Shulk Tech: Monado Art Landing Lag Cancel

[Jerm]

Jerm submitted a new guide:

Shulk Tech: Monado Art Landing Lag Cancel - Remove Landing Lag; Speed Up Your Shulk Play!

Shulk Tech: Monado Art Landing Lag Cancel

One of Shulk's most useful techs fleshed out!

Read more about this guide...

 

[TheHopefulHero]

Very nice job on explaining MALLC with this vid. I can't wait to see how much Shulk grows with this Tech. Keep it up, and maybe I'll get to square off with you someday.

 

[Pikalink]

Well done guide! I too is very excited to see how MALLC will lead to the future of Shulk play.

 

[erico9001]

-A lot of the guide is just re-coverage of what I put in my video guide, but you have put some different methods too. Since so much of the information came from that video, I was wondering if you were going to give it a shout out or something. I guess not, but whatever.

-I'm not sure if it's best to say MALLC is all about timing. This implies that the technique heavily involves timing of when to press the button, but that's not exactly true. The button inputs are either set and in quick succession, or there is a visual reference.

-I like that you put 9B's method in there, as it is a great display of this tech's use. However, I was wondering why you don't explain what he is doing in the clip. It can be broken apart and explained, which I was expecting because you explained all those different MALLC methods in the guide.

Speaking of this, what 9B does in that video is:
1) Short hop. During this time, he deactivates any monado art he is in if needed.
2) Second jump.
3) When rising with the second jump, he switches to the art he wants. He gets to the art he is looking for just after the top of the arc.
4) Fast Fall
5) Use aerial (in this case, Bair, which basically means he needs to fast fall and use Bair at the same time.)

-Something else, I was hoping you would have covered using MALLC with different levels that have platforms. For instance, the MALLC I do in my video guide with the top platform of battlefield provides a really safe method of getting back onto the base level of the stage. For this, you are using the MALLC to get rid of air dodge landing lag.
-Speaking of that, I just realized you don't cover using it with air dodges at all .

-Maybe there would have been a way to incorporate the following information? It is useful for when using the MALLC after coming off of the spawning platform, after being hit high up by an opponent's attack, or after intentionally jumping from a high place (like the top of duck hunt tree).

So what I've been doing research into is MALLC with different stages. You can use the stages as references in order to MALLC from high areas. There are advantages to this, such as being an easy way to utilize a specific art you want. Another is to cover landings after being hit high up. When I'm doing this, I'm using Bair. It has more hitstun than Fair and Nair, so it needs lower heights to work. The difference isn't too significant, though, and you should still get a decent MALLC with Fair and Nair. I think the combined hits of Dair and Uair have more hitstun, so they may not work with these heights. Single hits should work, though.

From this height, going at full (constant) fall speed, I will MALLC when I hit the ground. Any higher than this and the activation of the art will be before I land. At later times, there will still be a MALLC, but the lag increases.

Just imagine a horizontal line from the point of reference on Shulk's body to the part of the stage. Usually I'll either use Shulk's head, feet, or waist as reference points.

Battlefield

The reference to use is when Shulk's feet are just above the top platform. However, you still get a great MALLC if you use the top platform as reference instead (still, feet on top).

To MALLC onto the lower platforms, envision a third platform (with same vertical distance) being above the top platform. Think of it kind of like Big Battlefield, how you have the third platform on top there. Hit B when your feet are just above that imaginary platform. If you want to MALLC onto the top platform, you need to either imagine the height of two platforms, or just put the height from the ground to the top platform.

Town and City

This photo is a little off. Shulk's foot is supposed to be on the black line. Anyways, for this part of Town and City, you can either use *a little above the side platforms* as reference, or if the camera is zoomed out at this height (result of you being high in the air and opponent being on ground) you can use the cliff in the background as a reference.

For the other part of Town and City, the moving platforms are just a little above the height of Battlefield's shorter platforms. All you need to do is imagine twice the height of the moving platforms (or imagine another platform stacked on top of it). You may be able to use some things in the background as reference too. I wouldn't recommend it, though.

Smashville

The height of the moving platform on Smashville is the same height as the paltforms on the second part of Town and City. Use the same method.

Kongo Jungle 64

If landing on the outer parts of the base of the stage, Use when your foot is right by the higher part of the side platforms.

For MALLC onto the lower part of the stage, we must figure out the height difference in reference to Shulk.

The difference in height is from his foot to his waist. Therefore, to MALLC onto the lower platform, activate your art when your waist is on the top of the higher part of the side platforms.

Use your own judgement for when to activate the art if landing between the top and middle parts.

---------------------

These are the only stages I've looked into so far. After all this testing, though, I've kind of gotten a feel for the actual height from which to MALLC from regardless of stage. It's a little more than 2.5 Shulk heights from the ground to Shulk's feet. Or, if you're using Shulk's waist as reference instead of his feet, then it's a little more than 3 Shulk heights.

It would be a lot of work to include all of it. Perhaps you could have just brought up how you can also MALLC from high fall heights, and there are visual references that can be used for that. A link to the post on smashboards could cover the rest.

-It would have been cool if you could have included the MALLC methods I found for decisive arts! With customs being allowed, I think the decisive arts users might appreciate it. Of course, with decisive arts there won't be any of that 9B stuff .

I was getting annoyed at not being able to use my art activation while in Decisive arts for MALLC, so I figured out the inputs/timings for it.

Method 1)
SH and directly afterwards hit B for the art. Shortly afterwards, use your double jump, and fast fall when possible (once you're at the top of the arc)

Method 2)
***Can do this with your eyes closed***
FH. While rising, you can change your art. When around the top of the arc, use your second jump at roughly the same time as you press B.
---Note: If at the exact top of the arc, Bair will have too much hitstun for MALLC to work. Use ever so slightly before or after the top of the arc of your first jump to get your perfect MALLC. Fair can be used at the absolute top of the arc, however. The beautiful thing about this method is it is very hard to mess up the timing. Still works when not at the top of the arc.

Method 3)
Full hop off a platform roughly the height of Battlefield's lower platforms or Smashville's platform. Immediately after the FH, press B. Land on the ground below with no fast fall.

-Finally, a correction... In the video, you say the activation time is 25 milliseconds, and I'm really confused and curious how you got that. The actual time period for monado arts activation is closer to .8 seconds, or 80 centiseconds.

 

[NQuad1Zero]

-
-Finally, a correction... In the video, you say the activation time is 25 milliseconds, and I'm really confused and curious how you got that. The actual time period for monado arts activation is closer to .8 seconds, or 80 centiseconds.

I was wondering this too. I posted on your Youtube comments section (I'm Quad Wesker Travosky). I think you meant 250 milliseconds, and even then, 1/4 of a second is TOO damn short to be true. I struggle to even tap B with my thumb faster 4 times a second without being tired (to ensure it doesnt activate the previous one) so Im nearly certain it's longer. 0.8 seconds sounds much more reasonable

 

[Xenoblade Hero]

That was a very informative video, well explained and hopefully I'll be able to pull this off in competitive play with enough practise. Thanks!

 

[InfinityZERO]

I think this should be renamed so it's easier to say. Zanza maybe? And yeah, erico did come out with a video first.

 

[Zacko]

Tweaked Character Balancing.
What are the chances of MALLC being patched out?

 

[InfinityZERO]

I hope not much chance at all. The developers seem to more content to punish Greninja more (for ill-conceived reasons) and improve Shulk. The last update was nice to him.

 

[erico9001]

Tweaked Character Balancing.
What are the chances of MALLC being patched out?

I'm worried about this too. 9B, the person who appears amazingly good at MALLC, is a well known Japanese player. This makes it likely that Nintendo of Japan knows about the MALLC. I guess it is up to them. Hopefully they will just see it as a kind of hard to execute auto cancel, and not an exploit . Although, MALLC is not a tech that Shulk relies on. He is still fine without it.

 

[Berserker.]

I'm honestly not sure as to how he'll patch MALLC out. To do that, he'll need to do something with the Monado activation animations WHICH was shown in the Shulk reveal trailer so it's not like he can literally remove the animations. Right?

 

[DrShankums]

I doubt they'd patch this out, this is the kind of AT that seems intentionally put in. They had to program and animate the art activation so they must have known this was in the realm of possibilities. I just hope Nintendo doesn't nerf his numbers because of it.

 

[FOcast]

They could pretty easily patch out MALLC by making Shulk unable to enter the art change animation while in the lag state, just like it is for when throwing out attacks or when in shield.

I really have no idea whether they will. On one hand, they nerfed Greninja's Shadow Sneak lag cancel, so it's certainly not out of their scope. On the other, MALLC seems more specific and less abusable. We'll just have to wait and see.

 

[Terriner]

monado buster 2.0

 

[Berserker.]

They could pretty easily patch out MALLC by making Shulk unable to enter the art change animation while in the lag state, just like it is for when throwing out attacks or when in shield.

I really have no idea whether they will. On one hand, they nerfed Greninja's Shadow Sneak lag cancel, so it's certainly not out of their scope. On the other, MALLC seems more specific and less abusable. We'll just have to wait and see.

Whelp. I'll wait and see