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Sheik Tier 1
- Thread starter Exelency1
- Start date
Wasserwipf
Smash Apprentice
Source? Also, does this really deserve a topic? I'll just say what everyone else says. It's waay to early to be talking about tierlists. However, I do agree that Sheik is at least High, if not top tier. But #1? I don't think so.
I really want to know who those pros are...
I really want to know who those pros are...
Jackson
Smash Lord
Agreed, #1 seems a bit iffy but she's definitely up there.
Darklink401
Smash Master
I wouldn't be surprised. Rosalina and Yoshi are the only true competitors for the throne, I'd say, but Sheik is just so fast. Also her recovery got a boost.
I really would not be surprised if, in the near future, it was official that Sheik was, indeed, the best character in this game.
The first early tier list has her stated as such, and while it IS early, I don't think things will DRASTICALLY change.
I really would not be surprised if, in the near future, it was official that Sheik was, indeed, the best character in this game.
The first early tier list has her stated as such, and while it IS early, I don't think things will DRASTICALLY change.
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Judo777
Smash Master
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No eventually people will stop getting hit by BF and she will go down a little bit (she will still be good don't get me wrong). Having kill power that puts the opponent at around 180 every stock is a pretty big weakness. Especially when many of the characters that peope think are good have pretty great kill power (120 and before).
_Tree
The no-more hero
I think #1 is a bit much. As people have pointed out she has difficulty killing, and is pretty well countered by characters such as Lucario, who have a pretty un-gimpable recovery and gets stronger as Sheik fails to kill them.
Considering how long people live in this game the fact that she can't kill easily will set her back a bit.
She's definitely not going to be bottom or mid tier though, let me say that.
Considering how long people live in this game the fact that she can't kill easily will set her back a bit.
She's definitely not going to be bottom or mid tier though, let me say that.
Darklink401
Smash Master
Hmm...I guess only time will tell.
If not her, though, I can only imagine Rosalina surpassing her, for those who master her.
Unless people learn how to exploit Yoshi's glitches effectively in competitive play.
...who else would be a contender?
If not her, though, I can only imagine Rosalina surpassing her, for those who master her.
Unless people learn how to exploit Yoshi's glitches effectively in competitive play.
...who else would be a contender?
lRasha
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- Jun 19, 2014
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- 116
I love Sheik, but part of me doesn't want her to be #1 though. If I win against people, I don't want people to be like "Well, you DID beat me with the #1 tier character so...yeah." Sheik can be beaten more easily than #1 tier Brawl Meta Knight, a character more difficult to defeat.
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Darklink401
Smash Master
She can be beaten more easily, but people are ALREADY saying 'Everyone is good with Sheik' cuz of how good she is.
Also in Melee there are so many of the competitive players that used Fox or Falco , so I wouldn't say a metagame where Sheik is common would be one where you'd be hated on for winning with Sheik, and the casual players wouldn't really care that much.
Jackson
Smash Lord
I think ZSS is a very solid contender. She's like Sheik but more rushdown.
Darklink401
Smash Master
Also stungun.
I'd guess Bowser's in the top 5, but not top 3, due to the fact he IS still a slowish character.
I'd guess Bowser's in the top 5, but not top 3, due to the fact he IS still a slowish character.
Mazdamaxsti
Smash Lord
Sheik is not #1, nor is she easy to play. She is all about accuracy. Bouncing fish is high risk/high reward, starting a combo if you hit it but tremendous lag if you miss. Her down A is pointless unless you know you'll hit it, if you use your bomb you are in danger of punishment, etc.
Sheik does have an excellent B though, her needles counter any fast moving characters, and her basic attacks can go a long way.
Funny story, this guy and I had a good fight, but I won. I guess he thought I won because I was Sheik, so he picked her. I wanted to change, and I picked Peach. He failed, Sheik needs mastering, she isn't a pick up and win.
Sheik does have an excellent B though, her needles counter any fast moving characters, and her basic attacks can go a long way.
Funny story, this guy and I had a good fight, but I won. I guess he thought I won because I was Sheik, so he picked her. I wanted to change, and I picked Peach. He failed, Sheik needs mastering, she isn't a pick up and win.
Darklink401
Smash Master
Hmmm...I mean, all you gotta do is just overwhelm your opponent with aerials...at least, that's what I do. You mostly mentioned her special attacks, but her basic attacks are all very fast.
Sure, she's not Pickup and win, but she IS quite easy to use. Or maybe that's just me.
Sure, she's not Pickup and win, but she IS quite easy to use. Or maybe that's just me.
Jackson
Smash Lord
As far as Smash 4 goes, Sheik is fairly technical, especially with DACUS on Wii U.
Emblem Lord
The Legendary Lord
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Shes strong. Top 5 easy. It is what is. Someones gotta be top tier right?
Judo777
Smash Master
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Just so you know, I don't think sheik received a buff in priority on her aerials, nor did she gain faster aerials than brawl.
This is a little synonymous with brawls early life, where sheik had fast aerials, that strung together nicely and had very little ending lag (which made her feel comfortable to play for most people) so quite a few people played her. Granted not as many as this time around (many people knee jerk didn't play her because she wasn't absurd like she was in the previous game, melee), simply because she is actually buffed from the last game (thanks to bouncing fish).
Unfortunately as time goes on, people will figure out that priority matters.... ALOT. Right now people can't effectively wall because we don't have csticks (can't do any aeiral while moving in any direction, like retreating fair). Because people can't effectively control space as well as normal, the characters that benefit most from getting in (Sheik, Greninja, Fox, Yoshi and others) are indirectly buffed. That is not to say that once we get csticks those characters will plummet but right now those characters are barely having to use half of their gameplay (the approaching part) because for the most part its as simple as dash forward and jump over an attack.
This is a little synonymous with brawls early life, where sheik had fast aerials, that strung together nicely and had very little ending lag (which made her feel comfortable to play for most people) so quite a few people played her. Granted not as many as this time around (many people knee jerk didn't play her because she wasn't absurd like she was in the previous game, melee), simply because she is actually buffed from the last game (thanks to bouncing fish).
Unfortunately as time goes on, people will figure out that priority matters.... ALOT. Right now people can't effectively wall because we don't have csticks (can't do any aeiral while moving in any direction, like retreating fair). Because people can't effectively control space as well as normal, the characters that benefit most from getting in (Sheik, Greninja, Fox, Yoshi and others) are indirectly buffed. That is not to say that once we get csticks those characters will plummet but right now those characters are barely having to use half of their gameplay (the approaching part) because for the most part its as simple as dash forward and jump over an attack.
warionumbah2
Smash Master
No way is she number 1, top 5? Sure why not.
Jackson
Smash Lord
I feel the same way as you.
I spent a lot of time wondering on this.
What i felt like is:
Sheik: probably the best movements, maybe the only truly good shield pressure character in the game. If she had, say, a couple of kill moves that actually do the ko without requiring specific setups/situations to pull off, she would have been the best.
can sometimes be frustrating cause rage effect gets really annoying, you try so hard to ko them, they reach lik 160% and then they kill you with a random attack you misread/ something you got into by an accident.
ZSS: Similar to sheik, her movements are damn strong. However, she does not lack the kill power as much as sheik does. To be honest though, I think that sheik's movements, Fair, jab, F and Utilts are really better.
She's way more balanced and she hasn't really got a situation that completely shuts her down (atm)
If sheik would be have the perfect score of 10/10 in everything except for killing options and setups for them, ZSS would have like 9.5 in everything.
Rosalina: She's different, it's not about her movements or stuff, she has some other strenght and we need yet to understand if that strenght is just better than anyone else.
Right now, it just seems that it's kinda exploitable, but it is true that we don't have the full mastery of the character yet, i think.
Yoshi: Really good char, but atm I don't feel like it is even at the top3 level. I may be wrong on that.
Bowser: In this smash, it seems it is useful to main a couple of chars basing on their roles, and a tank could be good (imagine a scenario where you can't finish off a char or that you find out that your opponent is bad at stage control but good for setupping a kill, you would like to main a tank as well) Here, bowser is kinda the best tank. As a tank, he suffers pressure and stuff, and if your opponent manages to find the way to kill you without too much effort, or is able to keep you airborne by covering your landing, or stuff like that, the true weaknesses of the char come out.
I think that as the best tank, it will be high, but ATM i don't see him as a character going upward, instead, i feel like the exact opposite: the more you get deep in the game, the less the "tank function" will be relevant (snake anyone?)
Just my 2 cents. If you feel like something I said isn't correct, feel free to tell me, i like discussing.
What i felt like is:
Sheik: probably the best movements, maybe the only truly good shield pressure character in the game. If she had, say, a couple of kill moves that actually do the ko without requiring specific setups/situations to pull off, she would have been the best.
can sometimes be frustrating cause rage effect gets really annoying, you try so hard to ko them, they reach lik 160% and then they kill you with a random attack you misread/ something you got into by an accident.
ZSS: Similar to sheik, her movements are damn strong. However, she does not lack the kill power as much as sheik does. To be honest though, I think that sheik's movements, Fair, jab, F and Utilts are really better.
She's way more balanced and she hasn't really got a situation that completely shuts her down (atm)
If sheik would be have the perfect score of 10/10 in everything except for killing options and setups for them, ZSS would have like 9.5 in everything.
Rosalina: She's different, it's not about her movements or stuff, she has some other strenght and we need yet to understand if that strenght is just better than anyone else.
Right now, it just seems that it's kinda exploitable, but it is true that we don't have the full mastery of the character yet, i think.
Yoshi: Really good char, but atm I don't feel like it is even at the top3 level. I may be wrong on that.
Bowser: In this smash, it seems it is useful to main a couple of chars basing on their roles, and a tank could be good (imagine a scenario where you can't finish off a char or that you find out that your opponent is bad at stage control but good for setupping a kill, you would like to main a tank as well) Here, bowser is kinda the best tank. As a tank, he suffers pressure and stuff, and if your opponent manages to find the way to kill you without too much effort, or is able to keep you airborne by covering your landing, or stuff like that, the true weaknesses of the char come out.
I think that as the best tank, it will be high, but ATM i don't see him as a character going upward, instead, i feel like the exact opposite: the more you get deep in the game, the less the "tank function" will be relevant (snake anyone?)
Just my 2 cents. If you feel like something I said isn't correct, feel free to tell me, i like discussing.
Darklink401
Smash Master
I feel Little Mac and Duck Hunt Dog can be good for top 10, but they miss out on top 5 due to the aforementioned ones.
I mean LM only lacks air power, and Duck Hunt Dog....well....those projectiles tho. And his smashes reach deceptively far.
I mean LM only lacks air power, and Duck Hunt Dog....well....those projectiles tho. And his smashes reach deceptively far.
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Jackson
Smash Lord
I definitely think DHD is a high tier. I can't decide about Mac... sometimes he seems broken and sometimes he's so easy to kill it's funny.
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Duck Hunt has a hard time landing those smashes though as they're pretty unreliable. A lot of his kills comes from gimping with the can, the can itself, uair, and bair. I think he could be high tier, but definitely not top. His bad matchups include characters like Greninja, Sheik, Rosalina, all of whom are considered to be viable for top. He tend to get overwhelmed against speedy characters who don't give him proper spacing and time to set things up. Also, KO power is definitely an issue with him as he has no reliable means of KO'ing.
Jackson
Smash Lord
Yeah, I feel like beating DHD with Sheik is just basically relentless pressure on him- never letting him get away from you.
I do not agree with LM.
It's just one read and he's gone. I think he can be a good pocket character in certain matchups.
Some characters can cover a lot of his recovery options just by standing in front of the ledge once he tries to comeback.
LM can mix up side b to the ledge, high side b (which is bad cause it will result in being offstage again) up b (no sweetspot... try marth's dtilt to have fun) and they can go like walljump up b or side b, and counter is viable too.
The main problem with all those options is that they still don't help when LM is far AKA when he got read on his second jump.
At low % you can reach the ledge even if you get read on your jump, but don't forget that after reading your jump, your opponent is still there, and if his recovery is good enough, he could even get another hit and you can say a nice goodbye to your stock.
Add that the character can be juggled pretty easily.
IMHO LM will start going down as soon as people gets experience in the game, unless some talented player who has a lot of understanding about smash in general sticks with him and finds out something.
Once again, feel free to discusss =)
It's just one read and he's gone. I think he can be a good pocket character in certain matchups.
Some characters can cover a lot of his recovery options just by standing in front of the ledge once he tries to comeback.
LM can mix up side b to the ledge, high side b (which is bad cause it will result in being offstage again) up b (no sweetspot... try marth's dtilt to have fun) and they can go like walljump up b or side b, and counter is viable too.
The main problem with all those options is that they still don't help when LM is far AKA when he got read on his second jump.
At low % you can reach the ledge even if you get read on your jump, but don't forget that after reading your jump, your opponent is still there, and if his recovery is good enough, he could even get another hit and you can say a nice goodbye to your stock.
Add that the character can be juggled pretty easily.
IMHO LM will start going down as soon as people gets experience in the game, unless some talented player who has a lot of understanding about smash in general sticks with him and finds out something.
Once again, feel free to discusss =)