.

 

[Tsumugi Shirogane]

Anyone want to do a Vig vote today?

I was going to try to believe you were town then I saw this cute little dodge.

You better hope that your what you say you are.

 

[LogicoftheVI]

I think this is a bad idea as now that everyone knows who the vig is the mafia can just kill the vig if they know he is targeting scum.

You better hope that your what you say you are.

it's not like he would have to shoot who we chose just more wine for mafia tonight.
I can very much be the leading vote for this based on EoD2 and current vote placement.

Fair enough tho was just curious what others were thinking.

 

[LogicoftheVI]

It could be like Sabrar said and you he could be pushing your buddies, but also as Xivii said boom was a good player and could of seen through what you were doing.

I mean from your PoV anything is possible this is how people wine themselves out of good read through paranoia.
Kind of like how you got DB to back off his good read of the situation.
I have no buddies just a town team I need to find to win.

 

[LogicoftheVI]

Logic is not the kind of person to hammer or vote without thinking, that is the problem we face here.

How come you come to this conclusion? With the knowledge I have at most I could maybe say Xivii and Pythag are scum on that train.

Handorin (6) - Z25, Xivii, Pythag, Jackrito, Bessie, BoomFrog

I can see a scum team consisting of Logic, Pythag, Xivii and Bessie.

Edit added proper quote

 

[Pythag]

I can see a scum team consisting of Logic, Pythag, Xivii and Bessie.

Edit added proper quote

I see what you're getting at
unvote

But for a minute...
I know my alignment.
if I trust Jack's clear.
if I trust Mala to be townie

That shifts the pool to Xivii/Bessie/Logic/X (or maybe it's just a team of 3)

and if I believe's logic's claim..

I was going to try to believe you were town then I saw this cute little dodge.

You better hope that your what you say you are.

Help me out here, Toko. Did logic's claim ring true to you? What's the sticking point for you with Logic asking for a vig vote?





bessie can you flesh out your read on spak? He just reads so pure to me

 

[Tsumugi Shirogane]

Help me out here, Toko. Did logic's claim ring true to you? What's the sticking point for you with Logic asking for a vig vote?

I think the claim was done well enough to where I believe it, however, I also agree that decree to get people to vote vig is weird.

 

[Xivii]

I beat Dandara. Very good. My only complaint is that the final boss was too easy. I've noticed this with all the metroidvania games I've been recently playing. I always come across the final boss without realizing its the final boss and boomfrog the game is over. There should at least be three stages to a final boss imo.

Edit: a word

 

[Xivii]

The music tho

 

[Xivii]

bessie bessie can you flesh out your read on spak? He just reads so pure to me

Can you elaborate on yours as well.

 

[Pythag]

Can you elaborate on yours as well.

Aside from what I mentioned earlier, that being that the things I had questions about in my reread, Spak was literally right there asking them.
Spak hasn't done too much to blend in it would seem?
His D1 vote he was all by his lonesome on Trisscar
His D2 Vig vote put him strictly in the strange position of choosing to vig DB. (he did say if the vig hasn't already shot)
From my opinion, I think scum tries to blend in more often then not, it doesn't do them too many favors if they stand out in such an arresting manner.
While the vig vote for spak is odd (and maybe his follow up is a phone in with : go for anyone on the z wagon) going along with his tone it feels to me to be TWTBAW.

 

[Spak]

Okay, I'm back! Had job interviewing stuff suddenly pop up over the past few days (had a day's notice for the first interview, next interview expected next week w/ additional research needed on top of normal work stuff that has been crazy), but I should be around for an hour or two before heading to bed. Will start reading up right now.

 

[LogicoftheVI]

25 and a half hours.
This game state is pretty stagnate.
Spak I hope you can shake some thing up with the time you have.

 

[LogicoftheVI]

bessie may ask why no vote accompanied your scumread post?
Who are you willing to vote for?
You were on during the time pythag and I were leading trains any thoughts on that?

 

[bessie]

I should of been clearer. I ment on someone who doesn't have a role related reason for being town, since just ignoring the role wouldn't be very productive.

I wasn’t reading her townie just based on having results. It was the reasoning in claiming her results when she did, I felt was townie apart from the game mechanics. I also had a town lean on Z25. He was drawing suspicion from many players on D1, but I was seeing it more like enthusiastic and excited to play. In retrospect, maybe his enthusiasm was partially because he got a power role.