• Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!

    You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!

Noob Tier List

WT!

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 5, 2014
Messages
254
NNID
WT_Smash
3DS FC
4597-0015-7814
Switch FC
SW-3650-7945-8401
Many of us started out as noobs. By that I mean people who hadn't bothered to even read the instruction manual, may not even own the game and only know part of the controls. As for the controls...

The noob does not know how to spot dodge or air dodge, and rarely rolls or grabs. He NEVER SHIELDS. He blocks attacks with other attacks instead, and yet does not understand priority. He knows how to recover, but often gimps. He does not distinguish between his normals, he simply presses (or mashes) a in the direction of his foe when he wants to attack, spamming mostly a combination of jab, f-tilt and dash attack. He rarely uses air attacks, instead, he waits for his foe to come down. He doesn't attempt to edge guard, and when he does it is onstage. Noobs understand very little about the games mechanics. To camp, they spam their projectile button (usually b). Final smashes are on, and 3-4 player battles and free for alls are common. He uses moves that are usually considered bad options. He, of course, cannot DI and knows not of any advanced techniques. His reflexes are poor. He does not attempt follow ups. He always uses ledge attack and getup attack, never techs, overuses stall-then-falls and rapid jabs etc.

Smashes: noobs use smashes as bait. When their opponent is at a high percent (this is even more common if he too is at a high percent, but also usable from low-percent-neutral), he will stand at the far end of the stage and charge his smash attack with the greatest horizontal range. Now the other noob is not stupid. He doesn't exactly go through the same though processes that we do, but he knows that his opponent is charging a powerful attack. If he is hit, he will die or else get knocked to the point where he cannot recover, or at the very least take devastating damage. However, he knows that he can run in and interrupt the smash attack before his opponent can release the "a" button. However, with a well times release of "a", his opponent could send him flying. He also knows that the attack has [ending lag] that he can [punish]. He knows that the opponent cannot charge it forever and that he can instead rush in right when the charge time ends, and [punish] him when he is forced to release his attack. This is the mindset. Oh, and he doesn't use GC controller.

Noobs often get into close range ground exchanges, spammable moves are more effective, lock on projectiles are more effective, etc. I cannot lay out the entire noob mindset and meta, but anyway, I decided to make a tier list to show how effective certain characters would be in noob play. I'm not going to justify every one up front, so instead, I'd be happy to answer individual questions.

Top Tier

SS:
:snake::pit:

S:
:metaknight::kirby2::sheilda:

A+:
:pikachu2::sonic::ness2::ike:

A-:
:toonlink::zerosuitsamus::lucario:

High Tier

B::fox::falco::wolf:


Upper Mid Tier

C+
:marth::diddy::gw::link2:
C:

:lucas:

C-:
:pt::luigi2:


Mid Tier

D::peach::mario2::ganondorf::rob::samus2::bowser2::dk2:


Lower Mid Tier

E:
:dedede::falcon::wario::yoshi2:

Low Tier

F:
:popo::olimar::jigglypuff:
 
Last edited:

IceArrow

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 19, 2010
Messages
1,475
Location
Windfall Island
Interesting, I would put TL and Fox higher.

But the irony of this thread being under Brawl Competitive Discussion is funny.
 
Last edited:

ellord

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Apr 15, 2014
Messages
112
Location
Canada, Québec, Chicoutimi
I would set to lower rank :
-Sonic and Fox lower because they run and fall too fast for noob and this speed make them hard to control for noobs. Casuals know how to shield, they just never think to do it, so they will finish to catch up for the spam B of sonic, its easier to dodge than kirby's rock and deal less damages. A very beginner never shield and a casual shield and roll too much.
-Zero Suit Samus because she has no good smash to finish (most noob tend to finish with a smash and use barely tilt and occasionnaly air attack). I would even set her to mid tier.
I would set to higher rank.
-Wolf, his projectile and the ability to reflect other projectile give him a strong ability to camp for noob. His side smash, which is the move they will use the most with the gun has a long side range and very low starting delay compared to other character smash.

I think the rest is fine.
 
Last edited:

WT!

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 5, 2014
Messages
254
NNID
WT_Smash
3DS FC
4597-0015-7814
Switch FC
SW-3650-7945-8401
Hmm. I think I'll keep Fox where he is. Yes, more speed means harder to control, but it also means overwhelming approach speed. Sonic or Fox for instance, with just dash attack for instance, can be up an in an opponents face before they can do anything about it. Sonic's side b and down b are also quick approaches, and his homing attack is annoying. Noobs tend to get frustrated and mash buttons when they are annoyed. And the skill level I'm thinking of would never think to shield it. Plus Sonic has a very good recovery, which is very important for noob play. Fox has a spammy projectile, and just when the opponent reaches him through the bombardment of lasers, he can dash or side b to the other side of the stage. But his vertical recovery sucks so he can't be any higher. Wolf, well, he has no rapid jab (compared to other SF characters), his blaster is less effective in noob play (for reasons I won't go into right now) and his reflector is no more of an advantage. His fast smashes keep him where he is, but his minuscule recovery sweetspot and otherwise mediocre recovery keep him where he is. ZSS is very effective sine her ground game is good enough to compete with other top characters, her blaster is annoying and allows noobs to take follow ups that they other wise would never get a chance to do, her recovery is great, she has a stall then fall, her armor pieces, well, imagine this...

"3...2...1...GO!"
zssnoob: /spams "a"

Imagine how somewhat who never shields or dodges would do against that, not to mention how annoying it would be. Plus, noobs know how to kill with side b.

Toon link might might be made higher, except that his recovery (without the use of hookshot, which noobs don't know how to use) is not very good.
 

ellord

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Apr 15, 2014
Messages
112
Location
Canada, Québec, Chicoutimi
What about ness. If i compare him with lucas the 1st thing i think it's about his side B. But he has still a poor recovery and a poor range for a a+ noob tier.
 

WT!

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 5, 2014
Messages
254
NNID
WT_Smash
3DS FC
4597-0015-7814
Switch FC
SW-3650-7945-8401
The thing is, one thing noob Ness's do know how to do is recover. To the point where they miss a lot, but not every time. But his plethora of annoying projectiles is just too good anyway.
 

Phan7om

ドリームランドの悪夢
Joined
Jun 12, 2013
Messages
1,615
Location
???
Ike, TL, and Pika higher, Snake lower.
 
Last edited:

WT!

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 5, 2014
Messages
254
NNID
WT_Smash
3DS FC
4597-0015-7814
Switch FC
SW-3650-7945-8401
No way can Snake be any lower. His ground game is the best by far, which is huge when aerials are irrelevant. He has a lot of annoying projectiles, such as grenades which noobs might recklessly try to attack, nikitas which can lock on to the opponent and are hard for noobs to avoid and block, and mortars with can be used on airborne opponents. He is powerful, his recovery is amazing in noob play due to no edgehogging or real edgeguarding, and no grab releases. His priority is amiazing which is key when trying to block other attacks and in close-range ground exchanges. And, the 3 noob b&b moves, jab, ftilt, and dash attack are excellent.
 

-LzR-

Smash Hero
Joined
Jan 1, 2009
Messages
7,649
Location
Finland
Marth needs to be at least top 3. He is the definition of easymode in lower levels of play.
 

Phan7om

ドリームランドの悪夢
Joined
Jun 12, 2013
Messages
1,615
Location
???
No way can Snake be any lower. His ground game is the best by far, which is huge when aerials are irrelevant. He has a lot of annoying projectiles, such as grenades which noobs might recklessly try to attack, nikitas which can lock on to the opponent and are hard for noobs to avoid and block, and mortars with can be used on airborne opponents. He is powerful, his recovery is amazing in noob play due to no edgehogging or real edgeguarding, and no grab releases. His priority is amiazing which is key when trying to block other attacks and in close-range ground exchanges. And, the 3 noob b&b moves, jab, ftilt, and dash attack are excellent.
Ive been dealing with BB noobs for the longest time, trust me all that is great, but to noobs they're picking snake and spamming grenades and side-b into the stage. Its still good but its not that good. For noobs, Ike's fully charged fmsash will never miss and kills at like 30. Pika's thunder basically means no one can touch him. TL DJ D-air is basically untouchable.
 

WT!

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 5, 2014
Messages
254
NNID
WT_Smash
3DS FC
4597-0015-7814
Switch FC
SW-3650-7945-8401
Pikachu and Toon link moved up
 

RunawayPanda

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jul 16, 2014
Messages
102
Location
California
NNID
NiftySSB
This list is pretty amazing
I love how meta knight is still a character that we think is insane before we even know anything about the competitive scene
Down B for kirby is good... lol
 

Taco Emperor

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jul 20, 2014
Messages
9
Many of us started out as noobs. By that I mean people who hadn't bothered to even read the instruction manual, may not even own the game and only know part of the controls. As for the controls...

The noob does not know how to spot dodge or air dodge, and rarely rolls or grabs. He NEVER SHIELDS. He blocks attacks with other attacks instead, and yet does not understand priority. He knows how to recover, but often gimps. He does not distinguish between his normals, he simply presses (or mashes) a in the direction of his foe when he wants to attack, spamming mostly a combination of jab, f-tilt and dash attack. He rarely uses air attacks, instead, he waits for his foe to come down. He doesn't attempt to edge guard, and when he does it is onstage. Noobs understand very little about the games mechanics. To camp, they spam their projectile button (usually b). Final smashes are on, and 3-4 player battles and free for alls are common. He uses moves that are usually considered bad options. He, of course, cannot DI and knows not of any advanced techniques. His reflexes are poor. He does not attempt follow ups. He always uses ledge attack and getup attack, never techs, overuses stall-then-falls and rapid jabs etc.

Smashes: noobs use smashes as bait. When their opponent is at a high percent (this is even more common if he too is at a high percent, but also usable from low-percent-neutral), he will stand at the far end of the stage and charge his smash attack with the greatest horizontal range. Now the other noob is not stupid. He doesn't exactly go through the same though processes that we do, but he knows that his opponent is charging a powerful attack. If he is hit, he will die or else get knocked to the point where he cannot recover, or at the very least take devastating damage. However, he knows that he can run in and interrupt the smash attack before his opponent can release the "a" button. However, with a well times release of "a", his opponent could send him flying. He also knows that the attack has [ending lag] that he can [punish]. He knows that the opponent cannot charge it forever and that he can instead rush in right when the charge time ends, and [punish] him when he is forced to release his attack. This is the mindset. Oh, and he doesn't use GC controller.

Noobs often get into close range ground exchanges, spammable moves are more effective, lock on projectiles are more effective, etc. I cannot lay out the entire noob mindset and meta, but anyway, I decided to make a tier list to show how effective certain characters would be in noob play. I'm not going to justify every one up front, so instead, I'd be happy to answer individual questions.

Top Tier

SS:
:snake::pit:

S:
:metaknight::kirby2::sheilda:

A+:
:pikachu2::sonic::ness2::ike:

A-:
:toonlink::zerosuitsamus::lucario:

High Tier

B::fox::falco::wolf:


Upper Mid Tier

C+
:marth::diddy::gw::link2:
C:

:lucas:

C-:
:pt::luigi2:


Mid Tier

D::peach::mario2::rob::ganondorf::samus2::bowser2::dk2:


Lower Mid Tier

E:
:dedede::falcon::wario::yoshi2:

Low Tier

F:
:popo::olimar::jigglypuff:
This tier list is hilarious. It reminds me of when I played as a noob (laser x 50, when enemy approaches, Phantasm to other side of stage). However, I think Ganondorf should be higher up on this list, merely because noobs have a hard time punishing even Ganondorf's ridiculously slow attacks and his range is decent enough that he might be able to avoid moves from smaller characters in the Jabfest. Also, since Ganondorf is so heavy, and DI does not exist to noobs, he gets KO'd at higher percants than most. And finally, rolling around like a noob is a good thing for noobs being 'Dorf, as his dash speed is so slow that it's just as fast to roll everywhere.
 

WT!

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 5, 2014
Messages
254
NNID
WT_Smash
3DS FC
4597-0015-7814
Switch FC
SW-3650-7945-8401
Well, maybe I could move him up a bit, but his recovery is bad, he has trouble against projectile spamming and has no projectile himself. Also, other characters are just better options. It's not that he's bad, but...

Okay, Ganondorf moved up 1, ahead of ROB. -_-
 

-LzR-

Smash Hero
Joined
Jan 1, 2009
Messages
7,649
Location
Finland
How is Olimar in the bottom? Just insert the Cstick into your ass and start moving around for an easy win.
 

WT!

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 5, 2014
Messages
254
NNID
WT_Smash
3DS FC
4597-0015-7814
Switch FC
SW-3650-7945-8401
Yes, but they don't know how to utilize aerials or camping properly. They don't understand how to use each different pikmin either, and his recovery absolutely KILLS his viability in noob play. Plus none of the 3 core moves (jab, f-tilt, dash attack) involve pikmin, and, other than u-tilt and nair (nair isn't even ever used) his non-pikmin attacks suck. They are low on power and EXTREMELY low on range.
 

-LzR-

Smash Hero
Joined
Jan 1, 2009
Messages
7,649
Location
Finland
All he needs is his smashes. New players have no clue on how to approach Olimar, it's really hard. It makes no difference what Pikmin they have, just fmash/usmash all day long and sideB when far away and it's a free win for a while. No other moves needed except for a grab. You'll rarely be sent offstage if you just keep doing this.
 

WT!

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 5, 2014
Messages
254
NNID
WT_Smash
3DS FC
4597-0015-7814
Switch FC
SW-3650-7945-8401
That's the thing, they don't do that. They aren't even smart enough to c-spam.
 

Anop

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 10, 2009
Messages
126
Location
Salta,Argentina
I think jiggs is low, but it shouldn´t be last (for me). Noobs love to use rollout and don´t know how to fight against it. Plus they don´t have any recovery problem due to the several jumps jiggly has. Jiggs doesn´t need an up B recovery, thing that noobs love because of having trouble pressing that (butterfingers).
 

Phan7om

ドリームランドの悪夢
Joined
Jun 12, 2013
Messages
1,615
Location
???
Slower characters are still top tier as long as they have high kill power. (Snake, Ike, Ganon, prob DK, Bowser etc.)

Puff shouldnt be last, rollout spam is really good to them cuz of its KO potential and it always never misses.

Bowser is good because he can bowsercide and his down-b is pretty fast and safe to them, should be higher.

Diddy and GnW lower because they think they require too much skill to use, they are similar to Yoshi, but i do think Yoshi should be higher because egg lay at the ledge is a ohko and egg roll is OP. All 3 should be mid tier.

Also, DK's down-b pretty much makes him untouchable to them as well since no one knows how to use aerials properly unless its dair.

And i still think MK and snake should be lower, but thats just me.
 

WT!

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 5, 2014
Messages
254
NNID
WT_Smash
3DS FC
4597-0015-7814
Switch FC
SW-3650-7945-8401
Jiggs is bottom.

1) Has the lowest range, priority and power in the entire game in her ground normals, so she can't win the ground exchanges.
2) Her recovery is fine, except that noobs will keep forgetting that her up-b is not a recovery move and they will keep using it and suiciding.
3) Only kill move is rollout, and noobs will keep forgetting to turn it around and will roll off the stage, likely killing themselves. Noobs don't know how to dodge it, but they might jump over it or even attack it, and with the low priority of rollout that is more than likely a hit on puff.
4) Being slower than Ganondorf and having no projectile makes approaches painstaking.
 

-LzR-

Smash Hero
Joined
Jan 1, 2009
Messages
7,649
Location
Finland
Diddy and GnW lower because they think they require too much skill to use, they are similar to Yoshi, but i do think Yoshi should be higher because egg lay at the ledge is a ohko and egg roll is OP. All 3 should be mid tier.
GW is one of the easiest characters in the game.
 

Phan7om

ドリームランドの悪夢
Joined
Jun 12, 2013
Messages
1,615
Location
???
GW is one of the easiest characters in the game.
Yeah, to us.

For noobs its basically judge hammer spam which is useless half the time. Otherwise he's so weird they dont know what is useful therefore too much skill to use when they could just pick Kirby and spam down-b or something.
 

-LzR-

Smash Hero
Joined
Jan 1, 2009
Messages
7,649
Location
Finland
Yeah, to us.

For noobs its basically judge hammer spam which is useless half the time. Otherwise he's so weird they dont know what is useful therefore too much skill to use when they could just pick Kirby and spam down-b or something.
I don't see how any character who has 3 smashes that kill super early and are ridiculously fast and low cooldown for such strong moves could be considered hard for a noob. Dsmash is the only move you need. You can even Dthrow -> Dsmash for free because people can't tech.
 

Phan7om

ドリームランドの悪夢
Joined
Jun 12, 2013
Messages
1,615
Location
???
I don't see how any character who has 3 smashes that kill super early and are ridiculously fast and low cooldown for such strong moves could be considered hard for a noob. Dsmash is the only move you need. You can even Dthrow -> Dsmash for free because people can't tech.
It really depends on the level of the noob really. A noob that just got the game will never use smash attacks, only specials. They dont know how to use chef/thinks it sucks, dont know what bucket even does, and up-b is strictly for recovery to them, so all they have is judgement hammer. GnW to them is Side-B and Final Smashes. Once he/she finds out about smashes then its different, they spam that. They also dont know dthrow can combo into dsmash and will probably try to judgement hammer or something.
 

WT!

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 5, 2014
Messages
254
NNID
WT_Smash
3DS FC
4597-0015-7814
Switch FC
SW-3650-7945-8401
GnW jab + smashes = win.
 

WT!

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 5, 2014
Messages
254
NNID
WT_Smash
3DS FC
4597-0015-7814
Switch FC
SW-3650-7945-8401
Does not belong in competitive section, mod should move it to general discussion. @ Shaya Shaya
Really? You do realize you were just looking around for threads threads that you think could possibly have something wrong with them. Who does that?
 

WT!

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 5, 2014
Messages
254
NNID
WT_Smash
3DS FC
4597-0015-7814
Switch FC
SW-3650-7945-8401
Um... hyrule tier?
 

Thor

Smash Champion
Joined
Sep 26, 2013
Messages
2,009
Location
UIUC [school year]. MN [summer]
WT! said:
Really? You do realize you were just looking around for threads threads that you think could possibly have something wrong with them. Who does that?
Mods do that (well sort of, I think it's more along the lines of what I was actually thinking) because they want to keep the forum clean. Shaya is one of the only mods who does this sort of thing. Thing is (and I think this is what most mods actually do), I was actually looking for a different thread, but saw this and decided to speak up, just in case he cared. Wasn't trying to be rude, per se (I didn't say "Lock the thread", just "Move it" - and people have been infracted for posting threads in the wrong place, so if it just got moved that would actually be better than if it got locked and you got infracted...)

WT! said:
Um... hyrule tier?
Reference to when Jigglypuff wasn't below Link, and the bottom three were in a separate tier - they were Link, Zelda, Ganondorf, which people called the Hyrule tier. In other words, Yoshi should be bottom tier (Hyrule tier).

FYI, for noobs that use CG controllers (there are those who do, because they play Mario Kart Double Dash), Fox is definitely up a tier, because a noob can find the cstick and think "Oh really strong attacks, let's use them" and Fox usmash is stupid good on noob levels, so Fox is higher.

If noobs aren't using cstick/GC controller, MK should drop some, because he has no KO power (unless the noob learns about shuttle loop, which doesn't seem likely since "recoveries aren't attacks, unless you're Ike").

Also Pokémon trainer is waaaaay higher because Rock Smash and Bullet seed are SUPER strong - probably on the tier where the three spacies currently reside (and move Wolf down, his blaster isn't spammable enough and bairs are not a thing (most don't use them because the idea doesn't occur to them), and he's hard to recover with for a noob because small ledge sweetspot).

Just a bit of input from playing with people at lunch in FFAs in school for a year (mainly used time to do ATs in random corners and practice really bad 2v1s since they're not good but team up on me).
 

WT!

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 5, 2014
Messages
254
NNID
WT_Smash
3DS FC
4597-0015-7814
Switch FC
SW-3650-7945-8401
Ah well, it is competitive on a nooby level, and it's kind of funny that it was put here which is propably why it hasn't been moved already.

Oh! That hyrule tier! Sorry I keep forgetting that the tier list isn't still that way (jigglypuff is so better than link)
 

HeavyLobster

Smash Champion
Joined
Jun 7, 2014
Messages
2,074
NNID
HeavyLobster43
The problem with this tier list is that not all noobs are the same. Whether a noob spams jab and f-tilt or mashes the C-stick substantially changes the tier list. Some noobs roll spam nonstop while others don't know what rolling is. That said, there are some traits that all noobs share.
  • Repetitive and predictable attack and movement patterns
  • An inability to perform techniques such as short-hopping and fast-falling, thus lacking an effective aerial game
  • Struggle to consistently use more advanced/precise recoveries
  • Don't shield, at least not consistently, and never tech
  • Like to spam projectile moves or other moves that keep them safe(Kirby's Stone) or do a ton of damage with little effort(Ike)
  • Usually don't grab much, though this is sometimes untrue if the opponent spams Stone or Counter
  • Noobs may or may not know about Falco/D3 chaingrabs, but will abuse them if they do
Plenty of noobs use the Gamecube Controller, so ruling out C-stick mashing doesn't make sense. I have plenty of experience with the C-stick noob meta, and I can say that Yoshi is probably the worst since everyone self-destructs with his Side-B.
 

WT!

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 5, 2014
Messages
254
NNID
WT_Smash
3DS FC
4597-0015-7814
Switch FC
SW-3650-7945-8401
What do you mean a decent post? Plenty of decent posts have been made!
 

Shaya

   「chase you」 
BRoomer
Joined
Jun 8, 2007
Messages
27,654
Location
/人◕‿‿◕人\ FABULOUS Max!
NNID
ShayaJP
Yeah this is probably better in the general section to be honest. There are a lot of ambiguities/subjective notions within a "Noob Tier List" (another thread came up recently), to the degree in which it would be hard to be comparable to other things that are meant to be discussed around here.

But at the same time both sections are in a bit of disarray. I've already seen this thread before and chose not to act on it for the whole "well whatever" type of basis.
 
Top Bottom