Questioning Yoshi

[Damp]

Hey guys. I've been thinking a lot about Yoshi lately.. I;ve aalso bneen drinking heavily tonight. I'm scared that Yoshi can;'t compete at the highest level. I'd like to say that I'm a top 5 Yoshi or so, but it's sstill so hard to win some matchups (Link, Diddy, FLACOOOOO). Even though tose characterrs are thoguht to be OP by mnost of tje PM coommmunity (except falaco bcause EZ gimp gggggg), it's disheartening to lose matcjhips to people I'm clearly better than. I wantr to stick with Yoshi, I really do, but it would be soooo mcuh easyedir to be recognized by the cioomunity if I played ojne of the S tier chars. Convince me to sticj with Yoshi pleasseeeeeee. Love you all.

 

[Nikes]

Amsa took Melee Yoshi to top-level, there's no reason PM Yoshi can't achieve the same with enough player dedication. It's up to you to decide if you want to play to earn a name for yourself or to rep your character.
Do you have any footage of your Yoshi if you claim to be a top 5 Yoshi player?

 

[Damp]

Amsa took Melee Yoshi to top-level, there's no reason PM Yoshi can't achieve the same with enough player dedication. It's up to you to decide if you want to play to earn a name for yourself or to rep your character.
Do you have any footage of your Yoshi if you claim to be a top 5 Yoshi player?

I have no recent footage unfortunately. Although, Tombo claimed me to be top 5 yoshi a while ago before I learned how to ACTUALLY play this strange character. So I'm thinking I'm top 5 Yoshi, though there aren't many of us.

 

[TensenROB]

Once Yoshi's shield is fixed we'll see a bunch of Melee Yoshi players pick him up and he'll have way more tourney results.

There's a lot of people who call themselves top Yoshis even though most have jack squat as far as tournament results go. Yoshi is one of the lowest placing characters in tournaments which shows he has barely any high level players. I bet a lot of good players could be top 2 if they picked up Yoshi as a secondary or even tertiary character. I know there are a lot of good Yoshi players, but there's just a ton of ego over a character that very few people play in the first place and it's kind of annoying tbh.

 

[Damp]

Once Yoshi's shield is fixed we'll see a bunch of Melee Yoshi players pick him up and he'll have way more tourney results.

There's a lot of people who call themselves top Yoshis even though most have jack squat as far as tournament results go. Yoshi is one of the lowest placing characters in tournaments which shows he has barely any high level players. I bet a lot of good players could be top 2 if they picked up Yoshi as a secondary or even tertiary character. I know there are a lot of good Yoshi players, but there's just a ton of ego over a character that very few people play in the first place and it's kind of annoying tbh.

I'll agree with you here. Does it help that I made pro bracket at Mass Madness? Hax, Zero, Mattdotzeb, Slox were all in it, so it makes it somewhat credible. I'd like to say I'm a top Yoshi even though I don't have high placings to back it up. My region (New England) is pretty strong at PM, so it's rough. I have to compete with Wolf (best Link), Spaz (top Lucas/Squirtle), POOB (top DK), Sora (Top Marth), KDJ (yeah, that's korean DJ), Darc( you may know him as second best jigs in melee), the NZA (top 2 Ness), and many more. It's a damn competitive region, and it's rough being a Yoshi. I agree that I could be overrating my abilities, but I really think I'm one of the better Yoshis. Only time will tell. I hope once 3.5 comes he can become more viable.

 

[TensenROB]

I'll agree with you here. Does it help that I made pro bracket at Mass Madness? Hax, Zero, Mattdotzeb, Slox were all in it, so it makes it somewhat credible. I'd like to say I'm a top Yoshi even though I don't have high placings to back it up. My region (New England) is pretty strong at PM, so it's rough. I have to compete with Wolf (best Link), Spaz (top Lucas/Squirtle), POOB (top DK), Sora (Top Marth), KDJ (yeah, that's korean DJ), Darc( you may know him as second best jigs in melee), the NZA (top 2 Ness), and many more. It's a damn competitive region, and it's rough being a Yoshi. I agree that I could be overrating my abilities, but I really think I'm one of the better Yoshis. Only time will tell. I hope once 3.5 comes he can become more viable.

Absolutely time will tell. I want to see you on stream taking sets off the big dogs!

 

[Scatz]

Why should I convince you to keep playing Yoshi? That's a question you need to ask yourself. Personally, I don't play Yoshi in tournament because he's not up to my expectations, but when he is, you'll bet that I'll stick with him, along with my other characters that have helped me get to where I am now.

It's not a bad thing to have backups incase matchups get rough. Just realize that you'll need to know more matchups for your 2nds and 3rds, and that makes things much harder.

The most incentive I'll give you to keep playing Yoshi is to wait until you see the bug fixes (Parry, Shield Roll, Random DJ, etc.).

 

[Damp]

Why should I convince you to keep playing Yoshi? That's a question you need to ask yourself. Personally, I don't play Yoshi in tournament because he's not up to my expectations, but when he is, you'll bet that I'll stick with him, along with my other characters that have helped me get to where I am now.

It's not a bad thing to have backups incase matchups get rough. Just realize that you'll need to know more matchups for your 2nds and 3rds, and that makes things much harder.

The most incentive I'll give you to keep playing Yoshi is to wait until you see the bug fixes (Parry, Shield Roll, Random DJ, etc.).

For backups all I have is my melee skill, which includes fox and a mediocre falco. Both of which can be comboed HARD by most chars. My main in melee is Ice Climbers, who are currently **** in PM. Once they get fixed, I may have a legitimate backup to cover weak matchups, but for now I have to revert to fox and hope my opponent doesn't know how to deal with melee pressure.

 

[Scatz]

Or maybe you could play good enough to not always worry about how hard they get combo'd. If you live on constant hopes, then it's gonna hit you hard when they fall. If you really are looking for a 2ndary, then try out some other characters and see how they feel to you. You won't truly know until you actually mess around with them.

 

[-Maddox-]

3.5 might actually help yoshi a lot. He could be indirectly buffed by other characters getting nerfed.

 

[didds]

Yoshi is fine, he's just the type of character that you need to basically master to get the results. If you can throw fireballs, then you can have a good Mario. All of Yoshi's tools can be tech heavy, and all of them can be answered solidly by your opponent, so he ends up taking a lot of mental game and tech game to do well. I absolutely think he can compete at high level, none of us are quite there yet though... in progress

 

[TomBoComBo]

I'm a Diehard fan of Yoshi, so of course I firmly believe he can compete at high levels. I was told at CEO by ESAM that I play Yoshi, but not the game itself. I realized then, I may play smart, but I just play my own game and hope it's enough to beat everyone else's. Since then, I've worked very hard on not only trying to make my Yoshi the best there is, but also to learn every inconsistency and every little thing about every matchup and every stage and how everything works and how I can use it to my advantage. I'm sure (no offence to anyone) That I know more things about PM Yoshi than any of you, including matchup knowledge, mind games and little tricks like teeter canceling that most people have never heard of. I sparred with @ Mumbo the other night, He can vouch for my knowledge of little stupid things Yoshi can do in some matchups and just in general.

Is PM Yoshi worthy of high level play? My answer is a resounding and overwhelming Yes

 

[Nikes]

I'm a Diehard fan of Yoshi, so of course I firmly believe he can compete at high levels. I was told at CEO by ESAM that I play Yoshi, but not the game itself. I realized then, I may play smart, but I just play my own game and hope it's enough to beat everyone else's. Since then, I've worked very hard on not only trying to make my Yoshi the best there is, but also to learn every inconsistency and every little thing about every matchup and every stage and how everything works and how I can use it to my advantage. I'm sure (no offence to anyone) That I know more things about PM Yoshi than any of you, including matchup knowledge, mind games and little tricks like teeter canceling that most people have never heard of. I sparred with @ Mumbo the other night, He can vouch for my knowledge of little stupid things Yoshi can do in some matchups and just in general.

Is PM Yoshi worthy of high level play? My answer is a resounding and overwhelming Yes

Teeter cancelling? Care to share?

 

[TomBoComBo]

@ Nikes It would be so much easier to show a Gif but I'm unable to capture anything unless it's like 10 frames a second. (I've only got my laptop to work with right now) maybe I can get some stuff later with my hauppage....
Anywho, (tentative name) Teeter canceling is a form of ledge cancel. Obviously you guys know what the teeter animation is, when the character does an animation at the edge of a platform or stage edge like "oh noes, I might fall!".
that animation has priority over any other aerial animation (or at least Fair and Dair in Yoshis case). It's precise, but it's an instantaneous cancel out of at least those two moves. @ Mumbo knows of it can can vouch for it. It's a ledge cancel that keeps you on the platform

 

[TensenROB]

@ Nikes It would be so much easier to show a Gif but I'm unable to capture anything unless it's like 10 frames a second. (I've only got my laptop to work with right now) maybe I can get some stuff later with my hauppage....
Anywho, (tentative name) Teeter canceling is a form of ledge cancel. Obviously you guys know what the teeter animation is, when the character does an animation at the edge of a platform or stage edge like "oh noes, I might fall!".
that animation has priority over any other aerial animation (or at least Fair and Dair in Yoshis case). It's precise, but it's an instantaneous cancel out of at least those two moves. @ Mumbo knows of it can can vouch for it. It's a ledge cancel that keeps you on the platform

This works with Yoshi's other aerials as well but you gotta tap toward the ledge a bit.

 

[Nikes]

Right that makes a lot more sense now, thanks.

 

[TomBoComBo]

here's an example
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tVcSy-OoBMA#t=303

 

[Mumbo]

@ TomBoComBo Why don't we make character specific matchup threads? Some of the most useful things that you showed me the other night were the little tricks that help immensely for particular matchups, such as the dash attack edgegaurd on Ike. I read your write-up on Fox/Falco, and I think there are plenty of things to learn from it and plenty of things to question. A collaborative write-up like that would be super useful for each character. We could have people posting their sets with characters in those threads if they want help with the matchup or they want to show off. Most of all, it would consolidate and organize all of our knowledge, so people can find what they need quickly and easily rather than digging through the matchup thread.

 

[didds]

sounds like a good idea, I have fast fingers but definitely don't have the same extensive matchup knowledge that a lot of other players here do have.

 

[TomBoComBo]

@ Mumbo
I thought about that and I would be totally down. I wonder if we could create a sub-forum so that we have Threads pertaining to specific matchups (so we don't flood the general Yoshi boards and we don't have a thread with everything making people hunt down matchup info and then ask randomly at the bottom of the thread. MODERATORS! MAKE THIS POSSIBLE PLEASE~~~

With that in mind, I must also state that I have not mastered the technical part of Yoshi, only the mental part. I lack DJC aerials close to the ground, turnaround DJC aerials close to the ground and the ledge eggrthow stall shinanagans.
I will post everything I remember off the top of my head and then you guys can add to it and vice versa. I'll also work to get footage and make a list of things I have to record.

Lastly, with the top of this post in mind, Let me make a new thread pitching that idea, if anyone Knows a moderator, ask them if this is do-able and even tell them that every character forum should have the option for specific matchup-based forums

 

[SSBM_Sora]

Hey guys. I've been thinking a lot about Yoshi lately.. I;ve aalso bneen drinking heavily tonight. I'm scared that Yoshi can;'t compete at the highest level. I'd like to say that I'm a top 5 Yoshi or so, but it's sstill so hard to win some matchups (Link, Diddy, FLACOOOOO). Even though tose characterrs are thoguht to be OP by mnost of tje PM coommmunity (except falaco bcause EZ gimp gggggg), it's disheartening to lose matcjhips to people I'm clearly better than. I wantr to stick with Yoshi, I really do, but it would be soooo mcuh easyedir to be recognized by the cioomunity if I played ojne of the S tier chars. Convince me to sticj with Yoshi pleasseeeeeee. Love you all.

Who cares about being recognized? If you love the character, have the commitment, and love the game, whats stopping you?

 

[didds]

I care about being recognized a bit.
It's nice and great for my ego.