Maraphy
Smash Ace
Hey all,
This idea got brought up in the social thread but I think it's worth its own topic for discussing.
Unfortunately, most of the tournaments these days don't allow customs. This is kind of a problem for Palutena because she excels so much in customs; Lightweight alone makes her significantly more threatening, but she also has really good custom specials for all of her other slots that dramatically change how she plays. I mentioned this in another topic, but I'm willing to bet Palutena's design philosophy was pretty much this: "Mediocre character that becomes god-like when customs are turned on". As people have pointed out numerous times, her reveal trailer focused on the variety of moves she has, and besides Miis she's the only character that comes with all of her customs unlocked.
So, what do you all think? As a Palutena main (considering your potential bias), do you agree or disagree? Do you think this would be a good idea for just SOME tournaments to try or should it become a staple for every default tournament? Or do you disagree that Custom Palutena should be allowed in default, and you'd rather just have more custom tournaments?
If we can come together as Palutena mains to decide what we all want, then we can propose it to the smash community at large. Before then, however, let's talk about it!
As for a single set, I've tried asking here, but it's going slow. Probably because of the holidays. I have asked @AeroLink_the_SoulMaster what he finds the best set to be and he thinks it's 2322: Explosive Flame, Super Speed, Jump Glide, and Lightweight. I agree with that because EF covers the ledge very well and can kill, SS can set up for kills and recover, JG is good for mobility and recovery, and I don't think Lightweight needs any more explanation.
I'm also going through Palutena matches and counting the use of special moves of both characters in the match and comparing them. I'm doing this for default and custom matches. As expected Palutena has very little use of her specials in default compared to her opponent and it seems the better characters use their specials a lot more. I haven't gotten around to viewing custom matches yet, but when I do I expect an increased use of her specials and it should help to influence what set we should use. Although it's kind of hard to find custom matches other than Aerolink, but he wins with the set he is running.
One person told me, "But customs will change her intended play style," and all I have to do is look back to the trophy description: "She's very adaptable—you can customize her." Her intended play style is customs. For the "Why can't my character have a unified set of customs as well?" No other character was intentionally designed around custom moves. No other character has completely unique customs. Zelda and Sheik still have warping up Bs, but Palutena doesn't. Fox and Falco still have a reflector, but Palutena doesn't. Everyone with a counter still has a counter, but Palutena doesn't. "Oh but Palutena will be broken." Well you've probably already picked up Sheik so what difference does it make if you want to change your character again, or how about you learn to counter something before calling it broken. Denti was able to beat Aerolink's custom Palutena with what I'm pretty sure was default diddy. He might have had a custom banana or rockets but I don't remember (should probably go watch those sets again). Do you remember seeing a custom Palutena in top 8 of EVO, because I don't. Besides this is one set, so it's not like a Palutena player could be like, "Your gonna go that character. Well I'm gonna use these customs." It's just one easy to learn set that would make a character more viable. Now if you just don't want more character viability that's messed up and you're a terrible member of this community.
Once I get a better feel on what the Palutena players think her single set should be, I'm probably going to go to the rule set discussion and convince everyone there.
This idea got brought up in the social thread but I think it's worth its own topic for discussing.
Unfortunately, most of the tournaments these days don't allow customs. This is kind of a problem for Palutena because she excels so much in customs; Lightweight alone makes her significantly more threatening, but she also has really good custom specials for all of her other slots that dramatically change how she plays. I mentioned this in another topic, but I'm willing to bet Palutena's design philosophy was pretty much this: "Mediocre character that becomes god-like when customs are turned on". As people have pointed out numerous times, her reveal trailer focused on the variety of moves she has, and besides Miis she's the only character that comes with all of her customs unlocked.
So, what do you all think? As a Palutena main (considering your potential bias), do you agree or disagree? Do you think this would be a good idea for just SOME tournaments to try or should it become a staple for every default tournament? Or do you disagree that Custom Palutena should be allowed in default, and you'd rather just have more custom tournaments?
If we can come together as Palutena mains to decide what we all want, then we can propose it to the smash community at large. Before then, however, let's talk about it!
Well, I've been making an argument for allowing custom Palutena for awhile now. If you were to look at her trophy it says "she has special moves like Warp and Heavenly Light at her disposal. She's very adaptable—you can customize her into a long- or close-range fighter!" So clearly she was meant with customization in mind, but since people would be more unwilling with full customization I figure a single set would be the best option. I've also reviewed the frame data on her other moves and said it makes since for her to be designed around lightweight, because I think a character faster than sonic and best aerial mobility in the game with any faster frame data wouldn't be so fair. Now for people that are worried about dying at 40% off grab, why do alllow ZSS and DK then, but honestly you can just DI to end up behind Palutena in nair so that uair doesn't connect. People shouldn't be so quick to call something broken without finding a counter to it first. That paper says it's only asking for lightweight but after asking other people their thoughts, not Palutena mains, they thought lightweight would not be enough to make her a viable character, so 1 unified set is the way to go.
As for a single set, I've tried asking here, but it's going slow. Probably because of the holidays. I have asked @AeroLink_the_SoulMaster what he finds the best set to be and he thinks it's 2322: Explosive Flame, Super Speed, Jump Glide, and Lightweight. I agree with that because EF covers the ledge very well and can kill, SS can set up for kills and recover, JG is good for mobility and recovery, and I don't think Lightweight needs any more explanation.
I'm also going through Palutena matches and counting the use of special moves of both characters in the match and comparing them. I'm doing this for default and custom matches. As expected Palutena has very little use of her specials in default compared to her opponent and it seems the better characters use their specials a lot more. I haven't gotten around to viewing custom matches yet, but when I do I expect an increased use of her specials and it should help to influence what set we should use. Although it's kind of hard to find custom matches other than Aerolink, but he wins with the set he is running.
One person told me, "But customs will change her intended play style," and all I have to do is look back to the trophy description: "She's very adaptable—you can customize her." Her intended play style is customs. For the "Why can't my character have a unified set of customs as well?" No other character was intentionally designed around custom moves. No other character has completely unique customs. Zelda and Sheik still have warping up Bs, but Palutena doesn't. Fox and Falco still have a reflector, but Palutena doesn't. Everyone with a counter still has a counter, but Palutena doesn't. "Oh but Palutena will be broken." Well you've probably already picked up Sheik so what difference does it make if you want to change your character again, or how about you learn to counter something before calling it broken. Denti was able to beat Aerolink's custom Palutena with what I'm pretty sure was default diddy. He might have had a custom banana or rockets but I don't remember (should probably go watch those sets again). Do you remember seeing a custom Palutena in top 8 of EVO, because I don't. Besides this is one set, so it's not like a Palutena player could be like, "Your gonna go that character. Well I'm gonna use these customs." It's just one easy to learn set that would make a character more viable. Now if you just don't want more character viability that's messed up and you're a terrible member of this community.
Once I get a better feel on what the Palutena players think her single set should be, I'm probably going to go to the rule set discussion and convince everyone there.
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