Smashed vs Tilted Specials

[Indigo Jeans]

I'm trying to compile a list of all specials that change in some way when they are smash input as opposed to tilt input, and to document the differences. I have a feeling most if not all of them are side specials though so that should help narrow it down. Also, tilting vs smashing a special makes no difference toward fully charged effects of the special (a tilted fully charged special will deal the same damage/have the same range and a smashed fully charged special). Help me!

In no particular order-

Diddy Kong

• Monkey Flip / Back Flip / Flying Monkey Flip
  • Smash input: Greater horizontal jump distance, possibly greater speed
  • Tilt input: Lesser horizontal jump distance, possibly lesser speed
• Banana Peel (special toss)
  • Smash input: 6.15% point blank, greater horizontal and vertical toss distance
  • Tilt input: 4.7% point blank, lesser horizontal and vertical toss distance
• Shocking Banana Peel (special toss)
  • Smash input: 5.3% point blank, greater horizontal and vertical toss distance
  • Tilt input: 4.4% point blank, lesser horizontal and vertical toss distance
• Battering Banana Peel (special toss)
  • Smash input: 7.05% point blank, greater vertical toss distance
  • Tilt input: 5.4% point blank, lesser vertical toss distance

Pikachu

• Skull Bash
  • Smash input: 9.6% damage uncharged, greater travel distance, possibly greater speed
  • Tilt input: 6.15% uncharged, lesser travel distance, possibly lesser speed
• Shocking Skull Bash
  • Smash input: 7 hits, 8.9% total damage uncharged, greater travel distance, possibly greater speed
  • Tilt input: 7 hits, 7.3% total damage uncharged, lesser travel distance, possibly lesser speed
• Heavy Skull Bash
  • Smash input: 15.4% > 10.2% > 5.1% > 2% uncharged, lesser travel distance, possibly lesser speed
  • Tilt input: 6.8% > 4.5% > 2.2% > 0.875% uncharged, greater travel distance, possibly greater speed

For some reason, uncharged tilted Heavy Skull Bash travels the farthest, then uncharged smashed Heavy Skull Bash, then fully charged Heavy Skull Bash travels the same distance whether tilted or smashed

Mii Swordsman

• Airborne Assault
  • Smash input: 10.6% uncharged, greater travel distance, possibly greater speed
  • Tilt input: 7.2% uncharged, lesser travel distance, possibly lesser speed
• Chakram
  • Smash input: 6.5%, greater toss distance
  • Tilt input: 1.1% ×7 on grounded targets, 4% on aerial targets, lesser toss distance

Mii Brawler

• Burning Dropkick
  • Smash input: 13.1% uncharged, greater travel distance
  • Tilt input: 10.15% uncharged, lesser travel distance

Duck Hunt

• Clay Shooting / Rising Clay / Clay Break
  • Smash input: Greater toss distance, possibly greater speed
  • Tilt input: Lesser toss distance, possibly lesser speed

Luigi

• Green Missile
  • Smash input: 9.5% uncharged, reaches full charge slightly sooner
  • Tilt input: 6.15% uncharged, reaches full charge slightly later

King Dedede

• Gordo Throw (intial hit)
  • Smash input: Generally, greater toss distance horizontally and a lesser distance vertically
  • Tilt input: Generally, lesser toss distance horizontally and a greater distance vertically

I haven't tested smashed vs tilted Gordo Throw when knocking back a reflected Gordo.

Link

• Gale Boomerang / Boomerang / Ripping Boomerang
  • Smash input: Greater travel distance
  • Tilt input: Lesser travel distance

Toon Link

• Boomerang / Floating Boomerang / High-Speed Boomerang
  • Smash input: Greater travel distance
  • Tilt input: Lesser travel distance

Pikmin Throw throws Pikmin farther when smash input, and the Links' Boomerangs fly farther when smash input, but I'm tired and want to go to sleep so I'll format that tomorrow.

 

[Kofu]

The Mii Brawler's Burning Dropkick can have its charge boosted by a smash input. The same goes for Luigi's Green Missile.

 

[FirstaLasto]

Samus' side special is probably the most well known one, since homing missiles and super missiles look completely different (since Brawl, at least). I assume you've left her out because its so well known that it goes without saying...?

Or are you just going through the characters in some specific order and haven't reached her yet?

 

[Leonyx]

Samus' side special is probably the most well known one, since homing missiles and super missiles look completely different (since Brawl, at least). I assume you've left her out because its so well known that it goes without saying...?

Or are you just going through the characters in some specific order and haven't reached her yet?

Mii Gunner's missiles work the same way. Just thought I'd mention it in case this also gets missed.

 

[Zapp Branniglenn]

I once asked the Pikachu subforum about side B out of curiosity. They said that smashing Side B gives you a partial charge immediately. But taking another look, that doesn't seem correct. The charge time on both versions seem consistent. Furthermore, I don't think Pikachu gets any different FAF on hit or miss with the two versions. It begs the question why would you not smash the move?

 

[MrTeddyBear]

Diddy Kong's Banana Toss travels further when smashed, whether you were already carrying the banana or not.

 

[Indigo Jeans]

The Mii Brawler's Burning Dropkick can have its charge boosted by a smash input. The same goes for Luigi's Green Missile.

Thanks for the heads up Tofu!

Samus' side special is probably the most well known one, since homing missiles and super missiles look completely different (since Brawl, at least). I assume you've left her out because its so well known that it goes without saying...?

Or are you just going through the characters in some specific order and haven't reached her yet?

Mii Gunner's missiles work the same way. Just thought I'd mention it in case this also gets missed.

Yeah I'm not gonna mention neither Samus's nor Gunner's missiles since those go without saying.

I once asked the Pikachu subforum about side B out of curiosity. They said that smashing Side B gives you a partial charge immediately. But taking another look, that doesn't seem correct. The charge time on both versions seem consistent. Furthermore, I don't think Pikachu gets any different FAF on hit or miss with the two versions. It begs the question why would you not smash the move?

I know that for Luigi, a smash input Green Missile actually reaches full charge around 8-10F sooner than a tilt input one, but I didn't notice anything like that with any of the Skull Bash variations. I'm going to do some recordings tonight though to get accurate numbers.

Also, I originally entertained the notion that smash inputting a special just "accidentally" gave it a non-zero charge, but the fact that tilt inputting them can give damage outputs lower than their base damages in mastercore makes me doubt this. For example, in mastercore, Heavy Skull Bash's damage outputs were 15% / 10% / 5% / 2% when uncharged. Meanwhile, a tilt input uncharged Heavy Skull Bash deals 15.4% / 10.2% / 5.1% / 2% uncharged. While it is true that mastercore is still at v1.0.4., I really doubt that decimal adjustments would have been made to the hitboxes, and I really REALLY doubt that POSITIVE decimal adjustments would have been made.

Furthermore, an increase of nearly 8% from a tilt input to a smash input seems unlikely, especially considering that even if a smashed HSB reaches full charge sooner, it only does so in 1-2F.

On the other hand, they both have the same damage output at full charge, so either a tilted HSB's damage scales more rapidly with charge time, or a smashed HSB scales more slowly.

In any case, it's really weird. Mastercore normally gives base (minimum) damages for charge-based hitboxes (PK Flash), so if anything, the 6.8% hitbox is the one that should be in the game files, not the 15% one.

I don't really think there ever is any reason to tilt a special rather than smash it, except maybe Pikmin Throw for accuracy.

Diddy Kong's Banana Toss travels further when smashed, whether you were already carrying the banana or not.

Are you talking about when you throw a Banana with the A button? Because if so that's just a case of normal tossing versus smash tossing.

 

[Player-1]

No he's talking about the banana pluck, smash banana pluck and tilted banana pluck both travel different distances.

 

[Kofu]

Did a few more miscellaneous testing, all negative for Diddy Kong's Up-B, Link's grounded Up-B, and ROB's Down-B (this one might be fractionally faster to charge, it probably isn't and if it is it probably isn't worth documenting).

That's all I got.

 

[Leonyx]

Link and Toon Link's boomerangs move farther on smashed inputs. Are you only looking for changes to charged Side-B's?

 

[MrTeddyBear]

Link and Toon Link's boomerangs move farther on smashed inputs. Are you only looking for changes to charged Side-B's?

He already mentioned them at the end of the original post.

 

[Sinister Slush]

I was gonna list Yoshi's neutral B but then noticed it was Smash c stick not tilt c stick.

 

[Kofu]

I was gonna list Yoshi's neutral B but then noticed it was Smash c stick not tilt c stick.

But the difference in Egg Throw distance would he notable, yes?

 

[Leonyx]

He already mentioned them at the end of the original post.

My mistake, didn't even see that.

 

[Sinister Slush]

There's a difference? Haven't tested anything yet for Yoshi but mostly meant this for tilted c stick giving more distance for Neutral B.

 

[Kofu]

There's a difference? Haven't tested anything yet for Yoshi but mostly meant this for tilted c stick giving more distance for Neutral B.

That's actually really interesting since it's not normally possible to smash a neutral input. But yeah, smashing Egg Throw makes the eggs go farther than normal. I assume it's just second nature as a Yoshi main (or maybe you just always smash the input, IDK).

 

[Indigo Jeans]

Dedede's Gordo Throw is another one. Also Kofu, I tested smashed vs tilted Egg Throw and they travelled the same distance when I held back on the analogue stick and when I didn't adjust the trajectory at all. Did you maybe not hold the B button when tilted and did do so when smashing (wow that sentence came out weird).

Also Slush I'm not really sure what you're talking about. Do you mean a C-stick set to smash vs C-stick set to tilt? Because I'm checking specials that change when you enter their analogue stick input either as a tilt or a smash, like with Samus's missiles. I tried B-sticking Yoshi's neutral B so I could enter it as either a smash or a tilt and nothing seemed different.

 

[Kofu]

Dedede's Gordo Throw is another one. Also Kofu, I tested smashed vs tilted Egg Throw and they travelled the same distance when I held back on the analogue stick and when I didn't adjust the trajectory at all. Did you maybe not hold the B button when tilted and did do so when smashing (wow that sentence came out weird).

I was going to test Dedede's Gordo Throw but thought, they wouldn't give it multiple input variations. Guess I was wrong. Also, yeah, I thought the difference in distance from Egg Throw was from smashing the input, not from holding B. Sorry about that!

 

[Sinister Slush]

Well that's what I meant from my first post, there's gonna be no difference cause I misread the thread by the time I finished my wall of text initially lol