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Oasis Mafia - Over!

LaserGuy

Smash Ace
Joined
Apr 11, 2020
Messages
633
Location
In Quarantine
Quick question
LaserGuy LaserGuy : if you conclude in #132 that I'm scum who knew what you were doing, why do you not entertain the possibility that your reads on others is tainted by the simple fact that I would warn my buddies?
It is a possibility I had considered (likewise if BoomFrog is scum), though admittedly not in great detail. For example, I think it's fair to say that you and BoomFrog are almost certainly not going to be buddies with 3DS, and probably not with Z25. My reads are not solely based on how people interact with the gambit, but it's a helpful starting point.
 

Jackrito

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 14, 2020
Messages
809
Location
Ottawa
I mean there are 3 reasons
1. Final Fantasy 7
2. 40 hour work week
3. I was in another more fast paced game that was taken up slot of my time

The 3rd isn't a problem anymore
Yeah I'm having the same first 2 issues well apart from yesterday
 

Wiisp

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 4, 2020
Messages
1,783
Also I think even in light of our discussions about the importance of day 1, I'm no where near making it harder to read me as town as some other players choose to play on day 1

Anything you want me to answer I will happily do so, when I can
 

Wiisp

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 4, 2020
Messages
1,783
Personally right now, I am against Ranmaru/Jack/pythag lynched

Pythag doesn't give me any bad vibes

I might be able to get there on UP, but he's still in that spot where I don't think he's done anything that couldn't be done as either alignment
 

Wiisp

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 4, 2020
Messages
1,783
ranmaru ranmaru
The only thing I am truly worried about right now, is Ninja's alignment

If he is in fact weak town, I would like to not Lynch him today if we can find someone else wolfier, which is why I want people to focus on something that isn't him
 

Sabrar

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 13, 2020
Messages
931
IIRC I played two games with George, in one he was town and I was scum, the other it was reversed. His play reminds me very much of his townie play, I see the same level of aggression and confidence in him as in Crossover. Also Xivii's description of his scum-play in Stellaris was spot-on and there is none of that here. He is giving opinions, pushing people and has good progression. I'm eager to see his reads.
I got a townie vibe from him before all the weirdness happened. I think in the end he managed to explain himself although it took a long time. I was considering Jester at some point but then remembered to reread the rules. I just don't see anyone coaching him. I understand Jackrito's stance in #174 but this is just so weird that I can't see them as scum. However it would be really helpful if they could drop the attitude and actually try to post reads.
The self-consciousness in #13 feels weird. The vote on me is based on some pretty false reasoning and I don't think UP ever reacted to my reply in #215. I've already talked a lot about his confidence in #73 that he later toned down. #94 is actually the reserved reply to LG's gambit that could be the result of being coached. And he's even contradicting himself, see "Laser is null. There is no way to scumread Laser as of right now." vs "I'm reading them just slightly more scummy than null", followed up by "I don't see it as anything to hard push right now" which is an obvious sign that he knows what's going on. You can later see this in #157 as well. #182 is a clear scum-play, asking for directions from town.

My vote is still in the right place. Rest later.
 

Jackrito

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 14, 2020
Messages
809
Location
Ottawa
It is a possibility I had considered (likewise if BoomFrog is scum), though admittedly not in great detail. For example, I think it's fair to say that you and BoomFrog are almost certainly not going to be buddies with 3DS, and probably not with Z25. My reads are not solely based on how people interact with the gambit, but it's a helpful starting point.
I expected you to push me more sInce I came off the worst in your gambit if I remember your first real post right . If it was so important why have you left me largely alone.
 

Xivii

caterpillar feet
Joined
Jul 20, 2008
Messages
12,903
Location
Kindgom of Science
NNID
HBC
Vote Count 1.6


Utopian (2) - Ninja, Sabrar [L-4]


Maven (2) - pythag , Boom


Ninja (1) - Ran


Sabrar (1) - Laser


pythag (1) - Jack


Boom (1) - Utopian


Not Voting (3)
Maven, Z25, Wisp

P1
Sabrar #Laser
Ninja #UP
pythag #Maven
Ran #Jack
Laser #Ran
UP #Jack
UP #Unv
UP #Sabrar
Z25 #pythag
Boom #Sabrar
Laser #Wiisp
Ran #Ninja

P2
Jack #Laser
Boom #Unv
Boom #Jack
Ran #Laser

P3-P4*
Z25 #Unv

P4-P5*
Laser #Sabrar
Ran #Unv
Ran #Ninja
Sabrar #Unv
Sabrar #UP
Jack #Unv
UP #Unv
UP #Ninja

P5-P7*
Jack #pythag
Boom #Unv
Boom #Maven
Wiisp #Ninja

P7-P9*
Wiisp #Unv
UP #Unv
UP #Boom

Notes
None

Players and Events
Link

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to execute!

Deadline: Monday, April 20, 2:00pm EDT
 
Last edited:

BoomFrog

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 23, 2020
Messages
1,493
##Unvote
##BoomFrog


Hm, let’s try this. No reasoning atm is intentional.
Out of that though, I’d look at Maven or Bokm Frog. Part of it is my gut, but also because I feel like one of the two with a very low profile is scum trying to skate by early day one because if the long deadline.
I've been bodyslammed by work and personal life, but really want to play some mafia again after taking so much time off. My content level is going to be the same regardless of alignment. I wouldn't lie about RL issues regardless of alignment (on xkcd forum RL explanations were sacred). I like to read everything only when I have time to reply so I don't lose track of my thoughts.

More post to come, but I need to help my daughter with something...
 

ranmaru

Smash Legend
Joined
Feb 10, 2008
Messages
13,297
Switch FC
SW-0654 7794 0698
Still waiting on UP and Sabrar to respond to my questions to them.
 

Sabrar

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 13, 2020
Messages
931
I like #31, #89 and #109. Seems to be giving Maven a pass in #230. Previous history? Not liking #255 even if it was a joke. Very little actual content so far despite the number of posts but I think that's understandable from #19 and #159. Very slight town-lean.
Overall I like how they handled the chat-outing but one thing troubles me: #99 "If I’m being honest I would have supported the Laser lynch" vs #101 "And a scum in the neighborhood is something I didn’t consider." Was LG's emoting so annoying that you would willingly lynch a townie? Why? I know that you touched upon this in #110 but could you elaborate? Next topic, why is UP missing from your read-list in #120? I like their thought process in #233 and #249. I think overall they have less content than preferable but I'm getting good vibes, so pending satisfactory answers to the above I'm going with a town-lean.

Going back to #132 I'm not surprised that I disagree with LG about a few slots but his interpretation of UP's #94 baffles me. I'm moving LG down a notch.
Going back to #173 I'm actually surprised that BF's reads mostly align with mine and even where we differ I can see his point. I thought I had the whole scum-team figured out like in Texas but I'm having second thoughts. Still, let's go with the following:

Town
Ranmaru
3DSNinja
Z25
Pythag
Wiisp
LaserGuy
neutral
Maven
BoomFrog
Jackrito
UtopianPoyzin
Scum
 

Sabrar

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 13, 2020
Messages
931
Sabrar, since I have you here. All I want to ask you is why you have been less hyper active than usual. Overall I have no problems with you. I'm mostly curious about this. An explanation for your play would be much appreciated here as well.
Nowadays I find more stuff to do irl and get tired of arguing more easily. Mafia is still my favorite game of all time but I prefer fast games like in Throne of Lies where I don't have to reread a dozen pages two or three times.
 

BoomFrog

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 23, 2020
Messages
1,493
What immediately strikes me as weird that he calls me reserved and wants to wait for more of my content while not providing much of his own.
Up until that post I would also discribe my content as reserved, it's not hypocritical to point out that you too were reserved. Why is that weird? I left you on the townie side of neutral, do you think you deserved higher?

And now that I have reviewed Jackrito I still don't get it. Please explain what you like in his later content, how it moved the game forward. Please don't focus on his interaction with Ninja for reasons given.
My read of Jackrito was lazy scum. The much more proactive play didn't fit that read. I'll felt that I'd have to reread them to decide again what their alignment is because their style changed a lot while I was composing #173. Without reread I think I still have them leaning scum, but I wasn't going to get more reaction (or lack thereof) out of my vote.
 

Sabrar

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 13, 2020
Messages
931
it's not hypocritical to point out that you too were reserved.
But it's somewhat hypocritical not to acknowledge your own reservedness before you call someone out. IMO.
I left you on the townie side of neutral, do you think you deserved higher?
No, I don't expect you to read me properly early D1.

My read of Jackrito was lazy scum. The much more proactive play didn't fit that read. I'll felt that I'd have to reread them to decide again what their alignment is because their style changed a lot while I was composing #173. Without reread I think I still have them leaning scum, but I wasn't going to get more reaction (or lack thereof) out of my vote.
Okay, I can accept that.
 

Wiisp

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 4, 2020
Messages
1,783
I have no idea who Maven is
I wanted to tell at him, but that probably wouldn't have done anything, based on what I could infer about his personality
 

Pythag

BRoomer
BRoomer
Joined
May 7, 2007
Messages
2,627
Location
Flux
Pythag is close to being a town lean right now. I read him as town previously when he played and contributed like how he is now, but he was scum. However the odds of scum Pythag twice is unlikely so he’s sitting right there atm.
This is a really flimsy way of reading me as town.
"Pythag's posts look like they do when he was scum, but odds are he's town."

I don't see any town tells from 3DS here. I see no attempt to progress town's win condition, only appeal to emotion. Nothing he has done has changed why I was on him in the first place, in that he hasn't been interested in solving. He's also shown he's a liability and a question mark if he isn't lynched today. (That will eventually have to be lynched pre-lylo)
I can't disagree with any of this.
no, but what's hanlans razor? Dude reads a clearly new player, who every time I think he's hit bottom, someone throws him a shovel.


I'm going with him being caught newb scum from the very beginning. I'll take some time to formulate reads so I'll let the thread breathe.
how would a noob townie screw up look different?

\
Overall I like how they handled the chat-outing but one thing troubles me: #99 "If I’m being honest I would have supported the Laser lynch" vs #101 "And a scum in the neighborhood is something I didn’t consider." Was LG's emoting so annoying that you would willingly lynch a townie? Why? I know that you touched upon this in #110 but could you elaborate? Next topic, why is UP missing from your read-list in #120? I like their thought process in #233 and #249. I think overall they have less content than preferable but I'm getting good vibes, so pending satisfactory answers to the above I'm going with a town-lean.

Going back to #132 I'm not surprised that I disagree with LG about a few slots but his interpretation of UP's #94 baffles me. I'm moving LG down a notch.
Going back to #173 I'm actually surprised that BF's reads mostly align with mine and even where we differ I can see his point. I thought I had the whole scum-team figured out like in Texas but I'm having second thoughts. Still, let's go with the following:

Town
Ranmaru
3DSNinja
Z25
Pythag
Wiisp
LaserGuy
neutral
Maven
BoomFrog
Jackrito
UtopianPoyzin
Scum[/QUOTE]

So there are no scum in the neighborhood?

3ds, laser and yourself are all in the town leans.

Z25 has also been going out of his way to help 3DS a lot. It's nice! It is, but it also can be a gambit to appear townie.
Currently if there's scum in the neighborhood, I'm contemplating z25 over the others.

Also, if 3DS is scum, I really would've expected him to have already messaged the neighborhood accidentally thinking they were his scum team.
 

Pythag

BRoomer
BRoomer
Joined
May 7, 2007
Messages
2,627
Location
Flux
oh gosh, my quote got messed up. I can't remember who said the last thing I quoted
 

Pythag

BRoomer
BRoomer
Joined
May 7, 2007
Messages
2,627
Location
Flux
got it. It was Sab

I like #31, #89 and #109. Seems to be giving Maven a pass in #230. Previous history? Not liking #255 even if it was a joke. Very little actual content so far despite the number of posts but I think that's understandable from #19 and #159. Very slight town-lean.
Overall I like how they handled the chat-outing but one thing troubles me: #99 "If I’m being honest I would have supported the Laser lynch" vs #101 "And a scum in the neighborhood is something I didn’t consider." Was LG's emoting so annoying that you would willingly lynch a townie? Why? I know that you touched upon this in #110 but could you elaborate? Next topic, why is UP missing from your read-list in #120? I like their thought process in #233 and #249. I think overall they have less content than preferable but I'm getting good vibes, so pending satisfactory answers to the above I'm going with a town-lean.

Going back to #132 I'm not surprised that I disagree with LG about a few slots but his interpretation of UP's #94 baffles me. I'm moving LG down a notch.
Going back to #173 I'm actually surprised that BF's reads mostly align with mine and even where we differ I can see his point. I thought I had the whole scum-team figured out like in Texas but I'm having second thoughts. Still, let's go with the following:

Town
Ranmaru
3DSNinja
Z25
Pythag
Wiisp
LaserGuy
neutral
Maven
BoomFrog
Jackrito
UtopianPoyzin
Scum
So you think there are no scum in the neighborhood?
 

Jackrito

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 14, 2020
Messages
809
Location
Ottawa
Why? Don't you find it beneficial? Don't you find it disrespectful of the other players? Why do you even bother reeding your role-pm?
Mainly because most game rules are the same unless the game is more gimmick based. I also did not expect they to be confirmation of day talk in said rules. Also the rules and a role PM are very different for multiple reasons
 

BoomFrog

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 23, 2020
Messages
1,493
Wiisp Wiisp I was callin him potential scum because he hadn't actually done anything besides speak in emojis.
When he stopped and actually gave an analysis, he immediately became a lot less suspicious.

And I've never played with Neighbor, so I assumed you couldn't have any other role with Neighbor. Which of course, apparently isn't the case.
I think I believe Ninja. We know for a fact that Ninja messed up. As town or scum he made a mistake. So the question is which reality makes the most sense.

Weird things Ninja has done:
1) Claim neighbor with little benefit and without consulting neighbors if it was okay.
2) Thought Wiisp was in the neighbor chat.
3) Claimed only one PM then changed later to say there were two.

Town-Ninja
1) Thought that LaserGuy was confirmed town. Saw that LG was getting pressured and needed help. Checked that role-claiming was legal, was told you should only do it with a definitive result, then claimed. It's reckless to not check with the neighbors first, but we know 3DS is, if nothing else, not a careful person.
2) Confused Xiivi and Wiisp in chat, which means he wasn't paying very much attention. That fits with the idea that he thought they were confirmed town.
3) Lastly, forgot about his second role PM and didn't bother to double check before confirming it. This is also a pretty big screwup, especially since it was obviously a big deal and he had time to check it, but again, we know Ninja isn't careful.

Scum-Ninja
1) Thought that neighbor would be taken as a guaranteed town and wanted to get it out there? He'd know this was false, and I don't think 3DS is on the level where he could fake a mistake like that.
2) The Wiisp error could be that he's mafia with Wiisp, and wiisp not noticing that is pretty weird. Also Wiisp did go for 3DS pretty hard right after that slip so a bussing scummate fits.
3) 2nd role PM leans heavily to scum. If he thought that his mafia PM was a secret he'd claim only 1 PM, and then later his partner would inform him in Day chat that it should have been 2 PMs. This fit's far too well.

Alright. 1 doesn't make any sense from scum perspective, 2 is pretty neutral and 3 is more likely from scum. Still #1 really doesn't make sense from scum perspective. I don't think we are doomed to lynch 3DS necessarily. There's LOTS of opportunity for things to happen in later days and I've seen what look like hopeless cases end up confirmed town. I'm going to look for scum elsewhere today unless someone can come up with a believable logic for scum ninja to claim neighbor.
 

Z25

Pokemon Illusionist
Joined
Jan 6, 2014
Messages
28,667
Location
Mushroom Kingdom
NNID
Zoroarkrules571
3DS FC
0533-5240-0946
I like #31, #89 and #109. Seems to be giving Maven a pass in #230. Previous history? Not liking #255 even if it was a joke. Very little actual content so far despite the number of posts but I think that's understandable from #19 and #159. Very slight town-lean.
Overall I like how they handled the chat-outing but one thing troubles me: #99 "If I’m being honest I would have supported the Laser lynch" vs #101 "And a scum in the neighborhood is something I didn’t consider." Was LG's emoting so annoying that you would willingly lynch a townie? Why? I know that you touched upon this in #110 but could you elaborate? Next topic, why is UP missing from your read-list in #120? I like their thought process in #233 and #249. I think overall they have less content than preferable but I'm getting good vibes, so pending satisfactory answers to the above I'm going with a town-lean.

Going back to #132 I'm not surprised that I disagree with LG about a few slots but his interpretation of UP's #94 baffles me. I'm moving LG down a notch.
Going back to #173 I'm actually surprised that BF's reads mostly align with mine and even where we differ I can see his point. I thought I had the whole scum-team figured out like in Texas but I'm having second thoughts. Still, let's go with the following:

Town
Ranmaru
3DSNinja
Z25
Pythag
Wiisp
LaserGuy
neutral
Maven
BoomFrog
Jackrito
UtopianPoyzin
Scum
My problem with laser at the time, wasn’t the emojis but the fake they clearly didn’t have any conditions limiting their posts so they at the very least could have responded to me in the neighborhood chat when I asked or the thread.

I get why they did it now, even though I don’t agree with that mindset that if someone were to flip at that play style then they must be scum. Imo town and scum would both be annoyed with behavior like that.

I’m a little better on the slot now but I still can’t shake the potential of there being scum intent behind that posting and laser just had a good back up plan to make the strat seem better to town.

It reminds me of when in Star Wars Mafia in here, when Nabe was god father and pretended to have a silencer gimmick, except for the fact he just posted random pictures instead of speaking. Which isn’t how that role works, and after day one he completely dropped. Because people were annoyed by it. He didn’t even give a valid excuse as to why he could speak when he claimed silencer. And everyone gave him the pass the entire game except me but that ultimately didn’t matter.

So scum do try strategies like this which is why I’m not going to totally count laser out as guy even if their posts are getting better.

Also I hadn’t noticed UP was missing. I thought I had everyone down but I guess not.

At the time I would have put him in Null. Right now I don’t have big issues with his content but he is a slot I want to re evaluate the posts of as the day goes on.
 

Z25

Pokemon Illusionist
Joined
Jan 6, 2014
Messages
28,667
Location
Mushroom Kingdom
NNID
Zoroarkrules571
3DS FC
0533-5240-0946
I think I believe Ninja. We know for a fact that Ninja messed up. As town or scum he made a mistake. So the question is which reality makes the most sense.

Weird things Ninja has done:
1) Claim neighbor with little benefit and without consulting neighbors if it was okay.
2) Thought Wiisp was in the neighbor chat.
3) Claimed only one PM then changed later to say there were two.

Town-Ninja
1) Thought that LaserGuy was confirmed town. Saw that LG was getting pressured and needed help. Checked that role-claiming was legal, was told you should only do it with a definitive result, then claimed. It's reckless to not check with the neighbors first, but we know 3DS is, if nothing else, not a careful person.
2) Confused Xiivi and Wiisp in chat, which means he wasn't paying very much attention. That fits with the idea that he thought they were confirmed town.
3) Lastly, forgot about his second role PM and didn't bother to double check before confirming it. This is also a pretty big screwup, especially since it was obviously a big deal and he had time to check it, but again, we know Ninja isn't careful.

Scum-Ninja
1) Thought that neighbor would be taken as a guaranteed town and wanted to get it out there? He'd know this was false, and I don't think 3DS is on the level where he could fake a mistake like that.
2) The Wiisp error could be that he's mafia with Wiisp, and wiisp not noticing that is pretty weird. Also Wiisp did go for 3DS pretty hard right after that slip so a bussing scummate fits.
3) 2nd role PM leans heavily to scum. If he thought that his mafia PM was a secret he'd claim only 1 PM, and then later his partner would inform him in Day chat that it should have been 2 PMs. This fit's far too well.

Alright. 1 doesn't make any sense from scum perspective, 2 is pretty neutral and 3 is more likely from scum. Still #1 really doesn't make sense from scum perspective. I don't think we are doomed to lynch 3DS necessarily. There's LOTS of opportunity for things to happen in later days and I've seen what look like hopeless cases end up confirmed town. I'm going to look for scum elsewhere today unless someone can come up with a believable logic for scum ninja to claim neighbor.
I actually think one could lean more into scum territory then you realize.

Who says scum 3ds in this scenario didn’t know that it wasn’t a full clear?

He could have attempted saving laser to look better to town and may have bet on the players here not knowing the neighborhood in full. After all pretty sure this is the first time a game here ever used that role, at least since the section got revived.

This could also have been a distancing tactic if 3ds is scum. If you look at the last game( Ran’s flavorless mafia) Scum pokechu claimed Role Cop and on top of that at a Role cop that gives alignment as well.

Scum Chu knew this was a role usually given to scum but still claimed it as a gamble and to help distance themself from their teammate. While that was because town was close to losing, it is possible that scum 3ds wanted to try a similar strategy by distancing themselves while also attempting to look town by helping a townie out in laser.

The other two slips would make this action a little weird, but those could be genuine mistakes.

3ds mentioned reading past games here because he knew Up was “always scum”. So it’s possible they could be trying to make a play similar to scum from other games here, although how likely that is, is up for debate. But it was something I was thinking on while trying to make sense of things
 

BoomFrog

Smash Lord
Joined
Mar 23, 2020
Messages
1,493
Who says scum 3ds in this scenario didn’t know that it wasn’t a full clear?
He'd know it's not a full clear because he is scum and a neighbor. Only town-3DS could think neighbor was a full clear.
 

Jackrito

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 14, 2020
Messages
809
Location
Ottawa
Ok now I'm home my current readlist is

Ranmaru
Sabrar

Z25
UP
3DSN
Maven
Wiisp
Pythag

Laserguy
Boomfrog




Ranmaru really does not need much of a reason he tries to move the game foward the most and is doing the most scum hunting


I have done a bit of a u turn on Sabar their recent stuff is really good and feels more like actual scum hunting before I felt they were being a bit too passive and calculating taking care with their actions.

Z25 I have as town because his play this game feels very different from my only game with him when he was scum. I like his thoughts and how he is thinking about things.

I have UP higher then most since I see town intent from him at times I'm slightly annoyed with how his main contribution is going for Ninja though and now on Boomfrog for whatever reason he just seems a bit random. I want a more overview from him on the players and why not just the lists.


Ninja should really be lower tbh if just based off how bad they are but that slot is a damn enigma and part of me just thinks a scum would not be this bad still.

Wisp is down there because I'm sick of giving him chances.

Pythag still bothers me for reasons given before. They is possible town there and I'm being harsh as hell, but going with my gut on this one for now. This is the one that has the highest chance of changeing the most

Maven is just null to slight scum because just pure lack of content.


When I first did this list I had laserguy as a low higher, then I reread the game though and realized that he only had the one really good post and that changed my view of them and many others I think. That post was good and gave a nice overview of the game and players. My issue is though what has he done with the info he got off that reaction nothing. He says me Wisp and Sabrar look bad from it but made no attempt to push any of us or real attempt to do much else. The only thing is ask question which I'm partly scum reading Pythag for.



Boomfrog just feels lacking to a degree which is why he is so low, His U turn on me was weird and now Sabrar is making a case on me he is looking ready to jump on it just feels like scum trying to take adv of a situation. I need more thoughts from this slot on others players to be sure though
 

ranmaru

Smash Legend
Joined
Feb 10, 2008
Messages
13,297
Switch FC
SW-0654 7794 0698
I do agree that UP seems random with that switch. Just need his response to my question so I can finish my reads. (As it is important to sort him)
 

Jackrito

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 14, 2020
Messages
809
Location
Ottawa
Did I finally get to see a wolf!Jack game?
Lol
How do you not expect me to have you as slight red with your play here. I like you and respect you but I'm not beyond biased. Others have done way better then you. So change my mind
 
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