Rex Drives into Battle! (...As Pyra's Final Smash!!)

[jahkzheng]

To be fair, Alvis' looks not entirely like it's part of him to me. Plus it looks a little small compared to the others. I very much think he's who we think he is, but let's not jump the gun.

Spoiler

Seriously though, do you think we'll see him interact with his sisters in the post game?

It's possible. They wouldnt rewrite the story so at best they could appear in a flashback toward the end as part of the Klaus story maybe? Otherwise they'd have to be post game or extra content. Maybe there will be a post game cinematic describing their shared origins.

Spoiler

Also, the "core crystal" size could be because it's more a symbolic representation than a physical thing. After all, we dont know how a space time transition event of an aegis core into another dimension might change its appearance. The same rules may not apply. Plus Aegises dont play by real grounded rules anyways. I will say the zohar symbol as part of Alvis's appearance really strongly implies what many fans have speculated. Certainly not something that proves without a doubt that speculation, but it removes a whole lot of doubt from a theory that was already strongly speculated to be true before the alteration of Alvis's design appeared in this latest trailer.

 

[SilverSoul24]

Having Min Min as FP2 #1 and Rex at #2 would be my dream. An unlikely one and I'm not expecting it, but it's not impossible anymore either :]

I'm right there with you. An ARMS rep destroys the "relevancy" argument and is probably going to destroy the Spirits argument as well. Between this and XCDE, Rex's chances haven't been this high since base roster speculation.

 

[Arthur97]

As much as I'd love the spirits argument crushed, I want to take the assist trophy part out too. Let it all crumble!

 

[Lamperouge]

He's still not a lock but I'm starting to gain a little more faith for Rex now that ARMS made it into Smash. The supposed XC2 connections in XCDE only further strengthen my optimism that the game could still be relevant enough to warrant getting a character now.

btw Definitive Edition looks ****ing beautiful and I totally need that special edition

 

[fogbadge]

I'm right there with you. An ARMS rep destroys the "relevancy" argument and is probably going to destroy the Spirits argument as well. Between this and XCDE, Rex's chances haven't been this high since base roster speculation.

i think it was destroyed when sakurai said it wasnt a thing while making his excuses for terry

 

[Staarih]

A character from XC2 was supposedly ”too soon” for base roster along with an ARMS character, and now we’re actually getting the latter. So I definitely think Rex is on the table. He (along with Pyra/Mythra) also goes very well with Sakurai’s mentality of giving us new, unique fighters and the concept of driver + blade is certainly that.

 

[SmashChu]

As much as I'd love the spirits argument crushed, I want to take the assist trophy part out too. Let it all crumble!

The problem with Assist is they are a part of the game even if you don't have any DLC. Spirits and Costumes probably matter less. A lot of costumes are based on existing Smash characters already and I don't think anyone cares if a character equips themselves as a spirit.

 

[Arthur97]

The problem with Assist is they are a part of the game even if you don't have any DLC. Spirits and Costumes probably matter less. A lot of costumes are based on existing Smash characters already and I don't think anyone cares if a character equips themselves as a spirit.

Most spirits are part of the game too. Besides, assist trophies can be turned off. It happens on a stage by stage basis with some not being available on certain stages (at least in certain forms) like Alucard not showing up on Wii Fit Studio because of the mirrors and the Moon doesn't show up on several I think (it's also a back ground element of Great Bay). It can certainly be done. Besides, Chrom is still (annoyingly) part of a final smash despite being playable now. What does and does not constitute playable is a bit gray. Being an assist was a relic of restrictions that don't exist any longer.

EDIT: A thought occurred to me, what if the theme of pack two is just stuff that couldn't make into the base game for one reason or another? Kind of like a whole pack of misfits like Plant probably was close to being. Things they just didn't have the time or resources for. After all, the base game broke the trend of more newcomers than the previous installment likely due in part to bringing all of them back. Who knows how much was left on the drawing board. If so, it would bode well not only for Rex, but probably Nintendo fans in general.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

I want Elma more than Rex & Pyra, but at this point I will take any Xenoblade rep since we will be fortunate if we get another one at all in this game. I really want a 2nd Xenoblade rep so it's a win win situation for me if either of the two or three happen.

 

[Powerman293]

IMO, I think Rex would need a redesign for his appearance in Smash to remove the kind of trashy anime aesthetic Xenoblade 2 has. Much like how they polished up Corrin for Smash 4.

 

[RawkHawk2010]

Looking at how things are now, it may seem like a strange omission that there aren’t any new fighters from “Xenoblade Chronicles 2” and “ARMS”. However, this is because they needed to be included from the very beginning at the planning stages. - Sakurai, Jan 2019

If Rex doesn't get in after all this he'll be the single most cucked facet in the eternal history of the franchise, Jesus Christ. (Especially if Future Connected does what I think it will.)

Also, regarding Alvis:

Spoiler

Also, the "core crystal" size could be because it's more a symbolic representation than a physical thing. After all, we dont know how a space time transition event of an aegis core into another dimension might change its appearance. The same rules may not apply. Plus Aegises dont play by real grounded rules anyways. I will say the zohar symbol as part of Alvis's appearance really strongly implies what many fans have speculated. Certainly not something that proves without a doubt that speculation, but it removes a whole lot of doubt from a theory that was already strongly speculated to be true before the alteration of Alvis's design appeared in this latest trailer.

Spoiler

This isn't an in-universe explanation, but the thing about Alvis is that he has to maintain a biologically-normal homs appearance in order to faithfully play his role, and that's gonna be compromised if he has a large cross-shaped crystal embedded in his chest (and one that's glowing at that) during his interactions with Shulk. Monolith isn't going to want to make things too conspicuous for the player either, which is why his Core Crystal is smaller than the other two Aegises' as well as his previously-donned key which conversely didn't mean anything. It's also why it's not glowing/"activated". The indicator of Alvis being Ontos is indirect but it's more than easy to understand why.

IMO, I think Rex would need a redesign for his appearance in Smash to remove the kind of trashy anime aesthetic Xenoblade 2 has. Much like how they polished up Corrin for Smash 4.

Uhhhh...care to elaborate?

 

[SmashChu]

Most spirits are part of the game too. Besides, assist trophies can be turned off. It happens on a stage by stage basis with some not being available on certain stages (at least in certain forms) like Alucard not showing up on Wii Fit Studio because of the mirrors and the Moon doesn't show up on several I think (it's also a back ground element of Great Bay). It can certainly be done. Besides, Chrom is still (annoyingly) part of a final smash despite being playable now. What does and does not constitute playable is a bit gray. Being an assist was a relic of restrictions that don't exist any longer.

EDIT: A thought occurred to me, what if the theme of pack two is just stuff that couldn't make into the base game for one reason or another? Kind of like a whole pack of misfits like Plant probably was close to being. Things they just didn't have the time or resources for. After all, the base game broke the trend of more newcomers than the previous installment likely due in part to bringing all of them back. Who knows how much was left on the drawing board. If so, it would bode well not only for Rex, but probably Nintendo fans in general.

I think you misunderstand. Spirits are just something you "place" on a character. You wont see them during gameplay except on your character icon. Mii Costumes too as the Miis look different and there are already costumes of characters in Ultimate. The reason those can get DLC characters is because of a conscious choices rather than a restriction. They added the costume for, say, Rex, when he wasn't going to be in the game, so the costume was made in lieu of adding the character. This is also why myself and others believe the more recent spirits (such as Resident Evil and Astral Chains) "deconfirms those characters." If they were going to be added as fighters, you'd just save those additions for the DLC spirit board or something.

The issue with Assist trophies is they have a much more pronounced affect on gameplay. They come out and fight not unlike a character. You can also KO a lot of them. Lets say Spring Man is upgraded. Well now you have the character Spring Man and the assist trophy Spring Man. So now you can mix him up for a playable character. You can't have them in the match for this reason. Even if they weren't in the same match, someone could mix up the AT for a character during normal gameplay. Also, while a restriction on which assist can appear does exist, it hasn't been applied to characters, only stages. While some suggest updating Spring Man to Springtron, you are then also changing the game for people who don't have the DLC. Even still, this co-op would only apply to Spring Man. You can't do the same for Krystal.

To summarize, the reason the spirits and costumes matter less is that was a way to add the character when they otherwise intended not to. In Rex's case (as this is his thread), they added his costume because he was popular but didn't make the cut. They planned a lot of the DLC in advance so this also means they excluded Rex and this was a way to make up for that. Now that they are doing a second pass, they can revisit that. In contrast, adding Astral Chain spirits is the same thing: they don't intend to add an Astral Chain character (unfortunately) and added spirits instead. Assist are different as they have a pronoun effect on regular gameplay whether or not you have the DLC.

Looking at how things are now, it may seem like a strange omission that there aren’t any new fighters from “Xenoblade Chronicles 2” and “ARMS”. However, this is because they needed to be included from the very beginning at the planning stages. - Sakurai, Jan 2019

If Rex doesn't get in after all this he'll be the single most cucked facet in the eternal history of the franchise, Jesus Christ. (Especially if Future Connected does what I think it will.)

Care to elaborate

 

[RetrogamerMax]

IMO, I think Rex would need a redesign for his appearance in Smash to remove the kind of trashy anime aesthetic Xenoblade 2 has. Much like how they polished up Corrin for Smash 4.

What's wrong with the anime aesthetic? He is a Japanese character that would be appearing in a Japanese game so there is nothing wrong with any characters in Smash being too anime aesthetic.

 

[RawkHawk2010]

Care to elaborate

I predict that a story titled Future Connected is referring to connecting the futures of XC1 and XC2, meaning Rex will appear. Possibly via Dharkon that dimensional rift.

 

[Arthur97]

I think you misunderstand. Spirits are just something you "place" on a character. You wont see them during gameplay except on your character icon. Mii Costumes too as the Miis look different and there are already costumes of characters in Ultimate. The reason those can get DLC characters is because of a conscious choices rather than a restriction. They added the costume for, say, Rex, when he wasn't going to be in the game, so the costume was made in lieu of adding the character. This is also why myself and others believe the more recent spirits (such as Resident Evil and Astral Chains) "deconfirms those characters." If they were going to be added as fighters, you'd just save those additions for the DLC spirit board or something.

The issue with Assist trophies is they have a much more pronounced affect on gameplay. They come out and fight not unlike a character. You can also KO a lot of them. Lets say Spring Man is upgraded. Well now you have the character Spring Man and the assist trophy Spring Man. So now you can mix him up for a playable character. You can't have them in the match for this reason. Even if they weren't in the same match, someone could mix up the AT for a character during normal gameplay. Also, while a restriction on which assist can appear does exist, it hasn't been applied to characters, only stages. While some suggest updating Spring Man to Springtron, you are then also changing the game for people who don't have the DLC. Even still, this co-op would only apply to Spring Man. You can't do the same for Krystal.

To summarize, the reason the spirits and costumes matter less is that was a way to add the character when they otherwise intended not to. In Rex's case (as this is his thread), they added his costume because he was popular but didn't make the cut. They planned a lot of the DLC in advance so this also means they excluded Rex and this was a way to make up for that. Now that they are doing a second pass, they can revisit that. In contrast, adding Astral Chain spirits is the same thing: they don't intend to add an Astral Chain character (unfortunately) and added spirits instead. Assist are different as they have a pronoun effect on regular gameplay whether or not you have the DLC.

Care to elaborate

I think intent is also very important to consider. Anything done before phase 2 was decided on more or less has to be discarded. Now, we don't know when that was, but the Rex and Springman stuff came early, so it can probably be cast aside for the most part. Spirits though should definitely not be used as a determining factor alone. Oh how quickly people forget about the Mewtwo and Lucas trophies. Now, stuff like the conspicuous addition of Resident Evil spirits, yeah, probably doesn't bode so well for it, but stuff from before the game even launched, well, the landscape may have changed since then.

 

[SmashChu]

I think intent is also very important to consider. Anything done before phase 2 was decided on more or less has to be discarded. Now, we don't know when that was, but the Rex and Springman stuff came early, so it can probably be cast aside for the most part. Spirits though should definitely not be used as a determining factor alone. Oh how quickly people forget about the Mewtwo and Lucas trophies. Now, stuff like the conspicuous addition of Resident Evil spirits, yeah, probably doesn't bode so well for it, but stuff from before the game even launched, well, the landscape may have changed since then.

I'd mostly agree. Rumor is they started planning around the summer. They seem to plan pretty far out in advance in general, so the DLC was likely decided quite early on. Obviously this isn't an issue for Vol 2 for the reasons you mentioned.

I'm not super confident in Rex personally. It is something they may revisit, knowing people want it, but they could also just pass on it without a care. Still, I don't think we can say the spirits and costumes that were decided in mid 2018 are going to affect their decisions in 2019.

 

[Arthur97]

If they went with ARMS over Rex that seems like some odd priorities since it hasn't been confirmed to be series yet while Xenoblade is doing well with still only one fighter. Plus, as I said, this may be the unfinished business pack. Stuff they didn't have time for the first time around.

 

[Bobthealligator]

I predict that a story titled Future Connected is referring to connecting the futures of XC1 and XC2, meaning Rex will appear. Possibly via Dharkon that dimensional rift.

Also the fact that only Melia and Shulk are playable suggests we may be gaining a couple new-ish faces.

 

[SmashChu]

If they went with ARMS over Rex that seems like some odd priorities since it hasn't been confirmed to be series yet while Xenoblade is doing well with still only one fighter. Plus, as I said, this may be the unfinished business pack. Stuff they didn't have time for the first time around.

ARMS sold better than XC2 and does have more of a spotlight. It gets more attention when a new series is added to Smash. XC2 may be something they gloss over as Nintendo has done with Xenoblade in the past.

That said, there is potential the next fighter pass is a Mario character. If that's true, it means Vol 2 is very Nintendo focused and I'd be more confident in Rex.

 

[Arthur97]

Also the fact that only Melia and Shulk are playable suggests we may be gaining a couple new-ish faces.

Is it confirmed they are the only two or just the only two shown. I hope it's the latter. Wasn't the biggest Melia fan.

ARMS sold better than XC2 and does have more of a spotlight. It gets more attention when a new series is added to Smash. XC2 may be something they gloss over as Nintendo has done with Xenoblade in the past.

That said, there is potential the next fighter pass is a Mario character. If that's true, it means Vol 2 is very Nintendo focused and I'd be more confident in Rex.

ARMS kind of disappeared shortly after launch though. It was suddenly thrust back into the spotlight with this, but there has been no mention of a sequel. Meanwhile, Xenoblade is Nintendo's answer to Final Fantasy and is gearing up for a fairly extensive remake of the first game while already having three games. Overall, it seems to be getting more attention from Nintendo themselves as an ongoing series.

 

[chocolatejr9]

Is it confirmed they are the only two or just the only two shown. I hope it's the latter. Wasn't the biggest Melia fan.

ARMS kind of disappeared shortly after launch though. It was suddenly thrust back into the spotlight with this, but there has been no mention of a sequel. Meanwhile, Xenoblade is Nintendo's answer to Final Fantasy and is gearing up for a fairly extensive remake of the first game while already having three games. Overall, it seems to be getting more attention from Nintendo themselves as an ongoing series.

Wait, I thought The Last Story was meant to be Nintendo's answer to Final Fantasy. It was made by the same guy and everything!

 

[Arthur97]

Wait, I thought The Last Story was meant to be Nintendo's answer to Final Fantasy. It was made by the same guy and everything!

Except Xenoblade is actually alive and flourishing after a fairly rocky start thanks likely to the Smash infusion it got. XC2 has seemingly shown that it does have what it takes to continue as a series.

 

[fogbadge]

ARMS kind of disappeared shortly after launch though.

tell that to the long running tournament that only finished a few months back

 

[Arthur97]

tell that to the long running tournament that only finished a few months back

They did that, and they did some DLC (which is more than Super Mario Party got sadly), but the game mostly dropped off. As do most games. As it stands it is a one off. I'm not saying its undeserving, but Xenoblade has established itself as a franchise (even if some like to lump it with other series). The nature of the series means it will likely never become one of the main pantheon (but, hey, Fire Emblem did), but it is deserving of a second fighter at least. It doesn't seem to make sense to pass it over and go to ARMS, unless maybe they're building up to a sequel. Then again, now seems like the perfect time for Xenoblade. Though, E3 had two reveals last year. Perhaps they had planned to show off another there as well which we might still see in whatever they do.

 

[MrJudd]

They did that, and they did some DLC (which is more than Super Mario Party got sadly), but the game mostly dropped off. As do most games. As it stands it is a one off. I'm not saying its undeserving, but Xenoblade has established itself as a franchise (even if some like to lump it with other series). The nature of the series means it will likely never become one of the main pantheon (but, hey, Fire Emblem did), but it is deserving of a second fighter at least. It doesn't seem to make sense to pass it over and go to ARMS, unless maybe they're building up to a sequel. Then again, now seems like the perfect time for Xenoblade. Though, E3 had two reveals last year. Perhaps they had planned to show off another there as well which we might still see in whatever they do.

Xenoblade will probably get into the main pantheon over time because it's "Nintendo's Final Fantasy" right now:
- Fire Emblem is a Strategy RPG with little to 0 world exploration.
- Paper Mario is a sub-series of Mario that lost it's RPG roots and people hope they return to them with the next entry.
- Mario and Luigi is also a sub-series of Mario that has an unknown future.
- Golden Sun & Earthbound were forgotten.
- Bravely Default belongs to Square Enix.
I don't expect it overcoming Fire Emblem, but I expect the IP to grow more and more after each entry, especially how they're keeping the universes and starting plot separeted with each entry, without having to know about every other game.

Spoiler: Xenoblade 1, X & 2 Spoilers

The difference with this series over Final Fantasy is the overarching story that is being told in all games, which is a reward for who played everything: I expect the remake to tie-in to what we already know about Xenoblade 2, while Future Connected ties into Xenoblade 3 by going deeper into a plot point shown in the other games that is still a mystery (Morytha, Samaarians, Judicium, Conduit, Shulk's New World, Mira). I don't know why, but I have a feeling that X will either continue and eventually become part of the story or will be forgotten and we will never know Mira's Secret

 

[fogbadge]

They did that, and they did some DLC (which is more than Super Mario Party got sadly), but the game mostly dropped off. As do most games. As it stands it is a one off. I'm not saying its undeserving, but Xenoblade has established itself as a franchise (even if some like to lump it with other series). The nature of the series means it will likely never become one of the main pantheon (but, hey, Fire Emblem did), but it is deserving of a second fighter at least. It doesn't seem to make sense to pass it over and go to ARMS, unless maybe they're building up to a sequel. Then again, now seems like the perfect time for Xenoblade. Though, E3 had two reveals last year. Perhaps they had planned to show off another there as well which we might still see in whatever they do.

but we dont know theyve passed over xenoblade yet, best not to jump the gun. an arms character is an idea they are returning to re could very well be the same. and do remember whats deserving is subjective, some of us have been saying a major character from nintendo flagship franchise is more than deserving to be in smash but weve got nothing. point is dont rule anyone out until the dlc is over

 

[Sigran101]

Never posted here before but always been a Rex fan. At this point it's just a matter of time. If ARMS is getting in, Rex is 100% getting in too. I'm betting on a reveal in the June direct.

 

[Arthur97]

but we dont know theyve passed over xenoblade yet, best not to jump the gun. an arms character is an idea they are returning to re could very well be the same. and do remember whats deserving is subjective, some of us have been saying a major character from nintendo flagship franchise is more than deserving to be in smash but weve got nothing. point is dont rule anyone out until the dlc is over

That's true. I'm responding that I don't think it would make sense to overlook it and not ARMS. Honestly, both were ripe for some fighters anyway so I do think both should get something here.

Xenoblade will probably get into the main pantheon over time because it's "Nintendo's Final Fantasy" right now:
- Fire Emblem is a Strategy RPG with little to 0 world exploration.
- Paper Mario is a sub-series of Mario that lost it's RPG roots and people hope they return to them with the next entry.
- Mario and Luigi is also a sub-series of Mario that has an unknown future.
- Golden Sun & Earthbound were forgotten.
- Bravely Default belongs to Square Enix.
I don't expect it overcoming Fire Emblem, but I expect the IP to grow more and more after each entry, especially how they're keeping the universes and starting plot separeted with each entry, without having to know about every other game.

Spoiler: Xenoblade 1, X & 2 Spoilers

The difference with this series over Final Fantasy is the overarching story that is being told in all games, which is a reward for who played everything: I expect the remake to tie-in to what we already know about Xenoblade 2, while Future Connected ties into Xenoblade 3 by going deeper into a plot point shown in the other games that is still a mystery (Morytha, Samaarians, Judicium, Conduit, Shulk's New World, Mira). I don't know why, but I have a feeling that X will either continue and eventually become part of the story or will be forgotten and we will never know Mira's Secret

I think it may struggle due to the nature of it. RPGs are generally less popular than some other genres so it has that, and the games are pretty dense. They may simply lack enough general appeal.

Also, was Earthbound forgotten so much as finished? Didn't the creator step away? Either way, I do like that Nintendo now has their own big non-tactical RPG series, but by the nature of that, I'm not convinced it will make it into the big leagues. Plus, it still needs to pass the test of time. XC2 did well, and it's a step in the right direction, but the first one was more of a cult classic and X suffered from the hardware (though, honestly I didn't care for it). Deluxe edition is nice, and it looks amazing, but the series is just now seeming to get its bearing. Now, with the first game being remade, it will very potentially shake off its cult status, and things are generally looking up for the franchise (I am curious to see how the narrative changes and sets up for the future), but being part of the Nintendo pantheon is something else.

Spoiler: Future Connected

Seriously though, what do you think the odds are we'll at least see Rex? I would also love to see Alvis interact with his "sisters."

 

[fogbadge]

That's true. I'm responding that I don't think it would make sense to overlook it and not ARMS. Honestly, both were ripe for some fighters anyway so I do think both should get something here.

exactly, we have a god reason to feel optimistic, though i will remains cautious

as for the dlc

Spoiler

i was hoping the third aegis was being save for xenoblade 3

 

[Arthur97]

One, I don't think it's DLC. Just an epilogue.

Two,

Spoiler

It fit too well for Alvis to be the last one.

 

[fogbadge]

One, I don't think it's DLC. Just an epilogue.

Two,

Spoiler

It fit too well for Alvis to be the last one.

Spoiler

i know, it was always gonna be alvis but i still hoped just a little

 

[Arthur97]

Well, don't worry, with all this, I'd say a 3 is very much in the cards, and I think the potential could be great.

Spoiler

That said, I wonder how a third one would go if it is set after the other two. Would it be both teams, or a new group interacting with them? I'd say it'd probably be the latter, but I'd like the former.

 

[fogbadge]

Well, don't worry, with all this, I'd say a 3 is very much in the cards, and I think the potential could be great.

Spoiler

That said, I wonder how a third one would go if it is set after the other two. Would it be both teams, or a new group interacting with them? I'd say it'd probably be the latter, but I'd like the former.

Spoiler

i think a third one would be in an all together new world, with the connections to the others not becoming clear until later

 

[RawkHawk2010]

Also the fact that only Melia and Shulk are playable suggests we may be gaining a couple new-ish faces.

It looks like the two new Nopon will be functioning as a two-in-one third party member. Explains their close proximity and how both of them could be on the field at once.

 

[chocolatejr9]

View attachment 267983

It looks like the two new Nopon will be functioning as a two-in-one third party member. Explains their close proximity and how both of them could be on the field at once.

*insert Driver and Blade joke here*

 

[Arthur97]

View attachment 267983

It looks like the two new Nopon will be functioning as a two-in-one third party member. Explains their close proximity and how both of them could be on the field at once.

That's a bit of a stretch from one picture. They could just as easily be NPCs.

 

[RawkHawk2010]

That's a bit of a stretch from one picture. They could just as easily be NPCs.

When Shulk, Melia, and the two Nopon are shown exclusively together like this both in and out of game, I dunno what other conclusion to make. Could they be like Tatsu and not have a role in combat? Well, yes...except for the fact that in-game they're shown carrying weapons. (And if you don't think those are weapons, so be it, but just remember that Riki hits people with a dead fish.)

 

[Arthur97]

It still seems weird that that would be their party make up for it. It's also possible they are withholding a certain member for spoiler reasons (even though most of us probably know by now). It's also not unheard of to have NPCs with weapons. We just don't know enough to make statements with certainty. You don't know. I don't know. Especially to go as far as to say they're a two in one deal. It's also entirely possible that the rest of crew shows up later for all the talk of it just being Shulk and Melia. We just don't know enough.

 

[fogbadge]

We just don't know enough.

i imagine they wanted it this way

 

[chocolatejr9]

i imagine they wanted it this way

WHAT!?!? You mean they DIDN'T want to spoil the new content before the game came out!? PERISH THE THOUGHT!!!!!!