Official Standard Custom Moveset Project: King Dedede

[MintChipper]

Rising Dedede seems to have slightly more vertical distance than Super Dedede Jump (Rising Dedede can ledge-snap to a pillar 22 stage builder grid blocks high; Super Dedede Jump can only do 21. Quick Dedede Jump is 20. This is assuming that the grounded and aerial versions of these moves are the same...).

Okay, thanks! Definitely using Rising Dedede now.

 

[TheSlothStyleIsBack]

Out of our custom moves, I think only Gordo Throw should remain unchanged.

The high risk of a reflected Gordo removes any benefit of stage control a Bouncing Gordo could provide. Besides, Gordo Throw is so versatile in the angles you can send them at your opponent that I really do not see any point in using Topspin Gordo either.

All 3 variants of Jet Hammer are generally terrible and see very little use, if any, in any given match. Regular Jet Hammer would make sense to keep to confirm a kill against a shield break/whiffed rest, but since we also have FSmash, there's very little point in having another laggy/hard-hitting move.

Armored Jet Hammer could be used as a pseudo counter. Damage uncharged is pretty pitiful however.

Dash Jet Hammer provides an interesting downward aerial movement option that is faster than anything else Dedede has.
While still extremely situational; it feels a lot more useful than the other two.

Sets should overall be a mix of Super Dedede Jump/Rising Dedede and Taste Test/Inhale with whatever we feel is the better Jet Hammer with perhaps one set with Bouncing Gordo for good measure.

One set should be used for Dedede Storm for the time being. Its merits are obvious against Rosalina, and while there might be unexplored uses to the move, it's currently too high a risk to take another slot with Dedede Storm. Also feel like Super Dedede Jump is better in the Rosalina matchup, so we can basically keep that vanilla.

So 6 sets? Let's see :

1322 (Edited from 1113; just pick standard, Jet Hammer won't win you games).

3112

1122

3122

Bouncing Gordo Set : 1312

Rosa set : 2112

Discuss.

Umm... Why is Dedede Storm good against Rosalina again?

 

[TheSlothStyleIsBack]

Out of our custom moves, I think only Gordo Throw should remain unchanged.

The high risk of a reflected Gordo removes any benefit of stage control a Bouncing Gordo could provide. Besides, Gordo Throw is so versatile in the angles you can send them at your opponent that I really do not see any point in using Topspin Gordo either.

All 3 variants of Jet Hammer are generally terrible and see very little use, if any, in any given match. Regular Jet Hammer would make sense to keep to confirm a kill against a shield break/whiffed rest, but since we also have FSmash, there's very little point in having another laggy/hard-hitting move.

Armored Jet Hammer could be used as a pseudo counter. Damage uncharged is pretty pitiful however.

Dash Jet Hammer provides an interesting downward aerial movement option that is faster than anything else Dedede has.
While still extremely situational; it feels a lot more useful than the other two.

Sets should overall be a mix of Super Dedede Jump/Rising Dedede and Taste Test/Inhale with whatever we feel is the better Jet Hammer with perhaps one set with Bouncing Gordo for good measure.

One set should be used for Dedede Storm for the time being. Its merits are obvious against Rosalina, and while there might be unexplored uses to the move, it's currently too high a risk to take another slot with Dedede Storm. Also feel like Super Dedede Jump is better in the Rosalina matchup, so we can basically keep that vanilla.

So 6 sets? Let's see :

1322 (Edited from 1113; just pick standard, Jet Hammer won't win you games).

3112

1122

3122

Bouncing Gordo Set : 1312

Rosa set : 2112

Discuss.

Umm... Why is Dedede Storm good against Rosalina again?

 

[dean.]

It supposedly sends Luma flying really far; usually enough to knock it off-stage.

I still prefer Taste Test in that match-up though.

 

[shrooby]

I've seen it in action. I think it has much utility in the match-up. You just can't get cocky with it since it doesn't exactly make the match-up not difficult. Just less difficult.

 

[TheSlothStyleIsBack]

It supposedly sends Luma flying really far; usually enough to knock it off-stage.

I still prefer Taste Test in that match-up though.

I agree. I just feel safer with it. I like having an pseudo air grab.

 

[iiGGYxD]

I dont have all of DDD's customs unlocked personally. I've played a few matches at my local tourneys with custom DDD though and while bouncing gordo is fun / funny to use, I don't think it is better than standard Gordo. I feel, for now atleast, The setups with standard Gordo are superior than bouncing + the kill power of standard is nice to have.

On another note, has anyone experimented with DDD's up special that has the hitbox rising? What % does it kill at and can it be reliably comboed into from nair or a throw possibly?

 

[W.A.C.]

I use Rising Dedede and how early it kills will depend on where you are. I've gotten a lot of stupidly early kills with it off stages from players dumb enough to challenge Dedede when he has the Rising Dedede up special, which just spikes them against the stage for those who don't think to tech. I recently killed a bad Little Mac player at a tournament through taste test to get them off stage, then Rising Dedede to spike him. lol On stage, I've gotten a lot of grounded kills at around I think 110% and way earlier than that if I use it below a player who is in the air. Also can depend a lot on stage selection. Not to mention dean. mentioned the move has a higher vertical recovery. The only thing that's obnoxious about the move is that I have to face the edge or else I cannot grab it, which has cost me stocks in the past. I don't remember if the standard up special has that same obnoxious property, as I haven't used it in a long time.

 

[dean.]

Rising Dedede has a 15% sweetspot right at the start. Its knockback is comparable to usmash. It does 12% for most of the ascent with knockback comparable to uair and a 6% hitbox right at the end.

Weak hit nair into the ground combos into the 12% hitbox from mid-percents until about 100%ish on midweights with no rage and can possibly kill. Dthrow can combo into it if they don't DI or DI towards you but uair seems like the safer and more reliable option here. Nothing else seems to true combo into it apart from convenient Gordo hits which combo into basically everything.

Main drawbacks of Rising Dedede are:

• Lack of armour. Rising Dedede has a period of invincibility for the first 20% or so of the ascent. Super Dedede Jump has super armour for around 80% of the ascent until the apex.
• Can't cancel it at any point.
• After you reach the apex, there's sort of a cool-down period during which you can't grab the ledge.
• After you enter free-fall the time period for where if you land you get the extended landing lag is much longer than that of Super Dedede Jump.
• And obviously, there is no landing hitbox.

Points 3-5 are obviously non-issues if you sweetspot the ledge though.

 

[DoubleReed]

The Bouncing Gordo is really disappointing. Even the smallest of its arcs is way too big to set anything up. If it had a smaller arc it could be useful imo.

Topspin is sadly significantly slower than the normal Gordo for some reason. Using it offstage doesn't really work well. But it is pretty crazy, although it looks useless to me.

 

[W.A.C.]

I personally thought the arcs were fine.

 

[DoubleReed]

I just wanted the same or similar arcs as the normal gordo, just bouncing back and forth. Then you could do ridiculous setups with a lot of variety with your jump height and gordo type. You could probably get pretty reliable at hitting your opponent from behind.

 

[DrCoeloCephalo]

3122 could prove to be especially useful.

If everything in this is true https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8rpifNUEYo

Then that must mean that THIS actually works. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YeruB-sQnE

 

[W.A.C.]

3122 could prove to be especially useful.

If everything in this is true https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8rpifNUEYo

Then that must mean that THIS actually works. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YeruB-sQnE

I did that to a Little Mac player at a tournament. Fun times. lol

 

[DrCoeloCephalo]

I did that to a Little Mac player at a tournament. Fun times. lol

OOH! Did it get on stream or anything?

 

[W.A.C.]

No. Also, the player was terrible and it was his first tournament. lol