Social PK Love - Lucas Social Thread: “Inside the mailbox was absolutely nothing”

[meleebrawler]

Thanks to this picture I kinda picture Samus and Lucas as being really close to each other now.

Except Lucas ends up befriending the thing that killed his mother later right?

 

[Luco]

Except Lucas ends up befriending the thing that killed his mother later right?

Spoiler

Not quite. The Mecha-Drago is presumably what killed Hinawa, and although Flint lets it live, we don't see him again iirc. Lucas befriends a normal Drago, presumably one of the ones that wasn't affected by Porky's troops.

I was going to say you could also kinda argue Samus has a weird relationship with Ridley and then remembered her indecision in Other M doesn't count because Other M is not a good installment to the series story-line wise.

 

[meleebrawler]

Spoiler

Not quite. The Mecha-Drago is presumably what killed Hinawa, and although Flint lets it live, we don't see him again iirc. Lucas befriends a normal Drago, presumably one of the ones that wasn't affected by Porky's troops.

I was going to say you could also kinda argue Samus has a weird relationship with Ridley and then remembered her indecision in Other M doesn't count because Other M is not a good installment to the series story-line wise.

That wasn't indecision, it was trauma. You honestly thought she was pondering whether or not she should kill Ridley?
Also it's not good to dismiss the plot of a game just because you didn't like it. Other M does it's job of bridging Super Metroid
and Fusion together as well as providing more context for the things we learned about Samus in Fusion.

And any way Lucas could've easily reacted the same way if he saw any more of the thing that killed his mother but he doesn't as a testament to how much he grew.

 

[Luco]

That wasn't indecision, it was trauma. You honestly thought she was pondering whether or not she should kill Ridley?
Also it's not good to dismiss the plot of a game just because you didn't like it. Other M does it's job of bridging Super Metroid
and Fusion together as well as providing more context for the things we learned about Samus in Fusion.

And any way Lucas could've easily reacted the same way if he saw any more of the thing that killed his mother but he doesn't as a testament to how much he grew.

Soz, the reason I talk about Other M that way is because of the wider community's reaction to it. It was an alright game, it had good, fun gameplay and was engaging, but I don't think it's too un-reasonable to say its story was questionable.

To an extent yes, but mecha-dragos are very different from normal ones. I think that the situations are relatively similar none-the-less and the comparison is certainly appropriate.

 

[GreatSogeking]

The way Lucas turns around and then smiles just reminds me of 80's sitcoms. I just expect a caption with his name underneath him appearing-

Oh. Nevermind.

This immediately came to mind...

 

[FullMoon]

Since we're on this topic, I was always wondering... What was Lucas doing between the ending of Chapter 1 and the ending of Chapter 3?

Spoiler

Was he looking for Claus too, but eventually gave up while Flint still kept going at it, or was he just trying to find the Dragos? It's pretty easy to assume that the Drago that he befriends is the one we see lying down in the Prologue, who probably was very angry for what happened to their mate too. It's easy to assume that Flint told Lucas about what happened in the Drago Plateau once he came back home, but I kinda wonder what was going through Lucas's head after that.

 

[Kangaexe]

Some Lucas torny play https://youtu.be/PPff4NkvCBw?t=137

 

[Deleted member]

Some Lucas torny play https://youtu.be/PPff4NkvCBw?t=137

That was really cool. I didn't expect such a wide margin of victory for Lucas.

 

[Agent Emerald]

So I finally got the Dlc and I'm Loving it!

My FG win record, however, isn't.

 

[A Polar Bear]

So I finally got the Dlc and I'm Loving it!

My FG win record, however, isn't.

Win records won't bring Claus back.

 

[A Polar Bear]

For those who don't know, Star is an excellent Ness and Lucas player in Brawl, and now in Smash 4. Here's them showing off some nice tech. There's also a video of their Lucas gameplay on RED's channel I'd recommend you guys check out.

 

[KaptenFullkorn]

Thanks! Not coming from brawl makes the pro lucas players hard to find!

 

[Kenturo]

Hey guys wavebouncing pk magnet is actually really ****ing good

I don't really know if it is known but you usually cant fast fall right after you use the move but it you use an attack after the magnet you can fast fall right after. Combine this with double jump cancelling and Lucas is really hard to catch

 

[Tito Maas]

Hey guys wavebouncing pk magnet is actually really ****ing good

I don't really know if it is known but you usually cant fast fall right after you use the move but it you use an attack after the magnet you can fast fall right after. Combine this with double jump cancelling and Lucas is really hard to catch

Have any videos?

 

[Tito Maas]

lol I might sound like a dummy but I need some kind of annotations for the techs in that video

 

[Kenturo]

Have any videos?

Sorry no recording device. Someone else will probably have it on video eventually because I think it really important Lucas' game

 

[KaptenFullkorn]

Sorry no recording device. Someone else will probably have it on video eventually because I think it really important Lucas' game

Hey man, Thanks for contributing - I'd like to see a video of this implemented aswell! You can request hd recordings of your replay on the subreddit https://www.reddit.com/r/Smash4Replay/ . I tried it out recently and someone replied and helped me with two 1080p 60fps recordings within a DAY(you can see one of them in the lucas video thread)!

 

[Champ Gold]

So I finally got the Dlc and I'm Loving it!

My FG win record, however, isn't.

That record percent will never change.


EVER

 

[Snackss]

For Glory record can only go down, it's a statistical anomaly.

 

[Agent Emerald]

That record percent will never change.


EVER

So, It'll be at ~75% forever?

I'm okay with that.

 

[BSXDrayden]

I'm going to a tourney this weekend and will be repping Lucas (and if need be, Jiggs too)! Hopefully I'll do ok.

 

[Luco]

I was at a tournament the other day and pulled out Lucas in my first round. Even though I won, I didn't have the courage to pull him out after that, but I'l get there eventually.

 

[Kangaexe]

Got a TV, soon to be all set up and i can record my Wii U \o/

ill add you guys if you wanna send me a replay for me to record and email back to you!

 

[Tito Maas]

LucasFam

I've made my decision. Dropping Lucas down from secondary to pocket. Currently training up Zero Suit Samus to take his place.

Don't think too badly of me, alright? I'm desperate here

 

[A Polar Bear]

When we joined the coveted ranks of Lucas players, we took an Oath:

"Forever honor our main, play without disdain.
No matter the tier, no matter the matchup,
We swear to uphold our pride,
For justice, for family, for Glory."

On the blood of our Brothers, on the blood of our Mothers, we swore to uphold our golden haired child, even to the nine hundred ninety ninth percent.

Those who would break this Oath, are weak, betrayers, heretics...

Worthy of neither pity, nor mercy!

Even now, they use our sacred forums, to broadcast their subversion to our Faith with empty apologies and disgraceful excuses.

No matter, we shall grind them to dust, along with anyone else to dare tread in our way, scrape their blood off the welts of our shoes as we spike them into the oblivion they've been digging themselves for so long.

The weak shall surrender, and be tempted by easier paths that lead to nothing but Hell, but we the Lucas players shall never betray our strength, overcome all adversity, and continue our march to the sunflower laden fields of glorious Salvation!

...

In other words

LucasFam

I've made my decision. Dropping Lucas down from secondary to pocket. Currently training up Zero Suit Samus to take his place.

Don't think too badly of me, alright? I'm desperate here

Hoe why

 

[Champ Gold]

I'm more of funsie player with Lucas.

He doesn't hit the secondary pact yet

 

[Tito Maas]

When we joined the coveted ranks of Lucas players, we took an Oath:

"Forever honor our main, play without disdain.
No matter the tier, no matter the matchup,
We swear to uphold our pride,
For justice, for family, for Glory."

On the blood of our Brothers, on the blood of our Mothers, we swore to uphold our golden haired child, even to the nine hundred ninety ninth percent.

Those who would break this Oath, are weak, betrayers, heretics...

Worthy of neither pity, nor mercy!

Even now, they use our sacred forums, to broadcast their subversion to our Faith with empty apologies and disgraceful excuses.

No matter, we shall grind them to dust, along with anyone else to dare tread in our way, scrape their blood off the welts of our shoes as we spike them into the oblivion they've been digging themselves for so long.

The weak shall surrender, and be tempted by easier paths that lead to nothing but Hell, but we the Lucas players shall never betray our strength, overcome all adversity, and continue our march to the sunflower laden fields of glorious Salvation!

...

In other words




Hoe why

lmao I was extremely entertained by this post, I wish I could like it twice

Ugh man idk I just ran through a few matches with Lucas the other day and lost like every one and I got tired of it. Either his meta isn't developed yet or I just don't like the character as much as I thought I did. But an important factor is that I don't think he augments my main's weaknesses (Dark Pit) like other characters can. He's fun to play with but I don't think he gives me an edge over opponents that Dark Pit couldn't give me... besides PK Fire.

Plus Ness is better than him at like everything and it annoys me

 

[Snackss]

Dark Pit is already pretty solid even if Pit is still better. You can't really have a secondary for him that complements him without just picking Sheik or Fox or whatever.

How do you do the tether to jumping on stage thing? Where Lucas snakes the ledge then cancels it and jumps on stage rather than pulling himself up to a ledge hang.

 

[Tito Maas]

Dark Pit is already pretty solid even if Pit is still better. You can't really have a secondary for him that complements him without just picking Sheik or Fox or whatever.

How do you do the tether to jumping on stage thing? Where Lucas snakes the ledge then cancels it and jumps on stage rather than pulling himself up to a ledge hang.

Well I mean, everyone needs a secondary. ZSS/Pit is actually not an uncommon combo.

 

[Luco]

Plus Ness is better than him at like everything and it annoys me

Noooooo don't make that mistake! His recovery is still leagues better as is his keep-away. Comparing most of his tools to Ness' is a mis-leading exercise my friend, because most his tools are used for entirely different purposes.

 

[Tito Maas]

Noooooo don't make that mistake! His recovery is still leagues better as is his keep-away. Comparing most of his tools to Ness' is a mis-leading exercise my friend, because most his tools are used for entirely different purposes.

I mean, really? I honestly feel like Lucas would be a lot better with... well, a lot of Ness's mechanics.

I've had Lucas as my secondary since he was released, but idk, what does he do that's a lot different than Ness besides being forced into a hit and run type character who kills way later?

PK Fire was superior in Brawl but with the new multiphit mechanics, Ness's is just... better. He can do many setups out of it--setups that Lucas needs since he has like the worst grab in the game and unreliable kill moves. Sucks that his best combo starts and kill moves come via throw when the grab game is lacking. The spacing you get from it, especially in the air, is cool, but it overall seems to have less utility than the PK Fire, especially when you look at how the two play.

His recovery is better than Ness's but... I mean... Ness's PK Thunder can do so many different things. The utility is off the charts. Recovery, kills super duper early, great at juggling, great for mindgames, great for edgeguarding. Lucas's can do none of those things mostly due to endlag and it's pretty dangerous to use PKT2 on the ground because it's slower, meaning more readable, and goes through shields which can get you killed from pretty much anywhere if you're not precise with where you make contact with PKT and Lucas (an issue that Ness players for some reason don't have).

Lucas has advantages over Ness--recovery, BAir, PK Magnet, blowback on PKF... but idk, that's about it. And all of those things have pretty specific situations, unlike a lot of Ness's tools which can be used for a lot of things. In the grand scheme of things he just seems completely outclassed. Kinda silly that Lucas's PKT has all the drawbacks that Ness's PKT should have. Besides Luigi, does Lucas even have any matchup advantages that Ness doesn't have?

 

[Tito Maas]

I like Lucas but idk, guess I've just gotten kind of stale with him and it's discouraging.

 

[Luco]

Actually, Ness' PKF is.... Not that good competitively speaking. Light characters can and WILL fall out of it at any opportunity. Others can just punish us for whiffing it.

This is compared to Lucas who gets a near totally safe 9% off it, and even if it whiffs pretty much won't get punished. Zair is also one of the most amazing tools he has. On the occasion he does get a grab, especially around 0% he's set to do more damage than Ness in early combos. Hell, Nair can chain into itself until like 50% lol.

PKT is actually arguably better than Ness' for edge-guarding, both because stage spikes are easier to achieve and if it hits and the opponent uses upB they're usually sent all the way up to the top of the screen in helpless (it's a weird glitch but it works very well), which is a fantastic position to punish. Most times if you hit with PKT1 in an edge-guard situation you won't get punished. If you're scared about it, guide PKT back into yourself to retreat without incurring that year of end-lag.

Lucas isn't outclassed by Ness, he's just different - and his drawbacks are from other things. Zair almost single-handedly keeps him relevant, but by the same token his grab very much holds him back. These are struggles Ness doesn't have, but Lucas' kit is markedly different from Ness. Nair isn't a godly 3 frame OoS option, but instead works as an incredible chaining move. Most of their moves serve different purposes - if their moves were meant to serve the same purpose then yes I'd agree with you but it just isn't the case.

 

[Tito Maas]

Actually, Ness' PKF is.... Not that good competitively speaking. Light characters can and WILL fall out of it at any opportunity. Others can just punish us for whiffing it.

This is compared to Lucas who gets a near totally safe 9% off it, and even if it whiffs pretty much won't get punished. Zair is also one of the most amazing tools he has. On the occasion he does get a grab, especially around 0% he's set to do more damage than Ness in early combos. Hell, Nair can chain into itself until like 50% lol.

PKT is actually arguably better than Ness' for edge-guarding, both because stage spikes are easier to achieve and if it hits and the opponent uses upB they're usually sent all the way up to the top of the screen in helpless (it's a weird glitch but it works very well), which is a fantastic position to punish. Most times if you hit with PKT1 in an edge-guard situation you won't get punished. If you're scared about it, guide PKT back into yourself to retreat without incurring that year of end-lag.

Lucas isn't outclassed by Ness, he's just different - and his drawbacks are from other things. Zair almost single-handedly keeps him relevant, but by the same token his grab very much holds him back. These are struggles Ness doesn't have, but Lucas' kit is markedly different from Ness. Nair isn't a godly 3 frame OoS option, but instead works as an incredible chaining move. Most of their moves serve different purposes - if their moves were meant to serve the same purpose then yes I'd agree with you but it just isn't the case.

I try to use PKT for edgeguarding and oftentimes my opponent falls out of it... and back into me for an easy punish since I'm usually stuck in the PKT still since it's not interrupted by contact and/or endlag. Stage spiking is possible but not an opportunity that seems to arise very often at all. Ness's can also stage-spike, and he can send multiple repeatedly since they end after contact and he has very little endlag on them. As a Pit user, when Ness is throwing PKT's at you and you get hit by one, you're usually gonna run into a few more before/if you get back to the stage. Overall, it deals more damage and is more of a harrassment than Lucas's PKT. I actually think ledgeguard PK Magnet is much better for stage spiking than PKT.

I'll keep Lucas as a pocket for emergency matchups or just throwing people off (because Lucas plays so differently than Pit does, it often throws off my opponent as my strategy shifts so significantly), and I don't use Ness or particularly want to, but I don't think Lucas can be a multi-utility secondary like I originally visioned him to be.

And this might play a bit of a factor in my disappointment, but I did originally pick up Lucas to give my Ness main friend a "taste of his own medicine" with PKT2 kills and mindgames. Unfortunately, I've never been able to gain the upper hand against his Ness with him and find myself using him in less and less situations as my Dark Pit improves.

But of course, there's always room for improvement. I actually do think, though, Lucas serves as a better pocket than secondary, and I think holding him off for specific matches will do wonders for my competitive efficiency with him

 

[KaptenFullkorn]

PKT is actually arguably better than Ness' for edge-guarding, both because stage spikes are easier to achieve and if it hits and the opponent uses upB they're usually sent all the way up to the top of the screen in helpless (it's a weird glitch but it works very well), which is a fantastic position to punish. Most times if you hit with PKT1 in an edge-guard situation you won't get punished. If you're scared about it, guide PKT back into yourself to retreat without incurring that year of end-lag.

>this. PKT can be great actually, if you use it safe. Without retreating or knocking you in the ground, the endlag is sooo horrible lol. And as Luco said, zair is one of the best if not lucas greatest tool!

 

[Kangaexe]

LucasFam

I've made my decision. Dropping Lucas down from secondary to pocket. Currently training up Zero Suit Samus to take his place.

Don't think too badly of me, alright? I'm desperate here

zss is my bae you cant have her

 

[FlynnCL]

Does anyone else find it annoying that Training Mode's combo meter doesn't work correctly with a few of Lucas's moves? It's very noticeable on neutral-air...

 

[k-ta]

The combo counter in this game is just generally janky.

 

[Kangaexe]

The combo counter in this game is just generally janky.

this whole game is janky lol

 

[WaffleDinosaur]

Mother 4 getting me hyped so I decided to make some sprites