Olimar Frame Data - Patch 3.5

[KuroganeHammer]

You can find 3.02's data here.​

Olimar's Frame Data​

[intro paragraph.]

[COLLAPSE="Current Requests"]

Request | Requested By | Current Progress
Stage IDs | Kaeldiar | Figuring it out

[/COLLAPSE]

Table of Contents :
( To skip to a section, Ctrl + F and search for its 4-letter code. )

Section 1: Standard Terms [TRMS]
Section 2: Frame & Hitbubble Data [FRME]

2.1 Ground Moves [GRND]
2.2 Aerial Moves [AERL]
2.3 Specials [SPCL]
2.4 Ledge Moves [LDGE]
2.5 Tech & Trip Moves [TCHM]
2.6 Item Moves [ITMM]​

Section 3: Sticker & Moveset Attributes [STCK]
Section 4: Credits [CRDT]​

Section 1 / Standard Terms [TRMS]

[COLLAPSE="Terms List"]Hitbox Active: Frames during which the attack's hitboxes are active.
FAF (First Actionable Frame): First frame on which you can perform another move. This will be the animation's end or the IASA frame if the move has one.
Base Damage: Base damage values for each hit.
Angle: Angle at which the opponent will be knocked away.
BKB: Base knockback of the move.
KBG: Knockback growth of the move. This number affects how quickly knockback will increase relative to the opponent's damage.
Block Advantage: Ground moves only. Frame difference between Mewtwo's FAF and the opponent's when the move hits the opponent's shield. Counted from first hit frame per damage value. Add +14 to find the normal shield drop advantage.
Landing Lag: Aerials only. Number of frames Mewtwo lags when he hits the ground during the move.
Autocancel: Aerials only. Frames during which Mewtwo can land without the aerial move's landing lag. (He will instead suffer normal jump landing lag.)
Intangibility: Frames during which Mewtwo will take no damage.
[/COLLAPSE]​

Section 2 / Frame & Hitbubble Data [FRME]

2.1 Ground Moves [GRND]

Attacks | Hitbox Active | FAF | Base Dmg. L/B/F | Block Adv.
Jab 1 | 4-7 | 16 | 3 | -8
Jab 2 | 4-6 | 18 | 5 | -9
Dash Attack | 5-6, 7-14 | 31 | 7, 4 | -20
Ftilt | 9-18 | 38 | 10 | -22
Utilt | 7-10 | 28 | 8 | -14
Dtilt | 6-12 | 31 | 6 | -19
Fsmash (R) | 15-20, 21-27, 28-34 | 48 | 15/16/17, 12, 9 |
Fsmash (Y) | 11-15, 16- | 48 | 13/14/15, 9, 6 |
Fsmash (B) | 15-20, 21-27, 28-34 | 48 | 14/15/16, 11, 6 |
Fsmash (W) | 15-20, 21-27, 28-34 | 48 | 9/10/11, 6, 3 |
Fsmash (P) | 15-20, 21-25, 26-33 | 48 | 17/19/21, 16, 13 |
Usmash (R) | 8-11, 12-18 | 37 | 13/14/15, 10 |
Usmash (Y) | 7-13, 14-18 | 37 | 14/15/16, 10 |
Usmash (B) | 8-13, 14-18 | 37 | 15/16/17, 11 |
Usmash (W) | 8-13, 14-18 | 37 | 10/11/12, 5 |
Usmash (P) | 8-11, 12-18 | 37 | 16/18/20, 13 |
Dsmash (R) | 10-13 | 45 | 13/14/15 |
Dsmash (Y) | 10-13, 14-18 | 45 | 11/12/13, 8 |
Dsmash (B) | 10-13, 14-18 | 45 | 12/13/14, 9 |
Dsmash (W) | 10-13, 14-18 | 45 | 7/8/9, 4 |
Dsmash (P) | 10-12, 13-15 | 45 | 13/15/17, 10 |
Grabs | Hitbox Active | FAF | Base Dmg. | Notes
Standing Grab | 11-25 | 36 | - |
Dash Grab | 11-25 | 41 | - |
Pivot Grab | 11-25 | 41 | - |
Grab Pummel | 10-26 | 22 | 2-7 |
Throws | Weight Dependant? | Notes
Fthrow | No | -
Bthrow | No | -
Uthrow | No | -
Dthrow | No | -
Miscellaneous | Intangibility | Duration | {colsp=7}Notes
Spotdodge | 3-18 | 28 |
Forward Roll | 4-19 | 33 |
Back Roll | 4-19 | 33 |
Shielddrop | - | 15 |
Up Taunt | - | 80 |
Side Taunt | - | 90 |
Down Taunt | - | 90 |

2.2 Aerial Moves [AERL]

Attacks | Hitbox Active | FAF | Base Dmg. | Landing Lag/L-Cancel | Autocancel | Notes
Nair | 3-4, 6-7, 9-10, 12-13, 15-17 | 40 | 2 | 15/7 | 1-2, 32-39
Fair | 7-10 (-) | 31 | (13/14/15), (10/11/12), (12/13/14), (6/7/8), (13/15/17) | 16/8 | 1-5
Bair | 10-14 (-)| 38 | (11-12/12-13/13-14), (9-11/10-12/11-13), (10-13/11-14/12-15), (7/8/9), (10-14/12-16/14-18) | 16/8 |1-5
Uair | 8-11, 12-20 (-)| 35 | (12/13/15) 9, (9/10/11) 8, (11/12/13) 8, (5/6/7) 7, (14/16/18) 10 | 20/10 | 1-5
Dair | 16-18, 19-20 (-)| 33 | (15/16/17) 10, (13/14/15) 6, (14/15/16) 8, (9/10/11) 4, (15/17/19) 11 | 25/12 | 1-5, 32
Jump Data | Jump Squat Duration | SH Air Time | FH Air Time | Empty Landing | {colsp=5}Notes
| 4 | 30 | 55 | 4 |
Miscellaneous | Intangibility | {colsp=8}Notes
Airdodge | 4-29 | - | {colsp=8}

2.3 Specials [SPCL]

Attacks | Hitbox Active | FAF | Base Dmg. | Block Adv. | Notes
Pikmin Pluck | - | 11 | - | - | Pikmin appears: Frame 1
Pikmin Throw | - | 25 | - | - | Pikmin attach: Frame 9
Pikmin Throw (P) | 9 | 25 | 10 | -4 |
Pikmin Order | - | 12 | - | - | Pikmin respond: Frame 7

2.4 Ledge Moves [LDGE]

Attacks | Hitbox Active | Intangibility | FAF | Base Dmg. | Block Adv. | Notes
Ledge Attack <100% | 17-21, 22-23 | 1-15 | 56 | 8 | -33
Ledge Attack >100% | 39-43 | 1-43 | 70 | 10 | -24
Miscellaneous | Intangibility | FAF | {colsp=7} Notes
Ledge Grab |
Ledge Climb <100% | 1-30 | 35
Ledge Climb >100% | 1-55 | 60
Ledge Roll <100% | 1-29 | 50
Ledge Roll >100% | 1-65 | 80
Ledge Jump <100% | 1-15 | 16
Ledge Jump >100% | 1-19 | 20

2.5 Tech & Trip Moves [TCHM]

Attacks | Hitbox Active | Intangibility | FAF | Base Dmg. | Block Adv. | Notes
Get Up Attack (Back) | 15-17, 25-27 | 1-27 | 50 | 6 | -20
Get Up Attack (Stomach) | 16-18, 27-29 | 1-29 | 50 | 6 | -18
Trip Attack | 12-13, 24-25 | 1-8 | 50 | 5 |
Miscellaneous | Intangibility | FAF | {colsp=7}Notes
Tech | 1-20 | 27 | Universal.
Tech Roll | 1-20 | 41 | Universal.
Stand (Back & Stomach) | 1-22 | 30 |
Get Up Roll Forward (Back) | 1-22 | 36 |
Get Up Roll Backward (Back) | 1-22 | 36 |
Get Up Roll Forward (Stomach) | 1-22 | 36 |
Get Up Roll Backward (Stomach) | 1-22 | 36 |
Trip | 1-6 | 30
Trip Get Up | 1-17 | 22
Trip Roll Forward | 1-10 | 29
Trip Roll Backward | 1-10 | 29

2.6 Item Moves [ITMM]

| Item Thrown On | FAF | Notes
Forward Toss (Ground & Air) | 8 | 25
Back Toss (Ground & Air) | 11 | 26 | Reverses your direction on frame 4.
Up Toss (Ground & Air) | 12 | 24
Down Toss (Ground & Air) | 7 | 21 | Hitbox does not come out while grounded.
Dash Toss | 5 | 38

Section 4 / Sticker & Moveset Attributes [STCK]

Jab 1 - Head/Normal
Headbutt.
Jab 2 - Head/Normal
Another Headbutt.
Dash Attack - Body/Normal
Body hitboxes. Probably because Olimar uses his entire body to attack.
Ftilt - Foot/Normal
This move is actually really cute imo.
Utilt - Spin/Normal
Olimar doesn't spin, so I guess they forgot to change it.
Dtilt - Head/Normal
This move is a pseudo-crawl!
All Pikmin Attacks - Pikmin/Element|Pikmin/Normal
Basically if they're flowered they'll usually use their respective element. Other than that it's usually normal except for some circumstances like Side B's loop hit and late hits of Red Pikmin.
Nair - Spin/Normal
Surprise!

Section 4 / Credits [CRDT]

 

[KuroganeHammer]

reserved for terrain and pikmin data

 

[KuroganeHammer]

reserved for hitbox data

 

[KuroganeHammer]

reserved for... me.

I'll fix this all up later, I'm sooo tired I'm dyiinnnnnnggggggg

Good night

 

[steelguttey]

btw

patch name is 3.5 (not 3.05)

pls correct

 

[KuroganeHammer]

why have i been calling it 3.05 the past 6 weeks

why is someone only just telling me

 

[steelguttey]

how it goes is

major update (characters added+balance patches+bugfixes) = the first number in the patch (3.0)

balance patch (balance patches+bugfixes) = the second number (3.5)

bugfix patch (bugfixes) = the third number (3.02)

 

[B.W.]

No more terrain data. Pluck chances are all 20%.

Also if there's a way to put the Pikmin's Base Knockback and Knockback Growth in those charts that'd be usefull since they'd all be in one place.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

I know but for the sake of consistency it's worth mentioning that all terrain data is 20%

Where do you want this bkb and kbg? What chart?

 

[B.W.]

Section 2.1 - 2.5. I wouldn't mind them being shown how the aerial damage info is, where F-Smash was shown you could condense stuff so it looks more like the Aerial stuff, showing the differences the same way you plan on showing the Hitbox Active differences the same way they're shown in the Aerial section.

Just a suggestion though.

 

[Ningildo]

Is block advantage up for aerials? I can't see it on my phone, but I do want to know if it's there so I can check it out later on my pc. Very interested in particular for yellow fair to see if it coming out sooner makes a difference in safeness on shield.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Block advantage isn't there for aerials sorry. Honestly I do need to finish this, but there's so much on my plate it isn't funny.

At least you guys can play in debug mode so it's not that high of a priority (yet).

 

[B.W.]

I started to make a spreadsheet for Olimar's more basic stuff. It's not very full, but if people want to work together with me to fill it just say the word and I'll give you access.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1amGWuYgQZkiUzMe_37o697dexRege23t9F2PVxq7kMU/edit?usp=sharing

 

[Ningildo]

I started to make a spreadsheet for Olimar's more basic stuff. It's not very full, but if people want to work together with me to fill it just say the word and I'll give you access.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1amGWuYgQZkiUzMe_37o697dexRege23t9F2PVxq7kMU/edit?usp=sharing

I will. But wouldn't filling this up with info already gathered by Aerodrome be a good way to start? Just asking.
Also, how do I get this info via debug mode? I mean is there a hidden display that I need to "unhide" or something, or am I just an idiot and missing something important here?(Else I have no idea how to tell what frame a move starts on so I know how long exactly it is frame-wise)

As a side note, I'm pretty sure that jab 1+2 have Oli's antenna as a hitbox and deal damage (no real hitstun to speak of, though...). I've done 15% with a jab combo while fooling around in Training mode and rechecked to make sure I wasn't imagining things. Just something to note @ KuroganeHammer

 

[B.W.]

I've been double checking Aero's stuff, which is why it's not all filled.

I've also found a few differences in the frames where hitboxes come out too, which is why I haven't just copy/pasted the info.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Yeah I do need to do this but work is just hammering me and how can I justify doing project m when there is a lot of people expecting smash 4 content.

Sumimasen!

 

[B.W.]

S'all good. There's really no rush for this character.

No real need for data on a character no one will play lol.

 

[Ningildo]

I play Oli!

But, yeah, Sm4sh hype being as strong as it is makes frame data for it all the more important.

How do I get frame specific data via debug, tho? I don't have a clue about that, so if anyone could enlighten this uninformed man I'd be more then willing to help with frame data.

 

[B.W.]

Activate debug mode with L+R+D-Pad Down

Turn on hitbxes with R+D-Pad Right

Start should "freeze" the game. When it's frozen you can press Z to frame advance.

From there you have to count by yourself...

Other good advice for you is to stop playing Olimar.

 

[Ningildo]

Alright, thanks. I'll see if I can get frame data on a regular basis.

And nope. Just nope. I like this character a lot (bar in sm4sh, rip), so even if he does turn out to be bottom tier trash, well, tough luck for me :/. That did make me laugh more then it should, though, lol.

 

[Shokio]

I'm just now coming to the Olimar forums. I take it the verdict is that he isn't very good?

For me personally, he still plays the same....but something about his changes made him more unfun. I think it's the fact that they tried to normalize the KB of his Pikmin rather than have a really strong snowball mechanic. I dunno.

 

[Ultimate Sneeze]

Yeah, for the terms list, there's Mewtwo in there for some reason instead of Olimar. No rush, though, it's just a formatting thing.

 

[B.W.]

One thing I'm finding on a lot of the data in this thread is that the hitboxes come out on the the same frames as posted, but for the hitboxes that change during the attack, @ KuroganeHammer has them posted as changing 1 frame later than they actually do.

Some of the IASAs are still incorrect though. Still gathering data, but so far the hitbox thing has been consistent.

 

[Proxford]

I'm assuming that the block advantage is based on shield stun and the first active frame of a move. So if jab 1 has its first active on frame 4, its first actionable frame on 16 (the move ends on 15), and the opponent recovers 8 frames before you do, there are 3 frames of shield stun (15 frames from start to finish, 4 frames from start to hit, 11 frames from hit to end, and the opponent gains 8 frames on you). You hit them on frame 4, opponent is in stun on 5,6, and 7, they recover on frame 8, you recover on 16.
This is assuming that the notation here is the same as fighting games where + and - on frames means advantage and disadvantage respectively.
If an opponent were to be moving with a shield up, like with a wavedash into shield, if the opponent ran into jab 1 and blocked it on its last active frame (7), with the same amount of shield stun you would be -5 (3 frames of shield stun, 8 frames from hit to recovery)
You hit them on frame 7, opponent is in stun 8,9, and 10, they recover on frame 11, you recover on 16.

Having the shield stun number itself would be very useful. More so than traditional fighting games, because it is possible to have a moving block or a spotdodge (though spotdodge is similar to getting up from knockdown). I'm willing to do the legwork to find the numbers for olimar, but how would I best go about this?
I really want to know the numbers for aerials.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Shieldstun formula is (x + 4.45)/2.235))

 

[Proxford]

Got most of the data I wanted.The shield stun formula is coming out with different values than that in the OP for block advantage.The grounded moves part isn't complete. Aerials is mostly done, and I don't care about the grabs.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/11tn5D51vtSUvQKhbiKIcajkeGYmqchLZ8THRJNa0yng/edit?usp=sharing

 

[Taytertot]

This is great info. I was wondering (i havent played olimar in PM but i did play him a bit in brawl) if the downB still has super armor on frame 1?

 

[steelguttey]

nope thats gone

 

[Taytertot]

huh why's that? I feel like it wouldn't be OP and it would help olimar's gameplay (or at least give it some armor). Im not sure whether or not olimar is actually low tier, but it does seem like most people feel that way about him and because of that, as well as his learning curve due to the pikmin having different effects, olimar doesnt see much of the tournament scene.

 

[steelguttey]

armor on whistle is stupid and doesnt work on pm oli for lots of reasons. mainlt because its pointless and doesnt do anything healthy for the game.

pm oli sucks simply because his recovery sucks. hes bad for other reasons but mostly because hes based off of rng and he doesnt have grab armor. other than that hes p solid

 

[Taytertot]

In what way does it not do anything healthy for the game? I think it is an interesting mechanic for someone like olimar to have. Hes a lightweight character so he dies really early but with a super armor move that comes out so quick he can decide to play very risky and take the damage from an attack in order to switch up the momentum by throwing out an attack after the armor, but its a risk because if that trade of percent doesnt get much done for Olimar then he just took percent that adds up to him getting killed sooner by either being hit offstage and gimped/edgehogged cause his recovery sucks as you said or flat out killed because hes light.

 

[steelguttey]

absorbing hits with super armor is always better than getting hit, if you get damage off it or not.

just because its an interesting mechanc doesnt mean its healthy for olimar

 

[Taytertot]

i guess im talking more about situations where you could avoid that attack and reset to neutral vs absorb the attack and get a possible followup, rather than situations where you could absorb an attack vs just getting hit. In order to do that without making it an unfair move, I suppose the super armor couldnt be on frame one or else a player would be stupid not to use the super armor to avoid combos, cover mistakes, or other shenanigans.

 

[steelguttey]

super armor that isnt punishable by at least 10 frames of lag isnt good armor. if you have 2 frames of lag after than its just silly

 

[Taytertot]

i see your point but the frame data could be changed so that it isnt incredibly cheap

 

[steelguttey]

to what? make it laggy and ****ty to use for its intended purpose? nty

 

[Taytertot]

ok then i guess it has to stay the same. i was just tryin to think of ways to get more people playing him and that ability is what made him good in brawl and wouldnt take a whole lot of work on the PMDTs part since thats the way the move worked originally.

 

[B.W.]

People don't play Olimar because people don't like Olimar as a character.

The only reason he was played in Brawl was because he was one of the best characters in the game.

 

[Orange Chris]

I've dug up the knockback values with BrawlBox.
EDIT: I won't be updating this anymore until 3.6 comes out, unless PMDT come out and say it isn't anywhere near ready. When I do update, I'll revise what I currently have to include the frames all in this post. I'll probably end up making an entire new post, especially since Aerodrome said above he'd rather work on his career/sm4sh content.

Spoiler: To Do

• Double-check info
• Figure out Yellow Dair
• Obtain get-up, etc. data
  
• Obtain pikmin intangibility frames
• Color info/improve formatting
  
• Make gifs (only possible for non-pikmin attacks with BrawlBox, others would have to be ingame)
  
• Condense info better
• Obtain Pikmin intangibilty frames
• Calculate hitlag, sheildstun, and block advantage
• Analyze pikmin's sideB times.

Spoiler: Non-pikmin attacks

Attacks|Damage|Angle|Base Knockback|Knockback Growth
Jab1-Head*|3|20|10|80
Jab1-Antenna|2|361|0|0
Jab2|5|361|40|100
DashAttack-Early|7|65|90|35
DashAttack-Late|4|68|50|70
Ftilt|10|361|20|96
Utilt|8|100|50|80
Dtilt|6|80|40|115
Dtilt-Antenna|2|361|0|0
Nair-First 4 hits-head|2|270|30|100
Nair-First 4 hits-hands|2|130|30|30/80
Nair-First 4 hits-body|2|90|40|30
Nair-Final Hit|2|70|50|150

*Jab1 also has 10 Weight-Set knockback

Spoiler: Smashes

Attack/Pikmin|Damage|Angle|Base Knockback|Knockback Growth
Fsmash-Early
Red|15/16/17|361|20|105/100/95
Yellow|13/14/15(+4 Shield)|361|20|89/84/80
Blue|14/15/16|361|20|106/100/95
White|9/10/11|361|10/20/30|104/91/80
Purple|17/19/21|361|50|80/76/73
Fsmash-Middle
Red|12|361|20|90
Yellow|9|361|20|90
Blue|11|361|20|90
White|6|361|15|80
Purple|16|361|20|70
Fsmash-Late
Red|9|361|20|90
Yellow,Blue|6|361|20|90
White|3|361|15|80
Purple|13|361|20|70
Usmash
Red|13/14/15|85|30|106/100/95
Yellow|11/12/13(+4 Shield)|85|30|113/106/100
Blue|12/13/14|85|30|107/100/94
White|7/8/9|85|50|120/109/100
Purple|13/15/17|85|65|95/90/86
Usmash-late
Red,Yellow|10|60|50|90
Blue|9|60|50|90
White|5|60|50|90
Purple|10|60|40|100
Dsmash
Red|13/14/15|35|30|92/87/82
Yellow|11/12/13(+4 Shield)|35|30|113/106/100
Blue|12/13/14|35|30|93/87/82
White|7/8/9|35|35|120/109/100
Purple|13/15/17|35|50|80/75/70
Dsmash-Late
Red|10|35|22|95
Yellow|8|35|10|100
Blue|9|35|30|100
White|4|35|10|100
Purple|10|28|10|100

Spoiler: Aerials

Attack/Pikmin|Damage|Angle|Base Knockback|Knockback Growth
Fair
Red|13/14/15|361|25|99/93/88
Yellow|10/11/12(+4 Shield)|361|30|102/95/89
Blue|12/13/14(+1 Shield)|361|25|99/93/88
White|6/7/8|361|20|122/110/100
Purple|13/15/17|361|55|80/75/70
Bair
Red|14/15/16(1 Shield)|40|0|111/105/100
Yellow|11/12/13(4 Shield)|40|30|100/94/88
Blue|13/14/15(1 Shield)|40|0|110/105/99
White|7/8/9|40|20|120/109/100
Purple*|(14/10)/16/18|40|55|80/75/71
Uair
Red|12/13/14|80|40|107/100/94
Yellow|9/10/11(4 Shield)|80|30|92/86/80
Blue|11/12/13|80|40|107/100/93
White|5/6/7|80|20|124/111/100
Purple|14/16/18|90|35|96/90/85
Uair-late
Red|7|87|30|100
Yellow|8|87|30|90
Blue|6|80|20|100
White|3|80|20|100
Purple|8(2 Shield)|90|30|90
Dair
Red|15/16/17(1 Shield)|270|30|112/106/101
Yellow
Blue|14/15/16|270|30|112/106/101
White|9/10/11|270|20|115/107/100
Purple|15/17/19|270|60|90/85/80
Dair-late
Red|9|270|10|92
Yellow**||361
Blue|8|270|10|92
White|4|361|10|70
Purple|11|270|20|70

*Purple Leaf pikmin Bair does 14 with the head, 10 with the body.
**Yellow aerials have a lot of weird stuff in the game files, and I haven't figured it out yet.

Spoiler: Throws

Attack/Pikmin|Damage|Angle|Base Knockback|Knockback Growth
Forward
Red|6|361|0|70
Yellow|7|45|60|50
Blue|12|45|30|100
White|6|361|60|50
Purple|7|361|80|75
Back-Red|7|45|70|70
Yellow|9|45|48|52
Blue|12|45|10|110
White|7|45|48|52
Purple|9|45|80|60
Up
Red|7|85|80|75
Yellow|9|85|55|92
Blue|12|85|55|96
White|6|85|55|72
Purple|10|85|55|95
Down*
Red|6|70|85|75
Yellow|8|70|66|69
Blue|9|70|70|60
White|5|70|60|60
Purple|7|70|60|100

*Every down throw also produces a 1dmg hitbox on the same frame the enemy is released, which can only hit the enemy. I'm not sure how this affects knockback.

Spoiler: Misc. Info

• Pummel deals 2/4/6 damage with whites, 2 with all others

SideB:

• Red, Blue:2/3/4
• Yellow:2/3/4(+4/5/6 shield)
• White:3/4/5
• Purples, when thrown: 10DMG, 361Angle, 100KBG, 0 BKB
• Removal Explosion:6/7/8DMG,90Angle, 16/32/50 BKB, 50/64/80 KBG

Spoiler: Changelist

2015-06-05: Added 3.6 notice, Added features to ToDo
2015-04-12: added sideB removal data to Misc.
2015-03-31: added Misc. Info: Pummel and SideB
2015-03-31: Uploaded data