Problems vs. Pikachu?

[OnanDU]

I'm not sure if it's just me, or has anyone else had problems when faced against Pikachu? I've had a couple problems when fighting against pikachu, such as:

1) Pikachu's size makes it harder to land all 4 hits in a H+nair.
2) Snake's recovery is too punishable by Pikachu's thundertbolt, considering that Pikachu's cooldown between continuous thunderbolts has been reduced.
3) It seems that most of Pikachu's attacks out-prioritizes Snake's attacks.

Thanks.

 

[Depressed Man]

Who doesn't have trouble with Pikachu? That little rat is annoying .

Ugh especially the regular A attack. If you ever play CPUs, you'll know what I mean what they play Pikachu.

Though some advice, the regular A combo won't work well with small characters. So you may need to press A, then do the tilt (the knee and the kick).

To avoid Thunderbolt I guess you just have to air dodge..

 

[Insomniac487]

what does the H in H+nair stand for?

Yeah, your definitely right. Pikachu is a strong counter againest snake. Actually he gives everybody trouble, just that he gives snake a much harder time. One other thing that wasn't mentioned is pikachu's neutral b (those little shockballs). They explode snake's landmines (not always though). I don't know about you, but a good snake would have one laying at all times... so to see them get easily exploded by pika's projectiles (while being far) is frustrating.

That, and pika's thunder gives him a Really hard time when trying to recover. It's a entire vertical wall, that stops EVERYTHING. When they hit me off the platform to the side, usually I toss a grenade or two at them... cypher, and try to recover. That way, when im coming back on stage or on the edge... i come with safely (hoping that grenades explode at pika, stopping his thunder or interrupting him atleast).

The second method is to airdodge, but even then the thunder lasts a long time plus theres a ground-blast radius that is huge. you can try, but i wouldn't do it

The third method is to recover back on stage when less expected. If he expects you to come at a *certain* time, he'll thunder. If you stall a bit (throw grenades or Fair) its possible to come *after* his thunder. It all has to do with mindgames, distance estimation, and timing.

 

[rigapeen]

i've got a pretty good anti-pikachu game. i'll have some matches up eventaully.

heres a tip: play on battlefield and keep the game to the edge as much as possible. pikachu is really easy to edgeguard.

 

[OnanDU]

what does the H in H+nair stand for?

The second method is to airdodge, but even then the thunder lasts a long time plus theres a ground-blast radius that is huge. you can try, but i wouldn't do it

H+Nair means Full hop + Neutral aerial

I have tried to air dodge, but even then, Pikachu can use Thunder again before i can air dodge a second time.

And as for the previous comment saying that pikachu is easy to edgeguard, I beg to differ. Quick Attack can cover a tremendous amount of distance if used right.

 

[rigapeen]

dont cross pikachu so early. cypher asap, get to top height, approach the ledge, let pikachu thunder. wait till its over, grab the ledge or land on the stage.

i can imagine a good pikachu doing some sort of jump off stage, thunder while jumping back on so the lightning sticks out farther... that would be tough. anyone experience that yet?

 

[reilina_06]

@topic creator i knew u gonna have trouble with that thunderbolt (same here)
its like a wall thats hard to penetrate most especially in FD.

cant really think of anything but may i suggest to play it safe.

like dnt finish ur AAA or side tilts if ur not sure.
pikachu's mobility is good, he/she can just atk then run rinse and repeat.

-just play it safe.

@rigapeen: i agree.

 

[Punz]

I call pikachu the demon of the game, they really made him better in brawl, he's a lot faster. However if you have a good Wolf you'll be able to beat him, i had couple matches against a pro wolf earlier, and pikachu foward smash cannot contend with wolf's own, it's like he cancels it out or something, and even if you do manage to land the hit, pikachu will still get hit. This is only if the wolf throws his forward smash with your own tho, but wolf totally demolishes pikachu, also a good marth will own him.

 

[abit_rusty]

I call pikachu the demon of the game, they really made him better in brawl, he's a lot faster. However if you have a good Wolf you'll be able to beat him, i had couple matches against a pro wolf earlier, and pikachu foward smash cannot contend with wolf's own, it's like he cancels it out or something, and even if you do manage to land the hit, pikachu will still get hit. This is only if the wolf throws his forward smash with your own tho, but wolf totally demolishes pikachu, also a good marth will own him.

Yea that's all well and good but this is the Snake forums....

Just space yourself will with Pika, especially out of that dsmash. If he does spam his thundershock (b move), which your nikita can easily bypass, or you can throw nades over it. He may be speedy but the matchup isn't tough as long as you space accordingly. Also, use ftilts more than jabs because as you noticed, the final hit of the AAA often misses. Or you can try jab once, then ftilt to mix it up. Try not to be above him too much since he'll probably thunder, and someone had good advice that you should delay crossing the thunder's threshold until after he's thundered once. Or you can DI backwards, fast fall and grab the edge instead.

 

[Cho?]

im so glad that a lot of ppl hate pika and not just me :D nice information though. i've always had trouble against pika players

 

[Spy_Hunter]

I was wondering when somebody would mention the rat. My God it's so annoying. It's short , it's fast , it has great smashes , my brother spams the lighting like ther's no tommorow ( I once told him how gay it was to be playing a small rat that can only say it's name but then he KO'ed me with Thunder...and then kept right on taunting till I died. Sorry I just have some issues with Pikachu. If Satan exist in Pokemon then I'm sure it has something to do with Pikachu.
Anyway , does anybody know if the greandes explode when pikachu shocks them? I mean before theri suppose to detonate?

 

[abit_rusty]

I was wondering when somebody would mention the rat. My God it's so annoying. It's short , it's fast , it has great smashes , my brother spams the lighting like ther's no tommorow ( I once told him how gay it was to be playing a small rat that can only say it's name but then he KO'ed me with Thunder...and then kept right on taunting till I died. Sorry I just have some issues with Pikachu. If Satan exist in Pokemon then I'm sure it has something to do with Pikachu.
Anyway , does anybody know if the greandes explode when pikachu shocks them? I mean before theri suppose to detonate?

Yes.

Like I said, toss them over or else use nikita to plow through the thundershock.

 

["Philanthropy"]

Well, I'd suggest dropping C4 near the edge, whether it be before hand or as you're coming back. Not only will this intimidate, but if he's spamming or just forget, it'll blow him up to high heaven.


--Oh yea, and watch out for that bloody Down Smash... AHH!

 

[abit_rusty]

Doh, how could I forget the infinitely useful tactic of tossing nades onto the ledge as you recover. Saved my Snake's *** countless times, and this is especially effective against a thunder ledge-camping pikachu.

 

[rigapeen]

hmm, played a good pikachu today. practiced recovering vs thunder and its definately possible (it was just a thought when i first suggested it). use the cypher above the ledge so if he cuts you off with thunder you can stop and fall down until it finishes.

one thing that is absolutely mandatory vs pikachu: play on battlefield. you will not win on FD unless he sucks.

we traded matches back and forth on BF, i think i won 1 or 2 more than he did. on FD i just died. he destroyed me. so dont let him pick FD!

throwing nades on the stage during recovery definately helps too.

 

[StoleUrCar]

YEa pikachu is annoying, his thunder attack keeps hitting me out of my up special.

 

[A2ZOMG]

Hey, I was just thinking that Pikachu was a Snake counter (no, he's not higher tier than Snake, he just happens to have many attributes that make him a horrible matchup for Snake).

One, Snake's recovery is already predictable. I think someone mentioned how Pikachu happens to have the easiest time intercepting his recovery thanks to Thunder, which is a LOT less laggy in Brawl to make things worse for Snake.

Also, Pikachu's projectile spam is faster than Snake's, so Snake ultimately has to deal with more spam than Pikachu (Snake's spam is actually better since it is more versatile for other things, but on the stage he's going to have more trouble dealing with Pikachu's faster spam). This might actually force Snake to approach Pikachu, and he's not good at doing that. Do thunderjolts explode mines? That would really suck for Snake.

Pikachu's D-smash >>> Snake. If it sends him up, he gets Thunderflipped. If it sends him to the side, he has to recover, and he still potentially gets thundered.

So wow, I'm not the only one who's thought that this matchup is unbalanced in favor towards Pikachu, who I think is otherwise lower tiered than Snake?

Oh yeah, and if you're looking for a flat out counter to Pikachu, it appears to be G&W. Bucket >>> Pikachu's special attacks.

 

[abit_rusty]

Yea Snake is kinda disadvantaged there...

(off topic: One thunder attack fills up the bucket fully >.>)

 

[Spidah]

from my personal experience, the c4 on the ledge tech is really effective, but you still have a 50% chance of getting knocked out of the stage on the opposite side of your c4 -_-;

I guess it's all about the mindgame anyway, different ways of recovery against different pika players, gotta try em all ...

 

[DTKPch]

Hopefully a tip that actually works on all Pikachu's and not just the one that I play against:

Against Pikachus recovering with side-b, I use my side-b. Instead of shooting it directly at the pikachu, I shoot it straight, and then angle it up a bit so it travels slowly. The thing is, when a pikachu side-b's at a missile shot directly at it, the missile will be deflected and the pikachu will go through (I think). What I do is angle the missile up, then drop it with my shield right as the pikachu releases his side-b, because it actually blows up in his face.


But yeah, Pikachu is a pain to play. I have a question about his d-smash: Sometimes I DI successfully, but sometimes, I DI right or left while caught in the d-smash, and I end up going straight up (perfect set up for thunder). Does this ever happen to anyone else?

EDIT: and yes, A2ZOMG, thunderjolts blow up the proxy mines. I pretty much forget about those while playing Pikachus and focus more on the C4.

 

[ih0tfirei]

the best thing u can do on FD is run to a corner and place a c4 there and make pickachu come to u. spam with nades. but above all stay near that edge where the c4 was placed . if u happen to get knocked off your safe from the thunder.

 

[Eternal Yoshi]

There are a few things I learned in my matches against Pika:
Your Ftilt can clank with his Fsmash, provided you can come into contact with Pika's face, and nullify all damage.
Cooked grenades can cut off Pika's Skull Bash(after grenade dropping), and set him in a position to get blown up by it too. However, Quick Attack will cut off the Cooked Grenade, so try the Nikita instead.
Don't use the mines, either, Unless your opponent is lacking in common sense.
You will just have to learn to spot dodge thunder, which will be a little easier if you learn the pattern your foe uses it in and the size of the hitbox. If you get the chance, jab to punish. It has more range than ftilt.

While Pikachu certainly has the advantage, this is not a **** matchup, and you are still capable of obtaining victory.

 

[Cho?]

nice info. i hate going against pikas. nothing makes me feel better than uair-ing that lil rat out to space.