Oasis Mafia - Over!

[Xivii]

Vote Count 1.10.1


Ninja (3) - Laser, Ran, Jack, [L-3]


Utopian (2) - Sabrar, Boom


Sabrar (1) - Utopian


Maven (1) - pythag


Ran (1) - Ninja


Boom (1) - Wisp


Not Voting (2)
Maven, Z25​

Spoiler: History

P1
Sabrar #Laser
Ninja #UP
pythag #Maven
Ran #Jack
Laser #Ran
UP #Jack
UP #Unv
UP #Sabrar
Z25 #pythag
Boom #Sabrar
Laser #Wiisp
Ran #Ninja

P2
Jack #Laser
Boom #Unv
Boom #Jack
Ran #Laser

P3-P4*
Z25 #Unv

P4-P5*
Laser #Sabrar
Ran #Unv
Ran #Ninja
Sabrar #Unv
Sabrar #UP
Jack #Unv
UP #Unv
UP #Ninja

P5-P7*
Jack #pythag
Boom #Unv
Boom #Maven
Wiisp #Ninja

P7-P9*
Wiisp #Unv
UP #Unv
UP #Boom

P10
Jack #Laser

P12
UP #Unv
UP #Sabrar
Boom #Unv
Boom #UP

P13-15*
Laser #Unv
Laser #Ninja
Ninja #Unv
Ninja #Ran
Ran #Unv
Ran #Ninja

P15-P18*
Jack #Ninja
Wisp #Ninja
Wiisp #Boom

Notes
New episodes of Hi Score Girl!

Players and Events
Link

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to execute!

Deadline: Monday, April 20, 2:00pm EDT

 

[ranmaru]

I'm up now. Sabrar, what's your bottom four at the moment?

 

[Wiisp]

Maven89
ZDS
Why are neither of you voting

 

[ranmaru]

I wouldn't bother trying to find a meta to Jack
stick to the current game and leave it at that.

Wisp, I'm curious why you state this but then meta jack to give him a Day 1 pass. What's your stance on Jack with reasoning?

 

[Wiisp]

Later, I just woke up and I start work soon
I don't really think telling others to not read of meta and choosing to not evaluate him day 1 is that big of a deal

I think he's done enough, like many others
If there are deep wolves already, we are surely not going to find them yet given the PoE we have that looks quite mediocre

 

[Wiisp]

It doesn't take much for the average wolf to look townie enough to avoid a Lynch on day 1

Like I think sorcerer's wolf Lynch only happened because UP was lost and not because he was explicitly wolfy

 

[Sabrar]

I'm up now. Sabrar, what's your bottom four at the moment?

UP and Maven are given, the other 2 would come from [BF; Jack; Ninja]. But I haven't reevaluated Jack since my last read and Ninja is only there because we need to resolve the slot at some point.

 

[ranmaru]

I'm reading your case and Boom's case on UP now.

 

[ranmaru]

1. UP insisting the list doens't matter because it's been updated.

I think UP has history of avoiding to answer a question because of a genuine mistake. I think the answer regardless of alignment would look bad for him, which is why he can't and won't answer. I don't think he believes in folding, as he probably feels it is a sign of weakness.

I'll give examples from his previous game:

#62 UP voting himself in jest, clearly to show that he is comfortable being chaotic as town.
#63 UP repeating the same line that got him lynched in sorcerers, as an early game joke.


#102 Kary asking UP where Zest stated he came from MS
#104 UP quoting the post where Zest asked if there was a similar meta to MS
#106 UP Bringing up Zest's mafia scum wiki to prove that he comes from MS

So, UP as a character, may state things that are not exactly fact, and gets pushed to cite the evidence, but can't, and then goes over board to try to prove what isn't there. Basically, he states that Zest 'stated' he came from MS but that was never the case, it's a fact he didn't directly state that. (Essentially it was becoming semantics) Then he goes ahead and links the wiki, which makes UP's statement moot. If you did state he came from MS, there would be no reason for UP needing to cite his mafia scum wiki. Yet he was town here.

--

2. UP Insisting your Laser post was serious on page one

I don't think UP knows what exactly is good to look for when scum hunting. He seems to attack with the 'chip on the shoulder' strategy. Basically, omgus, or any illogical reason. He also seems to be blind to scum if he likes them enough, Pokechu is a perfect example of this in Flavorless Mafia III.

Why did you go out of your way to fetch games for pokechu when they could have done that themselves? On top of immediately defending my vote on them.

because I knew where to find it and I figured that Pokechu may not immediately be able to get it for you, so I was trying to quench your appetite in his name.

Hmmm

This wasn’t even answered but yet again you cling to pokechu and proceed to even provide a game they were in when you weren’t asked. And then immediately defending them despite no interactions between the two of you really. This is a very odd occurrence. I’d love to hear your thought process here

Because Pokechu is pleasant to play with, and we've been engaged since Etrian Ricochet Odyssey (I can't believe it's already been a year)

Pokechu's play is consistent with their typical town play. The quantity of quality posts is respectable, especially recently. Scum!Pokechu is a chronic lurker iirc, and is much more passive. Pokechu is acting proactively rather than reactively, and posts look genuine.

 

[ranmaru]

So, in conclusion:

I find UP's tone here, to be that of a townie tone, compared to sorcerer's, which seemed more like he had an agenda before hand, rather than always adapting on the fly. Which is what it seems like here. I've found his tone here to be genuine. I don't think UP's asset is logic, and I think his behavior, makes sense with context from his previous games.

The only things right now that can give me doubt on him, is his actions lately, and his confidence on Ninja, and then not pushing it as much, to then trusting him. UP is not someone I'm confident has a high chance of flipping scum.

 

[ranmaru]

This means I'll be bumping up to slight town below laser. I am also re-reading to re-evaluate who would take his spot in my bottom four.

 

[Sabrar]

Which is what it seems like here. I've found his tone here to be genuine. I don't think UP's asset is logic, and I think his behavior, makes sense with context from his previous games.

I can accept that as a possible explanation but then why didn't you thought of this when you prepared your read in #401?

Sabrar mentions a good point of him being over confident with the neighborhood and lessening over time, which is the only thing from having full trust in UP. It shows he's ashamed of being confident in that fact.

This seems to me a very similar thing that you descirbe above.

 

[ranmaru]

It is because I did think of it, but deleted it. I was originally thinking your confidence point didn't apply to UP, but since I am so confident in Ninja, it clicked to me that UP may seriously be connected to Ninja. But after weighing your case over, and reading his meta, this is my conclusion.

 

[ranmaru]

I also considered it was possible he was scum here since in sorcerers, he was acting alone as a traitor. Here he would have the support of scum mates. Yet overall, I think this lines up more with his town game than scum game.

 

[ranmaru]

ranmaru
what do you think of Laser?

are you talking about his rvs vote?

Wolves probably don't really play like how Ninja is playing, it's certainly possible, but it's not doing him any justice

Idk if he thinks it's cute or coy

##vote Boomfrog
because I think his vote on UP was weird
and just straight up OMGUS
I also want another train that isn't in UP, or Ninja

Right now these quotes are what ping me. Wisp, for a great part of the day, hasn't been voting. The laser question also seems odd and he never followed up with that. I asked him about it and he dodged the question in his #87. His question to me about Ninja seems to intentionally ask me about something he knows the answer to, as he shouldn't have missed pythag's #30. Wisp has been flip flopping his stance on Ninja, and I feel his vote on Boom doesn't actually do anything. I also feel he is giving Jack the benefit of the doubt when there is no in-game thread reason to do so. It goes against what he said in the beginning. (Telling people to not meta jack) Slight scum.

 

[ranmaru]

TOWN [Sabrar >Pythag > Z25 > Boomfrog > Lase > UP | Maven > Wisp > Jackrito > 3DSNinja] SCUM

 

[ranmaru]

Bottom Four: [Ninja > Jack > Wisp > Maven]

 

[ranmaru]

I'm confident that there lies three scum within my bottom four now.

 

[Wiisp]

I'm not dodging anything, outside making a read list which I hate doing regardless of my alignment unless I'm feeling it

My vote may not be doing anything but it's where I want to be if we aren't going to end the day early, else I will happily hammer the likes of ninja to progress this game

Evaluating Ninja has been hard, a flip flop is quite reasonable because I am uninformed and that slot is a disaster

I'm just not touching Jack, I think the fact that he re-evaluates Ninja means they are either both wolves, or Jack is probably just town anyways

 

[Wiisp]

Maven can certainly be a wolf here he's definitely in my PoE but not someone explicitly wolfy outside doing absolutely jack ****, so not someone I am interest in lynching over Ninja, or Boom whose reaction to UP doesn't feel real

 

[ranmaru]

You dodged my laser question. Why did you ask me for my opinion of Laser in early game?

You aren't touching Jack but you don't seem to be making an effort to sort him.

 

[Wiisp]

This day phase is 7 days, but I don't think we need to wait any longer, people should just vote Ninja, so we can get on with this game, or actually make another train

 

[Wiisp]

You dodged my laser question. Why did you ask me for my opinion of Laser in early game?

You aren't touching Jack but you don't seem to be making an effort to sort him.

I have no idea, why I asked you that specific question at the beginning of the game, I can definitely check when I get a chance
.but no promises on a decent answer

 

[ranmaru]

ranmaru How can you take this level of confusion? The dude really has no idea what is going on. I know you literally faked extra confusion in your first game as scum, but most people aren't that competent. Like, this could be fake, it's not impossible, but odds are 3DS is a bad lynch.

And, please don't lower your opinion of me for not doing something. I have limited time and choose how I spend it. So if you feel I made a post that wasn't worthwhile that's a ligit criticism, but don't lower my scum rank because I didn't update a read, unless you have a different post you think I shouldn't have made. You don't judge Maven for low participation, just for how he participates, please extend me the same consideration.

I wasn't competent, I literally didn't know much about the game. All I knew was 'I'm the bad guy' and tapped into that. Don't let his 'claim' of the neighborhood 'clear' him in your mind. You are ignoring his play because of it. I didn't lower my read on you, I just noted that was interesting to me. Alright, you're busy, that's understandable. I'm curious how you feel about my conclusion on UP, and I would like for you to give an updated reads list before the day is done, can you do that? I am making it a point to have you be clear about your reads list as I know you are very competent, I want to make sure I leave no stone unturned with you.

 

[ranmaru]

You believe that he isn't being coached. You can't verify whether or not that is the case. What you can do, is evaluate his play. I have done that. He is the best lynch, that will lead to a scum flip, and open up the game to give town a victory.

 

[Jackrito]

Jackrito :
What are you current reads on me and BoomFrog?

You both are still in my bottom 4 but I plan to review you both in full at some point today.

 

[Jackrito]

regards of his alignment, his survival hurts town.
if he’s scum, he gets away and who knows if we even get back to lynching him.

If he’s town, then he is really inexperienced here and thus a liability. Scum could manipulate that and if he’s alive in late game he make it very difficult for town to believe him with everything that’s happened, and could easily be pushed into a mis lynch late game which would hurt town a lot.

This is pretty much where I am at with Ninja at the moment as well.

 

[Jackrito]

Later, I just woke up and I start work soon
I don't really think telling others to not read of meta and choosing to not evaluate him day 1 is that big of a deal

I think he's done enough, like many others
If there are deep wolves already, we are surely not going to find them yet given the PoE we have that looks quite mediocre

I feel that I know the main reason you want to keep me around past day one even if part of you thinks I'm scum. So interested to see if you ever say it this game or not.

 

[ranmaru]

Jackrito, do you get the feeling Wisp is sorting you?

 

[Jackrito]

Jackrito, do you get the feeling Wisp is sorting you?

Not at all which concerns me to a degree ,but in my exp with him he never really does apart from call me town early. He likes to keep me alive long term for multiple reasons and me the same with him. My play is a bit different this game which could be throwing him off, I'm more intrested to see his readlist because that way I can see where his head is at overall.

My exp with his scum game is pretty small compared to his town but he is a lot more busy lately and doing different things because of recent game issues which is making any read on him harder for me as well. The only thing I know is if scum is that he hates to bus even when he should.

 

[ranmaru]

In your reads post, why do you only have one line for Wisp? It seems like the lack of sorting is a concern, why not address that there too? Finally, what's your opinion of his vote on Boom?

 

[Jackrito]

In your reads post, why do you only have one line for Wisp? It seems like the lack of sorting is a concern, why not address that there too? Finally, what's your opinion of his vote on Boom?

Its a concern but like I said semi expected and I don't feel he has fully invested yet so not really focusing on him until he does. I feel his vote on Boom is fine for the reasons he gave on OMGUS and wanting another wagon he does that type of thing a lot. Possible this is scum him trying to get attention off ninja but with his no busssing policy which maybe he changed I don't think he votes Ninja in the first place. I feel Ninja is a special case though

 

[3DSNinja]

Bottom Four: [Ninja > Jack > Wisp > Maven]

this bottom 4 is ridiculous.
FIrst, me, which is reasonable. I do think I've shown myself to be more townie then wolf, but whatever.
Jack? He hasn't done anything suspicious?
Wiisp, which you say cause he reconsidered me being scum? That's a really dumb reason for him to be scum, as well, scum would want to join an existing bandwagon to get a town out of there, so why would he vote BoomFrog and not me or UP?
Maven, which just confuses me, as he's been a bit inactive, which ISN'T the sign of a mafia. Mafia are always active in the voting discussion, whereas Maven hasn't been terribly active, which makes him less suspicious IMO.
And you put those 3 down there, and yet you say Sabrar is a townie? I honestly am 90% certain you're scum at this point. Especially when you said you doubted UP because he changed his view on me.

also LaserGuy I only played on one forum.

 

[Sabrar]

Wiisp : in case I missed it, did you ever follow up #329 or my reaction in #337? What was the purpose of #329, what conclusions did you draw?

 

[3DSNinja]

Anyways, it's very dumb to base your list of who isn't scum on day 1 based off of their suspicions of one person.

 

[3DSNinja]

Furthermore, you not responding to any of Boom's posts as far as I can see is very suspicious, as a townie would consider all POV's before lynching someone,whereas you seem to just want to get it over with by lynching me, a very scummy thing to do. Z25 at least gave reasoning as to why I was a good lynch either way; you just assume I'm scum and don't consider any other perspective in saying that I'm scum. That's not the sign of an aggressive townie. That's the sign of a mafia trying to get rid of a townie.

I still want to think you're misguided, but that's become less and less likely by the post.

 

[Jackrito]

Anyways, it's very dumb to base your list of who isn't scum on day 1 based off of their suspicions of one person.

He's not doing that though he has went into great detail why he thinks I'm scum and the others have cause. They is a lot more to his reads then people's thoughts on you. The game does not only centre around you.

 

[Z25]

Maven89
ZDS
Why are neither of you voting

I’m voting for 3ds but I’m not about to put him at -3 for an easy hammer to end the day early by scum.

And the fact Zds is an actual user is hilarious

 

[Jackrito]

I’m voting for 3ds but I’m not about to put him at -3 for an easy hammer to end the day early by scum.

And the fact Zds is an actual user is hilarious

I know why Wisp is doing that and it is pretty funny I feel bad for him.

 

[ranmaru]

Z25 Pythag Talk to me a out my UP conclusion and my bottom four.