Smash bros needs more girls? Why

[jaytalks]

I make the economic argument because it's fairly objective and supported generally by the current direction of all media (not just gaming). Although gaming is a bit behind in some ways in this regard, the point is that gaming will have females in more prominent roles in most games in the near future.

As for the other arguments, generally you either believe in the importance of diversity in media or you don't. Conversing on a forum dedicated to video games is not likely to change that, Smash is a bit different since it also features robots, monsters, and genderless creations, as well as generally characters that lack clearly defined ethnicities. But that doesn't mean fans can't have aspirations for they want to see for the series.

As long as worth female characters are the ones that make it into the game, there is literally no downside for them being a character. It's important that we consider "worthy" can change; I admit in the past I said Rosalina is not a worthy candidate. I admit I was wrong about that distinction and my bet is most of this forum has also changed their position (no need to point out if you're against her inclusion still). I regret not seeing her value and there are plenty of other worthy female candidates that I'm probably not considering (mainly because I havent played their games).

 

[Knight Dude]

I've said this before and I'll say this again, doesn't matter to me and it shouldn't matter to many. I just want cool characters. Male, Female, Monster, Robots, and what have you. I mostly want Ridley, King K Rool, Little Mac and Dixie Kong myself actually. Also Dark Samus could make a really good semi-clone, but another Metroid character other than Ridley isn't all that likely, as awesome as it would be.

You know, I've been a large supporter of Palutena. She always seemed like the gimmie for the second Kid Icarus rep. But I realized something. Palutena wouldn't really bring anything to Smash Bros as a character that we don't already have. Another magic wielding chick in a dress. Rosalina and Zelda both seem to fit that bill. Sure she'd have a staff and green hair and she's got the quirky personality, but other than that... too similar. Plus, she really talks too much.

However.

Medusa would definitely bring something new to the roster: a female villain. We could definitely use one. She's got history on her side, as she is the original Kid Icarus villain from the NES days, and as far as I can recall, she's the only female Nintendo villain besides Wendy Koopa that isn't just a doppelganger (IE Dark Samus, and Ridley would be a superior 2nd Metroid rep anyway). For moveset, she's definitely got potential with her scepter, teleporting, laser eyes, snakes, magic projectiles, flight, and that transforming into a big floating cyclops head thing.

And visually, she'd be so amazing in HD. Look at her.

I'd be fine with either Palutena or Medusa is the roster, but think I might now prefer Snake Head.

I think Palutena is more likely though. But Medusa would be cool, her KI:U design is friggin awesome. Also, you should to look into some female bad guys. Look up someone named Captain Syrup from Wario. She isn't a doppelganger like Dark Samus(who I would pick as a third Metroid character). And I'd argue is a lot cooler than any Koopa Kid.

 

[The Light Music Club]

Ok, when I said Hyperdimension Neptunia I also said they needed a more Nintendoish version of it. What I meant by this was that it would be more family friendly.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Ok, when I said Hyperdimension Neptunia I also said they needed a more Nintendoish version of it. What I meant by this was that it would be more family friendly.

So basically an RPG?

Nintendo has lots of those!

 

[The Light Music Club]

So basically an RPG?

Nintendo has lots of those!

A game predominately female characters, but family friendly ones.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

A game predominately female characters, but family friendly ones.

http://stylesavvy.nintendo.com/

If you mean a more fantasy oriented series, there's always Metroid.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Oh hell yes, I would definitely love a Style Savvy character, a fashionista fighting using clothes is pretty ____ing hilarious IMO.

 

[Hong]

While I see the point your trying to make, you have to remember that Nintendo EAD also made incredibly strong and compelling female characters as well.

Like and among many others. Sure there are lots of examples of female being a character trait but there are several examples of strong female characters as well.

Brawl Zelda icon isn't working for some reason.

I full well respect Zelda. But Samus? She is dead to me.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I full well respect Zelda. But Samus? She is dead to me.

One bad game doesn't destroy a legacy son.

 

[Hong]

One bad game doesn't destroy a legacy

Sort of.

When I think about "Metroid", I get warm fuzzy feelings and memories of Super, Zero Mission and my favourite: Fusion.

When I think of "Samus", I can't help but think of Nintendo's questionable art submissions and Sakamoto's discomforting views on the meaning of the series.

 

[BloderModer]

More playable female characters would be cool. Gender representation in playable characters is a good thing, as long as the playable characters aren't representing their gender alone.
Nothing wrong with characters like Peach... and C Falcon, who are a little stereotypical, that's their character.

Great suggestions of Sami, Medusa, Barbara and Lyn!

 

[Superyoshiom]

I like how when Sakurai reveals Zelda he says that it's nice to get a bunch of female characters into the roster.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I like how when Sakurai reveals Zelda he says that it's nice to get a bunch of female characters into the roster.

He said something similar when he revealed in Brawl.

She was the only female newcomer....

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Well why don't we go back to what female characters we think are most likely? From most to least the three I can think of are Dixie Kong, Palutena and Krystal.

 

[ThatPersonGuy]

Anyone not named Dixie Kong, Palutena, heck maybe even Lip doesn't stand a chance.

Star Fox isn't getting a new game or character anytime soon.
We aren't getting any other main series Mario reps.
Palutena is the front runner for KI reps.

Anyone outside of that seems just a bit too farfetched. True, I was a bit set in the "Mario doesn't need a newcomer" mentality to see Rosalina's potential, but outside of that there isn't anything feasible. Any other female newcomers would be instantly classified as either undeserving or WTF.

 

[3Bismyname]

i could see characters like Tetra, Krystal or possibly even a Wario or Fire Emblem female. but Dixie and Palutena are the only ones i would put any serious stock into appearing playable.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

Smash Bros isn't the right place to market to female gamers

Then explain the loads of yaoi and fanfictions spawned from them.

 

[Lazurwolf]

Then explain the loads of yaoi and fanfictions spawned from them.

Smash Bros isn't the right place to market to female gamers

 

[Koopaul]

I don't know what that Neptunia whatever is, but remember this, just because you find something "insulting" or "offensive" doesn't necessarily make it wrong.

Creators of a work of entertainment or art should be able to create whatever they envision. With that said, Sakurai should be able to make this game however he wants.

Yeah that must sound odd coming from a guy who's criticized him before.

However we as consumers have a right to criticize and complain about his work but we gave no right to dictate his work.

 

[Pega-pony Princess]

Smash Bros isn't the right place to market to female gamers

The amount of girls that play fighting video games or consider themselves "hardcore" gamers, is extremely small

Hmm...Then please explain to me why I've spent over 500 hours playing super smash bros brawl. Granted, I haven't spent every waking moment playing it, but I consider that to mean something. I do enjoy playing it every once in awhile. Perhaps I'm being a bit defensive, but I can't help but be a tad insulted. There's more girls that play these games than you realize.

 

[KCCHIEFS27]

Hmm...Then please explain to me why I've spent over 500 hours playing super smash bros brawl. Granted, I haven't spent every waking moment playing it, but I consider that to mean something. I do enjoy playing it every once in awhile. Perhaps I'm being a bit defensive, but I can't help but be a tad insulted. There's more girls that play these games than you realize.

It's a ****ing fact. Of course some girls play it, that's not what I was saying. But to waste time marketing smash bros to girls would absolutely ******** on their part. Catering to girls would get a razor thin amount of extra females to play. Girls like you are buying the game no matter what

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Smash needs more females because honestly it's a total sausage fest and this is comming from a gay male. It's sad to know the only females in brawl are Samus, peach, Zelda, jigglypuff and Nana. That's like 5 out of 30 + male characters?

They did recently show Wii Fit Trainer and rosalina as playable. That's a good start but

They can easily add more important females like
-Palutena
-Dixie Kong
-Toon Zelda
-Krystal
-Lip
-Medusa(female and iconic villain. Two birds with one stone!)
-Style Savy Manager
-Girl Avatar/Robin
-Bubbles

Also can someone please make a Style Savy Manager thread? I would support her in a heartbeat lol

 

[YoshiandToad]

It's a ****ing fact. Of course some girls play it, that's not what I was saying. But to waste time marketing smash bros to girls would absolutely ******** on their part. Catering to girls would get a razor thin amount of extra females to play. Girls like you are buying the game no matter what

I kind of agree with this. Just because there aren't a lot of female characters in past Smashes, doesn't mean there was a shortage of likable characters that appealed to everyone;

Pega Pony Princess up there appears to main Link. My younger sister mained Pichu and then Ike. My fiancee uses Pikachu. My friend uses Snake as she likes the character and is a big fan of MGS.

Thus all of the above, providing their characters don't get cut are already going to get the game.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

The sad thing is that loads of girls were whining over Rosalina getting in over Daisy, a controversial female who had never stood a chance from the start. They do gotta realize that Rosalina was arguably the best option of a new Mario female and that there are better options of female newcomers they should look forward to. And this is coming from a Daisy fan who's facing facts and reality.

 

[Curious Villager]

Yeah I remember in Tumblr and Deviantart there were particularly a lot of Daisy fans who were very annoyed at Rosalina making it in over Daisy.
But yeah, hate to say it, Daisy didn't really have that much hope besides Peach taking her dress and everything as an alternate costume again. :/

 

[DraginHikari]

I actually didn't even recall seeing alot of huge demand for Daisy in Smash until after Rosalina was announced, was it that there were people that actually were expecting Daisy to get in or it is more of a reaction to Rosalina getting in instead?

 

[Kon]

Speaking of females I have to say that as long as the females are reasonable choices such as Dixie(being playable in three out of five DKC games if we count DKC:TF already in too, being in most of the DK spinoffs if not even all the DK spinoffs) or Medusa(antagonist of KI and playing an important role in KI:U that makes people remember her as well), I'm fine with the choices.

i.e: Rosalina is a reasonable choice: She first appeared in Super Mario Galaxy, then appeared in Mario Kart Wii, Super Mario Galaxy 2, Mario Kart 7 and Super Mario 3D World. The Mario Kart 8 return was pretty obvious too and after all, she is relevant enough to be in SSB4.
Wii Fit is a small franchise which sold many copies, so a character from the series is ok. There were only a few choices and at the end Sakurai highlighted the female Wii Fit trainer while we know already the male version will also be included as alternate costume.

As for now, the choices were reasonable. Of course pretty no one expected WFT, but now, as she's in the game, we can at least understand her inclusion.

That's what I expect from other newcomer too. (both male and female)
There shouldn't be characters just because a female quote has to be achieved because in that case it wouldn't be reasonable. However I guess Sakurai will make some less likely seeming choices which can still be reasonable ones.

I wouldn't put to much weight on "we need more females" as the main question for new characters will be: How unique is the character and what can the character bring to SSB4?

 

[KCCHIEFS27]

Smash needs more females because honestly it's a total sausage fest and this is comming from a gay male. It's sad to know the only females in brawl are Samus, peach, Zelda, jigglypuff and Nana. That's like 5 out of 30 + male characters?

They did recently show Wii Fit Trainer and rosalina as playable. That's a good start but

They can easily add more important females like
-Palutena
-Dixie Kong
-Toon Zelda
-Krystal
-Lip
-Medusa(female and iconic villain. Two birds with one stone!)
-Style Savy Manager
-Girl Avatar/Robin
-Bubbles

Also can someone please make a Style Savy Manager thread? I would support her in a heartbeat lol

Saying that you're gay doesn't help your damn argument. 1/6th of brawl's roster is female. That's almost 17%. If you seriously think the percentage of girls buying the game is much more than that number then you are insane. Which I already think you are because of those characters that you listed.

-Palutena
-Dixie Kong
I'm okay with these two, if they are in they deserve it.

-Toon Zelda
Why do we want so many duplicate versions of the same character? Will Zelda and Zelda 2.0 really make many more females buy the game? If Zelda isn't enough to satisfy a girl on the fence of getting the game, a toon version of her won't make a difference.

Krystal
Irrelevant. But if there are 3 Star Fox reps for whatever stupid reason again, she should be in over Wolf.

-Lip
lmfao

-Medusa(female and iconic villain. Two birds with one stone!)
If you think Kid Icarus deserves 3 reps then get yourself checked into a mental institution

-Style Savy Manager
See Lip

-Girl Avatar/Robin
Would be the alt costume of male avatar if she was in, which would be fine.

-Bubbles
See Style Savy Manager

The problem with putting females in just because of their gender is that rarely do any of them deserve a spot over other iconic characters. Seeing as how we aren't expected to get 20 newcomers, most of the suggested female newcomers are laughable and will never get in over deserving characters based solely on their genders

 

[Curious Villager]

I actually didn't even recall seeing alot of huge demand for Daisy in Smash until after Rosalina was announced, was it that there were people that actually were expecting Daisy to get in or it is more of a reaction to Rosalina getting in instead?

I think it's more the reaction of Rosalina gaining a lot of attention from Nintendo lately. Many Daisy fans feel like she has been overshadowing her lately. So in a way, Rosalina has kinda become the next Mario to their Luigi in their eyes. Some are even demanding a "Year of Daisy" as well now because of her.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Saying that you're gay doesn't help your damn argument. 1/6th of brawl's roster is female. That's almost 17%. If you seriously think the percentage of girls buying the game is much more than that number then you are insane. Which I already think you are because of those characters that you listed.

-Palutena
-Dixie Kong
I'm okay with these two, if they are in they deserve it.

-Toon Zelda
Why do we want so many duplicate versions of the same character? Will Zelda and Zelda 2.0 really make many more females buy the game? If Zelda isn't enough to satisfy a girl on the fence of getting the game, a toon version of her won't make a difference.

Krystal
Irrelevant. But if there are 3 Star Fox reps for whatever stupid reason again, she should be in over Wolf.

-Lip
lmfao

-Medusa(female and iconic villain. Two birds with one stone!)
If you think Kid Icarus deserves 3 reps then get yourself checked into a mental institution

-Style Savy Manager
See Lip

-Girl Avatar/Robin
Would be the alt costume of male avatar if she was in, which would be fine.

-Bubbles
See Style Savy Manager

The problem with putting females in just because of their gender is that rarely do any of them deserve a spot over other iconic characters. Seeing as how we aren't expected to get 20 newcomers, most of the suggested female newcomers are laughable and will never get in over deserving characters based solely on their genders

Someone's mad about females. Most of the iconic males are already in smash. I mean the only iconic males left out is Ridley and lil Mac and that's about it. Everything else besides them is pretty much filler newcomers. I mean who else is there to add besides Ridley, lil Mac, mii and mewtwo? Those are like the only huge names left out. All of the huge all stars are already in smash. Besides it's not just girls who like female characters. Men like them as well for thier own reasons. It would be nice to fit some more ladies into smash as long as they are important to Nintendo.

 

[KCCHIEFS27]

Someone's mad about females. Most of the iconic males are already in smash. I mean the only iconic males left out is Ridley and lil Mac and that's about it. Everything else besides them is pretty much filler newcomers. I mean who else is there to add besides Ridley, lil Mac, mii and mewtwo? Those are like the only huge names left out. All of the huge all stars are already in smash. Besides it's not just girls who like female characters. Men like them as well for thier own reasons. It would be nice to fit some more ladies into smash as long as they are important to Nintendo.

You are considering creatures males which is stupid as ****. You think male gamers relate to Ridley being male and that's what makes us want the game? No, they want him because he is cool as ****. Did you even read my post? The whole thing with females is there aren't enough of them important enough for Nintendo to be considered for a game like this. Like 3 on that list at most even have a shot. People like Isaac deserve it way more. Your list is pathetic and just supports the notion that there are almost no good females left to even put in.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

You are considering creatures males which is stupid as ****. You think male gamers relate to Ridley being male and that's what makes us want the game? No, they want him because he is cool as ****. Did you even read my post? The whole thing with females is there aren't enough of them important enough for Nintendo to be considered for a game like this. Like 3 on that list at most even have a shot. People like Isaac deserve it way more. Your list is pathetic and just supports the notion that there are almost no good females left to even put in.

I bursted out in laughter the moment you said issac deserves it more. I'm sorry I can't take you serious any more lol How funny that you just said most of those females aren't important yet Isaac is more important? Oh the irony. Hmm they aren't important you say? Neither is falco, Lucas or ice climbers. They all got in because of favoritism/uniqueness/easy to clone. Sakurai is a random man. He can do anything. I mean I'm still puzzled how a small done series like mother has 2 reps yet metroid has 1 and donkey kong barely has 2?

 

[Kon]

[...]
-Medusa(female and iconic villain. Two birds with one stone!)
If you think Kid Icarus deserves 3 reps then get yourself checked into a mental institution
[...]

I don't know why people are still like: Palutena is the only choice for a 2nd Kid Icarus spot. This is ridiculous. Of course, Palutena is relevant. However I don't see Kid Icarus getting a 3rd spot in the near future and therefore: Sakurai has two spots for Kid Icarus, one filled with Pit. The other one could be his boss(Palutena) or an antagonist who even played an important role in Kid Icarus:Uprising. (Medusa) Of course we could take the whole argumentation to another level, but all I want to point out is that there are still two contenders, both female, for the 2nd Kid Icarus spot.

Someone's mad about females. Most of the iconic males are already in smash. I mean the only iconic males left out is Ridley and lil Mac and that's about it. Everything else besides them is pretty much filler newcomers. I mean who else is there to add besides Ridley, lil Mac, mii and mewtwo? Those are like the only huge names left out. All of the huge all stars are already in smash. Besides it's not just girls who like female characters. Men like them as well for thier own reasons. It would be nice to fit some more ladies into smash as long as they are important to Nintendo.

You forgot to mention King K.Rool. He's quite iconic too for the DK franchise even without being in DKCR and DKC:TF.

 

[KCCHIEFS27]

I bursted out in laughter the moment you said issac deserves it more. I'm sorry I can't take you serious any more lol How funny that you just said most of those females aren't important yet Isaac is more important? Oh the irony. Hmm they aren't important you say? Neither is falco, Lucas or ice climbers. They all got in because of favoritism/uniqueness/easy to clone. Sakurai is a random man. He can do anything. I mean I'm still puzzled how a small done series like mother has 2 reps yet metroid has 1 and donkey kong barely has 2?

Have you even looked at your list? You couldn't be more wrong its laughable. And how am I supposed to take you seriously? Your name on here is elite GAYmer. Pathetic. Flaunt your sexuality somewhere else. I'll just make my name KCStraights27.

I don't know why people are still like: Palutena is the only choice for a 2nd Kid Icarus spot. This is ridiculous. Of course, Palutena is relevant. However I don't see Kid Icarus getting a 3rd spot in the near future and therefore: Sakurai has two spots for Kid Icarus, one filled with Pit. The other one could be his boss(Palutena) or an antagonist who even played an important role in Kid Icarus:Uprising. (Medusa) Of course we could take the whole argumentation to another level, but all I want to point out is that there are still two contenders, both female, for the 2nd Kid Icarus spot.


You forgot to mention King K.Rool. He's quite iconic too for the DK franchise even without being in DKCR and DKC:TF.

Never said Medusa doesn't deserve it really, just that there's no way Kid Icarus gets 3. Medusa deserves it as much as Palutena, just seems like the latter is more likely

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Have you even looked at your list? You couldn't be more wrong its laughable. And how am I supposed to take you seriously? Your name on here is elite GAYmer. Pathetic. Flaunt your sexuality somewhere else. I'll just make my name KCStraights27.



Never said Medusa doesn't deserve it really, just that there's no way Kid Icarus gets 3. Medusa deserves it as much as Palutena, just seems like the latter is more likely

You really need to take your meds dude. Chillax buddy I said those females could be viable I never said "Herp derp they are shoe ins!" Also who cares I'm proud of myself. Should I bash people who put thier race in thier name? Nope and if you wanna put straight in your name more power to ya dude. Just please calm down. It's iust smashboards

 

[KCCHIEFS27]

You really need to take your meds dude. Chillax buddy I said those females could be viable I never said "Herp derp they are shoe ins!" Also who cares I'm proud of myself. Should I bash people who put thier race in thier name? Nope and if you wanna put straight in your name more power to ya dude. Just please calm down. It's iust smashboards

Most of the ones you named are NOT viable.

I'm glad you enjoy being gay. If only I had a premium membership so I could change mine to reflect how proud I am that I enjoy vaginas.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Most of the ones you named are NOT viable.

I'm glad you enjoy being gay. If only I had a premium membership so I could change mine to reflect how proud I am that I enjoy vaginas.

Issac is not viable! See how silly and ignorant that sounds? Are you sakurai? Nope. We don't know who's viable at this point. Heck most people thought adding rosalina is digging at the bottom of the barrel before Super Mario 3d world. Oh look she's playable now. I'm so happy cause I was one of her supporters and always toke major disses from anti rosalina fans and like I said I don't mind you saying your straight. I don't Judge I love all!

 

[N3ON]

People seem to assume being female and being a "hardcore" Smash player are mostly mutually exclusive. They can overlap, even if females who will invest countless hours into Smash are hardly a majority. I agree, marketing the game to a demographic who will have little interest in it is a waste of resources and marketing, but people assume you either have to market specifically to females or males. The females that actually care about Smash and other non-female oriented games would likely care about it regardless of how many female newcomers were added, they'll be intrigued by standard marketing, and marketing to the stereotypical "omg my Nintendog is so cute <3" group of females is about as likely as them marketing this game to the "I can play Wii Sports Club with my grandchildren" demo.

Nintendo has other games they're going to try and push in the more casual faces. That doesn't mean this one is going to shy completely away from females on the basis of Nintendo not aiming themselves for one specific group of girls. There are probably many more females who want to pick up this game after seeing the Mega Man trailer than the WFT or Rosalina ones. I'm pretty sure those type of female gamers are used to males outnumbering females in games, they don't need to see princess after princess to want to pick up the game.

Besides, with how much demand there was for more female characters, it's hardly just the "female" markets being appeased by these new female additions. Guys wanted them too, and guys will primarily play as them.

Neither is falco, Lucas or ice climbers. They all got in because of favoritism/uniqueness/easy to clone.

Lucas was pretty popular in Japan, where Mother is regarded much higher. Plus, just by going off their roles in the series, he's as of as much importance as Ness. Plus Sakurai did want to implement him since Melee. So I'd say he had his reasons, it wasn't a case of Sakurai just being random.

And I suspect Metroid has the amount of characters it does because Sakurai didn't see anybody other than Samus as meriting inclusion or a feasible addition. And DK was battling legal stuff during Melee and was kinda dead around Brawl, so getting Diddy was about as much as expected. It's not like it was in the place it is now.

And how am I supposed to take you seriously? Your name on here is elite GAYmer. Pathetic. Flaunt your sexuality somewhere else. I'll just make my name KCStraights27.

I'm glad you enjoy being gay. If only I had a premium membership so I could change mine to reflect how proud I am that I enjoy vaginas.

That's irrelevant to the conversation, no reason to focus on it.

 

[YoshiandToad]

-Lip
lmfao

Wait, wha? I pretty much agree on everyone else you listed, but Lip's a lmfao? I was under the impression she was a legit retro pick.

And what's wrong with Isaac? He deserves it more than Style Savy Manager or Bubbles.

 

[Wii Twerk Trainer]

Okay I was going random and thought of Bubbles lol

Style Savy Manager is more relevant then Issac at the moment. That's about it though lol I honestly could care less what the roster is. Wii Fit trainer is all I need but if Ridley, Palutena and medusa somehow make it in then I'll play this game forever!

I hear ya Neon. Well said and neatly written. I mean Mother only has 3 games. 2 which are japan only and 1 which didn't really do well in the US due to poor marketing. I guess that's just me being salty about it lol xD