No Crying Until the End: Ninten for Smash Ultimate!

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Even with characters being important, everyone does have their own opinion on it. But this is good because Sakurai and the team see all the Mother characters who are spirits imporant.

It also sounds like all the characters who are spirits are characters important to Nintendo's history. So, obviously, there are missing 3rd party spirits. There are 3rd party characters like Rayman, Shantae, and Geno (although he is only legally owned by Square Enix, he is a Mario character) who have spirits because of their important relationship with Nintendo.

I really think we are getting a new Mother rep, and with all the oddities, Ninten
Yeah, spirits aren’t a way to deconfirm, they’re a way to represent everyone important to Nintendo’s history and make a compelling single player mode. Honestly, this game is a gift. The effort put into everything just... Good lord... And I haven’t even started WOL yet! I’ve just been trying to beat Classic Mode with everyone first.

Odds are certainly in Ninten’s favor. I’ll keep y’all posted if I find more in game oddities as well as Smiles and Tears. :)
 

Zack E.

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Yeah, spirits aren’t a way to deconfirm, they’re a way to represent everyone important to Nintendo’s history and make a compelling single player mode. Honestly, this game is a gift. The effort put into everything just... Good lord... And I haven’t even started WOL yet! I’ve just been trying to beat Classic Mode with everyone first.

Odds are certainly in Ninten’s favor. I’ll keep y’all posted if I find more in game oddities as well as Smiles and Tears. :)
Thank you :) I think I am going to play some Mother 3 right now
 
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I know this isn’t directly related to Ninten but apparently Erdrick is somehow the placeholder slot now? I need actual evidence for this. Not just the leaker squad’s opinions. What happened to them by the way? NEVER have all leakers banned together and been so blantently obvious...

If there was a square character planned waaaaaaay far out it’d most likely be SMRPG or FF7...

Sorry I needed to say this...
 

Mad Duck

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I would be so happy if a DQ character gets in,I'm a huge Dragon Quest fan and always wanted a rep, I don't why it took this long,the series is extremely popular in Japan. The things is Erdrick would be another swordfighter,I hope his moveset is focused around his spells
 
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I’m mostly just super confused is all. I just don’t like bowling with leakers since they have a tendency to gutterball even after several strikes.

Sorry if I came off as rude.
 

TheBeastHimself

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I really hate to be a pessimist, but I just don't see Ninten happening at this point, and I'm not writing this here with the goal of being a buzzkill, but to rather generate a thought-provoking discussion. If you look at the DLC characters from the previous game, it is clear that Nintendo had faith that each of them would sell either due to fan demand, iconicness, or relevancy.
  1. Mewtwo - Back due to fan demand
  2. Lucas - Back due to fan demand
  3. Roy - Back due to fan demand
  4. Ryu - An iconic video game character
  5. Cloud - An iconic video game character that nobody ever expected to join Smash
  6. Corrin - More of an advertisement for Fire Emblem: Fates
  7. Bayonetta - Generally relevant and a prominent/promising franchise on Nintendo consoles (supposedly won the ballot)
I don't feel as though Ninten really fits any of these criteria. When it comes to fan demand, I'd say Porky has the most out of all the Mother characters. Forgive me if this sounds rude (because it isn't my intent), but this thread clearly reflects that because it is kept alive by the same 2-3 people. Sure, there could be other places where people are requesting Ninten but I doubt there are large communities dedicated to him, because if there was Ninten would be more of a topic of discussion during Smash speculation and for me it's rare to see him being brought up anywhere outside of Mother-dedicated channels.

Ninten isn't an iconic video game character either. Let's be honest, nobody from Mother is an iconic video game character in the slightest. Some may be known thanks to Smash Bros., but in the larger gaming world Mother is just one of those lesser-known JRPG franchises that people know about but few ever play. Not to mention that Ninten's debut and only appearance is in Mother 1, which compared to EarthBound and Mother 3 is the least popular pick.

Besides getting in due to fan demand or pure iconicness, some of the DLC characters got in likely due to their relevancy, which Ninten and other Mother characters clearly lack. One could argue that Ninten might be added to advertise some special edition of the Mother series thanks to the 30th anniversary, but that's under the assumption that Nintendo and Shigesato Itoi would do something new for the series. Stuff like HD remakes, or any sort of remake, is just highly unlikely in my opinion. Itoi owns the rights to the series and he's made it clear that he's done working on it. If anything, I could see Mother 3 finally being localized, and man that would be weird if Ninten got in alongside a Mother 3 localization (actually, it wouldn't make a lot of sense).

I'd like to end this post with some closing thoughts. At this point, Nintendo would only do something Mother related for the hardcore Mother fans that crave any sort of new content. However, Nintendo has also made it pretty clear that they are not going to go out of their way and jump through hoops for the series. It took them 17 years to finally release the localization of Mother 1, and April will mark 13 years of waiting for Mother 3. I mean once Mother 3 came out, not a lot happened for the series. Because of this, I doubt a new Mother character is in the works for DLC. Irrelevant/obscure/retro characters (which Ninten undoubtedly fits) are best suited for the base roster because they are packaged with the game at no additional cost, whereas for DLC a person would have to go out of their way to purchase the character. It seems that for DLC, Nintendo likes the reach for the stars and pull in characters from all across the gaming world, and compared to the larger gaming world, I just don't think Ninten of all people would be considered a priority in any way.
 

Mad Duck

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Don't worry,you are not being a buzzkill,in fact your post is very sensible. I always get my hopes up because that's the way I am,but I think he had more chances of being an echo in the initial roster than a fleshed out DLC.
It pains me to say this but yes,compared to others DLC characters he lacks relevancy and iconicness,at least outside the fandom
 

Zack E.

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I really hate to be a pessimist, but I just don't see Ninten happening at this point, and I'm not writing this here with the goal of being a buzzkill, but to rather generate a thought-provoking discussion. If you look at the DLC characters from the previous game, it is clear that Nintendo had faith that each of them would sell either due to fan demand, iconicness, or relevancy.
  1. Mewtwo - Back due to fan demand
  2. Lucas - Back due to fan demand
  3. Roy - Back due to fan demand
  4. Ryu - An iconic video game character
  5. Cloud - An iconic video game character that nobody ever expected to join Smash
  6. Corrin - More of an advertisement for Fire Emblem: Fates
  7. Bayonetta - Generally relevant and a prominent/promising franchise on Nintendo consoles (supposedly won the ballot)
I don't feel as though Ninten really fits any of these criteria. When it comes to fan demand, I'd say Porky has the most out of all the Mother characters. Forgive me if this sounds rude (because it isn't my intent), but this thread clearly reflects that because it is kept alive by the same 2-3 people. Sure, there could be other places where people are requesting Ninten but I doubt there are large communities dedicated to him, because if there was Ninten would be more of a topic of discussion during Smash speculation and for me it's rare to see him being brought up anywhere outside of Mother-dedicated channels.

Ninten isn't an iconic video game character either. Let's be honest, nobody from Mother is an iconic video game character in the slightest. Some may be known thanks to Smash Bros., but in the larger gaming world Mother is just one of those lesser-known JRPG franchises that people know about but few ever play. Not to mention that Ninten's debut and only appearance is in Mother 1, which compared to EarthBound and Mother 3 is the least popular pick.

Besides getting in due to fan demand or pure iconicness, some of the DLC characters got in likely due to their relevancy, which Ninten and other Mother characters clearly lack. One could argue that Ninten might be added to advertise some special edition of the Mother series thanks to the 30th anniversary, but that's under the assumption that Nintendo and Shigesato Itoi would do something new for the series. Stuff like HD remakes, or any sort of remake, is just highly unlikely in my opinion. Itoi owns the rights to the series and he's made it clear that he's done working on it. If anything, I could see Mother 3 finally being localized, and man that would be weird if Ninten got in alongside a Mother 3 localization (actually, it wouldn't make a lot of sense).

I'd like to end this post with some closing thoughts. At this point, Nintendo would only do something Mother related for the hardcore Mother fans that crave any sort of new content. However, Nintendo has also made it pretty clear that they are not going to go out of their way and jump through hoops for the series. It took them 17 years to finally release the localization of Mother 1, and April will mark 13 years of waiting for Mother 3. I mean once Mother 3 came out, not a lot happened for the series. Because of this, I doubt a new Mother character is in the works for DLC. Irrelevant/obscure/retro characters (which Ninten undoubtedly fits) are best suited for the base roster because they are packaged with the game at no additional cost, whereas for DLC a person would have to go out of their way to purchase the character. It seems that for DLC, Nintendo likes the reach for the stars and pull in characters from all across the gaming world, and compared to the larger gaming world, I just don't think Ninten of all people would be considered a priority in any way.
Alright, so you mentioned Corrin being an advertisement for FE. No one knew who he was and he didn't have any fan demand. I know you think something Mother related next year is unlikely, but I think it is likely. When Lucas was DLC in Smash 4, Mother 1 was localized around the same time. The protagonist of Mother 3 came along with Mother 1. It wouldn't be a stretch for the protagonist of Mother 1, Ninten, to come along with Mother 3, or a remake of the 3 Mother games.

Take a look at all the Mother content in Ultimate. It's a sudden jump in content from Smash 4. And a weird increase if there were supposedly no plans for anything Mother related on the 30th anniversary of the Mother series.

Pit, Ice Climbers, and Mr. Game and Watch were all characters no one knew about and were irrelevant. Didn't stop them from coming to the roster.

Also, in an article with Sakurai recently, he said that not all characters have to be a hero or very recognizable. He adds variety to the roster. This means that not all characters have to have a criteria. They don't have to have demand or mainstream recognition.

There was a novel approved by Itoi, showing Ninten in a completely different design than how he looked in Mother 1. Itoi let someone else change around Ninten's design. He would allow a redesign
 
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Ugh... God it’s like this fandom WANTS me to leave... Honestly... I can’t stand the Smash fandom as a whole right now... The Kencineroar/Box leak was bad, the Grinch leak was worse, the “spirits deconfirm” garbage almost sent me over but now... I don’t care what any insider has to say anymore, as they’re all the same to me. Leakers/Leak Culture and fanrules have outright RUINED speculation for me. This whole DQ leak with everyone being so smarmy about being right when nothing has been proven has been the last straw for me. I’m throwing in the towel for speculation as a whole with the exception of Ninten. Even then I almost feel completely burnt out because of how much I’ve been smacked around for the past half a year... If I didn’t feel at least halfway confident about Ninten’s chances, I wouldn’t even be here.

Honestly if he were mystery character no. 70 he wouldn’t need any relevance or anything if he were to be base roster. That’s why I’m trying to find when all the characters were inserted. It could really answer some questions. Also Nintendo wanting Sakurai to announce Joker at the game awards truly tells me one thing: Joker is going to be the most currently relevant character out of the bunch, meaning the other four are most likely going to be even more niche than Persona. And with seeing how SSBU handles spoilers, Ninten’s... kinda the only option if we’re gonna get a new Mother character... A character being more likely to get in based around move potential is a non argument when Villager, Captain Falcon, Duck Hunt, and ROB all exist.

I’m sorry I needed this off my chest. I’m... So done... With most of the fandom as a whole right now... I’ll post updates if I find any but... I think I need a break...
 

FLGibsonIII

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Ugh... God it’s like this fandom WANTS me to leave... Honestly... I can’t stand the Smash fandom as a whole right now... The Kencineroar/Box leak was bad, the Grinch leak was worse, the “spirits deconfirm” garbage almost sent me over but now... I don’t care what any insider has to say anymore, as they’re all the same to me. Leakers/Leak Culture and fanrules have outright RUINED speculation for me. This whole DQ leak with everyone being so smarmy about being right when nothing has been proven has been the last straw for me. I’m throwing in the towel for speculation as a whole with the exception of Ninten. Even then I almost feel completely burnt out because of how much I’ve been smacked around for the past half a year... If I didn’t feel at least halfway confident about Ninten’s chances, I wouldn’t even be here.

Honestly if he were mystery character no. 70 he wouldn’t need any relevance or anything if he were to be base roster. That’s why I’m trying to find when all the characters were inserted. It could really answer some questions. Also Nintendo wanting Sakurai to announce Joker at the game awards truly tells me one thing: Joker is going to be the most currently relevant character out of the bunch, meaning the other four are most likely going to be even more niche than Persona. And with seeing how SSBU handles spoilers, Ninten’s... kinda the only option if we’re gonna get a new Mother character... A character being more likely to get in based around move potential is a non argument when Villager, Captain Falcon, Duck Hunt, and ROB all exist.

I’m sorry I needed this off my chest. I’m... So done... With most of the fandom as a whole right now... I’ll post updates if I find any but... I think I need a break...
Definitely take the break if you need it. Honestly, debating people is a waste of energy when so many people are antagonistic and smug. Someone elses character getting in is perceived as a threat by many, so they will attack you incessantly. Some people see mother 1 as an unbalanced and inferior game and will continuously insist Ninten has no chance to make them feel better. I honestly felt you got a really bad rap in the Geno thread for supposedly derailing when it was other people who instigated debate. You have been nothing but positive. You don't owe anyone here anything. Take a break.

I also got the Ninten spirit today btw :)
 
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Zack E.

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Definitely take the break if you need it. Honestly, debating people is a waste of energy when so many people are antagonistic and smug. Someone elses character getting in is perceived as a threat by many, so they will attack you incessantly. Some people see mother 1 as an unbalanced and inferior game and will continuously insist Ninten has no chance to make them feel better. I honestly felt you got a really bad rap in the Geno thread for supposedly derailing when it was other people who instigated debate. You have been nothing but positive. You don't owe anyone here anything. Take a break.

I also got the Ninten spirit today btw :)
Wait how did you get it
 

Zack E.

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The store lol. I felt kinda bad getting it that way, but I getting Ninten was worth it. I also got Lloyd and Teddy from classic mode a couple days ago.
N-no....it was available at the store one time, but I didn't have enough coins, and it wasn't available after I left....

NOOOOOO
 

Zack E.

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I am really lucky I got a lot of coins for playing with friends and classic a lot.
I also feel like I see Ninten as the profile picture for a significant amount of people online. To me, it is clear there is a good amount of people who like him.
That is really nice. There are more people who like him than we thought!

I'm confident in his chances for DLC :)
 

Zack E.

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I feel you. Couple of days ago, he was there in the Store, and I had all of 200 coins. I really need a fun way to get rich quick.
Same lol. Also have you seem this art? https://twitter.com/mxx_gm Look through this guy's history. I really love all of it.

Anyways, good night everyone!
 
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Thanks for understanding how I feel guys,,, Really appreciate it... I'm still feeling super drained but... I found part of the insertion list by complete accident and I feel like this needs to be shown here cause... I'm nearly positive the Title theory Zack proposed is correct...

ohmygod.jpg


This character was chosen before even INKLING was picked. I N K L I N G. Not only that... But new third parties are always the last to be entered unless it's some freak last minute funsie like Toon Link. I have the link to this thread saved somewhere, but this goes with what I heard about Isabelle and Roar's placement...


This means... Mystery Character No. 70... Is a FIRST PARTY... It's not Erdrick, Geno, Lloyd Irving, Banjo-Kazooie, Steve, that Granblue fantasy character, NONE of those...
This character being placed before Inkling means Title theory must be true, so MCN70, is a first party character from a title in that datamined title list.

Holy ****ing **** man.

I need time to process this... And recharge myself obviously... I felt like I need to share this because... Wow... Something that thins the herd of possibilities...
 
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Zack E.

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Thanks for understanding how I feel guys,,, Really appreciate it... I'm still feeling super drained but... I found part of the insertion list by complete accident and I feel like this needs to be shown here cause... I'm nearly positive the Title theory Zack proposed is correct...

View attachment 185750

This character was chosen before even INKLING was picked. I N K L I N G. Not only that... But new third parties are always the last to be entered unless it's some freak last minute funsie like Toon Link. I have the link to this thread saved somewhere, but this goes with what I heard about Isabelle and Roar's placement...


This means... Mystery Character No. 70... Is a FIRST PARTY... It's not Erdrick, Geno, Lloyd Irving, Banjo-Kazooie, Steve, that Granblue fantasy character, NONE of those...
This character being placed before Inkling means Title theory must be true, so MCN70, is a first party character from a title in that datamined title list.

Holy ****ing **** man.

I need time to process this... And recharge myself obviously... I felt like I need to share this because... Wow... Something that thins the herd of possibilities...
And the character has a unique victory theme?
 
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And the character has a unique victory theme?
All we know is that it's a theme made for Ultimate as the original rips are from Smash 4. So the new Metroid, FE, Pokemon, Zelda and Mother victory themes were not applied to these meaning that the victory theme could either be any of those or something new entirely. I also highly doubt PP is gonna get a distinct victory theme seeing as a mook getting a unique theme is mega unlikely.

Also look at the positions. MCN70 was placed before all the obvious ballot characters, meaning this was one of the earliest picks right after the Pokemon placeholder, but before the fan picks like Inkling. More than likely, whoever this character is was cut for a very specific reason: To be pushed as DLC. At least that's my theory. Sakurai said there were truly no cuts and Nintendo chose the DLC...

Nintendo encouraging Sakurai to push a character to DLC no matter which way you slice it is Nintendo choosing the DLC.
 
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GoodGrief741

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Thanks for understanding how I feel guys,,, Really appreciate it... I'm still feeling super drained but... I found part of the insertion list by complete accident and I feel like this needs to be shown here cause... I'm nearly positive the Title theory Zack proposed is correct...

View attachment 185750

This character was chosen before even INKLING was picked. I N K L I N G. Not only that... But new third parties are always the last to be entered unless it's some freak last minute funsie like Toon Link. I have the link to this thread saved somewhere, but this goes with what I heard about Isabelle and Roar's placement...


This means... Mystery Character No. 70... Is a FIRST PARTY... It's not Erdrick, Geno, Lloyd Irving, Banjo-Kazooie, Steve, that Granblue fantasy character, NONE of those...
This character being placed before Inkling means Title theory must be true, so MCN70, is a first party character from a title in that datamined title list.

Holy ****ing **** man.

I need time to process this... And recharge myself obviously... I felt like I need to share this because... Wow... Something that thins the herd of possibilities...
I dunno about that. We know Incineroar was added after all other characters, so I think it makes more sense to assume that those files were reorganized.
 
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I dunno about that. We know Incineroar was added after all other characters, so I think it makes more sense to assume that those files were reorganized.
It was actually a placeholder for a new Pokemon with Incineroar's name being added later when they decided on the character. Pretty sure Sakurai mentioned having a placeholder for a Pokemon rep in SSBU in an interview somewhere.
 

GoodGrief741

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It was actually a placeholder for a new Pokemon with Incineroar's name being added later when they decided on the character. Pretty sure Sakurai mentioned having a placeholder for a Pokemon rep in SSBU in an interview somewhere.
He did mention leaving a spot in the project plan, but jury’s out on whether they left empty files to fill in later.
 
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He did mention leaving a spot in the project plan, but jury’s out on whether they left empty files to fill in later.
I... Don't think they went back and reorganized character slots when they didn't reorganize the spirits list since that's an absoulte disaster near the end... but... guess we'll just have to see what happens. Just posting my thoughts.
 

Zack E.

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All we know is that it's a theme made for Ultimate as the original rips are from Smash 4. So the new Metroid, FE, Pokemon, Zelda and Mother victory themes were not applied to these meaning that the victory theme could either be any of those or something new entirely. I also highly doubt PP is gonna get a distinct victory theme seeing as a mook getting a unique theme is mega unlikely.

Also look at the positions. MCN70 was placed before all the obvious ballot characters, meaning this was one of the earliest picks right after the Pokemon placeholder, but before the fan picks like Inkling. More than likely, whoever this character is was cut for a very specific reason: To be pushed as DLC. At least that's my theory. Sakurai said there were truly no cuts and Nintendo chose the DLC...

Nintendo encouraging Sakurai to push a character to DLC no matter which way you slice it is Nintendo choosing the DLC.
If Ninten is the cut character, then it looks like he will have the same victory theme as Ness and Lucas.

Lets see all the possibilities for a first party character with a new theme created for Ultimate:

- A Legend of Zelda rep
- A Metroid rep
- A (ugh) Fire Emblem rep
- A Pokemon rep
- A (best option) Mother rep
- A Rhythm Heaven rep
- A Golden Sun rep

These are all the options that come to mind. I highly doubt it is a Pokemon considering that it would be chosen right after the Pokemon that was planned, Incineroar. It's possible that it could be a RH, LoZ, FE, or Metroid rep, but there isn't much supporting the idea of any of them. I don't remember what happened specifically, but there were some odd happenings of Golden Sun related things around (iIrc) 2015 - 2018, when GS was trademarked. While I do not believe Isaac was the cut character since PolarPanda's source said that Isaac was planned to be an assist trophy from the start, it's possible that it could be Matthew, as his spirit battle (iIrc) doesn't use any GS music, even though there is GS music in the game.

So then we get to the last possibility - Mother. The series with all the odd happenings with the music and Ninten's odd spirit placement. I have a theory:


This is a video from Gamexplain made in January of 2017. Near the end of the video, they go over an article with Reggie, and Reggie is commenting on Mother 3 and Metroid. He says "In a year, we will look back," implying that they would have those 2 games ready on the Switch a year from January 2017. Now, you might be thinking "ugh, they sat on it and didn't work on it when they should have." Let's look back at Vergeben's Mother 3 leak. It was near the end of 2017. He said that one of the reasons that Mother 3 was being held back was because they couldn't decide what month to release it in. What if there were plans of Mother 3 coming to Switch along with a Mother character for Smash, but Sakurai and Nintendo wanted to have it held back so that they could announce both on the 30th anniversary of the Mother series?

All of this is certainly interesting
 
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If Ninten is the cut character, then it looks like he will have the same victory theme as Ness and Lucas.

Lets see all the possibilities for a first party character with a new theme created for Ultimate:

- A Legend of Zelda rep
- A Metroid rep
- A (ugh) Fire Emblem rep
- A Pokemon rep
- A (best option) Mother rep
- A Rhythm Heaven rep
- A Golden Sun rep

These are all the options that come to mind. I highly doubt it is a Pokemon considering that it would be chosen right after the Pokemon that was planned, Incineroar. It's possible that it could be a RH, LoZ, FE, or Metroid rep, but there isn't much supporting the idea of any of them. I don't remember what happened specifically, but there were some odd happenings of Golden Sun related things around (iIrc) 2015 - 2018, when GS was trademarked. While I do not believe Isaac was the cut character since PolarPanda's source said that Isaac was planned to be an assist trophy from the start, it's possible that it could be Matthew, as his spirit battle (iIrc) doesn't use any GS music, even though there is GS music in the game.
Due to Metroid and Zelda's new themes being slightly different mixes of the original themes, that kinda makes them unlikely since they're not super different. The two FE mixes were tailored to Awakening and Fates specifically so I also doubt those as well. For Metroid that would imply someone like Sylux was planned before the likes of Ridley and K Rool which is... Absolutely laughable since the poor guy didn't even get a trophy in Smash 4.

Ugh I feel terrible for the RH fandom. I expected they'd at LEAST get Marshal as an assist trophy...

Also I kinda doubt Matthew as that'd kinda be like putting Protoman in Smash before Megaman. It'd certainly make GS fans happy but a lot would say "This is really cool but why did you choose him over the guy that topped polls?" I mean I'd say that if Proto got in before Megaman. Maybe the music was a theming deal? I don't really remember what happened in Matthew's fight to be honest.


If Ninten is the cut character, then it looks like he will have the same victory theme as Ness and Lucas.

So then we get to the last possibility - Mother. The series with all the odd happenings with the music and Ninten's odd spirit placement. I have a theory:


This is a video from Gamexplain made in January of 2017. Near the end of the video, they go over an article with Reggie, and Reggie is commenting on Mother 3 and Metroid. He says "In a year, we will look back," implying that they would have those 2 games ready on the Switch a year from January 2017. Now, you might be thinking "ugh, they sat on it and didn't work on it when they should have." Let's look back at Vergeben's Mother 3 leak. It was near the end of 2017. He said that one of the reasons that Mother 3 was being held back was because they couldn't decide what month to release it in. What if there were plans of Mother 3 coming to Switch along with a Mother character for Smash, but Sakurai and Nintendo wanted to have it held back so that they could announce both on the 30th anniversary of the Mother series?

All of this is certainly interesting

Ain't rabbit holes fun? Careful though you might end up like me...


tumblr_o16n2kBlpX1ta3qyvo1_1280.jpg

^
Actual image of me trying to put this all together.

Though what your saying certainly makes sense to me. I pitched the idea of it getting delayed a while back due to a possible Smash character, but bringing up Verge's old leak certainly fits into all this. Especially since he hasn't been able to comment on it since. Willing to bet his source was either snuffed out or they're being EXTRA secure on making sure nothing Mother related gets leaked. This also ties into the article where it can take over a year to plan and develop a character. Oddly enough Sakurai tweeted out that Nintendo and has finalized the DLC nearly an entire year after Verge leaked Mother 3. There's a point where things stop being coincidences and we're pretty damn close to that position if you ask me.

Oh speaking of the music, I finally got Smiles and Tears.

Smilesandtears.jpg


Nothing out of the ordinary here. This makes the Magicant/Eight Melodies track the only one that's an oddball. Not only that but I found a pastebin with all the titles of the music tracks in game.

correcttitle.jpg


Take a good look at number 489's name...
 

Zack E.

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Due to Metroid and Zelda's new themes being slightly different mixes of the original themes, that kinda makes them unlikely since they're not super different. The two FE mixes were tailored to Awakening and Fates specifically so I also doubt those as well. For Metroid that would imply someone like Sylux was planned before the likes of Ridley and K Rool which is... Absolutely laughable since the poor guy didn't even get a trophy in Smash 4.

Ugh I feel terrible for the RH fandom. I expected they'd at LEAST get Marshal as an assist trophy...

Also I kinda doubt Matthew as that'd kinda be like putting Protoman in Smash before Megaman. It'd certainly make GS fans happy but a lot would say "This is really cool but why did you choose him over the guy that topped polls?" I mean I'd say that if Proto got in before Megaman. Maybe the music was a theming deal? I don't really remember what happened in Matthew's fight to be honest.




Ain't rabbit holes fun? Careful though you might end up like me...

View attachment 185755
^
Actual image of me trying to put this all together.

Though what your saying certainly makes sense to me. I pitched the idea of it getting delayed a while back due to a possible Smash character, but bringing up Verge's old leak certainly fits into all this. Especially since he hasn't been able to comment on it since. Willing to bet his source was either snuffed out or they're being EXTRA secure on making sure nothing Mother related gets leaked. This also ties into the article where it can take over a year to plan and develop a character. Oddly enough Sakurai tweeted out that Nintendo and has finalized the DLC nearly an entire year after Verge leaked Mother 3. There's a point where things stop being coincidences and we're pretty damn close to that position if you ask me.

Oh speaking of the music, I finally got Smiles and Tears.

View attachment 185759

Nothing out of the ordinary here. This makes the Magicant/Eight Melodies track the only one that's an oddball. Not only that but I found a pastebin with all the titles of the music tracks in game.

View attachment 185760

Take a good look at number 489's name...
Keiichi is credited for Smiles and Tears....oh my god...

Wait...the track is called Magicant/Eight Melodies in the pastebin...but not the finalized version of the game? That is extremely weird. They changed around the name....but why....
 
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Keiichi is credited for Smiles and Tears....oh my god...

Wait...the track is called Magicant/Eight Melodies in the pastebin...but not the finalized version of the game? That is extremely weird. They changed around the name....but why....
Yep... The name of this track was purposely tampered with...

Heh... Guess tinfoil hat theory of a certain character being Mystery Character No. 70 might not actually be as crazy as I first thought... You mentioned Ninten is the only EB0 character that doesn't appear in WOL right?
 

Zack E.

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Yep... The name of this track was purposely tampered with...

Heh... Guess tinfoil hat theory of a certain character being Mystery Character No. 70 might not actually be as crazy as I first thought... You mentioned Ninten is the only EB0 character that doesn't appear in WOL right?
Yep. Ninten is the only Mother 1 character who is not in WoL or WoD.
 
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What's this about Mystery Character 70? Isn't that the Piranha Plant? Sorry for the dumb question I usually don't catch up with these things
It's actually not PP as PP most likely doesn't have a victory theme made for Ultimate. It was someone completely scrubbed from the data and there's really no real reason to scrub PP from the data when he was announced to the public a full month in advance. It's most likely someone that got cut. It's a really bizarre scenario, but if it were PP, it would have had a Smash 4 Mario theme since a Mook and ONLY a Mook getting a unique one to himself when Bowser's isn't much different from Mario's is mega unlikely... It's kinda confusing so I hope I helped clear this up.


Yep. Ninten is the only Mother 1 character who is not in WoL or WoD.
That's absolutely bizarre to me. Everything about his spirit just... screams rushed to me... Hey weren't Fighter Spirits like a last minute thought? Or am I missremembering that.
 

Zack E.

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What's this about Mystery Character 70? Isn't that the Piranha Plant? Sorry for the dumb question I usually don't catch up with these things
Piranha Plant is most likely going to have the same victory theme as Bowser and Bowser Jr, and the missing character is a first party character with a theme made for Ultimate. The victory theme for Bowser and Bowser Jr is the same one from Smash 4, so since PP is likely to share that victory theme, PP is most likely not the missing character. There is a chance that it is Ninten, since he could share Ness and Lucas's victory theme, which is a victory theme made for Ultimate.

It's actually not PP as PP most likely doesn't have a victory theme made for Ultimate. It was someone completely scrubbed from the data and there's really no real reason to scrub PP from the data when he was announced to the public a full month in advance. It's most likely someone that got cut. It's a really bizarre scenario, but if it were PP, it would have had a Smash 4 Mario theme since a Mook and ONLY a Mook getting a unique one to himself when Bowser's isn't much different from Mario's is mega unlikely... It's kinda confusing so I hope I helped clear this up.




That's absolutely bizarre to me. Everything about his spirit just... screams rushed to me... Hey weren't Fighter Spirits like a last minute thought? Or am I missremembering that.
From what I remember, Sakurai said that no characters were cut from being playable, meaning that whoever this missing character is, he/she/it will be DLC.

I'm not sure about the fighter spirits
 

Zack E.

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Oh I see,thanks for answering guys.Man if Ninten was really cut I'm going to cry.

I read some time ago that there was data for a Style Savvy character that was supposedly cut,was that true?
Well, iIrc, Sakurai said that no characters were cut from being playable, meaning that if Ninten is the missing character, he is going to be DLC.

I do not believe there was any data found for an SS character
 
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Piranha Plant is most likely going to have the same victory theme as Bowser and Bowser Jr, and the missing character is a first party character with a theme made for Ultimate. The victory theme for Bowser and Bowser Jr is the same one from Smash 4, so since PP is likely to share that victory theme, PP is most likely not the missing character. There is a chance that it is Ninten, since he could share Ness and Lucas's victory theme, which is a victory theme made for Ultimate.



From what I remember, Sakurai said that no characters were cut from being playable, meaning that whoever this missing character is, he/she/it will be DLC.

I'm not sure about the fighter spirits
Yeah they wanted to make sure no one datamining the files would be able to glean who they are just by looking at it. I think they learned from Brawl and Smash 4 being datained. They don't want whoever it is to be obvious. That's why Joker is called Jack in the new datamine situation that happened. If you didn't know Joker was in, you wouldn't have a damn clue who that was. (Which is why I think everyone jumping on the Erdrick bandwagon for "Hero" might be a bit too hasty.)


Oh I see,thanks for answering guys.Man if Ninten was really cut I'm going to cry.

I read some time ago that there was data for a Style Savvy character that was supposedly cut,was that true?
No prob dude.

Hmmm... I don't think there was data for a character, a few known dataminers purposely said fake information and mixed it with real information to throw everyone off. (Why do people gotta be like that man...) It's most likely one of those rumors, since that and the Monster Hunter DLC rumor kinda died off and I really haven't heard people talk about it for a long while. I also remember people were freaking out for a bit because one dataminer said Ninten and Kumatora were cut echos and that's why their spirits are last which... is just untrue. Some people are just needlessly cruel sometimes... I did find a Style Savvy spirit and there are music tracks for it in game though so it actually does have some content which is pretty cool.
 

FLGibsonIII

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Whenever I think I am out, you guys pull me back in. I think Ninten has a solid chance guys.

The people in the square thread think Erdrick was cut from the base game and would probably say that it was his victory theme cut along with him. BUT it wouldn't make sense for a third party to be that early in the victory theme list.

I didn't realize that Ninten wasn't in the WOL mode at all. I think that its bizarre. It would then make sense he is a late addition as a spirit. The possibility of a mother anniversary edition or remake I think also bodes well for Ninten. The only thing that makes me doubt is that all the dlc picks seem to indicate 3rd parties. Despite this, you guys are keeping my hope for him up.
 
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