So with the Announcement of TLOC, This also raises Questions.

[Da_Shmo]

So there have been talks among certain people, That Twitch has been actively denying PM streamers Sub buttons, Even the ones who would get it from streaming other games. There were no facts or anything for this basis, except for word of mouth. However, Recent events have come to light, Including the TLOC Situation

http://www.reddit.com/r/SSBPM/comments/31ye4q/announcing_project_m_central_new_collaboration_by/

This furthers the idea that Twitch streamers, are actively not being able to get a sub button, and TLOC has gotten the strong arm for them to do this.

Also, this screenshot has surfaced

http://puu.sh/h6Ueu/7ce141774b.png

https://twitter.com/Dom_Smash/status/586013748508434432
(apparently TK deleted his response http://puu.sh/h6W8z/8c4f5aaa00.jpg)

Which could or could not be real, but I have on good terms that this was screenshoted from TK's Sub only skype chat.

This is not a witch hunt, This is just a concerned PM fan, trying to get to the bottom of this situation.

Easy ways to disprove this?
Show me a PM only streamer that has gotten a Sub button in the past few months ( Thats not a tourney streamer )
Or an official statement from anyone that has any say in the matter.

 

[Sol-]

This is getting ridiculous...we need a final consensus on this situation, no more of this limbo PR response ****

 

[Da_Shmo]

Look, I just want a real answer. Not some "lets hide everything from everyone."

 

[SlashStarEX]

deIlluminati

 

[Seikaret]

PM ISDEAD?
i hope not.

 

[Potatomochii]

Unconstitutional.

 

[InitialK]

#FreeProjectM

 

[Lex__]

Make sure to unsub from tourney locator, show your opinion with money.

 

[KinGly]

Umm... Maybe they're just making a pm only channel to... I don't know, stream pm, that game we all love.

But no, yall are right, they hate pm and sakurai gave Infinity $10000000000 to stop streaming it, and Infinity is now gathering a small army to destroy the PMDT.

 

[GP&B]

But they're already streaming PM which is why the decision is questionable to begin with.

That being said, I'd rather have this pan out before jumping to conclusions.

 

[Da_Shmo]

Umm... Maybe they're just making a pm only channel to... I don't know, stream pm, that game we all love.

But no, yall are right, they hate pm and sakurai gave Infinity $10000000000 to stop streaming it, and Infinity is now gathering a small army to destroy the PMDT.

They only streamed PM, or atleast thats all they got viewers for. Why would they move to a new channel when 80%+ of their viewers and subs are there for PM..why not make a new channel for Melee? Because Twitch?

 

[Omega Male]

I can't see any other reason for moving, *cough* sorry I mean "centralizing" the community. Its the same reason VGBC did it as well. No streaming PM on partnered channels. There would be no reason to make another channel for the exact same thing consider 90% of what they do and have worked their viewership towards is PM. It would make more sense for the fans and for them to keep it as is. Just my thoughts though. I'm not adamant about this but I don't want to ignore what seems to obviously be in front of us. You guys can stay naive if you want though.

 

[Zigludo]

I only ever really watched TLOC for PM content, because frankly the only really elite Melee player in DFW is Wobbles, whereas the Texas scene boasts lots of top level PM players.

I'll put it this way: I'm canceling my subscription to TLoc since they won't be providing content that I'm interested in any more (just like I did with VGBC.) I have already followed this new channel, though, and will be tuning in for the weeklies and Bowser's Revenge this weekend and any future PM tourneys streamed there (Paragon LA, anyone?) IF this new stream obtains a sub button (which is something I think we should all be interested in accomplishing), then I will also definitely subscribe to the new channel. But I'm done giving any attention to TLoc's channel.

 

[erasmorpheous]

If there's no quality drop, then whatever.

If there's a quality drop, :/

 

[Ageha]

There have been multiple things that have been covered up for no reason. This isn't the first time that Project M has been subject to this "hush hush" attitude. Just answering simple questions should not be this difficult.

 

[Bazkip]

TLOC is almost certainly being pressured into making this decision since it would be completely illogical for them to make it themselves out of fear of possible repercussions, since their growth is almost exclusively due to Project M they'd just be shooting themselves in the foot. The vagueness on the part of Infinity in that post all but confirms this.

The only candidate for the source of that is of course Twitch since Nintendo wouldn't go to streams individually, they'd just put the pressure on Twitch itself to pass on to it's partners. However, it's also entirely possible that Twitch hasn't received any notice from Nintendo but does fear the possibility, they are in a position to do that since PM is just a drop in the bucket for them.

There's really no way to tell though, and no way we'll be told since they're not allowed to talk about it. So yet again we just have to sit in the dark and speculate :\

I don't think TLOC are the bad guys, they've just been put in an unfortunate situation. I'm disappointed but at least they're trying to work around it, unlike VGBC.

 

[Zigludo]

If there's no quality drop, then whatever.

If there's a quality drop, :/

Non-partnered channels don't have video quality options, so there will be that downgrade, at the very least

 

[MegaMissingno]

There's so many questions and the fact that they won't clarify anything only raises more. Remember when GIMR said he was gonna move his vids to another channel?

Maybe they're telling the truth and this new channel will turn out to be a great thing, but it's hard for me to just trust that on blind faith. It just seems fishy and the lack of transparency doesn't help reassure me.

 

[MechWarriorNY]

Assume the negative, hope for the positive.

 

[Roxas215]

If there's no quality drop, then whatever.

If there's a quality drop, :/

Of course theres gonna be a quality drop. They wont be able to get any money now.

It's obvious whats going on. Twitch is not allowing any partnered channels to stream PM Content. Now i do think it's great that execpt for just abanoning PM like vgbc did they are trying to find a altentive for the pm content. But lets not be naive. The quaility will drop because they wont be able to get subs.


Just another bullet in the chest for PM fans.

 

[Omega Male]

Of course theres gonna be a quality drop. They wont be able to get any money now.

It's obvious whats going on. Twitch is not allowing any partnered channels to stream PM Content. Now i do think it's great that execpt for just abanoning PM like vgbc did they are trying to find a altentive for the pm content. But lets not be naive. The quaility will drop because they wont be able to get subs.


Just another bullet in the chest for PM fans.

Exactly

 

[Helsong]

Patreon is an option that's been used by multiple content creators in the past. It especially got a boost once Youtube instituted some pretty bad content policing policies. Why don't content creators in Smash use this...like, at all? Money goes directly to them, they can keep streaming, and we can support those that support the game we love.

 

[jhipster]

It's not like people can't stream whatever they want, but why is everyone so afraid to just say why? It's insulting to our intelligence to pretend like we are just going to accept these lame pat answers.

Make sure to unsub from tourney locator, show your opinion with money.

Done.

 

[W.A.C.]

I really wish TLOC would be blunt about whether or not this has anything to do with pressure from Nintendo or Twitch. This is not like them, but it's clear something is up. At least they're still trying to support the Project M community, unlike the backstabbers at VGBC.

 

[Keman]

And I just subbed during the Junebug MM at aftershock. Tloc seems to really like PM. maybe they "had" to do this separate channel thing because of pressure from D1/Gimr/Twitch who knows. Id like to think that they would have PM content on their main channel if they felt like they could. I will probably unsub just because some of that money goes towards twitch. and Id rather not support the fact that PM has to be on an off stream, whether it's a TLOC or Twitch decision. I will probably donate some maybe threw the new channel if that is an option to support them.

I know Messi recently created a separate channel for the Salt Mines Podcast too (I kind of thought PM content might be one thing that was hurting his partnership chance).

I think the worst part is all the silence about the situation. I guess we need to remember they probably all have C&D's / NDA's in place and stuff preventing people from talking about it, but it still sucks.

One thing I want to note is to not forget that its all bad news lately, paragon has broken the mold and turned away from mysterious shunning of PM. They even said Tloc having PM at aftershock really helped give the confidence to include PM at Paragon. http://www.reddit.com/r/SSBPM/comments/31s2xp/paragon_los_angeles_2015_ontario_california_2000/
(I hope Paragon making this moves helps other realize this as a real possibilty)

 

[Deleted member]

lmao the best part of this is like 2 weeks ago i was hanging out at strongbad's place with bec bwett disafter and i was popping off about how much i hate esports and how gimr sold out and betrayed his own. at least the new channel says something out than "im out bitchess thx for you cash" from a business standpoint. really glad our group down here isn't like that.

i really, really, really, really hate esports.

 

[epicmartin7]

Er... this thread was to serve a different purpose (and can't copy and paste the entire post due to the Wii U Internet Browser's limitation), but it does include what is going on in the PM community as a whole (and my useless opinion )... http://smashboards.com/threads/the-situation-we-face-copied-post-from-pm-subreddit.398322/.

 

[Omega Male]

There is most likely a very heavy NDA on either twitch or Nintendo's side so I seriously doubt TLoc will admit why they are doing so.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

But they're already streaming PM which is why the decision is questionable to begin with.

That being said, I'd rather have this pan out before jumping to conclusions.

This is what I think and will be doing for now.

Not gonna assume anything til I hear more.

 

[Fortress]

I like playing Project M~

 

[Da_Shmo]

So still no response from anyone. That NDA must be strong.

 

[TreK]

Has this become Project NDA ?
And here we were afraid it would become Project C&D
How silly of us.

 

[Roxas215]

As long as PMDT continues to update and work on this project im fine. It sucks about the tournament/stream exposure though.

Like honestly MUGEN streams have subs and is even listed as it's own game. But PM can't?? Lol thats ass backwards.

 

[DrLobster]

Has this become Project NDA ?
And here we were afraid it would become Project C&D
How silly of us.

"This is the way the world ends
Not with a bang, but with a whimper."

 

[Bleck]

I like playing Project M~

me too dude, me too

 

[Sundark]

TLOC isn't abandoning PM. They're compromising. From the way they present their secondary PM channel, they're hoping to make it much more than just a compromise. They're sidestepping an enormous problem and, I think, pivoting it into a bigger gain. Anybody who's followed TLoc for a while will know they love their PM, they're not going to give it up without a fight, but they're not going to foolishly fight battles they can't win. My two cents.

 

[SOJ]

TLOC isn't abandoning PM. They're compromising. From the way they present their secondary PM channel, they're hoping to make it much more than just a compromise. They're sidestepping an enormous problem and, I think, pivoting it into a bigger gain. Anybody who's followed TLoc for a while will know they love their PM, they're not going to give it up without a fight, but they're not going to foolishly fight battles they can't win. My two cents.

^Pretty much this. Everyone over-reacted because there's a lot of stuff people are scared to talk about, but by no means does TLOC have bad intentions with this second channel. In fact they've already started using it to host other PM channels and help support the scene. They'll be able to stream only PM on that channel without having to swap to Melee or Smash 4 during their events, so you'll get to see more of what you love. The situation really sucks but they're making the most of it.

 

[DrinkingFood]

I don't think that's the issue most people have though. The issue is why, with this kind of outcry, is nobody saying anything whatsoever at all. All we've heard is a bunch of garbage on how "This is intended to help", when really it's a PR nightmare, and occasionally "It's the best we can do". But never any mentioned of who initiated this or why. If there's an NDA that tight on them, why is it not safe to feel as if the goal of getting PM off major streams and preventing anyone from talking about it is to kill it? If anything getting mad about it shows we're vocal and won't go down easy. If Nintendo wants silence, then just thanking our TLoc lords that they didn't go the way of VGBC then sitting down and thinking "Wow, thank goodness we were all interned at PMCentral!" is exactly the way you slowly let something die

 

[MegaMissingno]

Yeah, if this is something NDAs forced them to do, that's all the more reason to worry.

 

[waygu]

Why is hosting other channels on twitch supposed to mean anything? Like ayy lmao we have absolutely no content for you go to this other stream but make sure to sub