Sonic help

[PK Webb]

Sorry from being away from the boards so long with school and what not i've really haven't had much time. But im still trying to refine my sheik, anyways i have a question about a sonic match up. How do you deal with his Fair and Bair and is he gimpable???? because i have difficulty fighting him. I have a vid of my attempt to beat the best sonic player i know but it doesn't go well for me so could i please get some advice???

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ixoU3rwlZvk

 

[__V]

Stop walking into the ****.

Sonic's aerials are really obvious. Wait for him to attack, and then punish the hell out of him. This guy knows how to power-shield extremely well, so don't start off with needles. Start off by getting the heck out of the way.

Don't just jab. Jab to grab. The Ftilt locking was good. More.

Tether = BAD. Sonic's fast enough to screw that up. Only tether when he isn't close enough to get in the way.

Grab/release him out of his up+B. He loses his recovery and falls to his death.

 

[SinkingHigher]

Yeah, and develop your spacing. You just keep running at him over and over.

Keep your eye on Sonic instead of Sheik and I guarantee your spacing and reaction times will improve.

I think this is probably your main problem. You get hit too much, thus you die too often. So don't get hit - dont run into his attacks. You seem like you think of a move and just try to do it no matter what. Focus on him. Learn how to block dodge and counter.

At 1:46 you tethered for some reason when from that point a Vanish could have landed you on the stage.

You don't really know when to use moves.

I noticed a few times he was above you or descending, and you vanished away. Clearly this is the perfect opportunity for a Usmash tipper.

When you go off stage you ignore sonic completely and focus only on recovering. Hit him to get some room THEN recover. Otherwise he'll just keep knocking you down.

I saw little to no edge-guarding. You're waiting for him to get up to some ridiculous %age and then n-air or d-smash. Edgeguaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrdddd. You need to do it if you're going to win.

 

[Tezmata]

Your dash attack seemed to betray you quite a few times. Either you're not fully comfortable with where it's going to hit or you were just having an off day, but you fell just a tiny bit short several times and Sonic punished you for it.

And there wasn't nearly enough grabbing at all.

The obvious tether thing is to not use the chain to tether if Sonic is already holding on to the edge. The not-so-obvious-but-still-important thing is to really not use tether much at all against a Sonic.

And if you miss a d-smash (completely miss it, not just that the opponent puts up a shield), you're going to be punished for it because of its long animation. This Sonic realized it too.

 

[PK Webb]

I do F tilt but his spring usually gets him out after the third tilt. I will try and space more. i didn't know that if you grab him he just dies Thanks alot. Ummm my problem with the edge guarding is he can just homing attack me and if i hit him he just uses his ridiculous up b and gets on stage before me. I will try all of the advice thanks

 

[Tenki]

step 1: master chain usage.
step 2: pick a level with a nonmoving low platform (battlefield)
step 3: go under the platform, use side-B and sweetspot chain until he suicides out of frustration
step 4: ???
step 5: profit

 

[Zankoku]

True enough, Spring is the only thing Sonic has that can penetrate Chain, and if you're standing under a platform...

 

[Tenki]

RyokoYaksa pulled that off on me in a green conn (sliiiight lag) wifi match.

I would have cried inside if I had to go up against that irl.

 

[-Zure-]

Something tells me you wanted to do Sheik's dash cancel instead of the running attack which would have thrown Sonic off the stage or at least at the edge most of the time. Don't try doing that so often. Especially not in Wi-Fi matches with input lag.

More grabbing. Sonic players have a tendency to grab often because of his running speed and combo-ability. Hence they are likely to shield grab instead of spot dodge and counter. You get the point. Grabbing Sonic gives Sheik herself the opportunity to do some nice follow ups, like U-Air into F-Air and so forth.

Do not retract the chain if it fails. Try waiting for Sonic to come closer to use the chain lock or "sparkle" him away if he jumps to avoid that. Only then you are save to retract it without getting punished. No chain usage to edge guard by the way. B-Air and F-Air work a lot better.

I have also seen some attempts to Vanish Glide. Even if it worked, it would have missed many times because Sonic was too far away. I mean, one time he was above the moving platform and you attempted to Vanish Glide below it...

You didn't seem to space enough. A simple short hopped F-Air does wonders in defensive play. And what about the needles? Only a few in the beginning? Charge them up sometimes. Racking up damage with Sheik is essential if you are not willing to use Zelda for finishing moves.

Yah, that's it.

 

[choknater]

sheik... having trouble... against... sonic....

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[PK Webb]

LOL no not sheik just me don't worry choknater

 

[choknater]

o haha ok my bad

 

[Tristan_win]

First off,

Sonic is low tier on every stage but flat that don't have many platforms, on mainly flat stages a good sonic will **** you up if your not careful. With that said you weren't careful.

What I usually do when I fight Sonics is explore the holes he has in his approach game and go from there while using the chain only when I think he's just about to "jump into the ****". Needless to say the chain completely ***** Sonic and if used under a non moving platform perfectly sonic has ZERO options left beside hoping you will **** up.

Whenever Sonic goes into his ball like state on the ground he has many options of approach the best way to counter this is by throwing a single needle to stop him. The reason single is bolded is because there's a good chance that if he goes into the air that the lag from throwing multiple needles will leave you open for a attack.

Now if you can't throw any needles or you are too close to throw needles but your not in grab range then just shield. Sonic's attacks are fast but will always leave him open after they finish if you predict him right/wait long enough. The only exception for this is if he start the ball like state in the air since he can cancel it into a grab, which completely ***** hiding in your shield.

Basically the best way to deal with a sonic though is just ftilting them away as he approaches you from the ball like state. I'm fairly sure the ftilt beats it no matter how long he hold it if you are far away enough. Trust me on this, if I could ftilt Sonic's away online then you should be able to do is as well especially offline.

Well I have a 13 hour shift in 4 hours so I'm gonna go end it with that. If I manage to think up anything else really worth note that everyone else hasn't already like your dash attacking then I'll edit my post later on tonight.

By the way, Sonic vs Sheik matches are always fun as hell to watch ^-^

 

[Browny]

step 1: master chain usage.
step 2: pick a level with a nonmoving low platform (battlefield)
step 3: go under the platform, use side-B and sweetspot chain until he suicides out of frustration
step 4: ???
step 5: profit

i think if that happened, id just go to another platform and spam side taunt until the sheik player suicides out of frustration :D

 

[Tenki]

i think if that happened, id just go to another platform and spam side taunt until the sheik player suicides out of frustration :D

oh crap, I shoulda done that. ;__; I was too shocked to think about it.

 

[The Great Leon]

i just never stop throwing needles. idk if ive played ****ty people or all sonics suck in general, but he has no projectile and ****ty approaches. im not that good either. needle camp.

 

[PK Webb]

Actually i found my solution beside needle camping that does work for a while. Zelda. At about 90% switch to zelda sheild his Fair and up smash. Works everytime its beautiful.

 

[Tenki]

i just never stop throwing needles. idk if ive played ****ty people or all sonics suck in general, but he has no projectile and ****ty approaches. im not that good either. needle camp.

This.

There's a solution called jump.

and a somewhat more complicated solution called spinshot.

Unless it was wifi, because Sonic runs into like, every projectile online.

 

[ShadowLink84]

Basically trying to camp Sonic is like trying to shoot a jet with a bow and arrow.

You'er better off trying to Zone him and taking advantage of your close range combat skills rather than far range.

Tenki just side taunt ryoko next time.

only if you're up in percentage if not stock.

 

[Zankoku]

Ryoko's a patient person and all he does on Wifi is either experiment with various little things, or prove why he dislikes the game on a competitive level.

He also hasn't been playing Brawl lately, I believe.