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Standard Offensive Team, Wrath

Ryu Shimazu

Smash Master
Joined
Nov 5, 2009
Messages
4,234
Location
Alabama
NNID
Ryushimmy
3DS FC
5000-5048-5681
First, I'd like to say I'm sorry for back to back RMT and give an explanation. I wanted to make five standard Wifi teams that would be great and fun to use. Being the dork I am, I wanted to tie in a meaning to these teams, a symbolic thing so to say. In the end I decided to do the seven deadly sins, but oh wait, that involves two more teams. That is where Envy(UU) came from, and also Pride(Ubers), which I never posted here. The reason why Wrath is posted so soon is because these are the five I want to see the best. Envy looks nice and I'm content (thanks for all the help), with Pride as I won't use it much, so that is why they are done so fast. Actually, Envy turned out a lot better than I figured it would. Pride (ironically enough, being composed of the strongest of Pokemon) will probably be my weakest link.
This team is composed of offensive pokemon that can either sweep right away or setup sweep. There is nothing defensive about this team unless you count Speed, and boy was it hard to put this together. I either had too many fighting/bug/ghost weaknesses or too many rock weaknesses. In the end, there are 7 weaknesses that two Pokemon share, which is depressing since Envy had only a few of those and none that three shared. I have this feeling I'm really overlooking something obvious too, but we'll see.
Anyways, here it is...
Wrath: "A great desire for vengeance"​


In the beginning it always starts with a lead. I had to find a good hard hitting leader. I almost picked Aerodactyl, but oddly enough I remembered Annoying(don't know the numbers afterwards) saying he hated Aerodactyl, and... I've never cared for him either. Not that his opinion is mine, I just saw why (to me) he is worthless. I found someone stronger, beater in everyone way (almost) except speed because rocks are supposed to be fast? I decided to go with....

Azelf @ Focus Sash (Amon)
Ability: Levitate
Naive
200Attack/58Special Attack/252Speed
- Taunt
- Stealth Rock
- Explosion
- Psychic
I may be ignorant of something better for an offensive team, but this guy seemed to be better than the flying rock turd. I considered Jirachi, especially with that cool event one coming, but then again, he could do something different for me on another team. Also, Azelf looks wrathful in a joyful cynical way, but Jirachi... nope.
As for what he does, he can Taunt other leads so they do not set up Stealth Rock, set up Stealth rock itself, and either fight or explode. I wanted to put more into attack because Psychic is powerful regardless. I could take some of the attack out, but Taunt > Stealth Rock > Explosion looked like the more common strategy.
As for covering, Azelf can cover the weakness to fighting on Tyranitar and Lucario with Psychic, but if I'm right about that combo listed about being common (I have no clue, it just looks like it would be) then I guess he can't cover a lot of things dead. Weakness wise he is weak to Dark, Bug, and Ghost.

Looking for a counter for his weaknesses (this wouldn't necessarily be the second out, just something to balance the weakness) I spent forever finding the next pokemon. I've had one of these guys before, and he was always decent. It wasn't until I saw Extreme Speed I understood why.

Lucario @ Life Orb
Ability: Inner Focus
Jolly or Adamant (I can't decide)
6HP/252Attack/252Speed
- Extreme Speed
- Swords Dance
- Close Combat
- Thunderpunch
I can't decide on which nature and was wanting help with that, and I really was skeptical about this. A perfect counter to Azelf's weaknesses (they won't matter if Azelf is gone..but still) and brings in some good offense to it's own. Swords Dance allows Extremespeed to OHKO anything faster than you (according to Smogon), though I think you have to be Adamant. Thunderpunch is for coverage mostly, and the last move seems self-explanatory. I won't lie, I still am skeptical of this, Lucario can be very fragile. I suppose if you get him in right at the end though, it can set up. Once setup though, I have no doubt he is a great threat.
Again, as for covering Lucario is weak to fire, ground, and fighting. Azelf can handle both of those ironically, though later on two pokemon will cover ground and fighting again. Fire was a bit of an issue, until I saw I could use my favorite pokemon to cover it.

Well one of my top 10 favorites, it's a changing list. At least point I think he is on the top 10, but...

Gyarados @ Life Orb (Scylla)
Ability: Intimidate
Jolly or Adamant (I can't decide either)
6HP/252Attack/252Speed
- Dragon Dance
- Waterfall
- Ice Fang
- Earthquake
I can't decide nature either, but this seemed perfect. Gyarados and wrath go hand and hand too. Azelf and Lucario are okay I guess, but Gyarados just screams it. After one Dragon Dance Gyarados can easily sweep and waterfall is just one of those moves I've always hated having used on me. (I always flinch) There really is not a lot too say, except he too covers ground, covers fire, and covers fighting. The strategy seems like it'd work. The only problem I have is deciding natures.
The only other problem is it brings rock and lightning into the weakness mix. Lightning will not be a big deal, but rock isn't good. Out of all the weak to rock offensive pokemon though, Gyarados seemed like a keeper. Just need Soul Silver to get me that good Shiny one!

Bringing in the rock and lightning mix, it was really hard to find a good counter. (Gyarados has the Earthquake, but with x4, I wouldn't risk it, and Jolteon...) The good thing is Lucario can take rock, so I focused more on the thunder issue. In the end, I almost went with Gengar which makes no sense whatsoever until it dawned on me. A pokemon to counter Gyarados' and protect me from lightning...

Jolteon @ Choice Specs
Ability: Volt Absorb
Timid
6HP/252Special Attack/252Speed
- Thunderbolt
- Signal Beam
- Baton Pass
- Shadow Ball
Jolteon is so fast even though he is weak to ground I did not count his weakness to ground. That might be arrogant, but it seems true. If so I have three weak to ground, but it doesn't seem like I can help it. He covers me from Electric types with Volt Absorb, can counter bulky waters, so it gets the job done. Jolteon also has a bug move, which is useful hurting other psychic/dark pokemon. I'd love HP - whatever, but this is a Wifi team.
Jolteon brings ground into this team, which Gyarados covers, and it shouldn't be a problem with it's speed.

My next two pokemon didn't need to be set-up sweepers, I wanted all out firepower. My next one felt like a standard to the set, I mean how can you not see the wrath in this?

Tyranitar @ Choice Band
Ability: Sandstream (Terramalum)
Adamant
128HP/252Attack/128Speed
- Crunch
- Earthquake
- Pursuit
- Stone Edge
I can't say much as what it's supposed to do, but I can say it does it well. Maybe used later game to not hurt 2/3 of my team with Sandstorm, that is one of it's two only downfalls. It covers me from any Psychic, ghost, rock, ice, flying problems (exceptions I'm sure) and has terrible power, especially with pursuit. Not much I can say except it brings a lot of weaknesses in with it, Grass(Salamence and Gyara can cover), Water(Gyara can take it, Jolteon, Salamence up), Fighting (Gyara, Azelf, Salamenece), Bug(Gyara, Salamence), Steel and ground, and Gyarados as well as my 6th can cover ground and steel. Lucario can also cover steel. He brings a lot of weaknesses but they can all be covered, so it seems to fit with me.

My sixth, who seems to be like Tyranitar's aide, has been something I've been anxious to use. I've heard this is the best set for him, if not I'd love to go special with him to balance out the team, but I really like this setup.

Salamence @ Life Orb
Ability: Intimidate
Naive
18Attack/240 Special Attack/252Speed
- Draco Meteor
- Earthquake
- Flamethrower
- Outrage/Dragonclaw/some other move (Can't decide there)
This set looks beastly and it saves Tyranitar numerous times. The fire move is a great aide to countering steel-types as well. I'm not too sure how well the physical moves with such little invested, but the EVs are from Smogon. I'm really confused about what to do for the fourth move, and I really do not want to do Outrage. Dragon Claw could work, but I was wondering if there is a better fourth move for coverage.
He is weak to ice, dragon, and rock, and I have numerous Earthquakes, and Lucario for rock. Tyranitar and Lucario can handle ice, primarily a weavile. As for Dragon, Gyarados has ice, and Draco Meteor if Salamence goes first, but Dragon could be a concern.


Ideally what I'm concerned/want help for:
- the natures that are not finite
- Salamence's last move
- A worry of a weakness to letting a Salamence sweep me if it used Dragon Dance or something. I really am concerned with this, but I can't think how to fix it either. I really don't want a Weavile.
- Advice on Azelf's EVs
- Any other advice/things I'm missing
- I also ran out of nicknames....not really important but yeah if you know good wrathful names.
This RMT looks a lot cleaner than my last.. I hope, and I hope this team is okay. I didn't take the first two this seriously, primarily because they are not/will not be as important, so.. I hope it shows.
 

kirbyraeg

Smash Hero
Joined
Nov 18, 2008
Messages
6,440
Location
in Makai
First, I'd like to say I'm sorry for back to back RMT and give an explanation. I wanted to make five standard Wifi teams that would be great and fun to use. Being the dork I am, I wanted to tie in a meaning to these teams, a symbolic thing so to say. In the end I decided to do the seven deadly sins, but oh wait, that involves two more teams. That is where Envy(UU) came from, and also Pride(Ubers), which I never posted here. The reason why Wrath is posted so soon is because these are the five I want to see the best. Envy looks nice and I'm content (thanks for all the help), with Pride as I won't use it much, so that is why they are done so fast. Actually, Envy turned out a lot better than I figured it would. Pride (ironically enough, being composed of the strongest of Pokemon) will probably be my weakest link.
This team is composed of offensive pokemon that can either sweep right away or setup sweep. There is nothing defensive about this team unless you count Speed, and boy was it hard to put this together. I either had too many fighting/bug/ghost weaknesses or too many rock weaknesses. In the end, there are 7 weaknesses that two Pokemon share, which is depressing since Envy had only a few of those and none that three shared. I have this feeling I'm really overlooking something obvious too, but we'll see.
Anyways, here it is...
Wrath: "A great desire for vengeance"​


In the beginning it always starts with a lead. I had to find a good hard hitting leader. I almost picked Aerodactyl, but oddly enough I remembered Annoying(don't know the numbers afterwards) saying he hated Aerodactyl, and... I've never cared for him either. Not that his opinion is mine, I just saw why (to me) he is worthless. I found someone stronger, beater in everyone way (almost) except speed because rocks are supposed to be fast? I decided to go with....

Azelf @ Focus Sash (Amon)
Ability: Levitate
Naive
200Attack/58Special Attack/252Speed
- Taunt
- Stealth Rock
- Explosion
- Psychic
I may be ignorant of something better for an offensive team, but this guy seemed to be better than the flying rock turd. I considered Jirachi, especially with that cool event one coming, but then again, he could do something different for me on another team. Also, Azelf looks wrathful in a joyful cynical way, but Jirachi... nope.
As for what he does, he can Taunt other leads so they do not set up Stealth Rock, set up Stealth rock itself, and either fight or explode. I wanted to put more into attack because Psychic is powerful regardless. I could take some of the attack out, but Taunt > Stealth Rock > Explosion looked like the more common strategy.
As for covering, Azelf can cover the weakness to fighting on Tyranitar and Lucario with Psychic, but if I'm right about that combo listed about being common (I have no clue, it just looks like it would be) then I guess he can't cover a lot of things dead. Weakness wise he is weak to Dark, Bug, and Ghost.
IMO you're going to want a coverage option or u-turn in the last slot over psychic. Particularly vs. lead ttars, you're generally going to want to u-turn out as they set up rocks/pursuit you/whatever, and your sash will keep you alive as you switch to lucario (and if they don't pursuit you you can always come back in to set up rocks later with full health).


Looking for a counter for his weaknesses (this wouldn't necessarily be the second out, just something to balance the weakness) I spent forever finding the next pokemon. I've had one of these guys before, and he was always decent. It wasn't until I saw Extreme Speed I understood why.

Lucario @ Life Orb
Ability: Inner Focus
Jolly or Adamant (I can't decide)
6HP/252Attack/252Speed
- Extreme Speed
- Swords Dance
- Close Combat
- Thunderpunch
I can't decide on which nature and was wanting help with that, and I really was skeptical about this. A perfect counter to Azelf's weaknesses (they won't matter if Azelf is gone..but still) and brings in some good offense to it's own. Swords Dance allows Extremespeed to OHKO anything faster than you (according to Smogon), though I think you have to be Adamant. Thunderpunch is for coverage mostly, and the last move seems self-explanatory. I won't lie, I still am skeptical of this, Lucario can be very fragile. I suppose if you get him in right at the end though, it can set up. Once setup though, I have no doubt he is a great threat.
Again, as for covering Lucario is weak to fire, ground, and fighting. Azelf can handle both of those ironically, though later on two pokemon will cover ground and fighting again. Fire was a bit of an issue, until I saw I could use my favorite pokemon to cover it.

Definitely run crunch over thunderpunch, it'll help your lategame sweep a lot. Azelf gets rocks up pretty frequently, and coverage on rotom>coverage on gyara in the lategame. My recommendation is jolly since your team seems to set about weakening pokemon pretty well (mixmence, cbtar, specsjolt, etc.) and outspeeding those threats that try to outspeed adamant luc might make the difference. It's a playstyle choice, but those are my thoughts.

Well one of my top 10 favorites, it's a changing list. At least point I think he is on the top 10, but...

Gyarados @ Life Orb (Scylla)
Ability: Intimidate
Jolly or Adamant (I can't decide either)
6HP/252Attack/252Speed
- Dragon Dance
- Waterfall
- Ice Fang
- Earthquake
I can't decide nature either, but this seemed perfect. Gyarados and wrath go hand and hand too. Azelf and Lucario are okay I guess, but Gyarados just screams it. After one Dragon Dance Gyarados can easily sweep and waterfall is just one of those moves I've always hated having used on me. (I always flinch) There really is not a lot too say, except he too covers ground, covers fire, and covers fighting. The strategy seems like it'd work. The only problem I have is deciding natures.
The only other problem is it brings rock and lightning into the weakness mix. Lightning will not be a big deal, but rock isn't good. Out of all the weak to rock offensive pokemon though, Gyarados seemed like a keeper. Just need Soul Silver to get me that good Shiny one!

This gyara set is standard but good. Again, the nature is your choice particularly since you have jolteon to cover the predictable as hell scarf rotom/starmie thunderbolt. This is just my recommendation, since I tend to be a speed>power player, go with jolly on this guy too. Being able to outspeed scarfed heatrans that run hp electric specifically to revenge gyarados is handy as hell, and LO will help to compensate for his lesser power. I'm gonna suggest a potential replacement pair for this guy and jolteon at the end of the RMT to help with your mixmence weakness, but this is definitely a viable pair as long as you can keep mence off of the field before you set up your lucario.


Bringing in the rock and lightning mix, it was really hard to find a good counter. (Gyarados has the Earthquake, but with x4, I wouldn't risk it, and Jolteon...) The good thing is Lucario can take rock, so I focused more on the thunder issue. In the end, I almost went with Gengar which makes no sense whatsoever until it dawned on me. A pokemon to counter Gyarados' and protect me from lightning...

Jolteon @ Choice Specs
Ability: Volt Absorb
Timid
6HP/252Special Attack/252Speed
- Thunderbolt
- Signal Beam
- Baton Pass
- Shadow Ball
Jolteon is so fast even though he is weak to ground I did not count his weakness to ground. That might be arrogant, but it seems true. If so I have three weak to ground, but it doesn't seem like I can help it. He covers me from Electric types with Volt Absorb, can counter bulky waters, so it gets the job done. Jolteon also has a bug move, which is useful hurting other psychic/dark pokemon. I'd love HP - whatever, but this is a Wifi team.
Jolteon brings ground into this team, which Gyarados covers, and it shouldn't be a problem with it's speed.
SpecsJolt=<3

this guy is too good, I've always loved using him and the fact that you're running signal beam lets you 2hko ttar switch-ins and deal with latias pretty well who come in expecting to sponge a thunderbolt. I can't really suggest a change for this, but you gotta be careful with this guy, always be cautious when you send it out first. Their counter might be something that can be surprised with the proper move (Latias, ttar, etc.) but it might also be a blissey that'll hammer your next switch-in with toxic.



My next two pokemon didn't need to be set-up sweepers, I wanted all out firepower. My next one felt like a standard to the set, I mean how can you not see the wrath in this?

Tyranitar @ Choice Band
Ability: Sandstream (Terramalum)
Adamant
128HP/252Attack/128Speed
- Crunch
- Earthquake
- Pursuit
- Stone Edge
I can't say much as what it's supposed to do, but I can say it does it well. Maybe used later game to not hurt 2/3 of my team with Sandstorm, that is one of it's two only downfalls. It covers me from any Psychic, ghost, rock, ice, flying problems (exceptions I'm sure) and has terrible power, especially with pursuit. Not much I can say except it brings a lot of weaknesses in with it, Grass(Salamence and Gyara can cover), Water(Gyara can take it, Jolteon, Salamence up), Fighting (Gyara, Azelf, Salamenece), Bug(Gyara, Salamence), Steel and ground, and Gyarados as well as my 6th can cover ground and steel. Lucario can also cover steel. He brings a lot of weaknesses but they can all be covered, so it seems to fit with me.

CBTar patches up a lot of stuff for this team, but be careful about switching into a wisp from rotom (they sometimes scout with that move to make sure they don't lose their spin blocker to a pursuiter like this guy). Solid, watch out for threats that run hp fighting solely to deal with ttar and crap like specs latias that 2hkos with surf xD

My sixth, who seems to be like Tyranitar's aide, has been something I've been anxious to use. I've heard this is the best set for him, if not I'd love to go special with him to balance out the team, but I really like this setup.

Salamence @ Life Orb
Ability: Intimidate
Naive
18Attack/240 Special Attack/252Speed
- Draco Meteor
- Earthquake
- Flamethrower
- Outrage/Dragonclaw/some other move (Can't decide there)
This set looks beastly and it saves Tyranitar numerous times. The fire move is a great aide to countering steel-types as well. I'm not too sure how well the physical moves with such little invested, but the EVs are from Smogon. I'm really confused about what to do for the fourth move, and I really do not want to do Outrage. Dragon Claw could work, but I was wondering if there is a better fourth move for coverage.
He is weak to ice, dragon, and rock, and I have numerous Earthquakes, and Lucario for rock. Tyranitar and Lucario can handle ice, primarily a weavile. As for Dragon, Gyarados has ice, and Draco Meteor if Salamence goes first, but Dragon could be a concern.
Mixmence is a beast, I wish it were used more. As for your 4th move, I'd actually go with Roost since you've got sandstorm+LO damage building up on this guy, and you generally want him to come in on a physical threat it can scare off and fire off a draco meteor/flamethrower. His type coverage is great already, so roost is a solid option. If you want a 4th move, I'd go with outrage simply because your overall goal is to set up SDluc.

Ideally what I'm concerned/want help for:
- the natures that are not finite
- Salamence's last move
- A worry of a weakness to letting a Salamence sweep me if it used Dragon Dance or something. I really am concerned with this, but I can't think how to fix it either. I really don't want a Weavile.
- Advice on Azelf's EVs
- Any other advice/things I'm missing
- I also ran out of nicknames....not really important but yeah if you know good wrathful names.
This RMT looks a lot cleaner than my last.. I hope, and I hope this team is okay. I didn't take the first two this seriously, primarily because they are not/will not be as important, so.. I hope it shows.
Dealing with a mixmence sweep is tough for this team, but arguably the easiest way to make SURE that you won't ever get swept by a mixmence is keeping a scarfed revenger in the wings (NOT something like jirachi/flygon who might lose a speed tie and get ko'ed by earthquake). Some revengers to consider would be starmie, latias, gengar (yep gengar is actually pretty solid and has some nice defensive synergy with ttar as well) as well as stuff like scizor who can revenge via priority+LO recoil+sandstorm. I know you probably want to keep your gyarajolt combo, but replacing your gyarajolt combo with CB scizor/subTran combo is probably your best option (despite the fact that I LOVE jolteon and gyarados xD).

Scizor @ Choice Band
Adamant Nature, technician
160 HP/172 Atk/12 Spe/164 SpDef
Bullet Punch
U-turn
Superpower
Pursuit

Heatran @ Leftovers/Salac Berry
Timid Nature, flash fire
252 SpAtk, 252 Spe, 4 Def, 30 HP IV
Substitute
Fire Blast
Earth Power
Toxic/Dragon Pulse/HP Electric

A bit of explanation about this heatran, generally people will look for leftovers recovery/LO damage as you come in/attack, so using a berry lets you not only bluff items but also gives you a bit of a lategame advantage. Coming into rocks for the second time and subbing down gives you the pinch berry boost with a 30 HP IV which can catch your opponent off guard...especially in the lategame. Going with this or expert belt will let you fake a choice item before you use sub for the first time.
The last slot has a lot of options open for it and each has their merits: Toxic lets you catch bulky switchins like swampert and suicune and cripple them, dragon pulse will cover latias/mence that think they can come in and set up against you, HP Electric covers gyarados and other water types pretty nicely (though toxic does a pretty nice job of that as well if you go that route).

This pair of pokemon gives you a more reliable way of killing mence, giving you a safer switch-in to things like rotom/etc. and taking care of some threats that stand in the way of letting your lucario sweep.
just my opinions.

and I like the format of your RMT :)
 

Ryu Shimazu

Smash Master
Joined
Nov 5, 2009
Messages
4,234
Location
Alabama
NNID
Ryushimmy
3DS FC
5000-5048-5681
Thank you ^^ it is something to think about, I was actually going to use Gengar, but then someone suggested Jolteon.. I've never really looked at him and saw...wow he isn't bad at all.
Scizor/Heatran os Gyara/Jolt..hard to choose =(

One problem I did notice if I changed that though is three pokemon would be weak to fire, as well as three to ground. I could just take off Lucario for a Gengar, but I don't know how well he'd cover against a Mixmence. I have no fears that Latias could, and Latias is strong. Hmmmm.
Latias @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
Timid
6HP/252Special Attack/252Speed
- Draco Meteor
- (three other coverage moves I can't come up with, got school soon)

Anyways, I could replace something with Latias. Not Azelf, and Lucario could be, I think. Though with him, fighting coverage goes away.
All else fails I could hope Gyara could take a hit and ice fang, lol...
 

kirbyraeg

Smash Hero
Joined
Nov 18, 2008
Messages
6,440
Location
in Makai
the big thing about having all those weaknesses is that they bait switch-ins for your other pokemon. The ground type weaknesses go to mence (which doesn't hurt as much since azelf can USUALLY keep rocks off the field while not instantly dying like aerodactyl), and your fire type weaknesses funnel nicely into heatran. Even when those are gone, the rest of your team can cover those hits relatively well (scizor is neutral to ground, azelf is also neutral to ground, and both can u-turn out of threats that come in to deal with them).
 

Circa

Smash Champion
Joined
Feb 6, 2009
Messages
2,874
Location
Three Rivers, MI
NNID
timssu
3DS FC
1891-2120-4792
Azelf is immune to ground. :\ And Kirby, I think you forgot that this team is meant for Wi-Fi. Iirc, Rotom forms aren't allowed on Wi-Fi.

Jolly on LO DDGyara. The LO takes out any needs you might have for the usual Adamant when running Leftovers, so you're free to go with the extra speed granted from Jolly.

I wouldn't get rid of Jolteon. I mean, it might just be the way I'd play it, but switching Jolteon into something early-game that it can easily OHKO, and then baton passing immediately to scout its counters (which they'll more than likely send in, considering they don't want to lose anything early on) would work golden with your current team, as between Tyranitar (or Scizor, which will be mentioned later) and Lucario you can take on many of Jolteon's counters.

SpecsJolt's Thunderbolt can OHKO Mence after SR, so I wouldn't worry quite as much about MixMence. DDMence, however, could be an issue. You only have one priority user, and it's on what's meant to be your main sweeper. As for what to do about it, I don't know. I'm not really seeing how much Tyranitar helps out your team to be honest, especially when considering you're running two LO users that don't resist SS and are also weak to SR. You might as well just make them commit suicide. I'd advise getting rid of Tyranitar and putting Scizor in. You're still going to have to sac something to DDMence (granted, with Mence you just about have to no matter what to begin with), but as long as you can sac it to an Outrage (Gyara does a good job of letting this happen), then you can bring in Scizor and beat it down with BP. But once again that's just what I'd do, as I don't really see what your Tyranitar is doing for the team that Scizor can't do as well.

Oh yeah, and adding Scizor gets rid of the 3x Ground weakness and means less Sandstorm is seen. If you can tell me what exactly Tyranitar does for the team that Scizor can't though, then I take back what I said.

Also, for names. Change Gyara to Charybdis and name Mence Scylla. It makes more sense that way. :)
 

kirbyraeg

Smash Hero
Joined
Nov 18, 2008
Messages
6,440
Location
in Makai
Azelf is immune to ground. :\ And Kirby, I think you forgot that this team is meant for Wi-Fi. Iirc, Rotom forms aren't allowed on Wi-Fi.

Jolly on LO DDGyara. The LO takes out any needs you might have for the usual Adamant when running Leftovers, so you're free to go with the extra speed granted from Jolly.

I wouldn't get rid of Jolteon. I mean, it might just be the way I'd play it, but switching Jolteon into something early-game that it can easily OHKO, and then baton passing immediately to scout its counters (which they'll more than likely send in, considering they don't want to lose anything early on) would work golden with your current team, as between Tyranitar (or Scizor, which will be mentioned later) and Lucario you can take on many of Jolteon's counters.

SpecsJolt's Thunderbolt can OHKO Mence after SR, so I wouldn't worry quite as much about MixMence. DDMence, however, could be an issue. You only have one priority user, and it's on what's meant to be your main sweeper. As for what to do about it, I don't know. I'm not really seeing how much Tyranitar helps out your team to be honest, especially when considering you're running two LO users that don't resist SS and are also weak to SR. You might as well just make them commit suicide. I'd advise getting rid of Tyranitar and putting Scizor in. You're still going to have to sac something to DDMence (granted, with Mence you just about have to no matter what to begin with), but as long as you can sac it to an Outrage (Gyara does a good job of letting this happen), then you can bring in Scizor and beat it down with BP. But once again that's just what I'd do, as I don't really see what your Tyranitar is doing for the team that Scizor can't do as well.

Oh yeah, and adding Scizor gets rid of the 3x Ground weakness and means less Sandstorm is seen. If you can tell me what exactly Tyranitar does for the team that Scizor can't though, then I take back what I said.

Also, for names. Change Gyara to Charybdis and name Mence Scylla. It makes more sense that way. :)
yup, I forgot lol. My only way I've stayed in touch with pokemon past gen 1 at all is by getting into shoddy fairly recently...I've only played red/blue/yellow, and I guess it shows in moments like this as well as forgetting that azelf has levitate :p

these suggestions make a lot of sense too though, I just think that jolteon doesn't offer as great of synergy with the rest of the team as would heatran (then again, lack of rotom-formes calls that into question as well).
 

Terywj [태리]

Charismatic Maknae~
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You're gonna want U-Turn on Azelf. It's one of the best moves Azelf can utilize.

Everything else looks good. And as Writer said run Jolly on Gyarados.

-Terywj
 

Ryu Shimazu

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Okay, a few questions. I was considering the Latias idea during school today, and towards the end Weavile, but god Weavile has too many weaknesses. I was thinking one of them could replace Lucario, but I like this. I love Tyranitar, but Sandstorm outside of a Sandstorm team can be hazardous. Especially when the majority of the pokemon don't want it. So... I can use Scizor over Tyranitar, which I do like a lot more.

The only questions I have is, I assume Jolly on Lucario too? Also..this isn't battle related but.. wasn't Scylla a sea monster? I can see Charybdis for Gyarados but Scylla for Salamence? I may be completely wrong, but just wondering. Thanks for all the help =D

Also, was just wondering, what do you think about Weavile? If used over Scizor, it could be a great counter to dragons. Although, he is fragile and has many weaknesses. Just wondering.
 

Circa

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I'd personally run Jolly Lucario, but I've never used Lucario (just doesn't strike my fancy), so I can't tell you what nature to run it exactly. I'm assuming that after an SD the Jolly nature would be better, but I'm not entirely sure.

Oh snap, you're right. Scylla's now the name of a rock too (thus, 'between a rock and a hard place'), so I always thought that Scylla was a monster that sat on top of a rock; on the opposite side of Charybdis. Sooo...you can see why I changed the names like I did. :\ You're right though.

Name Salamence Albi! :D Apart from that, I've got nothin'.
 

Ryu Shimazu

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What would you think of using Weavile to replace Ttar? I hear a lot of negative things on him, so I'm curious...
And what's Albi?
 

Ryu Shimazu

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Albi lol.

Yeah and Weavile fits wrath so well too, but couldn't he be fast enough to ohko a Salamence? The only reason I asked was because of that.
 

Ryu Shimazu

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Yeah I guess I'm going with Scizor; Weavile is just too fragile in the end. I'd rather sacrifice a pokemon and let Scizor kill to a DDMence than have a pokemon on my team with 6 (or more I don't know) weaknesses and the ability to die faster than...whatever is fast >_>.
 

Ryu Shimazu

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Choice Banding. If I replaced Scizor with it, it could counter any dragon that isn't kingdra, but then again, what else could it do. I do like low kick, but having dark moves isn't something I'd die for. It's a hard thing to say, I really like both of them, and I'd like to do Weavile, but he seems to get a lot of hate. On one hand I really like Technician + Priority and Scizor's great typing, on the other I like Weaviles Speed paired with attack and ability to take out the Salamence threat. Ugh.
 

Ryu Shimazu

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Yeah better to Sac a pokemon and cleanup with Scizor than have a Weavile and loose. They need to make Weavile just dark >_>. Oh well, thanks for all the help, I think I've got it figured out now. It's going to be funny out of the 7 teams I think Scizor will be in 3~4 of them XD.
 

xLeafybug =D

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You have gyara, luke, and Jolt so you're not really all that dragon weak. Weavile isn't a necessity to your team, because you don't have a dragon weakness. CB Scizor is a far better option.
 

Reigned

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As you mentoined that Salamence can destroy your team, but when you play the team safely and execute what you should properly. Your team doesn't have an answer to Zapdos and a +1 Stone Edge can still KO Gyarados after Stealth Rocks so please put that over ThunderPunch. Specs Jolt is terrible in this metagame but Life Orb is still very solid, so swapping items with the same movesets/Evs and nature (Or Charge Beam/TBolt/HPGrass or Ice and Shadow ball). Also, Band Tyranitar is outdated so you should switch it to the omnipresent Scarf version or go with Scizor for yet another answer to Salamence while retaining your ability to trap both Gengar and Latias.
Hope I helped!
 
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