Project M Social Thread

[stingers]

I saw that edit raph.

 

[RaphaelRobo]

I disagree. I think you didn't see it, and you're trying to mess with me.

On topic, though, I think Samus and ZSS are going to come out next. Because, you know, they said they would. While I'd really like Kirby to be out next (because if I'm stupid enough to play Kirby in Melee, I might as well play the good version of him), I don't think it'll happen.

 

[Strong Badam]

This, and also the way that people generalize an entire character and its playstyle based on the way that LITERALLY ONE SINGLE PERSON plays it. Any time someone makes a post like that, I just assume that they're new players and haven't seen any other Jigglypuffs ever play.

jiggs is dumb

 

[standardtoaster]

good **** SB

 

[Archangel]

Sounds like I pissed alot of people off. When I said it "put a stain on the results"so many people jumped on ignoring the last part of that sentence."for me personally?"

so yeah...shut up right back. I also went on to say that it was a good sign seeing characters like Zelda and Wario in the top five with characters like Puff. So yeah...read everything I say before you jump on the first few words of a post.


In any case there were some good enough sets that it got alot of new people interested. There were also alot of people hating on the game. I believe never before seen/hyped grand finals could've left a better final impression. The same way I believe the finals of Apex 2012 could've left a better final impression. Also the same way the final results of pound 4 could've left a better impression. Still...I personally was really hyped during Losers finals. I think that set (specifically the last match, was one of the better finals I've seen so far and the last match game 5 had a similar feel to some of the better melee feel to it. Hbox being able to win with puff does have it's positives as someone pointed out. seeing the better player still wins is a good thing and discredits the idea that some nerds are just hacking the game to make their favorite characters the best. However too much of this I feel could give melee players the impression that trying this could be a waste of time. That the best melee players with the best melee characters are going to win anyway so "Why not just play melee?". Don't agree with it but if the she starts to fit what's to stop this project from crashing in the long run? Anyway.....that is my opinion and i'm entitled to it. If you don't like it you can suck my ****.

 

[9Kplus1]

So about that DDD...

yo carroll, how much D3 did you use at Zenith?

 

[Sapphire Dragon]

Not necessarily, the most *balanced* CPU would be at level 5, but the most 'human' like would vary because of flaws in the AI (they love to walk into charged smashes no matter what difficulty you're playing on and they can't truly play the game of minds), and characters having optimal play styles or metagames that are biased towards an offensive or defensive play style. However, it'd make the AI more dynamic and the player more capable of 'practicing' against different styles of play, which in my opinion is highly important because people are all different. [collapse=More]

I just had another idea though, what if we used another modifier (like handicap is being used for buffer) to change another trait of the AI (Either skill or some other trait like Reactive/Proactive Offensive/Defensive [they're not the same]) so that there can be as many as 90 combinations of AI rather than just 9. At that point though that'd be asking the devs to suicide themselves on the traits of the AI rather than focusing on what's really important here which is gameplay.

The AI is a nice little treat because not everyone is exactly able to find a partner to play against 24/7, however, the main focus is the mechanics and the gameplay, the AI certainly can wait a bit if it means getting a polished game for multiplayer first. Though thinking of ways to improve the AI is fun, I'd personally like to see a few new characters come out first.

So lets speculate on who is coming out next , shall we?[/collapse]

Well, I did assume the most human like would be the balance of the two, since the dynamics of competitive play often include parts of both, but it makes sense that 4 or 6 would be more suited to adapt to people's offensive and defensive playstyles.

Also, that AI change sounds amazing. Maybe after the final build is out, they can potentially implement this gradually through more patches. :D

I think the next characters to come out will be the ones easiest to code and not dependent on others- basically Squirtle, Ivysaur, Wolf, Olimar, and MK. I can see Samus/ZSS and ICs being buggy, Diddy needs his banana move replaced, Yoshi needs to have new coding for his egg lay move, and Kirby needs a hat and a B move for all characters. Olimar actually might be buggy too with Pikmin and all, so he may or may not be in the next release.

 

[standardtoaster]

Replaced with what?.. Saying something should be replaced doesn't help if you don't say what it should be instead.

 

[stingers]

I really doubt they'd release a v3 without every character in it =/

 

[Mottie]

Sounds like I pissed alot of people off. When I said it "put a stain on the results"so many people jumped on ignoring the last part of that sentence."for me personally?"

so yeah...shut up right back. I also went on to say that it was a good sign seeing characters like Zelda and Wario in the top five with characters like Puff. So yeah...read everything I say before you jump on the first few words of a post.


In any case there were some good enough sets that it got alot of new people interested. There were also alot of people hating on the game. I believe never before seen/hyped grand finals could've left a better final impression. The same way I believe the finals of Apex 2012 could've left a better final impression. Also the same way the final results of pound 4 could've left a better impression. Still...I personally was really hyped during Losers finals. I think that set (specifically the last match, was one of the better finals I've seen so far and the last match game 5 had a similar feel to some of the better melee feel to it. Hbox being able to win with puff does have it's positives as someone pointed out. seeing the better player still wins is a good thing and discredits the idea that some nerds are just hacking the game to make their favorite characters the best. However too much of this I feel could give melee players the impression that trying this could be a waste of time. That the best melee players with the best melee characters are going to win anyway so "Why not just play melee?". Don't agree with it but if the she starts to fit what's to stop this project from crashing in the long run? Anyway.....that is my opinion and i'm entitled to it. If you don't like it you can suck my ****.

You know, being a vindictive ****** and over-highlighting "personally" just makes you look dumb. Don't be dumb.

People are allowed to disagree with your opinion, it was the people who were going "**** Hbox because he plays" that were pissing everyone off because well, nobody likes when people act like little children because their favorite didn't win. Seeing both old and new characters in the fray, causing new and unusual matchups that may just mix up the metagame compared to a 10 year old game might actually breathe some life into the smash community and get people to come and play P:M as well as whatever game they're already playing. Because it's welcoming to both Melee and Brawl players, this is a good thing, it unites the community rather than dividing it further. Think of that. People are going to play their characters however they are comfortable with and if you don't like that then well, you don't have to watch.

Oh wait. You just told everyone who disagrees to suck your ****, perhaps you should take your own advice.

 

[PGH Carroll]

Not as much D3 as Mario but still
IIRC my first set my d3 vs charizard
And me vs gunblaze was Mario/d3 vs marth/snake

I like d3 against fast fallers and heavys. There were like.. No spacies in this for me to show off the finer parts of my D3

 

[genkaku]

It sucks that I triple knee'd you on a accident though.

that is some accident.

 

[Archangel]

You know, being a vindictive ****** and over-highlighting "personally" just makes you look dumb. Don't be dumb.

People are allowed to disagree with your opinion, it was the people who were going "**** Hbox because he plays" that were pissing everyone off because well, nobody likes when people act like little children because their favorite didn't win. Seeing both old and new characters in the fray, causing new and unusual matchups that may just mix up the metagame compared to a 10 year old game might actually breathe some life into the smash community and get people to come and play P:M as well as whatever game they're already playing. Because it's welcoming to both Melee and Brawl players, this is a good thing, it unites the community rather than dividing it further. Think of that. People are going to play their characters however they are comfortable with and if you don't like that then well, you don't have to watch.

Oh wait. You just told everyone who disagrees to suck your ****, perhaps you should take your own advice.

you missed everything by about 20298340983294 miles. The reason for the response isn't because everyone disagreed with me it's because after *insert hateful comment about me for something clearly stated as an opinion* they then went on to reverberate EXACTLY what the **** I was saying. Meaning they 1 of 2 things.

1. Can't read.

2. didn't read.


as for taking my own advice? you want me to suck my own ****?.....not everyone can take advantage of double joints the way you do buddy.

 

[Mottie]

Replaced with what?.. Saying something should be replaced doesn't help if you don't say what it should be instead.

Well to be fair , it's not like one can come up with a new move right on the fly, but I'd personally like to see Diddy's Down B become more like Link's bombs, a utility projectile rather than an item to be abused to the point where it breaks the metagame, it winds up being like Sheiks throws where if a character wound up doing poorly against her grabs, they wound up much worse off than a character who could get around them. I like the idea of stage hazards being placed by players, because it makes stage control more important and ironically forces the player to approach an opponent before he sets up the hazards. Perhaps maybe just reducing the number of bananas that Didds can have would help balance that out.

Also I wonder of the character select screen can handle more characters than is the allotted maximum for the normal game, or if that part of the game will also have to be modified for the extended cast, I'd imagine that the portion of the code that's controlling that is dynamic to allow for more slots as more characters are unlocked , however, one could also assume that the programmers (Vbrawls, not P:Ms) are lazy so that it'll break once you reach the maximum amount of characters (equal to the full cast of the vanilla game) and will have to fix that too when they get to that issue.

 

[KingClubber]

Take it somewhere else guys...

 

[RaphaelRobo]

I really doubt they'd release a v3 without every character in it =/

This seems likely.

You'd better be careful, stingers. When v3 comes out, my Kirby is going to take down all of NCSU.

 

[9Kplus1]

you want me to suck my own ****?.....not everyone can take advantage of double joints the way you do buddy.

It's not that bad, actually. Self-fellatio is very similar to threading a fairly thick string through a small needle hoop -- so satisfying once you do it correctly. The best part is that is that it's not gay, but another form of masturbation.

I can see Samus/ZSS and ICs being buggy, Diddy needs his banana move replaced, Yoshi needs to have new coding for his egg lay move, and Kirby needs a hat and a B move for all characters. Olimar actually might be buggy too with Pikmin and all, so he may or may not be in the next release.

Zero Suit isn't buggy to the point where she's unplayable. Rather she's unfinished; there are / were some coding limitations preventing Samus from being very close to, if not exactly like her Melee counterpart. Yoshi's shield is his biggest problem, actually, as without parrying, his defensive game is gimped pretty hard.

Moreover, to add a bit of water to this fire -- and despite it being pretty irrelevant -- a lot of the newcomers perform well against Puff. Matter of fact, DDD vs Puff is my favorite MU, right after DDD vs Zelda.

 

[Archangel]

Hbox Playstyle + Commentators made this tournament pretty fking terrible for Project:M's PR.

Sorry guys, but that PM tournament was pretty boring to watch.

=/

Ryoko vs Chu was good, but.. yeah that was pretty much it.

Sorry

yeaaa.

But, it was really bad for PM's reputation.

The fact that Hbox won project M kind of put a huge stain of **** on it for me personally... -_-. More specifically a Puff. happening.

What everyone saw.

Then again it's kind of the point to make everyone competitively viable without nerfing and well the results do show a very mixed placing. I still want to see what happens when regional or even national tournaments get started

What everyone seemingly FAILED to see.


As you can see in the comments above me as well alot of players(including one that has had a HUGE hand in project M hyping) said they felt it was not the best showing we could've had.... so why would I get singled out for making a post that is neutral at worse?

 

[Sapphire Dragon]

Replaced with what?.. Saying something should be replaced doesn't help if you don't say what it should be instead.

Sorry about that x.x I was really just listing why I thought some characters won't be in the next release, but I honestly don't know of any moves that could replace it. That's why I thought he wouldn't be finished soon, because he needs a new move. Maybe bananas could just be recoded instead to give knockback and damage, and not make the character trip? Or maybe he could have a banana whip that swings down when in the air, and swings around him on the ground?

 

[Mottie]

What everyone saw.

What everyone seemingly FAILED to see.


As you can see in the comments above me as well alot of players(including one that has had a HUGE hand in project M hyping) said they felt it was not the best showing we could've had.... so why would I get singled out for making a post that is neutral at worse?

Mostly because you're acting like you're being persecuted on an internet forum. That tends to make people not like you terribly much, sorry.

It's not that bad, actually. Self-fellatio is very similar to threading a fairly thick string through a small needle hoop -- so satisfying once you do it correctly. The best part is that is that it's not gay, but another form of masturbation.

Autofellatio is a very important skill for the wise to know, as one will never know when they will be put into the position to suck their own ****.

 

[Comeback Kid]

Ok, I did make a joke at your expense Arrows, I'm sorry. But it was more about your thread personality and not your salty Puff comment. Let it drop everyone.

 

[RaphaelRobo]

so why would I get singled out for making a post that is neutral at worse?

You posted last. That's the way life works. The contents of the post relative to other peoples don't matter, the fact is you were the last one to say something, so you're what everyone remembers, quotes, and responds to.

 

[GP&B]

I can see v3 not having Olimar and ICs.

 

[KingBlaze777]

yeh i h8 project m now becuz hungay box win a tournament and all he does is bair bair bair itz so unfar 4 everbody plying lke a man like meng0 and project m neds to b patchd out so u cant win by ding puff gey and cheep stuff u gota ply wth skill and honor u no wut i mean?

Can anyone please translate what this guy said? All I understood was "I don't know how to spell correctly and I'm in desperate need of English lessons and guidance in the art of writing".

 

[Comeback Kid]

Can anyone please translate what this guy said? All I understood was "I don't know how to spell correctly and I'm in desperate need of English lessons and guidance in the art of writing".

I think it's satire.

 

[Sapphire Dragon]

Zero Suit isn't buggy to the point where she's unplayable. Rather she's unfinished; there are / were some coding limitations preventing Samus from being very close to, if not exactly like her Melee counterpart. Yoshi's shield is his biggest problem, actually, as without parrying, his defensive game is gimped pretty hard.

Ahhhh, I see. :o Thanks for the updates on that then :D Maybe Samus/ZSS will be finished a little sooner than I thought. Hopefully Yoshi is too, though that sounds like a bit of a bigger issue.

 

[9Kplus1]

Sorry about that x.x I was really just listing why I thought some characters won't be in the next release, but I honestly don't know of any moves that could replace it. That's why I thought he wouldn't be finished soon, because he needs a new move. Maybe bananas could just be recoded instead to give knockback and damage, and not make the character trip? Or maybe he could have a banana whip that swings down when in the air, and swings around him on the ground?

If anything, I'd rather see Diddy's Dash Attack get a huge buff so I can play swagtastic kawaii desu doubles with Guy.

In all seriousness, though, it would be great if Diddy kept his silly single-nanner game.

 

[Comeback Kid]

Wait 9K, wasn't it you that has said Zero Suit is basically finished except for her connection with Samus being tethered and therefore she's not releasable.

Now she sounds like more of a mess by your account.

 

[MaxThunder]

Well, I did assume the most human like would be the balance of the two, since the dynamics of competitive play often include parts of both, but it makes sense that 4 or 6 would be more suited to adapt to people's offensive and defensive playstyles.

Also, that AI change sounds amazing. Maybe after the final build is out, they can potentially implement this gradually through more patches. :D

I think the next characters to come out will be the ones easiest to code and not dependent on others- basically Squirtle, Ivysaur, Wolf, Olimar, and MK. I can see Samus/ZSS and ICs being buggy, Diddy needs his banana move replaced, Yoshi needs to have new coding for his egg lay move, and Kirby needs a hat and a B move for all characters. Olimar actually might be buggy too with Pikmin and all, so he may or may not be in the next release.

LOL...
hello this is ten characters...

 

[Archangel]

Mostly because you're acting like you're being persecuted on an internet forum. That tends to make people not like you terribly much, sorry.

It's not the persecution. I've been persecuted on and off for years now by different people and it doesn't bother me. What bothers me is being persecuted on some phony nonsense. I was in this thread years before you got here. Back when Project M looked like complete **** I was defending it. Fought tooth and nail with some of the same people who play the game now actually. I've put myself on the line for a vision of this game LONG before any of it was evident or seemingly possible.... There are others who've been here for as long as I have or longer and they'll tell you it's true. Love me, hate me, want to date me...whatever their relationship with me is They'll tell you that I've always had Project M's best interest in mind.

 

[Sapphire Dragon]

Whoops, forgot Wolf was already released. XD I just looked at http://projectm.dantarion.com/characters/ and Wolf looked greyscale too, but it didn't help that Wolf's color was mostly grey anyway. XD

 

[9Kplus1]

Wait 9K, wasn't it you that has said Zero Suit is basically finished except for her connection with samus being tethered and therefore she's not releasable.

Now she sounds like more of a mess by your accounr.

Foremost, that was only a neato educated guess for Yeroc's Demo 2 roster riddle. Secondly, having faith in a non-PMBRer's word is not the wisest thing to do. Even if I were correct, it should be well noted that I'm not dumb, or a complete ******; even if I'd acquired detailed knowledge about P:M character matters, I wouldn't spoil anything that the PMBR hasn't told the public, yet, as it's very likely said information is being kept secret from the public for a reason. Finally:

Zero Suit isn't buggy to the point where she's unplayable. Rather she's unfinished; there are / were some coding limitations preventing Samus from being very close to, if not exactly like her Melee counterpart.

We've all seen Zero Suit Samus in action. A lot of people can attest to her not being buggy. If you'd kept up with the stream's she's been featured in, then you'd realize that Zero Suit Samus, with her seemingly constant changes, was not finished in time for the Demo 2 release. "Basically finished" is most certainly an inaccurate way of describing a character than isn't even in Demo 2 >.>.

 

[Sapphire Dragon]

Foremost, that was only a neato educated guess for Yeroc's Demo 2 roster riddle. Secondly, having faith in a non-PMBRer's word is not the wisest thing to do. Even if I were correct, it should be well noted that I'm not dumb, or a complete ******; even if I'd acquired detailed knowledge about P:M character matters, I wouldn't spoil anything that the PMBR hasn't told the public, yet, as it's very likely said information is being kept secret from the public for a reason.

I actually thought you were in the PMBR, or at least part of the team in some way.

>>

 

[RaphaelRobo]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't there an announcement of a character expansion shortly after Demo 2's release? I remember it being announced at the same time as the bug fix, and both Samus characters being confirmed for the expansion.

 

[MaxThunder]

I think some PMBR said that samus/zamus would likely be in when they release more characters, but that it will be a while before they do...

 

[GP&B]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't there an announcement of a character expansion shortly after Demo 2's release? I remember it being announced at the same time as the bug fix, and both Samus characters being confirmed for the expansion.

I swear I saw that post too, but last time I remember asking was when monk (or some PMBR member) told me that this was not happening.

 

[Jonny Westside]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't there an announcement of a character expansion shortly after Demo 2's release? I remember it being announced at the same time as the bug fix, and both Samus characters being confirmed for the expansion.

Yeah, they're planning on releasing some "DLC" type content to expand the roster this fall, I'm quite sure that's what the post said. Yeroc said it.

 

[RaphaelRobo]

So I looked back and found Yeroc's post, which was on the 18th. It looks like it was edited 12 days later, on the 30th, to remove the announcement. It's clear from people's reactions that it was the right post, though.

So yeah, I guess we can assume there won't be a DLC. Or, if there is, they want to re-announce it.

 

[Jonny Westside]

Ah, thanks for taking the time to find it. Let's assume he removed it because of that deadline anxiety the PMBR have lol

 

[leelue]

A)I guess i'd have to see more of his work, but every time i watch a match of his (playing Sonic) he never leaves the stage, only edge guards.


B)All i see him do is rush, attack, and Dash Dance. Very few times have i seen him really try to avoid an attack, and when i thought he would he'd try to squeeze in an attack. And i don't know what you mean by "Here I was thinking that Spring time has passed.



C) I don't think you know what a kill setup is.....or maybe you know them a leads?

I dunno....But Sonic has like 4 different kill setups,.....5 really but that last 1 is kinda hard to pull of in melee's physics.

A) outside of sonic's spring, his offstage game is not very good. Out of the 20ish characters I can talk about, sonic has a worse "offstage game" than a majority of them. If you think his offstage game is up to par with Mario, luigi, DK, captain, ganon, sheik, pit, marth, ike, pikachu, puff, fox, link, or DDD, you're crazy. That, and Bowser, game&watch and falco have rewards when they go offstage. We know them as kills. What other character meteors people at 100 and has them live like it's no problem? I have video.
If you think slow aerials with little range, a nair that has the weakest sourspot known to man (its hard to sweetspot when you have exactly 3 frames to work with and Zero range and priority) and this comedian homing attack amount to an offstage game worth lauding about, you're crazy.
He has horrendous aerial mobility, and a lot of subpar options.
You must be talking about sonic vs DK if you don't think that I go offstage, because I will against other characters if sonic can. You know, unless spring is just 1000x a better option which it often is (see link, cfalc, ike, marth, etc).
Maybe I'm buggin but I'm pretty sure that I go offstage against characters he can go up against. There are a few that he can't just can't go out and get, though. DK. Mario. Marth. I can go on.
Not to mention that sonic has a garbage RAR which prevents him from taking his best offstage option with him when he wants it at times. And since he can't easily hop out backwards and cover space like falco, sheik, fox, link, DK etc... no wonder I'm apprehensive.
If the opponent is able to avoid the first jump out, sonic has to come back. His recovery is entirely vertical after he loses his double jump so he can't go out too far without dying. Let's not forget that sonic's recovery is perfectly gimpable and it takes a long time for him to get back.

And all that was just point A).

B) So... running away doesn't count as avoiding an attack? Or spinning away? Or springing (which is what he meant btw. Eli must not have read the sig.) Watch the videos. Whenever I'm near an opponent and we are within range of one another, it's an easy bet that I'm probably trying to get away from whatever the opponent is doing. Or jabbing. I need you to point out matches where avoiding attacks isn't #1 on my MO.

C) What are these kill setups? Saying he has a bunch and not listing them isn't helping me step my game up. However, if they are unsafe then that's probably why I'm not using them. I don't know where you inferred that I'm a reckless player, but that's pretty much the antithesis of my playstyle. Please inform me. Because dtilt doesnt link well at kill% (its also unbelievable in how unsafe it is... it moves you into a shield grab...). Up tilt doesnt. Up throw doesn't. Up air doesn't. Dair might, but it is fairly unsafe and telegraphs itself. So you tell me what I'm missing.



I dont grab enough? Sonic has a hard time shield grabbing, and even if he did, get the grab, his grab game is without reward. Let's be real.

I don't use nair enough? Maybe because sonic has a garbage shffl game and also because the move requires me to be in danger to use. Unless of course, my plan is to deal 0% when my opponent uses their nair back.