Pit's Better Half: Dark Pit General/Social Thread

[_Darkpit_]

Ah, the picture with the figures.

Honestly, while we are all aware of Sakurai's bias, I think a Figma figure and a Smash character are different concept. While I understand fully the marketing in giving Dark Pit his staff with the Figma, I think it's preferable for Dark Pit to stay as a costume.

While I understand the logic of making Lucina a Marth for beginners, I don't really see reasons to make an alternative moveset from Pit. Also, Pit may not use everything from Uprising, he represent the game well (Palutena and items contribute too).

But, well, that's just me. I'm not a develloper after all.

I think the more versatile characters with different movesets more versatile is Smash Bros 4. Pit and Darkpit are two different characters. It would be a waste if Darkpit is very similiar to Pit. In my opinion its terrible enough that we have to Links ( the same Mastersword, Bombs, Boomerang and so on.. ). Starfox characters shouled be revised too without Fox. But Darkpit could be an unique dark character.^^ It would be a waste if nobody used the potential of Darkpit. Smash Bros could be more versatile with versatile characters. If we would have Darkpit with the same moveset like Pit, a lot of versatile would get lose. ^^

 

[Altais]

I like the idea of some of your moves, the forward tilt, the jab, dash are good. I'm unsure of the neutral air, maybe Dark Pit could also hover like Mewtwo in Project M if that attack were in the game. I don't agree with the all the special moves aside from Pandora's Flight (His recovery should be shorter than Pit's too), the charged shot of the Dark Pit Staff should be his F-Smash.

I would put it like this:

Neutral Spec: Darkness Bow: Dark Pit shoots off a huge, controllable, dark arrow that does devestating damage to the opponent, although it takes a long start-up and a long cool-down and it is a slow projectile.

Side-Spec: Pandora's Claws: Dark Pit jumps forward a good distance to slash the opponent with the claws, similar to Mac's Side-Spec.

Up-Spec: Pandora's Flight: Functions the same as Pit's only his recovery is half the distance.

Down-Spec: Eye Orbitars: Functions the same as Pit's, only it does slightly better knock back and damage and has homing too. Although the projectile is relatively slow. The Orbitars can only stand against normal hits for 3 attacks.

Hmm, I could see them going with something like that, if they decided to make Dark Pit a close-range fighter. I just personally think making him a long-range fighter would do a good job in setting him apart from Pit.

Anyhow, how do you lot think the Lightning Chariot would work, if it was Dark Pit's final smash? I was thinking maybe it could work similarly to the Dragoon or Captain Falcon's final smash, but I would rather have something totally new and different in function. Perhaps Dark Pit could repeatedly dash across the screen at blinding speed, taking out any unlucky opponent he collides with.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Hmm, I could see them going with something like that, if they decided to make Dark Pit a close-range fighter. I just personally think making him a long-range fighter would do a good job in setting him apart from Pit.

Anyhow, how do you lot think the Lightning Chariot would work, if it was Dark Pit's final smash? I was thinking maybe it could work similarly to the Dragoon or Captain Falcon's final smash, but I would rather have something totally new and different in function. Perhaps Dark Pit could repeatedly dash across the screen at blinding speed, taking out any unlucky opponent he collides with.

For a Final Smash, how about just a controllable flying Dark Pit that is able to shoot KO-hard arrows, like in Chapter 6 of KI:U, I personally see that as a better idea.

 

[Weeman]

How about summoning Pandora for an assault on the other players?

 

[Altais]

For a Final Smash, how about just a controllable flying Dark Pit that is able to shoot KO-hard arrows, like in Chapter 6 of KI:U, I personally see that as a better idea.

Yeah, that is what I originally thought of, and it would suit Dark Pit's character. I just thought the Lightning Chariot would be more flashy.

 

[BluePikmin11]

How about summoning Pandora for an assault on the other players?

That would be kind of ironic if I had to be honest, considering Dark Pit betrayed her from the beginning.
Maybe Pandora's version of the 3 Sacred Treasures as a FS.

Yeah, that is what I originally thought of, and it would suit Dark Pit's character. I just thought the Lightning Chariot would be more flashy.

The Lightning Chariot has nothing to do with Dark Pit though, I doubt that would be part of his FS for whatever reason.

 

[Weeman]

That would be kind of ironic if I had to be honest, considering Dark Pit betrayed her from the beginning.
Maybe Pandora's version of the 3 Sacred Treasures as a FS.


The Lightning Chariot has nothing to do with Dark Pit though, I doubt that would be part of his FS for whatever reason.

Maybe he picks up the lighting chariot and runs over the other players, Super Sonic style.

 

[dedekong]

I'm curious, why do you guys support Dark Pit?

 

[Weeman]

I'm curious, why do you guys support Dark Pit?

Why not?, we like the character, and think he's got potential, of course we are also aware his shortcomings, but it's not like we can't suppoert him anyways.
As for his potential, most people think he'll just end up as a Pit clone, wich is a possibility, but due to the plethora of weapons that KI:U has, Dark Pit can have a completely different moveset than Pit if they utilize those weapons, now of course if Sakurai decides to make him a clone it'll porbably be a case similar to Lucina, when he would be added just to make the roster larger during late in development.

 

[Altais]

The Lightning Chariot has nothing to do with Dark Pit though, I doubt that would be part of his FS for whatever reason.

He did use it at the end of Chapter 20: Palutena's Temple to break open the path to the Chaos Vortex, and at the end of Chapter 23: Lord of the Underworld to save Pit from being digested by Hades. Although, that is only during cutscenes. As far as actual gameplay is concerned, Dark Pit never uses the Lightning Chariot.

I'm curious, why do you guys support Dark Pit?

Personally, I will not be too surprised or upset if Dark Pit does not get his own slot. But, as a character, I think he could be rather unique if he used his Dark Pit Staff instead of the Silver Bow. If he used the Silver Bow (or any other bow, for that matter), he would undoubtedly be a clone--whereas with his Dark Pit Staff, all sorts of possibilities for a unique moveset open up.

 

[BluePikmin11]

He did use it at the end of Chapter 20: Palutena's Temple to break open the path to the Chaos Vortex, and at the end of Chapter 23: Lord of the Underworld to save Pit from being digested by Hades. Although, that is only during cutscenes. As far as actual gameplay is concerned, Dark Pit never uses the Lightning Chariot.



Personally, I will not be too surprised or upset if Dark Pit does not get his own slot. But, as a character, I think he could be rather unique if he used his Dark Pit Staff instead of the Silver Bow. If he used the Silver Bow (or any other bow, for that matter), he would undoubtedly be a clone--whereas with his Dark Pit Staff, all sorts of possibilities for a unique moveset open up.

He did, that's a rather obscure detail I forgot about Uprising, I still think it's unlikely to happen though.

I'm curious, why do you guys support Dark Pit?

His moveset potential as a semi-clone is the main reason why I support Dark Pit all the way, an offense and ranged-based Pit would totally fit my style of play, I never really liked the weak power Pit had back in Brawl, I think Dark Pit would be the solution.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Dark Pit is being rated in RTC thread today, hopefully he doesn't get the big reject ratings like last time.

 

[dedekong]

Why not?, we like the character, and think he's got potential, of course we are also aware his shortcomings, but it's not like we can't suppoert him anyways.
As for his potential, most people think he'll just end up as a Pit clone, wich is a possibility, but due to the plethora of weapons that KI:U has, Dark Pit can have a completely different moveset than Pit if they utilize those weapons, now of course if Sakurai decides to make him a clone it'll porbably be a case similar to Lucina, when he would be added just to make the roster larger during late in development.

Sorry if I came off condescending. I also support Dark Pit and was just curious as to why my fellow DP supporters want him. I've wanted him ever since he debuted in the Kid Icarus: Uprising teaser—back when he had "no chance" to everyone except me and maybe two others.

 

[Deleted member]

I'm curious, why do you guys support Dark Pit?

I support mainly because I'm the guy that made the thread (which was because I figured no one else would).

I've grown legitimately fond of the idea over time, though. Mainly as an option in lieu of Palutena if she didn't make it. Though Dark Pit showing up at the end of Palutena's trailer sparked more interest.

 

[Mega Hawlucha]

A friend recently brought this up to me, now I don't know much about Kid Icarus Lore, but how would you guys feel if Dark Pit were a clone but retained Brawl Pit's Side-B and Down-B?

 

[BluePikmin11]

A friend recently brought this up to me, now I don't know much about Kid Icarus Lore, but how would you guys feel if Dark Pit were a clone but retained Brawl Pit's Side-B and Down-B?

He can't have Pit's Mirror Shield though, it's already part of Pit's FS, Dark Pit getting side-b would be questionable mostly because I expect Sakurai to give Dark Pit moves based on Uprising.

 

[Morbi]

I'm curious, why do you guys support Dark Pit?

Honestly, it might not seem the most heartfelt or inspiring reason, but I support characters based on speculation and who I subjectively deem a likely candidate on the roster. I can genuinely state that I am interested in his character and as an advocate of clones, nothing would please me more. My sister, on the other hand, has been an adamant Dark Pit supporter since day one. The assertions Sakurai made pertaining to Lucina are quite clearly contradictory (not necessarily "contradictory," per se; however, there is an aspect of his rationale that is missing changing the context), which leads me to believe that clone characters that were based on alternative costumes were actualized for a reason other than Lucina. Despite his statements implying that it was indeed her... "However, whenever there is a small difference in abilities, that character gets an actual roster slot," I do not necessarily find that to be true as he has yet (this is obviously subject to change) illuminated any differences and I fail to discern anything other than her mechanic alteration. He states that "even though Lucina shares her physical stats and techniques with Marth (which is fallacious in a Fire Emblem specific context), the characteristics of their attacks differ." It becomes blatantly obvious that this is the most prominent indication that Lucina was not the reason why we have clones and she will most certainly not be the last either. The characteristics of her attacks did NOT differ prior to her becoming her own newcomer slot as that was implemented and insinuated to be the reasoning to justify her inclusion. This means that the same thing happened with another character such as Dr. Mario (pills relevant to his character, electricity established in Melee, and F.L.U.D.D, something not associated with the good doctor) or perhaps even one that he already alluded to with an unprecedented trailer cliff-hanger? An alternate costume was mostly likely going to have a subtle difference in terms of move-set or game-play, but he decided that it was more logical to include them on the roster. Pittoo seems as though he could be one of the potential characters that would introduce this notion and incite a cause of action. Either way, as Golden indicates in the original post, there is more reason to include a Dark Pit clone than most let on and there is no inherent issue with the sentiment either.

I would probably also cite his subtle references to Pittoo from Sakurai and the characters popularity. But those are not entirely relevant as my demented thought process has already convinced me and me alone that he is a playable character. I was delusional enough to speculate in favor of Robin despite the bandwagon appeal fallacy that plagued this site and desecrated speculation, I am certain that if my logic got me through that, and will get me through this.

Edit that is not really an edit- I apologize for the odd text, the font size was continually changing, so I had to choose between "3" and "4." I decided to go with "4" so that it was readable, but to compromise, I chose the smallest font, it just looks odd. Haha.

 

[dedekong]

Great post, @ Morbi . It's good to know there are other clone advocates out there. I find the notion of clones "taking away roster slots" to be ridiculous and whiny. For me, clones offer players more options with characters that may not suit everyone (see: Fox and Falco). While Lucas is not necessarily a Ness clone, they are similar enough to be considered variations of the same character. Some people will prefer Lucas while others prefer Ness, there is nothing wrong with this and it only helps to diversify and expand the roster (everyone wins). As far as Dark Pit is concerned, I would like him to be similar to Pit (in order to stay true to the character), but also use his own set of unique abilities that gives him the feel of Pit, yet offers a completely different play style.

 

[BluePikmin11]

It's not that bad to like characters just because you expect them, I sometimes like characters because of that. And I'm so glad that I can finally expect Dark Pit as playable, it's like a dream come true.

 

[Morbi]

Further deluding myself into believing that Dark Pit is plausible:

It is not necessarily evidence in favor of Pittoo, per se; however, I could honestly see Sakurai implementing Dark Pit so that he might have an Amiibo of Dark Pit. It just depends on whether or not Sakurai happens to be as materialistic as I presume. Dark Pit probably means a lot to him just based on the notion that he was the creator of his character, to my knowledge. It would be great to see the transition from one of the best alternate palettes in the game into a full-fledged character. A character with Smash relevance, I might note. If he is indeed true to his word, hopefully certain nuisances such as the "Three Sacred Treasures" would incite him to conceive Pittoo as a newcomer. Another not-so material aspect to consider might be proportional representation. Kid Icarus: Uprising has about five items included in the final work product (and a few stages), it is probably not relevant, but that might indicate more than just one newcomer. Palutena was seemingly a haphazard addition as is. So I would not be surprised to see at the very least, one more Kid Icarus character (especially in the same vein as Fire Emblem). Most arbitrarily presume the series to be finished; however, it has already been proven that that logic is quite fallacious. Pit is treated as a front-runner in regards to Smash... for the most part and Sakurai is responsible for Kid Icarus' prominence. It is more probable than not, in my opinion, that he would include another character that does not require a lot of effort. It would be slightly counter-intuitive to just have him as a costume with his own name and voice-clips if he could easily alter the properties of moves (ever so slightly) to be more aggressive. At this point, it would be a little odd to see Dark Pit with "Palutena's Bow." Hopefully the man attributed to the creation of Dark Pit is able to discern why that might not be the most ideal. I have faith!

 

[Lightosia]

Dark Pit hinted today?

 

[Morbi]

Dark Pit hinted today?

Someone in the "Character Discussion Thread" thought that Dark Pit confirmed as an alternate costume based on this picture.

I would not consider it an allusion to Dark Pit, myself, to be honest.

 

[domokl]

now all alts for pit from brawl have been confirmed except dark pit. bit suspicous isnt it?why would sakurai just casulally leavee that for last unless he was now playable?

 

[Protom]

If we were to get one more clone, I would really want dark pit.
That being said, I still think he would be best as a color swap, just with its own voice and weapon designs.

Dark Pit hinted today?

Also, is that Pits default or blue team palette swap? I can't tell...

 

[Morbi]

now all alts for pit from brawl have been confirmed except dark pit. bit suspicous isnt it?why would sakurai just casulally leavee that for last unless he was now playable?

I could see Dark Pit's palette being saved for last if it was not a palette, but indeed an alternate costume.

If we were to get one more clone, I would really want dark pit.
That being said, I still think he would be best as a color swap, just with its own voice and weapon designs.

Also, is that Pits default or blue team palette swap? I can't tell...

It seems as though most people are saying that it is his blue-palette; however, it honestly seems as though it is his default to me. I suppose that I never really used his blue variant, so I am certainly not an authority on the matter.

 

[Deleted member]

It's his blue palette.
One key thing to look at is the patch on his hand, the hems at the end of his tunic, and the shoes all being blue as opposed to red (patch and hems) or brown (shoes) on his default.
His wings and tunic itself also have a tint of blue, though it's harder to tell because of the Nosferatu.

 

[Bowserlick]

One reason gliding may have been taken away from Pit (besides balance) is to leave the mechanic for Dark Pit.

I think Dark Pit could be available as a more advanced Pit. Just as Lucina is the beginner's Marth.

But I feel as if Dark Pit would have more changes to make him more of an aerial damage-racker.

 

[domokl]

One reason gliding may have been taken away from Pit (besides balance) is to leave the mechanic for Dark Pit.

I think Dark Pit could be available as a more advanced Pit. Just as Lucina is the beginner's Marth.

But I feel as if Dark Pit would have more changes to make him more of an aerial damage-racker.

that would acutally make perfect sense considering how he has infinte flight in uprising. i also feel he would be more of anm air fighter than a ground fighter.

 

[Deleted member]

One reason gliding may have been taken away from Pit (besides balance) is to leave the mechanic for Dark Pit.

I think Dark Pit could be available as a more advanced Pit. Just as Lucina is the beginner's Marth.

But I feel as if Dark Pit would have more changes to make him more of an aerial damage-racker.

After seeing Pit not being able to glide anymore, I felt that on the hypothetical that Dark Pit shows up, he would be the one that glides and be air-centric compared to Pit's more ground-centric style.

 

[Ridles the Space Pirate]

While I would like Pittoo to be another fighter, I think he is probably just gonna be an alt.

 

[Morbi]

While I would like Pittoo to be another fighter, I think he is probably just gonna be an alt.

While I would like Pittoo to be another costume, I think he is probably just gonna be a character.

 

[Deleted member]

Even though Dark Pit hasn't been shown using this weapon, I'm now feeling that Dark Pit using the Pandora Claws in place of the Upperdash Arm would be quite fitting due to him absorbing Pandora's power in Uprising.

What do you guys think?

 

[Morbi]

Even though Dark Pit hasn't been shown using this weapon, I'm now feeling that Dark Pit using the Pandora Claws in place of the Upperdash Arm would be quite fitting due to him absorbing Pandora's power in Uprising.

What do you guys think?

I am actually quite fond of the idea, I am not as much concerned with the fact that he never uses them as I am that he might be associated with them. I honestly felt as though Palutena was going to use "claws" in her move-set; however, that is obviously not the case (as far as I can tell). So it might be a cool weapon to impute to Pittoo.

 

[Deleted member]

Palutena isn't using any weapons, which comes to a shock to me as I was partly expecting the Palutena Blade to show up somewhere...
Instead, Palutena's using the Powers/Miracles, which is a nice touch.

So the idea of Pittoo using other weapons Pit isn't using isn't that farfetched to me.
And I'm hoping in the event Dark Pit is a character, that aside from the Silver Bow (which can't be ignored), he uses weapons that aren't Arms, Orbiters, or Clubs since those weapons already play a role.

Dark Pit Staff is an easy decision since it's the weapon named after him.
His "Dark First Blade" (a First Blade that uses dark ammunition) is another considerable addition, since its most used weapon in air battles.
Pandora Claws, despite Pittoo not using them unless you equip him with them in Chapter 22, represent Pandora's power, which Dark Pit had until the end of Chapter 22 (but is shown to have in Palutena's trailer).
The EZ Cannon and Violet Palms are also reasonable options considering he uses them against Pit in Chapter 6.

And even then, he doesn't have to restricted to just that specific set of Claws, Cannon, Blade, and Palm (Staff is non-negotiable), so there's plenty of options.

 

[domokl]

Palutena isn't using any weapons, which comes to a shock to me as I was partly expecting the Palutena Blade to show up somewhere...
Instead, Palutena's using the Powers/Miracles, which is a nice touch.

So the idea of Pittoo using other weapons Pit isn't using isn't that farfetched to me.
And I'm hoping in the event Dark Pit is a character, that aside from the Silver Bow (which can't be ignored), he uses weapons that aren't Arms, Orbiters, or Clubs since those weapons already play a role.

Dark Pit Staff is an easy decision since it's the weapon named after him.
His "Dark First Blade" (a First Blade that uses dark ammunition) is another considerable addition, since its most used weapon in air battles.
Pandora Claws, despite Pittoo not using them unless you equip him with them in Chapter 22, represent Pandora's power, which Dark Pit had until the end of Chapter 22 (but is shown to have in Palutena's trailer).
The EZ Cannon and Violet Palms are also reasonable options considering he uses them against Pit in Chapter 6.

And even then, he doesn't have to restricted to just that specific set of Claws, Cannon, Blade, and Palm (Staff is non-negotiable), so there's plenty of options.

i feel like out of the weapons types that do play a role in the game i think it would be fine if he used the orge club since he does use that in chapter 6 as well.

 

[Deleted member]

i feel like out of the weapons types that do play a role in the game i think it would be fine if he used the orge club since he does use that in chapter 6 as well.

Yeah, the Ogre Club is one of the weapons Dark Pit is known for (especially since the idol directly mentions that), so it would be a reasonable idea as well.
Though I feel with the Ore Club being an item that Clubs should be off-limits.

EDIT: Then again...Drill Arm is an item, and Pit has the Upperdash Arm.
Alright, I guess Ogre Club is still quite reasonable.

 

[Neo Zero]

See, this is why I love Dark Pit. Sure, he might be a semi clone, but there is still a ton that can be done to make him rather unique.

 

[Orchestrafanboy19]

If I may just throw in my two cents, I'm not trying to say you're all wrong, but I firmly believe in Pittoo being an alternate costume. My reasoning behind this has somewhat to do with Lucina. People make the assumption that Dark Pit is a separate character all because of Lucina. However, Lucina and Marth are two completely different people, even if they have similar moves. Now, I know Dark Pit and Pit are two different people as well, however Dark Pit is playable in Chapter 22 of Kid Icarus Uprising and in Together Mode. His playstyle is exactly the same as Pit's. He has no variation whatsoever aside from his appearance and his voice. He can use the same weapons and powers as Pit. Sakurai says that if there is even a little variation between characters, they are worthy of a spot. However, there is no variation between the two. They both play exactly the same. That doesn't seem to be enough to me to constitute another roster slot. Sure, he could use other weapons that Pit doesn't use in this game, but it still would be okay for him to use the Upper Dash Arm and Guardian Orbitars. As for the Silver Bow, it looks almost like the Palutena Bow, just change the color for it. The biggest example I can see for justifying a roster slot is Pit's Final Smash. It would be weird to see Pittoo using them. I know I could be entirely wrong about this, and I will look stupid if what I said at the beginning turns out to be true, but that's just my two cents. While the arguments for and against Pittoo both have weight, I lean more towards his fate being an alternate costume.

 

[Morbi]

If I may just throw in my two cents, I'm not trying to say you're all wrong, but I firmly believe in Pittoo being an alternate costume. My reasoning behind this has somewhat to do with Lucina. People make the assumption that Dark Pit is a separate character all because of Lucina. However, Lucina and Marth are two completely different people, even if they have similar moves. Now, I know Dark Pit and Pit are two different people as well, however Dark Pit is playable in Chapter 22 of Kid Icarus Uprising and in Together Mode. His playstyle is exactly the same as Pit's. He has no variation whatsoever aside from his appearance and his voice. He can use the same weapons and powers as Pit. Sakurai says that if there is even a little variation between characters, they are worthy of a spot. However, there is no variation between the two. They both play exactly the same. That doesn't seem to be enough to me to constitute another roster slot. Sure, he could use other weapons that Pit doesn't use in this game, but it still would be okay for him to use the Upper Dash Arm and Guardian Orbitars. As for the Silver Bow, it looks almost like the Palutena Bow, just change the color for it. The biggest example I can see for justifying a roster slot is Pit's Final Smash. It would be weird to see Pittoo using them. I know I could be entirely wrong about this, and I will look stupid if what I said at the beginning turns out to be true, but that's just my two cents. While the arguments for and against Pittoo both have weight, I lean more towards his fate being an alternate costume.

It is fine to have a different opinion, but I would argue that the under-lined portions are self-referential incoherence. Your claim is not an unreasonable claim, but if Sakurai states that if the characters have a "small difference in abilities" that they warrant a roster slot, I am most certainly not going to disagree with him. It does not matter if the difference is negligible as there is a difference, objectively speaking, of course.

 

[continuityOfficer]

I'll go for Dark Pit, I loved his character, and maybe make him have Pits old moveset to make him unique as a character?