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I though about trying to become more active in my local smash scene.
Started off by checking the local smash facebook group.
First thing I read was Anti PM sentiment.
A thread about sending a letter to Nintendo about the feelings of competitive Smashers keeps getting derailed by Melee vs Smash 4 arguments and the like.
I ask repeatedly for it to stop,and Bleck tells me to stop minimodding
lolololololololololol
A thread about sending a letter to Nintendo about the feelings of competitive Smashers keeps getting derailed by Melee vs Smash 4 arguments and the like.
I ask repeatedly for it to stop,and Bleck tells me to stop minimodding
lolololololololololol
Trust me; you shouldn't. Being offended achieves nothing/is a waste of emotional stability and time you could spend being HAPPY over something else instead.
Dun do it~
A few things I'd like to see just in general for PM (apart from all balancing, because I expressed my opinion on this more than enough, and apart from design choices I expressed so far):
- Correspondence Smash (chess background bias ftw): A network or server where you can play correspondence Smash. Rules would be like this: One stock, 2 minutes (otherwise it would take too long, and as you have time to think your adaptation should start at the first frame, so more isn't needed): You confirm your inputs for 12 frames (to resemble a very fast yet human reaction time, playing frame for frame would ruin the metagame and take too long), wait for the other player to do his, and on your next "move" one frame of action reveals itself with every frame input you confirm, until your 12 frames of input are over. Probably you should also be able to see what happens with your inputs if the opponent does nothing, because it could otherwise be awkward to do TAS a few frames delayed.
You can do multiple games at once, standard settings should be 3 days per move at most. It should also be possible to change the frames-per-move count.
I believe this would help theorizing out some matchups, would allow doing 20XX stuff against people you normally would only be able to play agianst over Wi-Fi, and it would lead to many epic matches as they would get recorded.
This could also be a way to tune AI up, via some self-learning algorithm and playing lots of correspondence games against other or the same AI. The frames-per-move minimum is necessary, too, here, because it is annoying if the AI can just powershield your attacks on reaction and that doesn't resemble real play
- Possibility to swap between music packs while playing (not during a game, but in the option menu): Sometimes I would like to play different music for practicing and playing with friends, or even for different characters (extreme case, but for example for a Ganondorf mirror matchup). Not that important but a feature I would definitely enjoy.
- Some ingame assistance to search for percentage-data (ability to write own AI programs). I like the results, but I hate the process.
- A new attempt on a good stage list. This was the one I was disagreeing most upon in 3.5. Some row 1 stages are definitely not thought to be legal. I think one should start to consider what a good competitive stagelist has to offer.
In my opinion one major complaint was that pretty unique stages (FD as example) lost importance because the stage number increased. One possibility would be that you have a certain number (preferably between 5 and 10), which include certain "similar" stages. The counterpicking-process would need to be adjusted, let's say we have 3 stages per category we could let the banner ban one category and one stage in the category the counterpicker has chosen. Some categories actually contain different stages, which are those where the stages are actually similar or at least comparable. Stages like FD get turned into categories including different recolors/designs of FD (here I have to say I would love to see a microworld redesign of FD for one of them, as the standard FD has the microworld with galaxies etc., so include atoms and the quantum world etc.). Some categories could also be bigger or smaller (so you could still do redesigns on a stage that isn't the only one in a category without needing to do dozens of FDs).
Actually, the counter-picking process in that category-system is the most important so do it even if there is no development time for redesigns, you would do me a favour.
- Continue to try out stuff! One of the things I love most about Project M are the creative aspects in it, in design and gameplay. And we do not have to pretend as if this game, or its stem game SSBM are perfect, and I'm sure there is still more to discover which we don't know about yet, but which we appreciated if it was discovered.
There are two ways of doing that, mainly adding stuff because it is new and trying out new ways to solve existing problems.
PM Lucario falls under the first category, and there is an infinite set of possibilities which would fall under this category. My personal favourites include trying out turnarounds on non-back-airs and non-back-throws, like on Jigglypuffs' fair, or new AT possibilities. The second one is still underused in my opinion, CCing or the pummel mechanic would be fields where it could be applied (there are more but those were the few where I thought about longer, here would be my conclusion):
[About CC..] The mechanic helps the game somtimes and hinders it at other times. To name examples, it allows a player at lower %s to have an advantage in the neutral game, which could be considered good because percentages can swap so quickly that it is a good way of turning the previous results in actual advantages. Also, it helps depolarizing a lot of matchups where walling out could be a bigger issue otherwise. On the other hand, it renders half the cast's jab and some tilts useless, which is taking potential depth away. It could also be one of the reasons why some big characters' matchups are polarized, because their strength in CCs makes it very grabintensive and characters which can do that have an advantage while others have a disadvantage (other factors play a role of course, but the polarization effect is there). Also it is shifting the mixup game even more in favor of grab, and just from my intuition I'd think it is a tiny bit too shifted towards grab right now. I would neither completely let it as it is nor remove it for above reasons.
- One could induce an animation of constant length after the CC, but now only the quick moves will be the only CC punishes which are guaranteed, and that is not wanted because a read shouldn't only give you access to 5-framers or faster. There is also a risk because faster moves succeed in so many aspects that it will cause balancing problems
- ASDI distance reduction so it only works at lower %s than now: will reduce both positive and negative aspects and is therefore not a real solution
- Finding a way to lower the weight/CC-ability curve: Something said by many quality posters and strong players is that in Melee, it wasn't a problem because heavy characters were mostly bad, and the effect was wanted for lighter ones. By lowering the curve one would effectively fight those "overdimensional" CC-abilities while still not unifying it, so an advantage is kept. The real problem is how exactly to do it, at best we wouldn't need to change how ASDI works and we wouldn't need to introduce a new variable, but I don't see a concrete way right now.
- Inducing an animation, its length based on any other factors (maybe knockback, percentage, damage or shield damage): Here I actually prefer the shield damage idea (I consider this the most useful of all listed ideas [...]). Alternatively there could be a new variable for a move but this should be avoided if possible anyhow. It could also be possible to form a new number depending on several of those, I will mention that later. The animation based on any other factor would have the following advantage: More characters have a move that counters CC which isn't grab (similar to Peach's d-smash, but without the multi-hit being necessary). And since it should be a finesse somehow and the counter-move shouldn't just be the rawest of all, shield damage seems optimal. I will have to put a bit more thought if this messes up CC's and shields advantages and disadvantages over each other. If this happens to be the case, I would suggest one uses a combines quantity which optimizes the functional necessities CCing has to fulfill.
[...]
I agree with the "don't replace it if you don't have a better alternative", but in the same video they mention a mechanic shielding a pummel afterwards, and it made me think that you could make a mindgame out of this.
The mechanic would work like this:
Grab mashing is not possible anymore.
You can enter an animation which gets you out of the grab if completed, which gets interrupted.
You could also enter another animation which would block the pummel.
Now, they are multiple possibilities. depending on how you want to design the game you could design it in a way that the pummelblock would give you a free grabbreak or not. Maybe one could add a third option for the grabbed opponent. If it is wished to make using grabs a little harder that could be an option that breaks the grab if the grabber tries to throw (probably it should have a few frames startup before the active window so you can always get a throw with very good timing, but you might not get it if you somehow mess your timing up, similar to a situation facing someone with good mashing skills).
How much startup, active frames and cooldown the pummelblock, the throwcounter or the grabbreak has could be adjusted in a way that the average outcome is similar to the current Smash mechanics, just with actually different options and without the "silly" mashing mechanic.
[...]
I think mashing is somehow unique and as long as there is no better alternative, it is OK, but on the other hand it is replaceworthy because there is no strategic element in it (even guaranteed combos normally have an element of reaction in it) and on the longrun it damages controller and hand.
I don't feel confident with making videos (never made one lol), but to explain my proposed method in a very basic way:
You give the grabbed player more options making it more of a mindgame thing, while balancing those options in a way that the average result will be similar to the results now.
I will try to explain it more clearly here. I have a bad attitude of making complicated sentences and grammatical constructions which make my points harder to understand. I will try to work on that.
Here would be one example of a proposed method, there might be others.
Options of the grabber (not including waiting):
PUMMEL: Deals damage.
ANY THROW: Functions differently and has different purposes depending on the throw.
Options of the grabbed player (not including waiting):
GRABBREAK: Initiates an animation, which, if it is completed, lets you out of the grab.
PUMMELBLOCK: "Shields" a pummel.
THROWCOUNTER: Has a few startup frames, followed by active frames.
Possible scenarios:
PUMMEL vs GRABBREAK: Pummel cancels the grabbreak animation and deals the damage.
PUMMEL vs PUMMELBLOCK: The damage isn't dealt. The grabbed player now has a frame advantage that could, depending on the timing, be enough to complete a grabbreak animation.
PUMMEL vs THROWCOUNTER: Pummel cancels the throwcounter animation and deals the damage.
ANY THROW vs GRABBREAK: The throw is executed.
ANY THROW vs PUMMELBLOCK: The throw is executed.
ANY THROW vs THROWCOUNTER: The grabbed player is released from the grab.
Additional:
Some of the grabbed players' option's frame data should be percentage-dependent so you can get more damage in at higher percentage, in average.
The throwcounter's startup animation is long enough that an instant throw after getting the grab cannot be throw-countered.
Advantages for the grabbed player:
The grabbed player can now choose between several options, and if he gets a read he can punish a greedy pummel or a mistimed throw.
Advantages for the grabber:
The grabbed player has to do someting to get out.
If you don't mess up, it is still always possible to get the throw of your choice when you grabbed someone.
Some more thoughts:
A third option (maybe initiated by pressing special) for the grabber might be worth considering. It could be designed in a way that it creates the advantage for the grabber at higher %s, so one wouldn't have to mess with the frame data of the other moves. After all, percentage-dependent frame data is a bit odd. One would need playtesting to see what works better. And if it turns out the grabber doesn't need the third option, I would try to keep it rather simple.
- An option to resign (chess background bias again): In Smash it is not needed that much because it is not really over until the last hit, but I think it should be a basic right of a player in a competitive game to resign the game, and the "ragequit" misses something, first because the game is officially not rated, and because it has this taste of not really accepting the loss or being salty, it just seems like a very informal way to end the game.
Maybe L+R+A+Reset with pause turned off should lead to a resignation. It is important that the player then also formally has won and I'd prefer to have a kind of blast zone animation on the resigning character itself, and the green letters either saying GAME!, P[number] RESIGNED or RESIGNATION.
As final point, looking in other (Smash) games is fine, but by the sheer amount of suggestions coming from Smash 4 just as they were used once (and yes, I'm also guilty of suggesting from this games, of which I regret some suggestions and of which I still like some), there has to be su much potential out there.
tl;dr: Some of my suggestions, if you read them you could actually discuss them, please give feedback!
i have to reroll an end-game character because of a god damn simple ass oversight I should have caught before I started building his skill tree.
god ****ing damn it that's ****ing stupid as **** why the **** did i not catch that ****. like jesus christ you think i'd ****ing catch and see some basic ass **** like that but nooo neko cant ****ing numbers at all. like christ i had the skill tree all set and done for like months and i've put 200 hours into this character with this god damn skill tree and equipment setup in mind but nope gotta reroll skill points and allocate that **** all over again and gotta make massive shifts to my playstyle
jesus christ neko you dumb **** why the **** can you readddd WHY DIDNT YOU DOUBLE CHECK YOUR WORK YOUR TEACHERS GAVE YOU **** ABOUT THAT ALLLL THROUGH SCHOOOL DOUBLE CHECK YOUR WORK
my black ass graduate thinking "nahh i dont need to double check my work. **** that ****."
and here i am having to redo a bunch of work because i cant ****ing double check my work.
i have to reroll an end-game character because of a god damn simple *** oversight I should have caught before I started building his skill tree.
god ****ing damn it that's ****ing stupid as **** why the **** did i not catch that ****. like jesus christ you think i'd ****ing catch and see some basic *** **** like that but nooo neko cant ****ing numbers at all. like christ i had the skill tree all set and done for like months and i've put 200 hours into this character with this god damn skill tree and equipment setup in mind but nope gotta reroll skill points and allocate that **** all over again and gotta make massive shifts to my playstyle
jesus christ neko you dumb **** why the **** can you readddd WHY DIDNT YOU DOUBLE CHECK YOUR WORK YOUR TEACHERS GAVE YOU **** ABOUT THAT ALLLL THROUGH SCHOOOL DOUBLE CHECK YOUR WORK
my black *** graduate thinking "nahh i dont need to double check my work. **** that ****."
and here i am having to redo a bunch of work because i cant ****ing double check my work.
AND I ****ED UP AGAIN BY BURNING UP ALL MY SKILL POINTS WITHOUT LEARNING A BASIC, BUT ESSENTIAL SKILL FOR BASIC ****ING MOVEMENT AND NOW I HAVE TO LEVEL UP 3 TIMES JUST TO EARN THE LAST SP I NEED TO LEARN IT **** WHAT IS WRONG WIT HME.
i need to go to sleep because clearly being up for ~18 hours is impacting my judgement severely.
Lizalfos
PMS | LEVEL 100 MAGIKARP
Neko is Japanese for black.
