Vestboy_Myst
NJ TO & Peach knitwit
Two strategies for Peach's side-smash and down-B that you can take as seriously as you care to.
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I. Knitting Theory of Turnips
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This is a combination of an optimization technique ("Knitting") and a few general rules for turnip use to maximize the benefits gained by it.
re
Currently the prevailing method to look for a stitchface between stocks is pull>throw>pull>throw. Pulls take 29 frames and grounded throws take 23 frames (direction changes frame of item release, but they all complete in the same time). This equates to a 52 frames per turnip (fpt) cycle. (.866 seconds). It looks like this, everyone should be familiar with it already (gif created by @radiogiraffe for this post, depicts a perfect pull>throw cycle)
(not in-game speed)
The fastest way to get rid of a turnip while remaining grounded to pull another (without getting into TAS realm bs) has been known since 2006. Luckily, its also unique to Peach and DJL characters. The Qdrop, named for @
Quetzalcoatl
, was first detailed in his guide:
By completing several Qdrops and pulls in sequence, termed 'Knitting' (since you're trying to make stitches), Peach optimizes the rate at which she can pull multiple turnips in a row. There are currently 5 documented Qdrop variations in two classes (YYZ vs YZY)
Quetz's Old School method (Y>Y+Z) is the easiest to start with when getting an idea of the qdrop timing. Just mash the second X/Y and Z at what you perceive to be the 'same time'. This method gives you a mix of 7/10/13 (YYZ) and 10/12 (YZY) qdrops depending on if Z or Y/Z is input first. It is pretty random, but personally I seem to get mostly YYZ qdrops when doing this.
----------Benefits of Knitting
As long as you're able to do one of the above Qdrops consistently, you're still saving frames over Pull>throw. Even if you're just mashing jump+Z and have no idea which one is coming out, congratulations you've learned to knit. This now gives you a 36-41 fpt cycle (.58333-.683 sec), saving 11-16 frames each pull. Searching with Qdrops takes you only 69-79% of the time pull>throw takes, and you're getting to see 27-44% more turnips/second as compared to pull>throw. (disclaimer: turnips cannot exist in a non-integer state)
Just before an enemy respawn, this can help expand those 2 safe pulls to 3, or free up some extra frames for panning (see next section). Knitting is perfect for when you get a kill off the top. It builds on the split-second facial recognition Peach mains should have already. Improving that will improve your knitting efficiency and visa versa.
Knitting helps force an approach if you're waiting out a PS transformation. I've have also had some success with it in the early stages of Samus bomb recovery, while waiting for her to get within throw range.
The one downside to knitting is not having the active hitbox flying about when they spawn, so you may still want to opt for an uthrow on the 2nd to last turnip pull (depending your location/spawn location/stage), and then holding onto the last turnip for immediately engaging the opponent. (From the Turnip Guide Revision 1: a smashed upthrow adds ~3.4% damage to the turnip, but its damage decreases as it rises into the air / regains as it falls back down)
----------Principles of Effective Turnip Usage
The entire point of knitting is to enable us to 'play the odds' as often as possible. Every pull comes with an expected value (EV) of how much we will 'get out of it'. The normal turnips (duds) are our baseline (=EV), ie the expected 'return' on our 29 frame investment. Obviously we want to get as many +EV pulls as we can in our games. An unsafe/interrupted pull is -EV, meaning you should avoid them at all costs.
As some background, here is some info on turnips from the turnip guide revision 1:
Here is the typical turnip distribution chart as documented by @Magus420
![]()
Here are the approximated numbers I'll work with based off of the above chart:
Below are the core tenants behind knitting theory, and need to be used in conjunction with the technique (i'd argue knitting on its own is too small of a benefit to be worthwhile). They still hold for the usual pull>throw method of searching and are (imo) worth incorporating into any peach player's game
1) Recatching
If you are unable to recatch well or don't regularly go for them when able, there is no point in trying to optimize your turnip game with knitting. Stop learning this weird technique and go work on recatching first. Without doubling or tripling the value we get out of each pull (especially our +EV turnips/saturn, but duds too) we waste our miniscule benefit gained from emphasizing playing of the odds.
It will not help you to work on getting to a +EV pull faster if you cannot use it to its fullest already. Even if we can see more turnips-per-second with knitting, we never want to make pull we don't have to. The odds are NOT in our favor that we'll get something better, and its a waste of vital frames when the opponent is not dead. According to knitting theory, recatching as well as possible is 100x more important than actually incorporating knitting into your game.
you can even recatch an accidentally qdropped turnip (for the 7f one at least) by hitting A right after, it can be pretty hard though. Here is a gif by @radiogiraffe showing her item grab box (grey)
2) Winky is the best
The goal of knitting, despite the name, is not to find stichface. If you find winky, the most common +EV turnip, its time to stop knitting immediately. Even if you have plenty of time before the opponent spawns, your search is over. Start focusing on your stage positioning for the incoming invincible foe.
If you did decide to keep pulling, you'll have thrown away perfectly good EV 10/11 times in search of something rarer. There is a 1/11 chance that you did luck out and got something as-good-as or better than winky, but its most likely got another winky anyway. The chance of getting anything better than winky (stitch/dot/item) is a paltry 312/7424 = 1/23.8 pulls = 4.2%. Its simply never worth gambling the guaranteed value in your hand for a high-risk-high-reward attempt like that. All in all I find winky to be the most 'bang for your buck' turnip, especially when you recatch reliably and regularly. He should be a welcome sight, never a disappointment. (be careful with the facial recognition, he can get tricky)
3) Never make an unsafe pull
This is about as important as recatching. As stated above, an unsafe / incomplete pull is the only time a pull can give you negative value. Spending 29 frames to play an already low-odds lottery and then being damaged/comboed/killed is probably the worst investment you could make.
Every single risky pull is giving free % to your opponent in a gamble to complete the FULL 29 frames (if interrupted on 28 or earlier, the turnip disappears). Even if you get hit as soon as the animation completes, there is still an additional chance that you'll drop the turnip in hitstun (no exact percentage, but it seems to be 1/10 of the times you get hit while holding a turnip). On top of that, if you luck out and retain the turnip/item, they're still getting a free punish before you can use that pull to defend yourself.
This is a core principle to peach play that you end up breaking when first playing a new opponent, since there are many matchup/stage combinations where you need to test pulling in uncertain situations. This sense comes through trial and error and playing on the edge of your opponent's reach in neutral. Ideally you'll slowly learn which opportunities are barely safe (can buffer spotdodge/shield to avoid punish) or read openings specific to your opponent, thereby minimizing your number of -EV pulls each game. If you're unsure that its safe, don't pull!
4) Know basic probabilities
Using the general rule of getting extra value one out of every nine pulls, probability can help further predict the likelihood of getting the +EV pull you're looking for. Each pull there is a 8/9 chance of getting a default turnip, so after two pulls (8/9 * 8/9) there is a 64/81 = 79% chance that you got a default turnip both times. This equates to a 21% probability that you get at least one +EV pull after two pulls.
Continuing this a bit:
5) Get comfortable with items
Items present Peach with a huge immediate advantage, its imperative to know how to capitalize with each the second she finds one.
Bomb-------
+++EV, do not be afraid of blowing up, learn to use it right and that should not happen. great when dropped, learn to zdrop>airdodge and qdrop oos. throws faster than turnips. avoid throwing when near platforms to avoid janky collision SDs. Mini guide by Caup
Sword-------
usually best to throw, can swing to mess with opponent. sometimes bad because it replaces your dash attack. goes away after falling on the ground two times at most. throws faster then turnips. some info by 1000g2g3g4g800999
Saturn--------
very strong shield breaker, plus people are used to shielding turnips. super combo when recaught, lasts the longest of all the items. try not to waste as an offstage edgeguard, throw him onstage to turn around instead if you can. feels like it has lower KB/scaling than a dud.
Corollary:
I was tempted to make a rule about 'minimizing wasted turnip/item throws' but its a bit harder to codify in my opinion. Its clear that pulls that end up not connecting are not necessarily -EV. You could be controlling space, turning around midair, or covering an option. As a result this is more of an important facet of peach knowledge in general, and is independent of knitting theory.
I'll leave it in this form:
"Know when to hold em, know when to throw them, know when to pull again, know when to run."
(As a sidenote, remember that all turnips when z-dropped only cause 1-2% and minimal KB / hitstun on collision, no matter what face it has. Following Knitting theory, it is never right to drop a +EV turnip where you normally would (edgeguard vs marth, running off platform). Holding onto a +EV pull until a good opening appears to throw it is smartest, so choose another option in those situations)
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II. Panning for Frying Pans
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Whenever you have spare time (especially in the mus that utilize fsmash), cycle through fsmash until you get the frying pan. The game doesn't actually cycle through the three in order, it randomly chooses one of the remaining two weapons to use each time. In other words, you will never get two of the same weapon in a row. Now that you've used pan, either the club or racket will come out on your next fsmash, which both have slightly better range and (arguably) KB trajectory (frame data for all three is the same). The first fsmash of every stock is picked from the three randomly, so this effect does not persist through death.This technique has been known since 2005, possibly earlier.
It is better in most cases to knock an opponent farther horizontally away with the club/racket and hope to set up an edgegard/gain space. Even if they are at high %, a frying pan will rarely kill (even when charged) and is awkward to act out of sometimes since they don't get sent a safe distance away. This, coupled with its slightly shorter range, makes it the weakest of the three in the matchups that I use fsmash the most in. In general, I find Fsmash is only worth using at maximum range anyway.
There are only two situations in which a frying pan may be better (that I can think of at least). One is as a puff rest punish, fully charged, on some stages. The other is as a low% tool for comboing/juggling fastfallers, but these are the mus that fsmash is hardly ever used in. (There is some preference involved. If you think that the club is the weakest of the three, you can go clubbing between stocks, and if you hate the racket you can go racketeering instead.)
One fsmash takes about as much time as a pull>qdrop or pull>throw, so you count it as one of your 'pull' attempts before starting to knit. Keep track of the last fsmash used, get good at reacting to them, and don't forget that the anti-pan effect goes away when you die. IMPORTANT: when waiting for opponent to spawn, DO ANY PANNING BEFORE KNITTING. Don't want to risk throwing away a +EV pull with a smash throw.
Hit: 15-18
Charge frame: 8
IASA: 40
Shield stun: 16
Shield hit lag: 7
Advantage: -14_-11
Gifs and data from "Complete Peach Hitboxes and Frame Data" thread, damage and KB data from SSBWiki and @Veril 's peach notes (damages may not be completely accurate)
------------------------------------------------------------------------
III. References
------------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------------------
I. Knitting Theory of Turnips
------------------------------------------------------------------------
This is a combination of an optimization technique ("Knitting") and a few general rules for turnip use to maximize the benefits gained by it.
re
Currently the prevailing method to look for a stitchface between stocks is pull>throw>pull>throw. Pulls take 29 frames and grounded throws take 23 frames (direction changes frame of item release, but they all complete in the same time). This equates to a 52 frames per turnip (fpt) cycle. (.866 seconds). It looks like this, everyone should be familiar with it already (gif created by @radiogiraffe for this post, depicts a perfect pull>throw cycle)
(not in-game speed)
The fastest way to get rid of a turnip while remaining grounded to pull another (without getting into TAS realm bs) has been known since 2006. Luckily, its also unique to Peach and DJL characters. The Qdrop, named for @
Quetzalcoatl
, was first detailed in his guide:Quetzalcoatl said:
By completing several Qdrops and pulls in sequence, termed 'Knitting' (since you're trying to make stitches), Peach optimizes the rate at which she can pull multiple turnips in a row. There are currently 5 documented Qdrop variations in two classes (YYZ vs YZY)
Quetz's Old School method (Y>Y+Z) is the easiest to start with when getting an idea of the qdrop timing. Just mash the second X/Y and Z at what you perceive to be the 'same time'. This method gives you a mix of 7/10/13 (YYZ) and 10/12 (YZY) qdrops depending on if Z or Y/Z is input first. It is pretty random, but personally I seem to get mostly YYZ qdrops when doing this.
Not sure who first discovered this set of inputs or when it was, but it was documented and sent to me by @radiogiraffe on /r/ssbm. The inputs are the same as the Rush song and is the most optimal way to knit.
DarkRijin
The GIF below shows the 7 frame qdrop / 36 fpt cycle and is also by @radiogiraffe . Because the DJ comes before the zdrop, the turnip will always fall behind her. Here are the two in gfy form (both recorded at 33fps, "#?speed=1.8" at the end of the URLs should approximate full speed) (gif by @radiogiraffe, mirror close to in-game speed http://gfycat.com/CleanOpulentIbex#?speed=1.8 )
![]()
Radiogiraffe said:
Here is a complete list of inputs for the three YYZ qdrops as documented byRadiogiraffe said:
DarkRijin
7 frame Qdrops give you a 36 fpt knitting cycle (.58333 sec), saving 16 frames over pull>throw each individual 'knit'. It takes 69% as much time as pull>throw, and you're getting to see 44.4% more turnips per second as compared to pull>throw.DarkRijin said:
The GIF below shows the 7 frame qdrop / 36 fpt cycle and is also by @radiogiraffe . Because the DJ comes before the zdrop, the turnip will always fall behind her. Here are the two in gfy form (both recorded at 33fps, "#?speed=1.8" at the end of the URLs should approximate full speed) (gif by @radiogiraffe, mirror close to in-game speed http://gfycat.com/CleanOpulentIbex#?speed=1.8 )
This was the optimal Qdrop method at the time of original posting, and in compliance with cunningham's law the 7 frame Qdrop was brought to my attention within 24h. The exact inputs for this Qdrop as determined by @Stratocaster are as follows:
Getting a combination of these two qdrops during your knitting gives you a 39-41 fpt cycle (.65-.683 sec), saving 11-13 frames each pull. Knitting with these two qdrops takes 75-79% as much time as pull>throw, and you're getting to see 27-33% more turnips per second as compared to pull>throw
The 39 fpt / 10 frame Qdrop, gif also by @Stratocaster
(mirror gif at 1/6 game speed http://gfycat.com/AdmirableHomelyBumblebee )
![]()
These are the 10 frame Qdrop (39 fpt, faster, see GIF below) and the 12 frame Qdrop (41 fpt, slower, easier/more common). Both drop the turnip in front of Peach.Stratocaster said:
Getting a combination of these two qdrops during your knitting gives you a 39-41 fpt cycle (.65-.683 sec), saving 11-13 frames each pull. Knitting with these two qdrops takes 75-79% as much time as pull>throw, and you're getting to see 27-33% more turnips per second as compared to pull>throw
The 39 fpt / 10 frame Qdrop, gif also by @Stratocaster
(mirror gif at 1/6 game speed http://gfycat.com/AdmirableHomelyBumblebee )
----------Benefits of Knitting
As long as you're able to do one of the above Qdrops consistently, you're still saving frames over Pull>throw. Even if you're just mashing jump+Z and have no idea which one is coming out, congratulations you've learned to knit. This now gives you a 36-41 fpt cycle (.58333-.683 sec), saving 11-16 frames each pull. Searching with Qdrops takes you only 69-79% of the time pull>throw takes, and you're getting to see 27-44% more turnips/second as compared to pull>throw. (disclaimer: turnips cannot exist in a non-integer state)
Just before an enemy respawn, this can help expand those 2 safe pulls to 3, or free up some extra frames for panning (see next section). Knitting is perfect for when you get a kill off the top. It builds on the split-second facial recognition Peach mains should have already. Improving that will improve your knitting efficiency and visa versa.
Knitting helps force an approach if you're waiting out a PS transformation. I've have also had some success with it in the early stages of Samus bomb recovery, while waiting for her to get within throw range.
The one downside to knitting is not having the active hitbox flying about when they spawn, so you may still want to opt for an uthrow on the 2nd to last turnip pull (depending your location/spawn location/stage), and then holding onto the last turnip for immediately engaging the opponent. (From the Turnip Guide Revision 1: a smashed upthrow adds ~3.4% damage to the turnip, but its damage decreases as it rises into the air / regains as it falls back down)
----------Principles of Effective Turnip Usage
The entire point of knitting is to enable us to 'play the odds' as often as possible. Every pull comes with an expected value (EV) of how much we will 'get out of it'. The normal turnips (duds) are our baseline (=EV), ie the expected 'return' on our 29 frame investment. Obviously we want to get as many +EV pulls as we can in our games. An unsafe/interrupted pull is -EV, meaning you should avoid them at all costs.
As some background, here is some info on turnips from the turnip guide revision 1:
- 'Dud': =EV, 6% damage, 25 base KB, 60 KB growth
- 'Winky': +EV, 8% damage, slightly more KB than normal
- 'Dot': +EV, 16% damage, slightly more KB than winky
- 'Stitch': +EV, 34% damage, slightly more KB than winky
Here is the typical turnip distribution chart as documented by @Magus420
Here are the approximated numbers I'll work with based off of the above chart:
- The dud faces are all effectively the same, with an 89% chance of pulling (~1 out of every 1.2 pulls)
- Winky has a 6.8% chance of pull (~1 out of every 14.6 pulls)
- DotEyes/SemiStitch/theodore has a 1.711% chance of pull (~1 out of every 58.5)
- Stitchface/gaddish has a 1.711% chance of pull (~1 out of every 58.5)
- Pulling an item is about .8% chance (~1 out of every 128).
- ~10% chance (~1 out of every 10) you will get +EV turnip (winky, stitch, dot) each pull
- ~11% chance (~1 out of every 9) of pulling anything +EV (winky/stitch/dot/saturnbomb/ sword)
Below are the core tenants behind knitting theory, and need to be used in conjunction with the technique (i'd argue knitting on its own is too small of a benefit to be worthwhile). They still hold for the usual pull>throw method of searching and are (imo) worth incorporating into any peach player's game
1) Recatching
If you are unable to recatch well or don't regularly go for them when able, there is no point in trying to optimize your turnip game with knitting. Stop learning this weird technique and go work on recatching first. Without doubling or tripling the value we get out of each pull (especially our +EV turnips/saturn, but duds too) we waste our miniscule benefit gained from emphasizing playing of the odds.
It will not help you to work on getting to a +EV pull faster if you cannot use it to its fullest already. Even if we can see more turnips-per-second with knitting, we never want to make pull we don't have to. The odds are NOT in our favor that we'll get something better, and its a waste of vital frames when the opponent is not dead. According to knitting theory, recatching as well as possible is 100x more important than actually incorporating knitting into your game.
you can even recatch an accidentally qdropped turnip (for the 7f one at least) by hitting A right after, it can be pretty hard though. Here is a gif by @radiogiraffe showing her item grab box (grey)
2) Winky is the best
The goal of knitting, despite the name, is not to find stichface. If you find winky, the most common +EV turnip, its time to stop knitting immediately. Even if you have plenty of time before the opponent spawns, your search is over. Start focusing on your stage positioning for the incoming invincible foe.
If you did decide to keep pulling, you'll have thrown away perfectly good EV 10/11 times in search of something rarer. There is a 1/11 chance that you did luck out and got something as-good-as or better than winky, but its most likely got another winky anyway. The chance of getting anything better than winky (stitch/dot/item) is a paltry 312/7424 = 1/23.8 pulls = 4.2%. Its simply never worth gambling the guaranteed value in your hand for a high-risk-high-reward attempt like that. All in all I find winky to be the most 'bang for your buck' turnip, especially when you recatch reliably and regularly. He should be a welcome sight, never a disappointment. (be careful with the facial recognition, he can get tricky)
3) Never make an unsafe pull
This is about as important as recatching. As stated above, an unsafe / incomplete pull is the only time a pull can give you negative value. Spending 29 frames to play an already low-odds lottery and then being damaged/comboed/killed is probably the worst investment you could make.
Every single risky pull is giving free % to your opponent in a gamble to complete the FULL 29 frames (if interrupted on 28 or earlier, the turnip disappears). Even if you get hit as soon as the animation completes, there is still an additional chance that you'll drop the turnip in hitstun (no exact percentage, but it seems to be 1/10 of the times you get hit while holding a turnip). On top of that, if you luck out and retain the turnip/item, they're still getting a free punish before you can use that pull to defend yourself.
This is a core principle to peach play that you end up breaking when first playing a new opponent, since there are many matchup/stage combinations where you need to test pulling in uncertain situations. This sense comes through trial and error and playing on the edge of your opponent's reach in neutral. Ideally you'll slowly learn which opportunities are barely safe (can buffer spotdodge/shield to avoid punish) or read openings specific to your opponent, thereby minimizing your number of -EV pulls each game. If you're unsure that its safe, don't pull!
4) Know basic probabilities
Using the general rule of getting extra value one out of every nine pulls, probability can help further predict the likelihood of getting the +EV pull you're looking for. Each pull there is a 8/9 chance of getting a default turnip, so after two pulls (8/9 * 8/9) there is a 64/81 = 79% chance that you got a default turnip both times. This equates to a 21% probability that you get at least one +EV pull after two pulls.
Continuing this a bit:
- 30% likely to get at least one +EV pull after 3 pulls
- 50% likely to get at least one +EV pull after 6 pulls
- 75% likely to get at least one +EV pull after 12 pulls
- 85% likely to get at least one +EV pull after 16 pulls
- 95% likely to get at least one +EV pull after 25 pulls
- 10% likely to get at least one stitch after 6 pulls
- 20% likely to get at least one stitch after 13 pulls
- 50% likely to get at least one stitch after 40 pulls
- 5% likely to get at least one item after 6 pulls
- 10% likely to get at least one item after 14 pulls
- 25% likely to get at least one item after 38 pulls
5) Get comfortable with items
Items present Peach with a huge immediate advantage, its imperative to know how to capitalize with each the second she finds one.
Bomb-------
+++EV, do not be afraid of blowing up, learn to use it right and that should not happen. great when dropped, learn to zdrop>airdodge and qdrop oos. throws faster than turnips. avoid throwing when near platforms to avoid janky collision SDs. Mini guide by Caup
Sword-------
usually best to throw, can swing to mess with opponent. sometimes bad because it replaces your dash attack. goes away after falling on the ground two times at most. throws faster then turnips. some info by 1000g2g3g4g800999
Saturn--------
very strong shield breaker, plus people are used to shielding turnips. super combo when recaught, lasts the longest of all the items. try not to waste as an offstage edgeguard, throw him onstage to turn around instead if you can. feels like it has lower KB/scaling than a dud.
Corollary:
I was tempted to make a rule about 'minimizing wasted turnip/item throws' but its a bit harder to codify in my opinion. Its clear that pulls that end up not connecting are not necessarily -EV. You could be controlling space, turning around midair, or covering an option. As a result this is more of an important facet of peach knowledge in general, and is independent of knitting theory.
I'll leave it in this form:
"Know when to hold em, know when to throw them, know when to pull again, know when to run."
(As a sidenote, remember that all turnips when z-dropped only cause 1-2% and minimal KB / hitstun on collision, no matter what face it has. Following Knitting theory, it is never right to drop a +EV turnip where you normally would (edgeguard vs marth, running off platform). Holding onto a +EV pull until a good opening appears to throw it is smartest, so choose another option in those situations)
------------------------------------------------------------------------
II. Panning for Frying Pans
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Whenever you have spare time (especially in the mus that utilize fsmash), cycle through fsmash until you get the frying pan. The game doesn't actually cycle through the three in order, it randomly chooses one of the remaining two weapons to use each time. In other words, you will never get two of the same weapon in a row. Now that you've used pan, either the club or racket will come out on your next fsmash, which both have slightly better range and (arguably) KB trajectory (frame data for all three is the same). The first fsmash of every stock is picked from the three randomly, so this effect does not persist through death.This technique has been known since 2005, possibly earlier.
It is better in most cases to knock an opponent farther horizontally away with the club/racket and hope to set up an edgegard/gain space. Even if they are at high %, a frying pan will rarely kill (even when charged) and is awkward to act out of sometimes since they don't get sent a safe distance away. This, coupled with its slightly shorter range, makes it the weakest of the three in the matchups that I use fsmash the most in. In general, I find Fsmash is only worth using at maximum range anyway.
There are only two situations in which a frying pan may be better (that I can think of at least). One is as a puff rest punish, fully charged, on some stages. The other is as a low% tool for comboing/juggling fastfallers, but these are the mus that fsmash is hardly ever used in. (There is some preference involved. If you think that the club is the weakest of the three, you can go clubbing between stocks, and if you hate the racket you can go racketeering instead.)
One fsmash takes about as much time as a pull>qdrop or pull>throw, so you count it as one of your 'pull' attempts before starting to knit. Keep track of the last fsmash used, get good at reacting to them, and don't forget that the anti-pan effect goes away when you die. IMPORTANT: when waiting for opponent to spawn, DO ANY PANNING BEFORE KNITTING. Don't want to risk throwing away a +EV pull with a smash throw.
- Pan: 15-18%, 39 base KB, .44 KB scaling, vertical KB, most damage, slightly less range
- Club: 13-17%, 50 base KB, .38 KB scaling, 45 deg above horizontal KB, tipper/sourspot effect, slightly more range
- Racket: 12-16%, 48 base KB, .18 KB scaling, horizontal KB, least damage
Hit: 15-18
Charge frame: 8
IASA: 40
Shield stun: 16
Shield hit lag: 7
Advantage: -14_-11
Gifs and data from "Complete Peach Hitboxes and Frame Data" thread, damage and KB data from SSBWiki and @Veril 's peach notes (damages may not be completely accurate)
------------------------------------------------------------------------
III. References
------------------------------------------------------------------------
- @SuperDoodleMan @Stratocaster @emmawatsonsboyfriend "http://smashboards.com/threads/complete-peach-hitboxes-and-frame-data.287033/"
- @
Quetzalcoatl
"http://smashboards.com/threads/quetzalcoatls-extensive-turnip-guide.79319/"
- @
Quetzalcoatl
"http://smashboards.com/threads/quetzs-turnip-guide-revision-1-turnip-damage-and-knockback.400824/"
- @
CAUP
"http://smashboards.com/threads/bob-omb-minutiae.388104/" - @Veril "http://smashboards.com/threads/peach-data-and-notes.309178/"
- @Magus420 "Melee turnip table"
- "http://www.ssbwiki.com/Peach_(SSBM)"
- "http://www.ssbwiki.com/Forward_smash/Knockback_chart"
- Thanks to @Stratocaster for the 10/12 Frame Qdrop frame data & the gif
- Thanks to @radiogiraffe for sending me information on the 7 Frame Qdrop & the other gifs
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