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PM Arts and Alts Thread

Thank you PMDT!

  • :)

    Votes: 6 31.6%
  • :')

    Votes: 10 52.6%
  • ;-;

    Votes: 9 47.4%

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Nefnoj

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Maybe this should go to the official stage discussion thread?
Good thought, even though we have discussed stages in terms of aesthetic, more stage people hang out there than here.

I personally like the training stage, the size is good for li'l calculations, and anytime I introduce a friend to Smash, I always go there for a brief "press all the buttons".
 

Nefnoj

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iirc, all diddy's costume files have their own jetpack, so an alt could have it's own aesthetically different version.

someone tell me I'm right.
You're right.

They should make each jetpack for Diddy's current files have slightly different hues that accord to his skin tone swaps.
 

Nefnoj

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I think it seems like something that would have been suggested by I did not see it in the OP, but I think it would be interesting to give Mewtwo an alt with the brown cape he is seen wearing occasionally although I can imagine there could be a number of technical issues with that.

http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/upload/6/6f/Mewtwo_Cloak.png
I don't personally like the idea of Mewtwo having a cape, his tail, like you said, would be an issue, and it doesn't seem to fit his aesthetic in my opinion...

...Unless they made it closer to a wizarding cloak.
 

ThePlacidPlatypus

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I think it seems like something that would have been suggested by I did not see it in the OP, but I think it would be interesting to give Mewtwo an alt with the brown cape he is seen wearing occasionally although I can imagine there could be a number of technical issues with that.

http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/upload/6/6f/Mewtwo_Cloak.png
This would be pretty cool if they could get it to work. Maybe have it split or end at the tail.
 

Narpas_sword

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Though I don't like the removal of the names, this is awesome:
I would love to see it implemented.

This is why I pay you, Bootz! It'd be neat if it could be random each time.
Removal of names is the first thing i do.
Like, it really serves no purpose having the names blocking the icon. We get them on the CPS's anyway.

That out of box CSS is amazing though, ive had it a weekish and love it.
 
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Nefnoj

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Removal of names is the first thing i do.
Like, it really serves no purpose having the names blocking the icon. We get them on the CPS's anyway.
I beg to differ with your differing, haha.

Partly because I'm biased and love redundancy in details, but mostly because Smash is a lot of people's introductions to Nintendo characters! Back when 64 came out, I didn't know who the heck this "Samus" man was, nor why "Captain Falcon" would yell so much. When names are being subtly displayed (they're not even that big) when someone new to Smash first sees a character, it plays as an introduction to new players visiting a friend's house trying out a new game. Smash characters aren't the exception of friendships. You introduce yourself to a weird new character, then you start liking him, then you start loving him. Or her, I'm used to using male terms as gender nonspecific because I know very little women in my life.


This rule also applies to Project M, my best friend's first moment with Smash was Project M, he loved it so much he got a cheap Gamecube with Melee because Wiis ain't cheap, dawg.


The twist: He's an Xbox fanboy. He knew nothing about why some robot fox was fighting a giant head elf kid. When I suggested a character, he didn't have to go scrolling through each selection having to find out who "Meta Knight" was, and I didn't have to bother with explaining a round caped ball thingy with a sword. Smash is pretty overwhelming to new players, names make it a bit less foreign, thus, less overwhelming.

I guess I might be just a tad strong about redundancies. I'm even disappointed that they removed names from the battle portrait stuff, haha!
That out of box CSS is amazing though, ive had it a weekish and love it.
It's so pretty! Would you happen to know how it works and how sensitive it is? I'm tempted to try it, but I don't want to bother if I can't mess with it at all. Breaking things is the first step to making them better.
 

Narpas_sword

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Yea, or find ugly names taking up 1/3 of the icon to be more painful than describing meta Knight to someone. Besides, new people tend to pick who they like the look of =p

To each their own though, and I don't think that awesome css would look as good with names.

Actually, from what I can see the names wouldn't fit as they are and would require shrinking to fit in the smaller squares.
 
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CBO0tz

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Sour Supreme

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Nefnoj

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So back to my whole over-analysis of pre-existing palette swaps. So Donkey Kong's been updated to reflect his Super Kong palette from the Donkey Kong Country Returns titles... But poor Diddy didn't get the same respect. I would like to see this updated, for Diddy Kong to match Donkey Kong's palette. Diddy's green palette is very red, the stars on the shirt make for a nice contrast, but his fur takes a small contrast and makes it look like diarrhea. If his yellow fur was replaced with white fur for his blue palette swap, maybe they could move that fur to the green swap to make him look nicer?

And while I'm at it, I think Ice Climbers are quirky in terms of their palettes. They should match, but if they look too different, it's weird, and if they look too similar, I forget which one I'm playing as (happens to me more often than it should). I think their red, blue, and white palettes should be adjusted.
I think Red Popo should wear orange instead of that white-blue (to reflect his orange from Melee), a white-blue that would be moved to the white palette swap. The blue Nana should wear some purple. Each of those colours are close to their base, but different enough to match well:

Dat purple's a bit 'ard to see, in't it?

Maybe I should apply for a palette swap guy for Project M, I'm always paying close attention to those, and anytime I change them, I always use in-game resources. (For orange, I combined the yellow Ice Climber and the Red Ice Climber). I'm not exceptionally skilled in texturing, but there's a need: The Project M team tends to neglect certain palette swaps that are unfun.
I wouldn't mind a cloaked Mewtwo. It'd be more interesting than another Armor recolor.
ORANGE. ORANGE MEWTWO. ORANGE MEWTWO.
Also I just found this thread today, not sure how old it is, but I like a lot of the ideas and stuff he's already done.
http://smashboards.com/threads/mr-h...ry-bowser-accurate-samus-more-to-come.387372/
Extra emphasis on how cool Fire Mario would be if his Fair burned with fire like that in PM.
I want those to official.
 
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Sour Supreme

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So back to my whole over-analysis of pre-existing palette swaps. So Donkey Kong's been updated to reflect his Super Kong palette from the Donkey Kong Country Returns titles... But poor Diddy didn't get the same respect. I would like to see this updated, for Diddy Kong to match Donkey Kong's palette. Diddy's green palette is very red, the stars on the shirt make for a nice contrast, but his fur takes a small contrast and makes it look like diarrhea. If his yellow fur was replaced with white fur for his blue palette swap, maybe they could move that fur to the green swap to make him look nicer?

And while I'm at it, I think Ice Climbers are quirky in terms of their palettes. They should match, but if they look too different, it's weird, and if they look too similar, I forget which one I'm playing as (happens to me more often than it should). I think their red, blue, and white palettes should be adjusted.
I think Red Popo should wear orange instead of that white-blue (to reflect his orange from Melee), a white-blue that would be moved to the white palette swap. The blue Nana should wear some purple. Each of those colours are close to their base, but different enough to match well:

Dat purple's a bit 'ard to see, in't it?

Maybe I should apply for a palette swap guy for Project M, I'm always paying close attention to those, and anytime I change them, I always use in-game resources. (For orange, I combined the yellow Ice Climber and the Red Ice Climber). I'm not exceptionally skilled in texturing, but there's a need: The Project M team tends to neglect certain palette swaps that are unfun.
ORANGE. ORANGE MEWTWO. ORANGE MEWTWO.

I want those to official.
I only brought up Super Diddy 4 pages ago...

I agree with all of this, though
 

Draco_The

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I'm not sure if this was discussed earlier, but if Samus' grapple beam was no longer fired from the arm cannon that would mean that she would have the arm cannon free to use for a throw.

This idea may be crazy but well. I propose leaving all current throws intact. As in not changing how they work or the idea behind their animations (the animations would need to be changed for the grapple beam change). Maybe making the back throw reminiscent of the Metroid Prime 3 grapple lasso animation.

BUT one more throw would be added, and it would be performed by pressing B instead of a direction in the joystick. It would be a point blank charge shot, whose knockback and damage depends on the current charge level. Of course that charge would be lost after firing the shot.

Discuss.
 

Xermo

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I'm not sure if this was discussed earlier, but if Samus' grapple beam was no longer fired from the arm cannon that would mean that she would have the arm cannon free to use for a throw.

This idea may be crazy but well. I propose leaving all current throws intact. As in not changing how they work or the idea behind their animations (the animations would need to be changed for the grapple beam change). Maybe making the back throw reminiscent of the Metroid Prime 3 grapple lasso animation.

BUT one more throw would be added, and it would be performed by pressing B instead of a direction in the joystick. It would be a point blank charge shot, whose knockback and damage depends on the current charge level. Of course that charge would be lost after firing the shot.

Discuss.
Broken.
 

Nefnoj

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By the way, Zelda has every costume file in the 3.6 build, anyone know why?
I would also like to point out that ROB's jet thingies on his virtual boy are completely blacked out still... It looks like it's been done ON PURPOSE.

I would also like to point out that Dark Toon Pit is really mad. Like I was when they removed Olimar's smokey helmet that I don't know how to fix!
I'm not sure if this was discussed earlier, but if Samus' grapple beam was no longer fired from the arm cannon that would mean that she would have the arm cannon free to use for a throw.

This idea may be crazy but well. I propose leaving all current throws intact. As in not changing how they work or the idea behind their animations (the animations would need to be changed for the grapple beam change). Maybe making the back throw reminiscent of the Metroid Prime 3 grapple lasso animation.

BUT one more throw would be added, and it would be performed by pressing B instead of a direction in the joystick. It would be a point blank charge shot, whose knockback and damage depends on the current charge level. Of course that charge would be lost after firing the shot.

Discuss.
I had an idea like this, but much less cool. This is brilliant! Though I fear for Samus' file size. It'd be neat if you could press B and a direction at the same time. They'd have to refine a few animations, for the jab, since Samus would be bashing whomever's face in with her arm cannon, it might be awkward being as fast as her current jab is.

And - of course - it'd need to be nerfed. If it's uncharged, would it be a tiny pew-pew, or a missile?
I think Samus well deserves a good throw by now.

The coolest part for this would be that they would get a chance to design the standard grapple, the Fusion grapple, and the grapple for the Power Suit.
I only brought up Super Diddy 2 pages ago...

I agree with all of this, though
You send me looking for the exact post, and I go wasting my time four pages ago, darn you poopsleeper...
 
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Shin F.

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I'm not sure if this was discussed earlier, but if Samus' grapple beam was no longer fired from the arm cannon that would mean that she would have the arm cannon free to use for a throw.

This idea may be crazy but well. I propose leaving all current throws intact. As in not changing how they work or the idea behind their animations (the animations would need to be changed for the grapple beam change). Maybe making the back throw reminiscent of the Metroid Prime 3 grapple lasso animation.

BUT one more throw would be added, and it would be performed by pressing B instead of a direction in the joystick. It would be a point blank charge shot, whose knockback and damage depends on the current charge level. Of course that charge would be lost after firing the shot.

Discuss.
A Charge Shot that can neither be dodged nor shielded against? Cool, but...
 

Draco_The

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What's the difference between that and any other kill throw? You even need to charge it first in order to make it kill anyone.
 
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Nefnoj

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What's the difference between that and any other kill throw? You even need to charge it first in order to make it kill anyone.
And it'd probably be just as hard to pull off than an actual fully charged shot, considering the stuffs. The charged shot technically has infinite range, this only has range for whatever's right in front of you.
 
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Shin F.

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What's the difference between that and any other kill throw? You even need to charge it first in order to make it kill anyone.
It's not that it's different from other kill throws, it's just that Samus herself doesn't have a kill throw as an option, so giving her one may be a bit too much of a buff. I suppose that's going to have to be a judgement call on the PMDT's part.

And I'm not positive, but don't Charge Shots kill quite a bit sooner than a typical kill throw?
And it'd probably be just as hard to pull off than an actual fully charged shot, considering the stuffs. The charged shot technically has infinite range, this only has range for whatever's right in front of you.
Not really, since an actual Charge Shot can be reflected, absorbed, shielded, or dodged, which would be impossible if it was a throw. More range just gives a greater chance of reflecting it, so it would definitely be a superior option to the standard Charge Shot.
 
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Narpas_sword

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Samus already has a good Chargeshot folwwop with downthrow (or up vs spacies), it just takes a bit of a read in DI or tech.
Giving her a guaranteed full chargeshot is too much.

That said, id love her f throw to be like a melee m2 / fox/ falco style, but with a missile.
and her pummel to be uncharged shots.
 

Draco_The

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It's not that it's different from other kill throws, it's just that Samus herself doesn't have a kill throw as an option, so giving her one may be a bit too much of a buff. I suppose that's going to have to be a judgement call on the PMDT's part.

And I'm not positive, but don't Charge Shots kill quite a bit sooner than a typical kill throw?

Not really, since an actual Charge Shot can be reflected, absorbed, shielded, or dodged, which would be impossible if it was a throw. More range just gives a greater chance of reflecting it, so it would definitely be a superior option to the standard Charge Shot.
I'm not into Samus myself, but her throw startup is pretty slow compared with other characters and all her current throw options seem rather meh. Also, AFAIK her ranged grab is the only one that can grab airborne opponents. I doubt they made it that way just because.

Also, when I said point blank charged shot I didn't mean just make her use her neutral B while the opponent is still grabbed, that's why I said make the knockback and damage dependant instead of equal. It would count as another different move but using the current charge level as a base for its knockback, damage and maybe gfx. If the knockback from the normal charged shot is too much they could just tone it down.
 

Shin F.

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I'm not into Samus myself, but her throw startup is pretty slow compared with other characters and all her current throw options seem rather meh. Also, AFAIK her ranged grab is the only one that can grab airborne opponents. I doubt they made it that way just because.

Also, when I said point blank charged shot I didn't mean just make her use her neutral B while the opponent is still grabbed, that's why I said make the knockback and damage dependant instead of equal. It would count as another different move but using the current charge level as a base for its knockback, damage and maybe gfx. If the knockback from the normal charged shot is too much they could just tone it down.
It would feel kind of odd to have the same charge do differing damage. I'd rather have it so her grab charge is separate entirely and can only be charged while she's holding onto the enemy. So you'd grab them and then hold b to charge, then release to fire. This could help prevent abuse of the attack since it would be difficult or impossible to charge it fully until the enemy is already at a fairly high percent, and it would allow the Charge Shot's power to be consistent without making it an overpowered option since it would require time to execute. I'd be fine with it if it functioned like this. Cool but impractical except on rare occasions, like Ganondorf's sword.

Plus, just imagine how satisfying it would be to grab your high-percent enemy, put your blaster on their face and charge your beam while they're helpless to do anything about it, and then blow them out of the stage.
 
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Xermo

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Problem with it is that samus doesn't have problems killing without a kill throw, and in her current state she has links that leads into a charge shot anyway. Having a guaranteed fully charged shot at optimal kill percents turns her into a character that can play the missile camping game and then finish you with a grab when you approach.

Doing it your other way where it's lowered in power / knockback turns the option into a "why would I burn out my charge shot if it isn't going to kill when I can dthrow -> charge shot and net the stock; unless I happen to be at the ledge where it would kill."
 

Sour Supreme

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Like Narpas said, D-throw/Up Throw into Charge Shot is already a thing, and it's balanced because it relies on you reading your enemy's tech post-throw.

@ Nefnoj Nefnoj , can't you just fetch the Smoky Helmet file from an old version..?
 

Nefnoj

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Like Narpas said, D-throw/Up Throw into Charge Shot is already a thing, and it's balanced because it relies on you reading your enemy's tech post-throw.
Samus isn't my number one main, but she's definitely my number four. The only throw I ever use is the up-throw, and whenever I do, it only involves an up-air and screw attack. Every other throw is pretty measly and spontaneous, especially in comparison to every other character.

Though I'm not an expert, I think it might be a good idea to wander this to the Samus character discussion. More Samus experts.
@ Nefnoj Nefnoj , can't you just fetch the Smoky Helmet file from an old version..?
Nup, Olimar's light wouldn't change, and I use that quite a bit... I've tried to switch out textures, but nup nup.
 

Narpas_sword

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Samus isn't my number one main, but she's definitely my number four. The only throw I ever use is the up-throw, and whenever I do, it only involves an up-air and screw attack. Every other throw is pretty measly and spontaneous, especially in comparison to every other character.

Though I'm not an expert, I think it might be a good idea to wander this to the Samus character discussion. More Samus experts.

Nup, Olimar's light wouldn't change, and I use that quite a bit... I've tried to switch out textures, but nup nup.
You definitely want to be using Dthrow.
 

Nixie

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so, does black gi lucario's headband not look right for anyone else?

I'm sure it's already been noticed, but just in case, @Nanobuds


3.6b on left and 3.5 on right
The other costume doesn't have this problem, however.
 
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Nefnoj

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so, does black gi lucario's headband not look right for anyone else?
I'm a bit of a nitpick for stuff like that, but I think it looks fine. It's a colour that contrasts from the Gi drawing attention to it, but it's not a completely outlandish colour that clashes with the rest. Of course, I might be the only one who thinks so.
 

Nixie

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I'm a bit of a nitpick for stuff like that, but I think it looks fine. It's a colour that contrasts from the Gi drawing attention to it, but it's not a completely outlandish colour that clashes with the rest. Of course, I might be the only one who thinks so.
No, I mean it literally doesn't appear as it's supposed to for me.

I haven't noticed anyone mention this problem before which seems weird because this feels like it would be pretty obvious.
Perhaps because this wouldn't be the place to do so...
I'm sure Justin Bailey's 3.5 eyelashes were brought up in here, though..
 

Nefnoj

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No, I mean it literally doesn't appear as it's supposed to for me.

I haven't noticed anyone mention this problem before which seems weird because this feels like it would be pretty obvious.
Perhaps because this wouldn't be the place to do so...
I'm sure Justin Bailey's 3.5 eyelashes were brought up in here, though..
Don't worry, if it's visual, we talk about it! Glitches or otherwise! We get away with so much here! If you can, you should take a screenshot of the band and post it, I'll take a look at it in-game sometime later to see if mine's wonky.

His headband looks fine for me, speaking of Gi Lucario. Red Gi to reference Ken when? Lol X)
I'll eat your flesh.
Though Lucario has two slots left, I wouldn't mind seeing them as more recolours. I could see Lucario's skin tone being the unused recolours from Brawl, and the Gi changing colour based on various fighter stereotypes in Pokémon.
Did you also try grabbing the original's helmet material and possibly its shader?
Nope! I will try.
 
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birdnerd

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For other Lucario gi alts, what headbands are there to choose from? Here are a few I dug up:
 

StarWaffle

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We need Great Bay as the Pirate Ship's alt.
OVER ANALYSIS TIME
. So my entire life of knowing of Project M's costumes I've always hated the idea of Mr. L team colours. When I saw them on the Vault, I always shuddered. When they were confirmed for 3.6, I had a heart attack, and not the good Nanobuddy kind... Until I saw the white variant, it stood out, looked better than the other palette swaps. Then I realized that it goes all the way back to my Wario palette swap. Remember what I said about the palette with primary colours? Not red, green and blue, but the colours that stand out the most. It's a similar system. Not only do they look extremely alike in gameplay, but they don't stand out, and are comparatively jarring because the costume only has two colours, green and black, and in every other Smash game, two to three colours are almost always changed, with the most primary colour changing the most. Neither happened with the Mr. L palettes.

I thought I'd try switching the sleeves and the pants, leaving everything else, including Luigi's sweater vest with the nipple oh my gosh I've never said that word before, is it a bad word? Will Mommy slaughter me? thingies, unchanged. Turns out the vest uses the same texture as the sleeves, so that was impossible. Instead, I switched the texture of the pants and the mask to the team colour, red for the orange, and blue for the cyan. I also changed the white buckle and nips of the cyan Mr. L to silver, to better fit the cool colour spectrum of Mr. L. Please understand:

Are they good? Are they bad? Please tell me how these can be improved because the older palette swaps make me want to hurt those whom I love..
I too, always thought recolors of him would be an awful idea until I started seeing more and more people choosing the skin in tournament/casual play. I'd say about 65% of the time I saw a gify or video of Luigi being played in Project M, it was the Mr.L skin being used. Which is why more flavors/team colours were added.

And I understand your concern but there's no way they are going to be changed, at least not as drastically as you are suggesting here. What makes Mr.L, Mr.L is his completely black attire with an accent colored hat/bandana. (milkman being a special inverted case) Changing his pants/sleeves/mask/nipples/shoes/whatever would completely defeat the purpose of it being recolors of Mr.L. It's hard to please everyone when making things like this and I often see things like "I love the ____ recolor but hate the ___ one". Please understand that we are trying our best and if it means anything, that the extra costume files now exist and are available for further customization.


The differences are subtle but they are there. I just did not want to start adding in more colors where they don't belong
 

Nefnoj

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A tad bit unrelated, where's your Project M guy tag?
I too, always thought recolors of him would be an awful idea until I started seeing more and more people choosing the skin in tournament/casual play. I'd say about 65% of the time I saw a gify or video of Luigi being played in Project M, it was the Mr.L skin being used. Which is why more flavors/team colours were added.

What makes Mr.L, Mr.L is his completely black attire with an accent colored hat/bandana. Changing his pants/sleeves/mask/nipples/shoes/whatever would completely defeat the purpose of it being recolors of Mr.L. It's hard to please everyone when making things like this and I often see things like "I love the ____ recolor but hate the ___ one". Please understand that we are trying our best and if it means anything, that the extra costume files now exist and are available for further customization.


The differences are subtle but they are there. I just did not want to start adding in more colors where they don't belong
Oh, I absolutely understand the need for new recolours, and I saw the subtle bits while I was changing my version... The problem is that the only time you see the subtle bits are when you're changing the textures. With the lighting, the shading, all that from the camera's distance ten feet away (I'm just assuming, I can't measure distance), they're impossible to see in-game. Except for training, zoomed in, of course.


I understand the need to keep blackness to maintain his character, but it defies all the palette swap logic in Smash Bros: It's like there being a recolour for Mario that only changed his gloves and shoes: And like Mr. L's black, what makes Mario Mario is his red hat, yet every recolour changes that detail. (Exaggeration) Hence why you guys fixed all of the Pokémon's and Sonic's recolours! Recall the Donkey Kong Boxing recolours, you guys didn't just change the gloves, you changed the fur, the skin-tone, dozens of different details. The Mr. L recolours defy pretty much every rule of palette swaps!

I understand the "need to please everyone", and more of everybody's favourite costume is a good idea, but this isn't a simple case of "I love the ____ recolor but hate the ___ one", they're closer to Sonic OC where all that's been done is a switch of a colour, not a switch of a palette. Someone would choose one of those, not based on the character of the palette matching the character and corresponding well with each colour, but based on "hey, I like orange, that's an orange hat. I guess I'll go with that one". Palettes have a lot of character; people choose "Old Manondorf", not because he wears white, but because he has white hair, gilded armour, and looks like an old man. People choose pink Captain Falcon, not because they like pink (sometimes), but because he so dang fabulous! Palettes have more character and personality than a simple colour swap.

An example, these ones are extremely poorly done, yet they have more character to Mr. L and each swap because they follow the Palette Rule. And that red one is cool.

Should they be "drastic"? I don't think so, which is why I kept a black shirt in my change, but like every secondary colour in Smash Bros., there needs to be some kind of change. Just match a typical teenage goth and it'll be fine, huehuehue.

Also it's very annoying for colourblind players. Dey need dem secondary colour changes.
Please understand that we are trying our best
Please understand
That phrase gives me a feel.
 
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