Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[LiveStudioAudience]

Never honestly heard the Mario with New York accent . Where is this heard ?

Clearly someone that's never experienced the quality and depth of Hotel Mario:

 

[Opossum]

Clearly someone that's never experienced the quality and depth of Hotel Mario:

There's also the Atari Mario Bros. port commercial where Luigi has a very prominent New York accent lol.

Fun fact: this commercial is the first piece of media where Luigi is depicted as the more meek and cowardly of the two.

 

[fogbadge]

which poll?

I feel like I’m missing something

Sucumbio ?

 

[dream1ng]

If Mario's voice ends up being mostly Chris Pratt with a hint of Brooklyn, I wonder how much that was his creative choice and how much it was the executives.

Because when Ryan Reynolds voiced Pikachu, he said he wanted to do a gruff noire detective voice and they were like "just be Deadpool".

I wonder how much of paying these A-listers to voice characters is the studios just wanting them to sound recognizably like themselves.

 

[fogbadge]

Because when Ryan Reynolds voiced Pikachu, he said he wanted to do a gruff noire detective voice and they were like "just be Deadpool".

Really?

 

[dream1ng]

Really?

I'm paraphrasing, but yeah. Originally he was going to do a more befitting voice but they told him to just basically do the Ryan Reynolds thing.

The interview is from some talk show back when that movie was doing press.

 

[Sucumbio]

which poll?

I feel like I’m missing something

Lol what TCT~Phantom said. Is he in your block list or something cause it's the post literally right before mine...?

So wait are you mad that mario's original
Origin was Brooklyn, NY, USA or are you mad that this new story hasn't established a new origin, or that origins are even part of the story ?

Edit

These Queens Blade ads lol is this game Good what gatcha reps should Smash entertain?

 

[fogbadge]

Lol what TCT~Phantom said. Is he in your block list or something cause it's the post literally right before mine...?

So wait are you mad that mario's original
Origin was Brooklyn, NY, USA or are you mad that this new story hasn't established a new origin, or that origins are even part of the story ?

Edit

These Queens Blade ads lol is this game Good what gatcha reps should Smash entertain?

oh. yeah he kinda is. last time we interacted they accused me of being racist

well by having Mario from some where other than the mushroom kingdom feels more like they’re adapting the old movie rather than the games. though I suppose they’ve done it so they can use Mario to explain things to the audience

 

[Ivander]

These Queens Blade ads lol is this game Good what gatcha reps should Smash entertain?

Queen's Blade started as an anime, so it wouldn't be able to get into Smash anyway.

The only Gacha games I feel would have a chance are Fire Emblem Heroes, Granblue Fantasy, Fate Grand Order(as the Fate series started with a video game novel first) and Genshin Impact. Dragalia Lost is a big "No one knows" when we do not know if there's even a sliver of hope left for it's future after it's shut-down.

 

[Sucumbio]

well by having Mario from some where other than the mushroom kingdom feels more like they’re adapting the old movie rather than the games. though I suppose they’ve done it so they can use Mario to explain things to the audience

I gotcha. Myself having not played a whole game past NES means my only interpretation is "the old days" so I partly see this as a chance to make Mario a movie not be so ... Haha whatever I didn't care for it but it didn't do badly as a movie and even got award nominations etc. so it's clearly a matter of personal taste.

Honestly? This Bowser is terrifying. Maybe only if you're like ... 5 (no he scary). It's the quirky side that reminds us it's a family show not meant to actually frighten but as adults we see visual cues and can tune out the comedy momentarily to see a truly sinister villain. (Which may not be immutable). I really just wanna watch this now lol

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Lol what TCT~Phantom said. Is he in your block list or something cause it's the post literally right before mine...?

So wait are you mad that mario's original
Origin was Brooklyn, NY, USA or are you mad that this new story hasn't established a new origin, or that origins are even part of the story ?

Edit

These Queens Blade ads lol is this game Good what gatcha reps should Smash entertain?

I don't think Queen's Blade is for good boys and girls of all ages.

 

[StrangeKitten]

I'm personally hoping they retcon Mario's origins (again) to have him be from New Donk City instead of New York. That way, they can still have Mario be a newcomer for exposition purposes, but not lose video gamey-ness by having him be from the real world. And makes sense for where Foreman Spike, Cranky, and DK could be, since we know they'll show up.

 

[fogbadge]

I gotcha. Myself having not played a whole game past NES means my only interpretation is "the old days" so I partly see this as a chance to make Mario a movie not be so ... Haha whatever I didn't care for it but it didn't do badly as a movie and even got award nominations etc. so it's clearly a matter of personal taste.

Honestly? This Bowser is terrifying. Maybe only if you're like ... 5 (no he scary). It's the quirky side that reminds us it's a family show not meant to actually frighten but as adults we see visual cues and can tune out the comedy momentarily to see a truly sinister villain. (Which may not be immutable). I really just wanna watch this now lol

err not all of us can pick up on social cues

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

Its worth noting that besides some of the Yoshi's Island games, SMB has rarely had enough of a strong lore to really make Mario's exact origins that significant. Him coming from Brooklyn was basically taken as gospel prior to Super Mario World 2, and even when that game effectively said they were born in the Mushroom Kingdom, the most typical reaction was "Huh" rather than any sort of antipathy about a perceived retcon. For the film, being from New York/New Donk City is not terribly surprising given that its an easy way to do exposition about the setting for anyone in the audience not familiar with Mario.

Compared to something like Sonic where the East/West canon divide was much stronger and the emotional investment in the US/Europe's version of the lore (which then led to the fractured fanbase seen in the last two decades when Sega embraced the Japanese backstory)? Mario is much more malleable to various changes here and there largely because specific world building was never that critical outside the RPG games.

 

[chocolatejr9]

These Queens Blade ads lol is this game Good what gatcha reps should Smash entertain?

No, it's gonna be today's sponsor, RAID: SHADOW LEGENDS! Are you ready to play-

Dragalia Lost is a big "No one knows" when we do not know if there's even a sliver of hope left for it's future after it's shut-down.

Take it from the guy who kept wanting to talk about Euden in Smash despite the whole "gachas are illegal in Europe" thing: our best bet is to hope Nintendo is willing to use the IP again for something non-mobile. Like a console remake or something.

 

[fogbadge]

Its worth noting that besides some of the Yoshi's Island games, SMB has rarely had enough of a strong lore to really make Mario's exact origins that significant. Him coming from Brooklyn was basically taken as gospel prior to Super Mario World 2, and even when that game effectively said they were born in the Mushroom Kingdom, the most typical reaction was "Huh" rather than any sort of antipathy about a perceived retcon. For the film, being from New York/New Donk City is not terribly surprising given that its an easy way to do exposition about the setting for anyone in the audience not familiar with Mario.

Compared to something like Sonic where the East/West canon divide was much stronger and the emotional investment in the US/Europe's version of the lore (which then led to the fractured fanbase seen in the last two decades when Sega embraced the Japanese backstory)? Mario is much more malleable to various changes here and there largely because specific world building was never that critical outside the RPG games.

so where does Christmas Island come from?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Its worth noting that besides some of the Yoshi's Island games, SMB has rarely had enough of a strong lore to really make Mario's exact origins that significant. Him coming from Brooklyn was basically taken as gospel prior to Super Mario World 2, and even when that game effectively said they were born in the Mushroom Kingdom, the most typical reaction was "Huh" rather than any sort of antipathy about a perceived retcon. For the film, being from New York/New Donk City is not terribly surprising given that its an easy way to do exposition about the setting for anyone in the audience not familiar with Mario.

Compared to something like Sonic where the East/West canon divide was much stronger and the emotional investment in the US/Europe's version of the lore (which then led to the fractured fanbase seen in the last two decades when Sega embraced the Japanese backstory)? Mario is much more malleable to various changes here and there largely because specific world building was never that critical outside the RPG games.

With all that's happened, I view it was "born in Mushroom Kingdom, and later on pretty much lived in Brooklyn", so both stories. At least as a decent headcanon, that fits enough with all the games and all.

Anyway, yeah, due to not having a blatant canon like Sonic has(albeit, it has more than one universe), it's easy for tons of various stories/concepts to come up and still fit well~

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

so where does Christmas Island come from?

Best I can tell Christmas Island was a concept that wasn't even introduced to Western audiences until after SA1 or if it was, its mention was so obscure that the vast majority of the fans in North America and Europe wasn't aware of it. Its one of many aspects that simply wasn't treated as a given until well into the aughts.

 

[fogbadge]

Best I can tell Christmas Island was a concept that wasn't even introduced to Western audiences until after SA1 or if it was, its mention was so obscure that the vast majority of the fans in North America and Europe wasn't aware of it. Its one of many aspects that simply wasn't treated as a given until well into the aughts.

well if nothing else it explains a few things

 

[Ivander]

Take it from the guy who kept wanting to talk about Euden in Smash despite the whole "gachas are illegal in Europe" thing: our best bet is to hope Nintendo is willing to use the IP again for something non-mobile. Like a console remake or something.

Yeah, I just couldn't find the right words to sum up how incredibly lucky DL fans need to be, considering Nintendo isn't above and below letting some of their IPs just stay in the basement. And going by some of Cygames' comments regarding Nintendo and Dragalia, DL certainly isn't on Nintendo's more favourable side.
And in the case for Smash Bros, you think mainly Japanese exclusive characters like Takamaru have it rough getting picked in later Smash titles, but try selling people on a character where you truly can't play their game anymore, and had issues in certain countries because of it's genre(and the genre's nature) being taken more seriously.

 

[osby]

These Queens Blade ads lol is this game Good what gatcha reps should Smash entertain?

On top of games people already talked about, I'd also add Arknights.

It has amazing gameplay and writing, is pretty popular, and the developers are already branching into console games that shares a universe.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

So, Splatoon.

People seem confident that it's set to get a newcomer, but outside of an Octoling echo fighter, people don't seem confident on any character in particular.

I'd like to bring up DJ Octavio. He's a major reoccurring character in the franchise and

Spoiler: Splatoon 3

he's a boss in every game and has transitioned from major enemy to ally.

I feel like he's a character that the Splatoon franchise really values and has a more obvious moveset than Squid Sisters, Off the Hook or Deep Cut have.

I'm honestly flabbergasted as to why he isn't a more popular request. He's a great villain and I think he's Nintendo's biggest villain that's feasible and isn't in yet (barring Waluigi and maybe King Boo).

 

[TCT~Phantom]

So, Splatoon.

People seem confident that it's set to get a newcomer, but outside of an Octoling echo fighter, people don't seem confident on any character in particular.

I'd like to bring up DJ Octavio. He's a major reoccurring character in the franchise and

Spoiler: Splatoon 3

he's a boss in every game and has transitioned from major enemy to ally.

I feel like he's a character that the Splatoon franchise really values and has a more obvious moveset than Squid Sisters, Off the Hook or Deep Cut have.

I'm honestly flabbergasted as to why he isn't a more popular request. He's a great villain and I think he's Nintendo's biggest villain that's feasible and isn't in yet (barring Waluigi and maybe King Boo).

To be honest, it’s also just easy to do Octolings as any form of newcomer. If you go unique, they could easily use weapons from Splatoon 2 and 3. Semi Clone like wolf or Isabelle? That’s feasible? Echo? Also feasible. I would genuinely be shocked if they weren’t in the next Smash. Not knocking the DJ, but I think Octolings are a huge hurdle to overcome. Being real tho, spaltoon is growing so much if it got two unique newcomers I wouldn’t be shocked.

 

[Ivander]

So, Splatoon.

People seem confident that it's set to get a newcomer, but outside of an Octoling echo fighter, people don't seem confident on any character in particular.

I'd like to bring up DJ Octavio. He's a major reoccurring character in the franchise and

Spoiler: Splatoon 3

he's a boss in every game and has transitioned from major enemy to ally.

I feel like he's a character that the Splatoon franchise really values and has a more obvious moveset than Squid Sisters, Off the Hook or Deep Cut have.

I'm honestly flabbergasted as to why he isn't a more popular request. He's a great villain and I think he's Nintendo's biggest villain that's feasible and isn't in yet (barring Waluigi and maybe King Boo).

I mean, it's not that hard to see why any popularity he has is overshadowed when his "competition" are the main characters and 3 groups of idols.

That aside, I haven't finished Splatoon 2 yet, but does he still use a Mech like he does in Splatoon 1? I'm just asking on whether or not he would be capable on his own or if most likely he would be a Mech Fighter. And if the latter, that sounds like he would face competition from Dr. Eggman since Eggman would easily fit as a Mech Fighter.

And that reminds me that there aren't really any Mech Fighters in Smash aside from Bowser Jr. Considering Sakurai's decent obsession with them, you'd think there would be more of them in Smash, let alone a character with a giant robot mech for a Final Smash.

 

[Diddy Kong]

So, Splatoon.

People seem confident that it's set to get a newcomer, but outside of an Octoling echo fighter, people don't seem confident on any character in particular.

I'd like to bring up DJ Octavio. He's a major reoccurring character in the franchise and

Spoiler: Splatoon 3

he's a boss in every game and has transitioned from major enemy to ally.

I feel like he's a character that the Splatoon franchise really values and has a more obvious moveset than Squid Sisters, Off the Hook or Deep Cut have.

I'm honestly flabbergasted as to why he isn't a more popular request. He's a great villain and I think he's Nintendo's biggest villain that's feasible and isn't in yet (barring Waluigi and maybe King Boo).

At this point

Splatoon probably deserves a Echo / Isabelle or semi clone newcomer with Octoling, and DJ Octavio as a unique one.

 

[fogbadge]

I feel like he's a character that the Splatoon franchise really values and has a more obvious moveset than Squid Sisters, Off the Hook or Deep Cut have.

well that's not quite true, each member of the bands are known to favour specific kinds of weapons, callie rollers, marie chargers etc so you could make a move set based around those

 

[Opossum]

Honestly I don't even think the Octolings would be echoes or semi-clones. Inkling's moveset in Smash is so very heavily based on the first Splatoon specifically, and that's a bit weird for the Octolings considering they weren't playable yet. Meanwhile they're the cephalo-poster children for Splatoon 2, essentially. So whereas the Inkling mains the Splattershot in Smash, the Octoling would probably main the Dualies, making them a very evasive and mobile dual gun wielder.

 

[osby]

Honestly I don't even think the Octolings would be echoes or semi-clones. Inkling's moveset in Smash is so very heavily based on the first Splatoon specifically, and that's a bit weird for the Octolings considering they weren't playable yet. Meanwhile they're the cephalo-poster children for Splatoon 2, essentially. So whereas the Inkling mains the Splattershot in Smash, the Octoling would probably main the Dualies, making them a very evasive and mobile dual gun wielder.

I see them working similarly to Isabelle, personally: a lot like the fighter they are based on at the surface but with significantly different tools.

Octolings have a lot more to work with due to their action-oriented games so they'd be more unique but I have a hard time seeing them not at least using Inklings as a base.

 

[Diddy Kong]

I'm personally hoping they retcon Mario's origins (again) to have him be from New Donk City instead of New York. That way, they can still have Mario be a newcomer for exposition purposes, but not lose video gamey-ness by having him be from the real world. And makes sense for where Foreman Spike, Cranky, and DK could be, since we know they'll show up.

Yes. The baby versions could then be their own characters, belonging to a separate Yoshi's Island canon? Not that the Mario franchise cares much for canon anyways.

Anyways, seen the trailer, it's pretty awesome. They did Bowser right at the very least, Toad too. Mario am still not too sure about. Animations look great, Bowser looks and acts exactly like he should, and I can't wait to bring my son to this movie so I have an excuse to watch this lol

 

[TCT~Phantom]

Smash Community Character Corral Part 2

For this section of the forum, please answer the questions based on your opinion on the depicted character's likelihood. A ranking of 1 would be like "this has almost no chance of actually happening", while a ranking of 10 would be "this is almost guaranteed to show up in the next game". If you...

forms.gle

So we have a nice little bit of data so far for the SCCC round 2 (please vote if you have not!) so far. Some very interesting early trends for the data. I think the main thing I can say is that so far, the overall want score seems to have trended higher for this section than last time.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Smash Community Character Corral Part 2

For this section of the forum, please answer the questions based on your opinion on the depicted character's likelihood. A ranking of 1 would be like "this has almost no chance of actually happening", while a ranking of 10 would be "this is almost guaranteed to show up in the next game". If you...

forms.gle

So we have a nice little bit of data so far for the SCCC round 2 (please vote if you have not!) so far. Some very interesting early trends for the data. I think the main thing I can say is that so far, the overall want score seems to have trended higher for this section than last time.

By how much?

 

[TCT~Phantom]

By how much?

I havent crunched the exact numbers, but with the current trendline it seems quite a few characters could get above a 6.4 in want. IIRC i think six have the potential to rn.

 

[Perkilator]

I just saw this video around the same time I was doing a Sonic rework.

Spoiler: Sonic rework

Intro: Sonic Spin Dashes from the foreground onto the stage and strikes a pose.

Stance/Idle 1: Sonic’s idle pose from Sonic Rush
Idle 2: Sonic strikes an “I’m waiting” pose with an annoyed look
Idle 3: Sonic looks at the camera and wiggles his finger

Notable Palette Swaps:
1. Sonic the Hedgehog (default)
2. Classic Sonic (cyan; cuffs resemble the white Chaos Emerald)
3. Tails (yellow; cuffs resemble the blue Chaos Emerald)
4. Knuckles the Echidna (red; cuffs resemble the green Chaos Emerald)
5. Shadow the Hedgehog (black/red; cuffs resemble the yellow Chaos Emerald)
6. Silver the Hedgehog (gray; cuffs resemble the cyan Chaos Emerald)
7. Jet the Hawk (green; cuffs resemble the red Chaos Emerald)
8. NiGHTS (lavender; cuffs resemble the purple Chaos Emerald)

Walk: Sonic does a casual jog
Dash: Sonic does what he does best, which is run at the speed of sound
Damage: His damage animation from the Classic games
Jump: His jump from the games
Crouch: HIs crouch from the games

Normal Attacks
Jab: P / PP / PPK; Sonic mimics Mario’s 3-hit jab (7%, small knockback), but with a rapid punch in between (1% each hit, small knockback)
Forward+A: Horse Kick; Sonic turns around for a second to kick the opponent (9%, OK knockback)
Down+A: Split Kick; Sonic kicks on both sides of himself (6%, small knockback)
Up+A: Skip Kick; Sonic performs a 540 kick with both legs (8%, OK knockback

Aerial Attacks
Air+A: Insta-shield; A single white circle appears around Sonic, making him briefly invincible and knocking away opponents (9%, OK knockback)
Air Forward+A: Sonic Rocket; Sonic performs a diagonally downwards kick in the air (11% with a meteor effect, OK knockback)
Air Back + A: Humming Top; Sonic performs a backwards spin kick (12%, OK knockback)
Air Up+A: Sonic Updraft; Sonic kicks opponents into the air with a somersault kick (11%, OK knockback)
Air Down+A: Stomp; Sonic stomps straight down as he plummets towards it at high speeds (8% with a meteor effect, OK knockback), leaving a small shockwave upon landing (6%, small knockback)

Dash Attack: Super Skid; Sonic slides along the ground at high speeds (9%, OK knockback)
Edge Attack: Sonic Eagle; Sonic gets up and performs an overhead axe kick (11%, OK knockback)
Get-Up Attack: Dizzy Spin; Sonic Spin Dashes back and forth (7%, small knockback)

Smash Attacks
Forward+A: Wind-Up Punch; Sonic winds up and punches the opponent (17%, OK knockback)
Up+A: Short Spin Attack; Sonic jumps up while performing a Spin Dash (16%, OK knockback)
Down+A: Sonic Flare; Sonic uses breakdance moves to hit opponents multiple times while using wind to pull in nearby opponents (21%, medium knockback)

Grab Game
Grab: Sonic grabs the opponent with two hands
Pummel: Grab Kneebutt; Sonic quickly pummels the opponent with his knee (1%)
Forwards+Throw: Close Kick; Sonic nonchalantly kicks the opponent like a soccer ball (7%, small knockback)
Down+Throw: Genesis Drive; Sonic traps his opponents in an Item Box from the Genesis games and slams on them (8%, OK knockback)
Back+Throw: Spin Throw; Sonic quickly backflips multiple times before performing the tomoe nage (11%, OK knockback)
Up+Throw: Hedgehog Needle: SOnic heaves the opponent upwards before stabbing them with his quills (9%, OK knockback)

Special Moves
B : Homing Attack; Sonic curls into a ball and homes in on the nearest opponent.

• Tapping B has Sonic home in quickly (10%, OK knockback)
• Holding B has Sonic charge up before homing in with a powerful strike, albeit with some endlag (20%, medium knockback)

B + Forwards : Light Speed Dash; Sonic speeds forward similar to Fox and Falco (13%, OK knockback)
B + Up : Spring Jump; Sonic uses a spring to jump in the air, and he can move freely afterwards.
B + Down : Spin Dash; Sonic charges himself in a ball to dash towards opponents (14%, OK knockback). He can also use it as the Drop Dash in midair (9%, OK knockback).

Final Smash: Super Sonic; Sonic turns into Super Sonic and has the ability to move around freely, ramming into any opponents in his path (20%, OK knockback)

Gimmick: N/A

Taunts
1: Sonic does a front flip, then crosses arms with his index finger pointing out while making a teasing clicking tune, which forms into one of his signature poses.
2: “Too slow!” Sonic runs in place doing a figure-8 peel dash
1+2: Says "C'mon, step it up!" while performing a windmill, similar to his victory animation in Sonic Advance 3.

Winposes (credit goes here for the first one)
1: Sonic runs past a goal post that shows his face saying “Piece of cake!”
2: Sonic break dances while saying “Let’s do that again some time!”
3: Sonic sprints to the right and back to the left before stopping, giving a thumbs-up and saying “That was almost too easy!”

Applause: Sonic claps for the opponent.
Icon: The Sonic head logo, with Sonic’s eyes
Boxing Ring Title: The Blue Blur
Star K.O.: “NOooooo…!”
Victory Music: What else?
Kirby Hat: Sonic’s quills

 

[Arcanir]

I just saw this video around the same time I was doing a Sonic rework.

These are cute, but there are a large number of moves and inputs that were done that I have to question why they were handled that way. ZSS in general, Falco's Down Special, Villager and Isabelle's slingshots, Ridley's side special, Byleth losing half of the TH weapon moves but keeping others, and so on feel like they were changed just for the sake of it and/or lose flavor and cohesion with their movesets. I understand it's in a rough state and obviously some of these will be adjusted, but in its current state I'm not too impressed.

Also, please stop trying to insert Grima into Robin's moveset. The entire story of Awakening is for Robin to reject that fate for themselves, not give in and make use of his powers. If you want something unique then dip into their Class Change options as that allows for a more flexibility without any character portrayal issues.

 

[Chuderz]

I think it'd stand to reason that one could argue that a lack of this Grima element would be a portrayal issue. Your personal judgment alone isn't what gets to decide the correct portrayal for everyone. If it's a part of the character then that's that. I would welcome a float for Robin however way the devs could justify it and if this grima element is an opening for that then I say go ahead. If they were to do even more with it that's fine too.

I've always thought it'd be cool to put the lightning book and the nosferatu book somewhere else in Robin's moveset just like the fire and elwind ones are for their 3-hit jab and flurry jab respectively. Nosferatu would make a cool pummel gimmick where so long as nosferatu book has mana Robin's pummel will heal themselves a little with each pummel. The lightning book could be used as a follow-up secondary-input for the immediate moment after each of Robin's Smash-attacks similar to how Link's and Young Link's Side-Smash works. Tap the A (jab) button at the correct point in the middle of the attack to do a secondary lightning attack for a guaranteed true-combo follow-up sort of thing. This'd only work I guess if both the charged blade are active and the lightning book had mana because the charged blade Smash-attacks have this sort of "stopping effect" that I think could be utilized to this guaranteed true-combo follow-up end and the lightning book mana for obvious reasons.

Throw in this Grima float thing and maybe a mana-charge Shield-Special and I'd say they're perfect.

 

[PeridotGX]

Smash Community Character Corral Part 2

For this section of the forum, please answer the questions based on your opinion on the depicted character's likelihood. A ranking of 1 would be like "this has almost no chance of actually happening", while a ranking of 10 would be "this is almost guaranteed to show up in the next game". If you...

forms.gle

So we have a nice little bit of data so far for the SCCC round 2 (please vote if you have not!) so far. Some very interesting early trends for the data. I think the main thing I can say is that so far, the overall want score seems to have trended higher for this section than last time.

I'm gonna defend the Pokemon characters I nominated, because even though I don't know why they wouldn't be good enough I like to worry. I'm not necessarily saying that these are likely or should happen, I just think they're interesting discussion pieces.

Meowth and Eevee: They're very iconic Pokemon from Gen 1, who are still important to this day. Eevee has it's evolutions and even has a game where it's on the box, while Meowth is the second most important Pokemon in the anime and has multiple regional variants.
PMD Grovyle: if we were ever to get a representative of the spinoffs, it would be Grovyle. The PMD series is incredibly beloved, both financially and critically, and Grovyle is a center character in what is widely considered the best game. Therefore, Grovyle is essentially a disguise for a greater question: Will the Pokemon spinoffs ever get content?
Melmetal: while initially an odd Pokemon to nominate, it makes more sense the more you think about it. Melmetal is the only Pokemon (aside from it's pre-evolution) that is original to Pokemon Go, one of the biggest parts of series history. It's also a game that, knock on wood, will keep getting content, making it as relevant when Smash 6 launches as it is now (perhaps moreso). Giving it a character just kinda makes sense.
Another Trainer: this one is rather self explanatory, Grovyle and Melmetal were the ones I was worried about.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I think it'd stand to reason that one could argue that a lack of this Grima element would be a portrayal issue. Your personal judgment alone isn't what gets to decide the correct portrayal for everyone. If it's a part of the character then that's that. I would welcome a float for Robin however way the devs could justify it and if this grima element is an opening for that then I say go ahead. If they were to do even more with it that's fine too.

I've always thought it'd be cool to put the lightning book and the nosferatu book somewhere else in Robin's moveset just like the fire and elwind ones are for their 3-hit jab and flurry jab respectively. Nosferatu would make a cool pummel gimmick where so long as nosferatu book has mana Robin's pummel will heal themselves a little with each pummel. The lightning book could be used as a follow-up secondary-input for the immediate moment after each of Robin's Smash-attacks similar to how Link's and Young Link's Side-Smash works. Tap the A (jab) button at the correct point in the middle of the attack to do a secondary lightning attack for a guaranteed true-combo follow-up sort of thing. This'd only work I guess if both the charged blade are active and the lightning book had mana because the charged blade Smash-attacks have this sort of "stopping effect" that I think could be utilized to this guaranteed true-combo follow-up end and the lightning book mana for obvious reasons.

Throw in this Grima float thing and maybe a mana-charge Shield-Special and I'd say they're perfect.

Robin and Grima are comparable to Ryu and Evil Ryu/Kage.

Robin and Ryu are defined by their rejection of evil power. In fact, Ryu using the Satsui no Hado is so out of character that they had to make a whole other character to show it. The evil Robin from the future is literally a Robin that's been possessed by the fell dragon.Ryu willingly using the Satsui no Hado in Smash would be absurd. Robin willingly using Grima's power would be a similar situation.

To use characters people may be more familiar with. It's like if Peach became Shadow Peach or Luigi became Mr. L, or Zelda became Puppet Zelda for a Final Smash.

It's a bad showcase of the character.

The funny thing is that Robin can levitate without Grima. That's his run animation in Fire Emblem Warriors.

 

[Perkilator]

Robin and Grima are comparable to Ryu and Evil Ryu/Kage.

Robin and Ryu are defined by their rejection of evil power. In fact, Ryu using the Satsui no Hado is so out of character that they had to make a whole other character to show it. The evil Robin from the future is literally a Robin that's been possessed by the fell dragon.Ryu willingly using the Satsui no Hado in Smash would be absurd. Robin willingly using Grima's power would be a similar situation.

To use characters people may be more familiar with. It's like if Peach became Shadow Peach or Luigi became Mr. L, or Zelda became Puppet Zelda for a Final Smash.

It's a bad showcase of the character.

The funny thing is that Robin can levitate without Grima. That's his run animation in Fire Emblem Warriors.

This sums up my feelings pretty well. People who try to insert Grima into the moveset never really think about the lore implications of why that wouldn’t work.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Grima is better as a stage anyway.

That absolute size of this lad is stage material.

 

[chocolatejr9]

Grima is better as a stage anyway.

That absolute size of this lad is stage material.

Or if he HAS to be playable, just give him a hood and call him an Echo.