Project Melee 2.0 - Young Link

[TheBuzzSaw]

For one of my upcoming blog entries (see my sig), I am posting an article about how the creators might go about "fixing" Young Link to bring him up to par with higher tier characters (similar to the many character repair article featured in the Super Smash Blog). However, rather than attack the issue all by myself, I want your input (the Young Link forums need life). If Nintendo were to release Melee 2.0, how would they go about improving Young Link? Please be sure to only post fair buffs/nerfs. No fantasies: "HIS DSMASH SHOULD KO @ 0% AND BRAKE SHEELDS!!!1!"

I will start off by addressing the boomerang. For how slow it takes to come out, I see one of two needed buffs: (1) -- If the boomerang is already out, Young Link should not do the throw animation. It is silly how on top of being ridiculously slow to launch, Young Link can completely expose himself for basically a full second with no benefits. The intent was obviously to punish just trying to throw the boomerang over and over, but it was too big of a punishment. (2) -- The boomerang should come out in about half the time. The boomerang came out instantly in the actual Zelda games, so the slowness is clearly an attempt at balance. It was simply too much.

 

[Silvaxe]

Maybe the hookshot should be a lil longer or less lag then links since links is longer. I can't think of any nerfs...

 

[TheBuzzSaw]

In regards to Young Link's bombs, I think they need to fly faster and travel at least 50% farther. Too many characters have physical attacks that out-range and out-prioritize the bomb.

And I agree with the hookshot, Silvaxe. I personally would prefer that it have less lag when it misses. Being longer would be nice for recoveries, but I feel his up-B sort of makes up for that.

 

[D20]

A couple of really simple things would be...

1. Silghtly faster jabs and utilts.

2. Fsmash only being the second half of his current fsmash.

3. Longer stun on the arrows (similar to Ness' PK Fire).

4. A bair more like Mario's.

 

[TheBuzzSaw]

I would actually prefer that the first part of the forward-smash better position the opponent for the second hit. It should also push the opponent away if they shield.

 

[Silvaxe]

In regards to Young Link's bombs, I think they need to fly faster and travel at least 50% farther. Too many characters have physical attacks that out-range and out-prioritize the bomb.

And I agree with the hookshot, Silvaxe. I personally would prefer that it have less lag when it misses. Being longer would be nice for recoveries, but I feel his up-B sort of makes up for that.

yep, bombs should fly faster but they do more damage then links(Because they can hit 4 times(Link's hits max 2))., but links flys farther O.o...and what do u mean by out range and out priortize the bomb??? I must know!!!

 

[Silvaxe]

A couple of really simple things would be...

1. Silghtly faster jabs and utilts.

2. Fsmash only being the second half of his current fsmash.

3. Longer stun on the arrows (similar to Ness' PK Fire).

4. A bair more like Mario's.

Number 3, I agree.

 

[TheBuzzSaw]

When you play against awesome opponents (particularly good Ganondorf players), they just eat up projectiles like candy.

 

[Chip.]

When you play against awesome opponents (particularly good Ganondorf players), they just eat up projectiles like candy.

No they don't. Even a good Ganon actually has a hard time keeping up vs a campy young Link imo.

Anyway, I'll post something useful probably tomarrow when I'm not too tired to think *yawns*

 

[Silvaxe]

Like on a small level yes ganon will eat the projectiles up...

 

[Giggidax]

like on small levels, ganon does eat up projectiles.

because i feed them to him like cake to a fat boy, ganons to big and bulky to avoid any projectiles.
altho i have played ganondorfs who can weave thru my arrows/bombs/boomerang....

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

you guys obviously have never played a decent ganon. play vs eddie/tipman/any other known ganon and see what they do. all of ganon's moves have TONS of priority and all go thru your spam.

 

[D20]

I've played Joe Bushman, Renth, and Linguini... I typically lose, but the games are almost always close. Young Link just has to work much harder than Ganon does. If you get off of the stage, you die. However, edgegaurding should go both ways. I say Ganon wins that match 7 out of 10 times.

 

[Renth]

I've played Joe Bushman, Renth, and Linguini... I typically lose, but the games are almost always close. Young Link just has to work much harder than Ganon does. If you get off of the stage, you die. However, edgegaurding should go both ways. I say Ganon wins that match 7 out of 10 times.

I miss you Rob

 

[D20]

I <3 you Mark.

 

[takieddine]

you should be here playing me noob.

 

[D20]

Sorry Taki, but I have big business tonight. I'll actually be around a lil bit tommorrow though.

Also, we should stop spamming the Young Link threads... ironic, eh?

 

[technomancer]

Buzz, if you did your original suggestion, the boomerang would combo into itself on fastfallers w/ throw catch repeat almost as much as you wanted

 

[RikyuXz]

hm.. buffs for ylink.... well you could give him more power in general...

and maybe a few more kill moves..

but then it just wouldn't be young link anymore..

ya know what i mean?

 

[Chip.]

you guys obviously have never played a decent ganon. play vs eddie/tipman/any other known ganon and see what they do. all of ganon's moves have TONS of priority and all go thru your spam.

I have played NoobKing's Ganon. NoobKing is ranked 5th in B.C. Canada, has played Eddie and went blow for blow in their matches (they were about even), and also went to 0C3 and got 25th; tieing with Isai, the GERM, and DJ Combo.

I'm pretty sure I've played a good Ganon =P the best one in all of Canada.

imo, it's an even matchup

 

[TheBuzzSaw]

I have played NoobKing's Ganon. NoobKing is ranked 5th in B.C. Canada, has played Eddie and went blow for blow in their matches (they were about even), and also went to 0C3 and got 25th; tieing with Isai, the GERM, and DJ Combo.

I'm pretty sure I've played a good Ganon =P the best one in all of Canada.

imo, it's an even matchup

OK, so you have Young Link skills, but you apparently lack reading skills. Why are you debating this in this thread? Seriously, GTFO...

 

[Chip.]

OK, so you have Young Link skills, but you apparently lack reading skills. Why are you debating this in this thread? Seriously, GTFO...

Apparently you lack both...

I said I would post something useful later (i said 'tomarrow' but i meant some time later =p). Plus there were more people than just me going off debating on the Ganon tangent on this thread, so don't go all butt-hurt over just me. I'm done posting about that stuff now, now on to the good stuff ^_^

I've got a nice list of buffs/ advancements for young Link.

First of all, I would like to start off with attack speed. Surprisingly, young Link does not have very fast attacks at all. For example, his jab. Young Link's jab comes out and hits his opponent in 6 frames. Most charachter's jabs come out and hit their opponent in 2 frames; a substantial difference. I will admit that young Link's jab usually gets the job done with 6 frame speed, but it would still be a nice addition. Young Link's f-tilt, u-tilt, d-tilt, usmash, dsmash, fsmash ALL come out within 9-14ish frames (utilt about 9 and dtilt about 14). You can just take a look at other charachter's frame statistics and can see young Link doesn't compare THAT well, but still alright.

All right, the second thing is young Link's grab; a glaring weakness of our young Link. The fastest grab in the game (is tied with many charachters) comes out in 7 frames, while young Link's come out in 11 frames. Sure it's got great range (3rd longest in the game ^_^ yeeaahuuz!) but the range is not compensated equally enough for it's generally slow speed. I would much rather have a fast grab than a really long grab, only because young Link is HIGHLY limited in his sheild game vs charachters such as Fox and Falco's arials, while any other charachter in the game can sheild grab (some of the time) Fox and Falco's arials even when L-cancelled.

Another addition is the 0 lag factor after initiating special B projectile moves (like Sheik, Fox, and Falco). I mean, isn't it fair enough that young Link have little-to-no lag after B move projectiles in the air too? Seriously, SH boomerang, bomb, and bow would make young Link a WAY more effective and efficient spammer. If young Link had this ability, then his spam game might actually be able to compete against Fox's spam when in this matchup.

I would also like to mention that young Link needs a stronger "all-purpose" arial. I say arial instead of attack because young Link has a great D-smash. The D-smash is a great utility attack that is great for killing or edgeguarding and is quick and has little lag (along with the Double-Hit from behind too). I would say young Link's nair is a good all-purpose arial, but it just doesn't have enough . . . . *humph*. What I mean by "*humph*" is that young Link's nair doesn't have the same *humph* as Falcon's Knee does, or Sheik's Fair, or Fox's Uair, or Falco's Dair, etc. The nair does have great priority and is a good killing move for young Link, but it doesn't have enough *humph* like those other moves of other charachters. I mean Falcon's knee has HUGE knockback, and same with Sheik's Fair, or Fox's Uair which can juggle AND kill, or Falco's Dair which has combo ability and can spike, as previously mentioned. Not just that, but these charachters have more than just ONE *humph* arial, like Fox and Falco have the powerful bair and nair or Sheik who has Bair and Uair which can unleash powerful knockback as well. Sadly, young Link's nair just doesn't deliver like some charachter's arial game does.

I have more to come. . . so to be continued I guess XD

 

[Silvaxe]

What happen to "Protect Melee 2.0 - Young Link".

 

[Laijin]

I have played Chaddd.
He has two stocked Eddie and has beaten Tipman
I two stocked him like 2 times in a row.

You just need to know the match up

 

[chaddd]

I have played Chaddd.
He has two stocked Eddie and has beaten Tipman
I two stocked him like 2 times in a row.

You just need to know the match up

You = lame for this post alone.

You never beat me when I was sober, and you never beat me in tournament or in any match that's remotely serious. Don't list who I've beaten like it's some trophy for you to use based on 2 out of god knows how many friendlies.

EDIT: Btw I believe I 3 stocked both Eddie and Tipman. At least get it right. =P

 

[Laijin]

You = lame for this post alone.

You never beat me when I was sober, and you never beat me in tournament or in any match that's remotely serious. Don't list who I've beaten like it's some trophy for you to use based on 2 out of god knows how many friendlies.

EDIT: Btw I believe I 3 stocked both Eddie and Tipman. At least get it right. =P

laawlz.
cool.
Yea. Sorry. I should'nt use specific examples.

I was just too into making a point.

Edit: btw. For the record. It was out of 3 friendlies and you seemed pretty sober to me.
But lets not argue plz. I'd rather not repeat what happened between us last time.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

I have played NoobKing's Ganon. NoobKing is ranked 5th in B.C. Canada, has played Eddie and went blow for blow in their matches (they were about even), and also went to 0C3 and got 25th; tieing with Isai, the GERM, and DJ Combo.

I'm pretty sure I've played a good Ganon =P the best one in all of Canada.

imo, it's an even matchup

eddie sucks in ganon dittos. like REALLY bad. when i was a total noob and haddnt played ganon in months i went blow for blow with eddie.

and instead of naming people this guy tied with in a tourney (last place tie, wow thats something to be proud of) try naming some good people he beat.

 

[Chip.]

eddie sucks in ganon dittos. like REALLY bad. when i was a total noob and haddnt played ganon in months i went blow for blow with eddie.

and instead of naming people this guy tied with in a tourney (last place tie, wow thats something to be proud of) try naming some good people he beat.

At 0C3 he beat Zoap, Wolf, and Sa2Jeff. Point is, I've played a good Ganon.

 

[chaddd]

laawlz.
cool.
Yea. Sorry. I should'nt use specific examples.

I was just too into making a point.

Edit: btw. For the record. It was out of 3 friendlies and you seemed pretty sober to me.
But lets not argue plz. I'd rather not repeat what happened between us last time.

I wuv you Laijin. No more dramaboards, man. Ever.