Pikachu 1.0.4 Changes (Complete)

[Pikabunz]

Official Changes

FSmash (Close) Knockback Growth : 65 ⇒ 73
FSmash (Tip) Knockback Growth: 100 ⇒ 102
Skullbash Knockback Growth: 60 ⇒ 62
Thunder Knockback Growth: 62 ⇒ 66
Distant Thunder Knockback Growth: 62 ⇒ 66

Spoiler

Launch Speeds Differences​

| Damage | 100% | 150% | 200%
Forward Smash (Mid) | 18% | 130 | 165 | 199
Forward Smash (Close) | 15% | 99 > 107 | 124 > 136 | 150 > 165
Forward Smash (Tip) | 12% | 110 > 112 | 143 > 145 | 175 > 178
Up Smash (Close) | 14% | 118 | 151 | 184
Up Smash (Tip) | 13% | 113 | 144 | 175
Down Smash | 13% | 107 | 129 | 151
Forward Tilt | 9% | 76 | 102 | 127
Forward Tilt (Up) | 10% | 82 | 110 | 138
Forward Tilt (Down) | 8% | 71 | 94 | 117
Up Tilt | 5% | 84 | 103 | 123
Dash Attack | 10% | 111 | 136 | 161
Up Throw | 4% | 84 | 102 | 119
Down Throw | 8% | 85 | 102 | 118
Back Throw | 9% | 88 | 101 | 114
Neutral Air | 8% | 86 | 111 | 137
Forward Air | 10% | 88 | 105 | 122
Down Air | 12% | 84 | 111 | 138
Back Air | 9% | 92 | 112 | 133
Thunder | 15% | 108 > 113 | 133 > 139 | 157 > 165
Skull Bash (Full Charge) | 22% | 112 > 115 | 145 > 149 | 177 > 183

 

[Psyant]

Not a change, but thought I'd mention that even though Wario's Wectoring got removed, Pikachu's momentum glitch on Heavy Skull Bash is still in the game. Seems to be flying under the radar for now, but I guess it'll get patched out when it's well known.

 

[Choice Scarf]

Haha when I first read these I thought the kill percents went up and got scared. Good to know they're giving Pika a bit more kill power.

 

[Nocally]

Any nerfs to the b-air and f-air spikes?

It is nice seeing some power buffs, now we just need a buffed neutral air so we can kill reliably in the air (just like in Brawl)

 

[JamesUK7]

@ N Nocally might just be me but I can no longer bair spike with Pikachu, can't fair spike with Falco either...

 

[LunarWingCloud]

Knockback buffs to Thunder and FSmash? I'll take it!

 

[Nocally]

@ N Nocally might just be me but I can no longer bair spike with Pikachu, can't fair spike with Falco either...

Yeah, I heard a rumor about multi hit moves being unable to spike.

 

[hell-dew]

we got more kill power then? i haven't tested the patch yet still wondering what i should do with replays >.>

 

[NobleClamtasm]

Any nerfs to the b-air and f-air spikes?

It is nice seeing some power buffs, now we just need a buffed neutral air so we can kill reliably in the air (just like in Brawl)

Looks like his bair got a nerf. Not only does it no longer spike when interrupted, but your opponent will escape from the hits if you initiate a fastfall. This means that you can no longer use his Bair as a suicide to trade stocks. DDD:

Feel free to further confirm this.

 

[Nocally]

Feel free to further confirm this.

confirmed, the move does no longer "suck" as much, which is a nerf.

The nerf hammer has overall been kind to Pikachu compared to some other characters at least.
The buff to Thunder and side-b is not that noticeable in my opinion, Would still like a further buff to thunder and neutral air,
I guess we just have to suck at "for Glory" matches to get noticed by Nintendo

 

[Tagxy]

Supposedly they took out the 1-frame thunder hitstun thing too? Didnt really seem like a glitch, but people should check thunder's start-up.

The spike thing is a pretty decent nerf, but then again it did seem like it wasnt intended and was maybe a bit too good. Im liking the overall list of changes.

 

[NobleClamtasm]

Supposedly they took out the 1-frame thunder hitstun thing too? Didnt really seem like a glitch, but people should check thunder's start-up.

The spike thing is a pretty decent nerf, but then again it did seem like it wasnt intended and was maybe a bit too good. Im liking the overall list of changes.

Thunder's startup feels the same as before, but I don't have a 1.0.3 system to compare to.

 

[hell-dew]

Fair still spikes

 

[Nocally]

Just out of curiosity, but does Pikachu´s running speed seem to be faster, or am I just imagining things. I have a hard time believing it has been increased.

 

[Tagxy]

They fixed pikawatch glitch Im hearing, we arent banned from teams now!

 

[Soul.]

Knockback buffs. Yes, about time.

 

[Choice Scarf]

I heard Mario actually weighs more from the same update. Not confirmed yet though. We should probably keep watch on this thread or use a different character for testing.

http://smashboards.com/threads/patch-1-0-4-changes.378437/

 

[Pikabunz]

His weight didn't change otherwise most of Pikachu's moves wouldn't have stayed the same.

 

[hell-dew]

someone test if thundering through combos still works? (cant test right now)

 

[thatguybane]

I just went through all these moves in the new patch and here are the knockback changes:

Launch Speeds​

| Damage | 100% | 150% | 200%
Forward Smash (Mid) | 18% | 130 | 165 | 199
Forward Smash (Close) | 15% | 99 > 107 | 124 > 136 | 150 > 165
Forward Smash (Tip) | 12% | 110 > 112 | 143 > 145 | 175 > 178
Up Smash (Close) | 14% | 118 | 151 | 184
Up Smash (Tip) | 13% | 113 | 144 | 175
Down Smash | 13% | 107 | 129 | 151
Forward Tilt | 9% | 76 | 102 | 127
Forward Tilt (Up) | 10% | 82 | 110 | 138
Forward Tilt (Down) | 8% | 71 | 94 | 117
Up Tilt | 5% | 84 | 103 | 123
Dash Attack | 10% | 111 | 136 | 161
Up Throw | 4% | 84 | 102 | 119
Down Throw | 8% | 85 | 102 | 118
Back Throw | 9% | 88 | 101 | 114
Neutral Air | 8% | 86 | 111 | 137
Forward Air | 10% | 88 | 105 | 122
Down Air | 12% | 84 | 111 | 138
Back Air | 9% | 92 | 112 | 133
Thunder | 15% | 108 > 113 | 133 > 139 | 157 > 165
Skull Bash (Full Charge) | 22% | 112 > 115 | 145 > 149 | 177 > 183

If you find any other changes, feel free to post.

Hi, new member interested in picking up Pikachu. I'm curious, how did you determine the knockback speed and what is the unit of measurement? Also how do these speeds correlate to his kill %s? I assume faster speeds = earlier kill % but I'm wondering how big of a difference this will really make.

 

[NobleClamtasm]

someone test if thundering through combos still works? (cant test right now)

I played a few matches against a Mario online, and it seems like Thunder can no longer interrupt his downthrow uptilt strings. I could be doing it wrong though, and I encourage other people to try it as well.

 

[hell-dew]

I had a feeling they removed it (it makes sense TBH) kinda sucks though cause it gave thunder just another utility but W/E i had my suspicions it was gonna get axed.

 

[Gamingboy]

Glad to see more knockback. I presume that Wii U V.1 will be the same as 3DS V.1.04, right?

 

[infomon]

Oh I'm so sad they nerfed Bair. now how am I supposed to kill

 

[JamesUK7]

Oh I'm so sad they nerfed Bair. now how am I supposed to kill

It's gonna be more difficult to gimp for sure but Pika still has great off stage options and a great recovery.

 

[hell-dew]

Glad to see more knockback. I presume that Wii U V.1 will be the same as 3DS V.1.04, right?

it feels similar thus far but just wait like 2 days and try it your self

 

[Pikabunz]

Updated the OP with the official numbers. I went through the game's data that was posted by Dantarion and found no other changes. There could be some changes to IASA and autocancel frames since that data isn't stored in the data that was released.

 

[Tagxy]

Good stuff @ Pikabunz , looks like pika survived the patching...this time.

Also took a look at his frame data. Everything seemed the same always but a few things seemed 1 frame slower like ftilt and uair. I dont find that a big deal, but I am a bit sad about pikas ftilt hitbox not staying out forever. Hard to tell if that came with other attributes though.

 

[SyncNatsyu]

Official Changes

FSmash (Close) Base Knockback : 65 ⇒ 73
FSmash (Tip) Base Knockback : 100 ⇒ 102
Skullbash Base Knockback : 60 ⇒ 62
Thunder Base Knockback : 62 ⇒ 66
Distant Thunder Base Knockback : 62 ⇒ 66

Spoiler

Launch Speeds Differences​

| Damage | 100% | 150% | 200%
Forward Smash (Mid) | 18% | 130 | 165 | 199
Forward Smash (Close) | 15% | 99 > 107 | 124 > 136 | 150 > 165
Forward Smash (Tip) | 12% | 110 > 112 | 143 > 145 | 175 > 178
Up Smash (Close) | 14% | 118 | 151 | 184
Up Smash (Tip) | 13% | 113 | 144 | 175
Down Smash | 13% | 107 | 129 | 151
Forward Tilt | 9% | 76 | 102 | 127
Forward Tilt (Up) | 10% | 82 | 110 | 138
Forward Tilt (Down) | 8% | 71 | 94 | 117
Up Tilt | 5% | 84 | 103 | 123
Dash Attack | 10% | 111 | 136 | 161
Up Throw | 4% | 84 | 102 | 119
Down Throw | 8% | 85 | 102 | 118
Back Throw | 9% | 88 | 101 | 114
Neutral Air | 8% | 86 | 111 | 137
Forward Air | 10% | 88 | 105 | 122
Down Air | 12% | 84 | 111 | 138
Back Air | 9% | 92 | 112 | 133
Thunder | 15% | 108 > 113 | 133 > 139 | 157 > 165
Skull Bash (Full Charge) | 22% | 112 > 115 | 145 > 149 | 177 > 183

Just making sure but is the thunder KB for T1(the lightning thats sent down) or T2(The second hitbox if pikachu is hit by its T1)?

 

[Pikabunz]

The knockback is for T2.

 

[ThundrDome]

I had to make a Smashboards account for this, cause this has been bothering me that no one has noticed this, or maybe I'm just bad.

Is anyone else having trouble performing a running up smash since this patch has gone out? Trying to perform it just ends up having me dash attack, which isn't that bad, but it pretty much kills any setups for up smashes that Pikachu had last patch. Since thunderspiking is near impossible now, killing with Pika is incredibly difficult.

 

[Psyant]

@ ThundrDome For some reason with the recent patch they made it so you can't cancel into an up smash during your end of dash sliding animation...if you have tap jump off. With it on everything is as normal. You can still up smash from a dash with tap jum off, but you need to release dash and wait a split second for the sliding animation to end before inputting the up smash. Yeah, it's a tad slower, still very usable. You'll just have to deal with it if you play with tap jump off, sadly.

No idea why they did this, might be some kind of error on their part. Hopefully they'll fix it in the future if so. If you're playing on 3DS it's really unfortunate. If you're on WiiU you should really use tap jump anyway. It's better for you in the long run.

 

[ThundrDome]

@ Psyant Well thats unfortunate, hopefully they fix that, its been messing with the flow of my combos lol. Other than that I'm very happy with the knockback to FSmash, especially with Pivot Cancelling.

 

[infomon]

Can you jump-cancel the dash into the upsmash? Will experiment when I get home...

@ ThundrDome If you're on WiiU you should really use tap jump anyway. It's better for you in the long run.

Huh? Why?

 

[ThundrDome]

Can you jump-cancel the dash into the upsmash? Will experiment when I get home...



Huh? Why?

Up until this patch you could just run and then up smash without having to jump cancel. After experimenting with tap jump on you can just do as I previously stated and just run and up smash without jump canceling, but I could totally see it possible to jump cancel it.

 

[Psyant]

Huh? Why?

Well, it's just my opinion, but tap jump makes a number of things easier, like Uair and Up Smash out of shield. Pikachu can make more use of it than most characters. It matters more in Melee/PM where more tech is made easier with tap jump, but it helps in Smash 4 too. If you're used to tap jump then jumping by accident shouldn't be a problem.

I do turn tap jump off on 3DS, though. It's just too easy to end up double jumping when you just want to up air, with the 3DS silly analogue. But for GC controller tap jump has some benefits and it won't hinder you at all once you're used to it.

Not sure if you can jump cancel up smash to do it from a run instantly with tap jump off. Haven't tried it. I'd expect it to work, though.

 

[infomon]

Whoa ok I'm not sure what we're talking about. I'm on WiiU v1.0.1 (latest), and I can Usmash out of a dash or run just fine with Pika.

I'm using the Pro Controller with tap jump turned off. I can dash/run usmash by tapping Up and Attack at the same time, OR I can even just hit the C-stick up out of a run. There's no jump-cancel, none required.


@ Psyant : Regarding tap-jump, I don't have any problems JC'ing OoS with tap-jump off... I just use the buttons. I know the timings. I find tap-jump off much easier for being in control of up-tilts and up-airs without ever hitting an accidental jump.... which is oh so problematic when it's an unexpected double-jump off the ground where you might end up in the air offstage and not realize your second jump is missing...

But to each their own! Maybe you're right that for more techskill-intensive games like PM there's some advantage to having tap-jump on.. But that's why it's a choice

 

[ThundrDome]

This seems to be a not only Pikachu issue, and more of just a general fix, but its most noticeable with him since up smash is arguably his best kill option in Smash 4. If this change ends up going on Wii U, its not gonna make much of a difference anyway since the control stick is more accurate then the circle pad and the option of having a C-stick means never having to worry about a rogue dash attack getting thrown out.

 

[infomon]

Ah so that's on 3DS v1.0.4. Interesting. I thought 3ds v1.0.4 was supposed to align things to the WiiU but I guess they missed a few details. I wonder what the next patch (to either system) will do.....