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Online Brawl: Yay or Nay?

BigRick

Smash Master
Joined
Apr 9, 2006
Messages
3,156
Location
Montreal, Canada AKA Real City brrrrrrrrapp!
Question: should Super Smash Bros. Brawl have online play?

I'm not sure if there's gonna be an online play feature for Brawl, but I feel that Brawl shouldn't have online play... here's why:

1) party games aren't meant to be played online
2) fighting games aren't meant to be played online
3) hence, Smash Bros isn't meant for online

So these are very good reasons why Brawl shouldn't be online... I would like to hear some of your opinions. If you like online play in Brawl... then go ahead, and try to convince me.
 

xeonoex

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 20, 2005
Messages
201
Location
Donna. Texas
Yay.

Even if there is online, I feel the community will stay alive, mostly due to lag online. Even the slightest bit of lag will hurt the competitive players, plus, after an offline SSBM, I think most of us have made a few good friends.

I'm more worried about the gameplay. Online will also be good to play when theres no one available, since the computer make most people worse.
 

Vampirekain

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Feb 15, 2007
Messages
235
Location
Greece,Athens
Alright that's something new! First of all I think that online Brawl is a fact by now not just an assumption.Well now for trying to convince you...Smash has taken into the air with its popularity! What Am I saying you already know that right? All of the US and Europe is playing it right? Even where I reside(Greece) its fairly popular...So Nintendo probably thinks like that "What would happen if we could join all these countries and pit them against one another with the new Brawl?" Well the answer is simple! All will love it :D Some may not /points at you but the majority will nevertheless! And I cant really understand what's the hold up with you! I mean dont you want to improve,to experience different things with players throughout the world? Have you ever played a player from France? From German maybe? A player from Greece? Chances are slim...Now you will be able to play all these people that you couldn't before!
 

BigRick

Smash Master
Joined
Apr 9, 2006
Messages
3,156
Location
Montreal, Canada AKA Real City brrrrrrrrapp!
All hail the power of multiquoting.

Yay.

Even if there is online, I feel the community will stay alive, mostly due to lag online. Even the slightest bit of lag will hurt the competitive players, plus, after an offline SSBM, I think most of us have made a few good friends.
Lol, lag refers to point number 2. But one thing that is scary is that we have nothing to tell us about the impact of online play on a competitive community of a fighting game, because: current online fighting games either suck, have a bad online mode, or isn't accessible to many ppl cause it's on Xbox/360.

And about playing against the CPU... we do have a **** good player 'round here that plays the CPU hahaha

Well now for trying to convince you...Smash has taken into the air with its popularity! What Am I saying you already know that right? All of the US and Europe is playing it right? Even where I reside(Greece) its fairly popular...So Nintendo probably thinks like that "What would happen if we could join all these countries and pit them against one another with the new Brawl?" Well the answer is simple! All will love it :D Some may not /points at you but the majority will nevertheless! And I cant really understand what's the hold up with you! I mean dont you want to improve,to experience different things with players throughout the world? Have you ever played a player from France? From German maybe? A player from Greece? Chances are slim...Now you will be able to play all these people that you couldn't before!
Hmm I don't know man... If I would like to socialize, I'd just play WoW or chill on the boards (just like right now lolz). When you think about it, in online games there is no difference between a Canadian or a French dude because the playstyles become universalized since every1 plays each other. Those ''new experiences'' that you're talking about will only happen if there is no online mode and I fly to Greece to play you guys. Plus, the farther your opponent is, the more chances that you get lag so I'd rather meet up with sum1 than play online with that person (refers to point 1 or 2).
 

UCbizerkeley

Smash Cadet
Joined
Mar 12, 2007
Messages
41
I don't see why there is any backlash against online play. My theory is that the majority of posters here do not have extensive experience with any online games.

To the OP - i have no idea how you decided that neither "party" games nor "fighting" games are intended to be online, that holds just zero credibility.

The fact is that adding ONLINE content does NOT HARM SSBB OFFLINE content. It is what is known as a "nonrivalrous" relationship, just like information. If I possess knowledge that I impart to you, it doesn't mean I lost the information. Just the same, if I play online and you don't, it doesn't take away from your experience.

The two chief concerns espoused by the community that I fail to understand are LAG and COMMUNITY MAINTENANCE. I will also detail a stint on why I believe a leader-board is a good quality for SSBB


First, LAG. Yes, it exists, and anybody that has played an online game in the past decade knows how it can affect gameplay. But Smashers are wrong to believe they are special in regard to lag. Smash will not be the first "twitch" game nor is it even the "twitchiest" game. In fact, in terms of supporting an online fighting community, Smash is a rather good fit.

If you look at games like Counterstrike or Quake, they have two sources of imbalance - speed of the computer and internet connection. That is, raising your FPS increases your advantage in addition to your internet connection.

Smash is different. Played on the Wii, everybody has an equal gaming platform, and the game is locked at a set FPS (60 for SSBM obviously). This removes one source of inequality.

if your argument is that "liek ZOMG - SMASH REQUIRES ISAI-LIGHTNING-MODE REACTIONS AND OTHER GAMES DONT!" you are plain wrong, and have not played another twitch game at a competitive level. Yes, a fraction of a second can mean you get hit, combo'd, perhaps even lose a stock. In CS, a headshot is the end, no questions.

Other games have succeeded tremendously going from console -> online, Halo and Call of Duty come immediately to mind. Smash is not so unique that it can't follow suit.

COMMUNITY
This argument is laughable really. When has putting a game online DECREASED connectivity? The answer is NEVER. You will still play with your friends just as much, you know why? Because they are your friends, and they are FUN! Tournaments will still be held in person, just like every other competitive gaming function (CS, Halo, Quake, Unreal, whatever) because it enforces a level playing field. Again, this is the nonrivalrous aspect - you have your friends, you can play with them. My friends dont play smash, I can play with my online friends. More fun for everybody.

As a community, Smash only stands to gain from going online. If you disagree with this statement, ask yourself why, and objectively analyze your answers credibility. Note Bene: If you are 15 and you answered "because I want to PWNZ my friends on my 17" plasma W()()T" you are the antithesis of these forums and detract from the community. You have no say in arguing the merits of community and online benefits. Bringing people together does just that - brings people together.


LEADER BOARD

This is where SSBB could soar, this is where it could cement its place among competitive console gaming and maintain a HUGE following. No more MLG dropping SSBM like its hot, no more commentary like "Well since Halo isn't starting until tonight, we have time for 6 rounds of this best of 11 match!"

I fear the distribution of ages on this board may be too young to actually admit that some hacker 4 stocking you and climbing the leader board, contrary to popular opinion, DOES NOT harm your experience of the game. adolescents are adolescents, they are cocky, defensive and most of all prideful. that both lends competitiveness to the smash community (good) and rampant immaturity in terms of logic and actions (bad).

By applying economics to satisfaction, we can determine if online play is a good move for the general populous. It's quite simple really, if the BENEFIT of ONLINE > COST + DEMORALIZATION then its good. In this instance, the benefit is the total fun, the cost is the extra price incurred (likely 0), and demoralization represents the amount of people not playing because they are upset by negative facets in the game (hackers). It is clear to me, at least, that the overall benefit FAR outweighs the price of COST + DEMORALIZATION in this case.

The benefits of the leader board are immense. It brings players together that otherwise would never have met each other. Online relationships are real relationships, the player ranked above you could become a quality friend. Furthermore, it acts as that XXXX FINDER on a COMPLETE level - if done regionally, you can discover who plays in your area at the very least.

Most of all, it increases playability. If you dont feel like destroying a lvl 1 cpu and no friends are around, hop on and play a match in your skill bracket (if implemented). Hopefully, you can play against people similar in skill until you develop a record (or ratio more likely) that bumps you up a bracket. Through this, you will continually improve AND HAVE MORE FUN.

I never meant to write my senior thesis on SSBB Online Theory, so I will answer any theoretical questions people have, but I'm done bogging down this street corner
 

Dylan_Tnga

Smash Master
Joined
Feb 19, 2007
Messages
4,644
Location
Montreal Canada
Question: should Super Smash Bros. Brawl have online play?

I'm not sure if there's gonna be an online play feature for Brawl, but I feel that Brawl shouldn't have online play... here's why:

1) party games aren't meant to be played online
2) fighting games aren't meant to be played online
3) hence, Smash Bros isn't meant for online

So these are very good reasons why Brawl shouldn't be online... I would like to hear some of your opinions. If you like online play in Brawl... then go ahead, and try to convince me.
I don't care, either way. But here are some other good reasons

4) the internet has lag. 1 frame of lag will **** up smash, 1 frame. Im serious. If you flame me about this one, noobs, I'll eat you.
5) People will figure out a way to have 1337 h4xor
6) Scrubs will think they're good because they can beat other scrubs online. Even worse, if this game sucks and is online, scrubs might think they could compete in melee and make even WORSE posts on these boards about their ''skillz'' and ''honor'' and ''not wavedashing''
7) Time spent putting this thing online should be time spent on more characters / improved movesets / keeping wding in the game, etc.

Essentially, like Rick said, smash is meant to be played face to face, its an awesome community and online play would alienate us.
 

UCbizerkeley

Smash Cadet
Joined
Mar 12, 2007
Messages
41
I don't care, either way. But here are some other good reasons

4) the internet has lag. 1 frame of lag will **** up smash, 1 frame. Im serious. If you flame me about this one, noobs, I'll eat you.
5) People will figure out a way to have 1337 h4xor
6) Scrubs will think they're good because they can beat other scrubs online. Even worse, if this game sucks and is online, scrubs might think they could compete in melee and make even WORSE posts on these boards about their ''skillz'' and ''honor'' and ''not wavedashing''
7) Time spent putting this thing online should be time spent on more characters / improved movesets / keeping wding in the game, etc.

Essentially, like Rick said, smash is meant to be played face to face, its an awesome community and online play would alienate us.
You are plain wrong, I'm sorry, and represent the perfect 15 yo logic I was lamenting earlier. I believe I addressed nearly all your points - before you raised them - in my above post.

7) This too is just BAD logic, with zero sense of market understanding. Putting the game online is NOT going to detract from time spent developing the game itself. I gaurantee the process is being undertaken by different teams of developers, with a full staff working on the "movesets" / offline content of the game, independent of the online developers.

Smash is not MEANT to be anything, that is merely how you interpret it in your limited, egocentric view point. Smash is meant to first and foremost, turn a profit, and second, bring as much FUN to as MANY people as POSSIBLE. Your fixation with pwning newbs can take a hike, you're in the minority buddy.

Online play will strengthen the community and bring MORE people face to face. What part of that don't you understand? Are you so fixated on being better than your friends that you want to keep this "awesome community" an "elitist community?" because that is what you just described, and is the opposite of any "community"
 

UCbizerkeley

Smash Cadet
Joined
Mar 12, 2007
Messages
41
1) party games aren't meant to be played online
2) fighting games aren't meant to be played online
3) hence, Smash Bros isn't meant for online

So these are very good reasons why Brawl shouldn't be online...
I just read this again and laughed out loud. pardon me
 

BigRick

Smash Master
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Messages
3,156
Location
Montreal, Canada AKA Real City brrrrrrrrapp!
Nice post UCbizerkeley... thx for making paragraphs and for not sending me a wall of text.

I don't see why there is any backlash against online play. My theory is that the majority of posters here do not have extensive experience with any online games.

To the OP - i have no idea how you decided that neither "party" games nor "fighting" games are intended to be online, that holds just zero credibility.

Lol, when I said that fighting games aren't meant to be played online, I was just refering to the two points that you mentionned below.

The fact is that adding ONLINE content does NOT HARM SSBB OFFLINE content. It is what is known as a "nonrivalrous" relationship, just like information. If I possess knowledge that I impart to you, it doesn't mean I lost the information. Just the same, if I play online and you don't, it doesn't take away from your experience.

Very true. But just like you said, if you play online and I don't, this simply shows that online play will simply divide the Brawl community in 2: underground and online players... this again refers to my statement ''fighting games aren't meant for online''

...First, LAG. Yes, it exists, and anybody that has played an online game in the past decade knows how it can affect gameplay. But Smashers are wrong to believe they are special in regard to lag. Smash will not be the first "twitch" game nor is it even the "twitchiest" game. In fact, in terms of supporting an online fighting community, Smash is a rather good fit.

Hmm, in a one on one match maybe there won't be lag. But, if you add 4-players, random attacks, random items, super moves, stage hazards and you'll probably get a ticking lag bomb.

Smash is different. Played on the Wii, everybody has an equal gaming platform, and the game is locked at a set FPS (60 for SSBM obviously). This removes one source of inequality.

Well, there's still that internet connection thing that remains... Also btw, ppl will simply improve their framerate by lowering gfx if they have frame problems...

if your argument is that "liek ZOMG - SMASH REQUIRES ISAI-LIGHTNING-MODE REACTIONS AND OTHER GAMES DONT!" you are plain wrong, and have not played another twitch game at a competitive level. Yes, a fraction of a second can mean you get hit, combo'd, perhaps even lose a stock. In CS, a headshot is the end, no questions.

Well, that's why lan parties/centers are popular. FPSes/RTSes are mostly played online because of their natural design : 1 screen for 1 player.

Other games have succeeded tremendously going from console -> online, Halo and Call of Duty come immediately to mind. Smash is not so unique that it can't follow suit.

Again, these are not fighting games. Those are FPSes, aka meant for lan/online.

COMMUNITY
This argument is laughable really. When has putting a game online DECREASED connectivity? The answer is NEVER. You will still play with your friends just as much, you know why? Because they are your friends, and they are FUN! Tournaments will still be held in person, just like every other competitive gaming function (CS, Halo, Quake, Unreal, whatever) because it enforces a level playing field. Again, this is the nonrivalrous aspect - you have your friends, you can play with them. My friends dont play smash, I can play with my online friends. More fun for everybody.

I already brought this earlier and you can see this in Dylan's post. Adding online play in a fighting game usually splits the community.

(cut the bad part) Bringing people together does just that - brings people together.

Smashboards brings people together... we do have our community already.
I don't want to get on the leader board aspect yet, because my post would've been too long.

EDIT: Lol, I know that if you simply read my first post and don't really think about it, it just sounds silly... but I hope now that you see a little bit what I meant with what's in my first post...

I don't know why, I just like to post that way... guess I'm too lazy to actually explain stuff lolz
 

Dylan_Tnga

Smash Master
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Feb 19, 2007
Messages
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Location
Montreal Canada
Smash is not MEANT to be anything, that is merely how you interpret it in your limited, egocentric view point. Smash is meant to first and foremost, turn a profit,
Must... resist... jew..joke...

and second, bring as much FUN to as MANY people as POSSIBLE. Your fixation with pwning newbs can take a hike, you're in the minority buddy.
Just so you're clear I dont take this game so seriously that I don't enjoy it. Its my favorite game and I enjoy it. Also, competitive smash is the proper way to play smash. Why? Because players who are competitive can beat players that aren't items on, or off. Doesn't matter. Darkrain WILL beat you, he's better than you. Minority or not, pro players pwn and that's what matters in gaming, spare me the corporate bs.

So you can take a hike, because I bet I could beat you in smash. :)

Online play will strengthen the community and bring MORE people face to face. What part of that don't you understand? Are you so fixated on being better than your friends that you want to keep this "awesome community" an "elitist community?" because that is what you just described, and is the opposite of any "community"
Pwning my friends?? Excuse me. You're implying im one of those. Those people who smash with like 2 people and guage their skill accordingly. Hell no, I play bi-weeklies and I also enter tournaments.

How will online smash bring people face to face? That doesn't make any sense. It wont bring people face to face, people will feel more inclined to eat chips and play online smash as opposed to going to the arcade so in my opinion online play would weaken the community.
 

shoe

Smash Ace
Joined
Sep 10, 2004
Messages
869
Location
Holtum, Netherlands
I don't know about the leader board thing, if the developers focus on fun than FFA would be an obvious option online. Then, you will play all of your 1vs1 matches, and climb the ladder and all, but right next to you, one place above you on the ladder, there is up-bLinkster1234, who beats everyone in FFA with his up-B spamming link. He's also climbing the ladder in teams, he likes to play team atack off and teams with his buddy PeachAdownSmash112. So, a leader board probably won't come with the rulesets we define, and therefore will probably not benefit the competitive smash scene.


Online as a means of practice when nobody's around would be great, if the lag doesn't screw it up too much. Yet, I believe online will hurt the competitive community, for what it is worth, because we, as in competitive smashers, are in a very small minority, I think it will hurt this community because of the following points.

First downside would be the loss of any form of a local metagame. This has allready happened for 50% by youtube, just look at all the dair-waveshining falco's, but online would totally destroy any form of a local metagame. But I guess with globalization of the world comes globalization of the smash metagame.

Another downside would be patching, as crazy as it may sound, patching would most likely be no good to competitive smash, while it will be good to the fun-based community of the game. When broken things can be fixed the game will become boring, the best way for a player to improve is by finding his way around something considered broken at first. The best thing about fighters is exploring their extremities, when these extremities are taken out, you will have a bad fighter.

Than, another thing that could happen by patching, which might not hold any value at all because it is up to the developpers. Scrub911 makes a petition, about fixing Marth's f-smash, because it is beating his Link all the time! He gets mostly all other Link scrubs to sign it, leaving him with 80% of the online community's votes! What would be the best thing for the developpers to do?
 

UCbizerkeley

Smash Cadet
Joined
Mar 12, 2007
Messages
41
Alright, so briefly, your counter is that "minority or not, pro players pwn and that's what matters in gaming"

If that was the case, there would be no SSBM, so I suggest you rethink that stance slightly.

Also, being online brings people face to face because it increases ones social network, introducing people to one another. Heard of MySpace or Facebook?

Fact 1: People drive to bi-weeklies and large tournaments.
Fact 2: People go because it offers a unique competitive environment where you can compete and learn from others.
Fact 3: More people learning about these events through advertisement (like the banner up top) means higher turnout
Fact 4: Fact 3 can be accomplished through playing regionally online
 

shoe

Smash Ace
Joined
Sep 10, 2004
Messages
869
Location
Holtum, Netherlands
Alright, so briefly, your counter is that "minority or not, pro players pwn and that's what matters in gaming"
Yet, I believe online will hurt the competitive community, for what it is worth, because we, as in competitive smashers, are in a very small minority, I think it will hurt this community because of the following points.
For what it is worth, can you read? For what it is worth, my believes, for what my opinion is worth. Not everything in this topic revolves around you and your arguement. Read the topic's title, Online Brawl: Yay or Nay? My answer, as a competitive player, Nay! And for being not the type to come in here and just post 'Nay! [10characters]' I also stated why, for me, it is a Nay!
 

skellitorman

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 12, 2005
Messages
319
If they do have online brawl i think it should be very simple. I think it should only be 1 on one matches only; with no items to lessen the lag, and to help people get better. And i think it should have a chat room so people could meet with other people or w/e. However i believe that smash should stay a game about competition, and not only "fun." I hope they keep all technicals and add more. As long as online smash doesn't affect offline competition i say Yay.
 

Mic_128

Wake up...
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current online fighting games isn't accessible to many ppl cause it's on Xbox/360.
I agree, there's no competative games on the Xbox.

*CoughHALOcough*

Consoles don't decide what's competative, the game does.

And I don't see how having an online mode for FUN will affect the games offline competative nature.
 

Red Exodus

Smash Master
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Dec 7, 2006
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Hell
As long as online doesn't affect offline [make hitboxes bigger] I won't really care. I'll only play it for fun anyway, I doubt I'll be able to play competitively with even 1 frame of lag. People say 1 frame doesn't matter but it does.
 

BigRick

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Montreal, Canada AKA Real City brrrrrrrrapp!
I agree, there's no competative games on the Xbox.

*CoughHALOcough*

Consoles don't decide what's competative, the game does.
Sure Halo 2 is a very competitive game, but is it a Fighting game? No.
Consoles actually have an impact on fighting games, because most of the community play them on PS2 instead of Xbox.

And I don't see how having an online mode for FUN will affect the games offline competative nature
Hmm, I agree with you, and I already admitted that UC was right when he brought up that point. An online mode built for fun shouldn't really affect the offline competition. However, an online mode built for fun shouldn't have leaderboards in them... you know how silly the human can be, especially in an online environment. Also, do you remember the Halo2 leaderboard situation?

UCbizkerley said:
Also, being online brings people face to face because it increases ones social network, introducing people to one another. Heard of MySpace or Facebook?
Online definitely brings people face to face. Why do you even have to mention MySpace or Facebook as examples, the best example that applies to our situation is the very forum where you are currently posting, Smashboards!

Smashboards is an online community... however, it doesn't provide online play. We can communicate with other smashers all we want here, but we can't actually play them if we don't meet them in person.

Online play is a big difference here: it is true that it provides communication between players, but it also provides them the option to play each other without having to meet each other. I doubt that this will make tournaments more crowded and stuff...

Good example would be the DOA4 flop at Evo2k6. Less than 50 entrants for the biggest fighting championship in the states... lol that's a joke.(DOA4 never came out for the arcades, and focused on an online strategy using Xbox live.)
 

xeonoex

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 20, 2005
Messages
201
Location
Donna. Texas
All hail the power of multiquoting.

Lol, lag refers to point number 2. But one thing that is scary is that we have nothing to tell us about the impact of online play on a competitive community of a fighting game, because: current online fighting games either suck, have a bad online mode, or isn't accessible to many ppl cause it's on Xbox/360.

And about playing against the CPU... we do have a **** good player 'round here that plays the CPU hahaha
I don't see whats so funny.

Not only lag will mess up the the game, but latency. Host will always have a huge advantage in a game that requires so many precise movements. One frame makes a huge difference, and unless they make the online great, it will have more than one frame of lag. I play Halo online too, and though its not as important in shooters, it will be hell in smash.

I'm still for it though. It just wont be a competitive online mode to me.

And most people will agree fighting high lvl computers will hurt there game. People can do it, but it wont help there game, while fighting a lvl 1 will.
 

Fawriel

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Online play. Dude, it's the main reason I'm saving money for a Wii and Brawl. I don't know any decent players here in Germany, not like America where you go to a university and there's already a SSB club or something. I can find random people to play with, but even with my meager skills I can defeat a team of three less experienced players... and that only happened once or twice during one of my vacations at my girlfriend's place. Yeah, my girlfriend lives in a neighboring country, and I want to play with her.
I don't know whether it's been said, but the party game aspect of the game will still prevail, because people who just play it for the fun aspect will most likely not care about having no-one of their skill level to play with ( and SSBB is supposed to become easier to play anyway )... and playing online is just not as fun as playing against one or even more peoplein reality, hearing and seeing their reactions, interacting with each other.
I managed to play Seiken Densetsu 3 with my girlfriend online, and it was fun, but we could barely interact with each other during the game except for the occasional phrase in the barely sufficient chat function. Even just watching her play Twilight Princess was more fun.
And SSBM with three or four people is the ultimate in fun.
 

Icetrash

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But Fawriel it is unknown whether or not you can play people in different countries.
 

Fawriel

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I think the question is whether it's regional or non-regional... and in that sense, Europe counts as one region.
 

Mic_128

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But Fawriel it is unknown whether or not you can play people in different countries.
I think it's a given that you can, just not a given wether you'll be able to play random people worldwide or just people with friend codes.
 

Black/Light

Smash Master
Joined
May 23, 2006
Messages
3,207
I think it's a given that you can, just not a given wether you'll be able to play random people worldwide or just people with friend codes.
I think it will be like Mario strikers charged as in you can randomly play people in your own region but you need Wii-codes to play people in different regions.

But ont topic. . . Yay!
The reason I don't play melee right now is because I only had ONE friend who owned a GC and had SSBM. . . everyone else where just sony and M$ fan-boys (Im going to start back up now that I am going to be in my college's game club and SSBM is the most popular game there:chuckle: ). After I got better than him he didn't want to play much anymore. . . and the comp only keeps you interested for soo long.

Online will make it alot more fun to play if you don't have any friends willing to play with you at any given time.

And all this talk over LAG this and LAG that. Look, it's pretty clear that SSBB is one of the TOP things Nintendo wants to use inorder to build upon online gaming. Sakurai even said that SSB was one of the first games to be suggested when Nintendo talked amoung themselves at the round table about how to hit online gaming.
They would have just added more characters and online play had Sakurai not stepped in. . . seems online was pretty important to them if thats the case

(Not even going into how the speed will be more "moderated" than in melee so we don't even know how the game will flow. Many expect something between SSB and SSBM but no one knows)

They know how important this is because it is important to them to do this right so I expect nintendo to deliver on this. (Plus, the Xbox had good online. . . the wii is stronger than the Xbox).

And this wont "hurt" the pro smashers. . . why would it? If the online shows to be as good as nintendo can make it than hey, pros can practice with each other online. . .maybe a online torney here or there. That doesn't mean that underground or MLG will stop. . . if anything it will become better and bigger. More people will have away of competeing against each other online with could bring upon even MORE people being interested in SSBB and that could likely result in even more underground scenes across the globe for face-2-face interaction.


Thats my lil rant/rave. . . carry on.:p
 

BigRick

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Location
Montreal, Canada AKA Real City brrrrrrrrapp!
Online play. Dude, it's the main reason I'm saving money for a Wii and Brawl. I don't know any decent players here in Germany, not like America where you go to a university and there's already a SSB club or something. I can find random people to play with, but even with my meager skills I can defeat a team of three less experienced players... and that only happened once or twice during one of my vacations at my girlfriend's place. Yeah, my girlfriend lives in a neighboring country, and I want to play with her.

Ok, you definitely have the right to play others for fun online.

I don't know whether it's been said, but the party game aspect of the game will still prevail, because people who just play it for the fun aspect will most likely not care about having no-one of their skill level to play with ( and SSBB is supposed to become easier to play anyway )... and playing online is just not as fun as playing against one or even more people in reality, hearing and seeing their reactions, interacting with each other.

I don't really know what message you wanted to send with the statements. But I'll disagree with the first one : the majority of ppl want to play someone their level... There's a big amount of scrubs that simply DC when they start losing at a game. I agree with the second statement though: Bomberman is one of the greatest games ever, but it becomes pretty lame when played online.

I managed to play Seiken Densetsu 3 with my girlfriend online, and it was fun, but we could barely interact with each other during the game except for the occasional phrase in the barely sufficient chat function. Even just watching her play Twilight Princess was more fun.
And SSBM with three or four people is the ultimate in fun.

Hmm I don't think that a communication feature will be supported. Somebody needs to confirm this. Also, it seems that Nintendo is using the same strategy as DS for its Wii online play.
Online will make it alot more fun to play if you don't have any friends willing to play with you at any given time.

I guess you're right. Playing against human is always better than playing AI.

And all this talk over LAG this and LAG that. [...]

They know how important this is because it is important to them to do this right so I expect nintendo to deliver on this. (Plus, the Xbox had good online. . . the wii is stronger than the Xbox).

One, you don't work at Nintendo. And two, we all know that the company has good intentions, but you gotta admit that cutting lag is a very difficult thing to do. I've already stated why in a previous post... Smash has the ingredients to make a laggy game.

And this wont "hurt" the pro smashers. . . why would it? If the online shows to be as good as nintendo can make it than hey, pros can practice with each other online. . .maybe a online torney here or there. That doesn't mean that underground or MLG will stop. . . if anything it will become better and bigger. More people will have away of competeing against each other online with could bring upon even MORE people being interested in SSBB and that could likely result in even more underground scenes across the globe for face-2-face interaction.

By seeing this can I suggest that you haven't previous posts? First, I doubt that online play will be good practice if there's factors like lag that can mess up important things like timing... Also I've already posted something about how online play usually doesn't help the offline community (look quote below).
BigRick said:
Online definitely brings people face to face. Why do you even have to mention MySpace or Facebook as examples, the best example that applies to our situation is the very forum where you are currently posting, Smashboards! Smashboards is an online community... however, it doesn't provide online play. We can communicate with other smashers all we want here, but we can't actually play them if we don't meet them in person.
Online play is a big difference here: it is true that it provides communication between players, but it also provides them the option to play each other without having to meet each other. I doubt that this will make tournaments more crowded and stuff... Good example would be the DOA4 flop at Evo2k6. Less than 50 entrants for the biggest fighting championship in the states... lol that's a joke.(DOA4 never came out for the arcades, and focused on an online strategy using Xbox live.)
Hmm and we haven't talked about leader boards yet... should we bring up that part of the discussion?
 

t0m0

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Apr 7, 2007
Messages
86
Location
Arcadia, California
Yay, most definetly. That is probably the most attractive new feature that could possibly come out for brawl. Look at it this way, for people out there that cannot drive to tourneys, they can play from the comfort of their own homes and still find some compeition out there. Im sure most of the tourneys for brawl will not be online, but the idea of hosting one just for fun is something too hard to pass up. If the gameplay will remain almost lag free, then count me in.:cool:
 

Dylan_Tnga

Smash Master
Joined
Feb 19, 2007
Messages
4,644
Location
Montreal Canada
I don't know whether it's been said, but the party game aspect of the game will still prevail, because people who just play it for the fun aspect will most likely not care about having no-one of their skill level to play with ( and SSBB is supposed to become easier to play anyway )... and playing online is just not as fun as playing against one or even more people in reality, hearing and seeing their reactions, interacting with each other.
Easier in what way? Whats ''difficult'' about melee? It just takes practice against people to become good. I find it more difficult to be good in classic 64 smash to be honnest, I play that online and if your opponent is REALLY good, it shows, he 0-deaths you all the time *cough rest combos cough* In melee theres so many factors you can manipulate like DI and stuff that at least give you a CHANCE versus pros.

If they water down smash in Brawl, that's going to be gay and ******** and stupid. And lame.
 

Fawriel

Smash Master
Joined
Apr 2, 2007
Messages
4,245
Location
oblivion~
Hmm.
I got my first N64 about a year ago. After a few months, I realized I could afford a Gamecube and the next SSB and bought them on eBay. Before I received them, I beat the SSB64 single-player mode in Very Hard.
Once I got SSBM... it was too fast for me. I could barely follow what was happening, control the characters' movement, I once played Classic single-player and got comboed to death by Mario in three hits ( the ******* meteored me o_0 ).
And father... he's been playing SSB with me from day one, and he still hasn't grasped much of how the game is to be played... not to mention that he tends to lose track of who is who if there are more than two characters.
Sure, these are extreme cases, but still...
 

The_NZA

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 7, 2007
Messages
1,979
I think online helps everyone. Afterall, if your competitive but deont have someone to play with all the time, its still nice to play online to keep practicing and having fun. While in Starcraft tourneys in korea are played solely through lan that doesn't mean pros dont go on bnet to practice a little or play for fun (although korea's a wierd situation since over there if your playing SC competitively then your LIVING with your clan.
 

Dylan_Tnga

Smash Master
Joined
Feb 19, 2007
Messages
4,644
Location
Montreal Canada
Hmm.
I got my first N64 about a year ago. After a few months, I realized I could afford a Gamecube and the next SSB and bought them on eBay. Before I received them, I beat the SSB64 single-player mode in Very Hard.
Once I got SSBM... it was too fast for me. I could barely follow what was happening, control the characters' movement, I once played Classic single-player and got comboed to death by Mario in three hits ( the ******* meteored me o_0 ).
And father... he's been playing SSB with me from day one, and he still hasn't grasped much of how the game is to be played... not to mention that he tends to lose track of who is who if there are more than two characters.
Sure, these are extreme cases, but still...
Hm well I played N64 smash since it came out and still play it online today, and own at it. I got into melee about 3 years after it came out, and it only took me about 2 years to be ready to compete in it, and to ''control'' my character and whatnot only took like a month or two, and I mained fox from the start. I play shiek/falco now though.

Edit : Yeah koreans are messed up :/

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2006/12/18/MNG5NN1JHO1.DTL

^^ article on starcraft scene in korea, good read. But depressing.. because of this quote

'' Many players are shy and show little emotion, win or lose, he said. But when one player crowed too much, such outward expressions were banned as "inconsiderate." It puzzled fans because they could not tell who won.

"Now they train [to be] happy when they win a game," said Ju, a graduate of Seoul National University, one of the country's most prestigious schools. ''
 

pikachun00b7

Smash Lord
Joined
Oct 22, 2006
Messages
1,771
Location
Phillipsburg, NJ
Online is beneficial. Even if people people can go to tourneys chances are you are going to a local one playing the same people. and when you are not at a tourney you are playing with your freinds or a "Krew' and playing with the same people again and again and again will not increase your skill playing against different people(online) with different strategies thus increasing your game to fit more situations.

Oh and how about smash64? Doesn' t the online for that own. And if there is small would it matter? I mean I Fountain of Dreams and that has lag but still playable. And I would like to see an article or proof that the Wii online will have lag anyway. Perhaps that is what Sakui said about "leaps" for online, maybe he was talking about fixing the lag. And BigRick
"Fighting Games shouldn't have online" well why would FPS or RPG etc. Have online all competitive games should have online.



EDIT: Plus non of us will be fighting "n00bs" since of Nintendo's friend code. This also discredits the argument of that you won't know your opponents since you must know them on SWF beforehand. Oh.. and there is lag if 2vs2 all items, ect(said bigrick). Well chances are we wont do item match and for 2vs.2 the Oh ****ing well I like 1vs.1 much better anyway.
 

Press22

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Aug 2, 2006
Messages
447
Location
VEGASsmash
I think it should have online, I mean if you don't like it its not a reason not to have it, its a reason not to use it. Much better to practice for all of us who have nobody good at smash close to where you live.
 
I

i8waffles612

Guest
Yay....

i have never played a video game console game online ever!!, only online computer games, and i am looking forward for this to being one of my first..

and for those of you who say nay,.... just dont play online....
 

XgimmickX

Smash Rookie
Joined
Apr 21, 2007
Messages
24
Smash bros isn't meant to be online? Fighting games aren't meant to be online? Are you kidding me? With the number of people all over the world who love and enjoy smash bros, to play it online with other people is like a dream. Wow isn't the only online game out there, all video game genres have explored online play so smash bros, can do the same.
 

Red Exodus

Smash Master
Joined
Dec 7, 2006
Messages
4,494
Location
Hell
Practicing online is not beneficial, it's the same reason playing in slow-mo melee is not beneficial, it screws up your timing. Even 1 frame of lag will screw you up, so online will most likely be used for fun, FFAs, crazy item matches etc., otherwise you'll hear lag johns a lot.
 

Black/Light

Smash Master
Joined
May 23, 2006
Messages
3,207
One, you don't work at Nintendo.When the hell did I say I work at nintendo? I KNOW this game is important to them for MANY reasons (one being the success of Melee and another being the fact that they are giving Sakurai all the things he needs and, according to him, are paying him ALOT of $ to do this) And two, we all know that the company has good intentions, but you gotta admit that cutting lag is a very difficult thing to do. I've already stated why in a previous post... Smash has the ingredients to make a laggy game.One, you have no idea what nintendo's online will be like. Why, because they haven't even given us any online games as of now. Two, you have no idea how fast Brawl will play. Most believe the it's going to be inbetween Melee and 64 speed. . . .and there are faster games than melee that run effectively online as someone has stated earlyer. Seems VERY unlikely that one of the reasons SSB3 is being made (online play) will be slapped on with such laggyness that it takes alway from the online play all together.:ohwell:

By seeing this can I suggest that you haven't previous posts?WTF?!? First, I doubt that online play will be good practice if there's factors like lag that can mess up important things like timing...Can you read sir? I said that if it PROVES TO BE GOOD as in, lag unnoticed or too small to effect gameplay, than pro might practice with it. . . Also I've already posted something about how online play usually doesn't help the offline community (look quote below).It DOES get more people into the game, am I right? Which could result in more people willing to do underground and so on, am I right? And even if it doesn't greatly effect underground than at the least it wont hurt underground, am I right?:dizzy:
This is moronic. Online has been confirmed for Brawl (as I said, it's one of the reasons they are making the game). . . and this is a effing "yay or nay" topic. WHY are you debating about this with ever "yay" sayer when the title cleary states its a "are you for or against this " thread? If your against on-line for W/E the hell reason than make a "SSBB shouldn't have on-line" thread an don't just jump around with w/e bs you come up with as to why it isn't "good".
(EVEN IF it's laggy as dirt or has crappy service. . . how the hell does that effect you, someone who seems to be against playing online by any means? Im done here. . . )
 

XgimmickX

Smash Rookie
Joined
Apr 21, 2007
Messages
24
It seems to me more people in this thread are batting heads about whether online will even be in the game at all. :ohwell:
 

Chi's Finest

Smash Lord
Joined
Dec 18, 2005
Messages
1,988
Location
Chicago
Fighting games not meant to be online? Where did this come from? On my 360, every fighting game I know of is played online.

If Nintendo uses their own servers for matches and doesn't make the same mistake MS and Epic did for Gears of War, host should have basically no advantage.
 

JesterBox

Smash Ace
Joined
Nov 11, 2006
Messages
545
Question: should Super Smash Bros. Brawl have online play?

I'm not sure if there's gonna be an online play feature for Brawl, but I feel that Brawl shouldn't have online play... here's why:

1) party games aren't meant to be played online
2) fighting games aren't meant to be played online
3) hence, Smash Bros isn't meant for online

So these are very good reasons why Brawl shouldn't be online... I would like to hear some of your opinions. If you like online play in Brawl... then go ahead, and try to convince me.
You, my friend are very close-minded since when are games "meant to be online"? Party and fighting games were out before onlining gaming kicked up so you could say FPS are not meant for online or RPGs or RTS games or any genre really every genre wasn't meant for online until they tried it, and guess what...it works for pretty much every multiplayer game.

those are just...horrid ...horrid reasons they are as solid as wet kardboard in the grasp of a gorrilla on roids. You said brawl isn't meant for online..yet...it totaly is, it just is and that how its going to be, they designed it to be "meant for online"
 

Banks

Smash Hero
Joined
Feb 17, 2005
Messages
5,861
Location
Maine (NSG)
the game should be online, or nintendo will have made a huge mistake. but i dont get why you said fighting games shouldnt be online, that makes no sense.
 
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