Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[Diddy Kong]

perhaps not but the game industry throws curveballs all the time

Let one of them make a Donkey Kong game while they're at it.

 

[fogbadge]

Let one of them make a Donkey Kong game while they're at it.

weirder things have happened. i remember there was a time people said we'd never see DKC again and look how that turned out

perhaps its a fallacy to think its possible but its no more a fallacy than many of the other things we take as given

 

[SPEN18]

At least the DK brand is publicly recognizable enough that it will probably always get used in some capacity, which is more than we can say for several others...

 

[Chuderz]

A working relationship with Sony is totally possible. They wanted Smash at EVO and probably still do and still will afterward. The ball is on Nintendo's side of the court.

Bamco could make a platform fighter with Shonen Jump IP and they totally should. They don't need to make a video game-focused one and they don't really have the IP to do one by themselves.

If a different company made Smash I'd imagine Capcom would be a contender for that coveted position. How would Smash differ from them doing it? I truly don't really know.

If Ken with completely different moves can be an echo to Ryu then Jin could have easily worked as an echo to Kazuya.

Also Kazuya should have had victory music. It's as extremely a baffling poor decision as Sakurai's insane decision to order the character select screen by when they were developed.

One thing I'd like from another Smash game that seems like a small ask is more costumes. 16 default base game costumes/palette-swaps and then more "epic/legendary" ones from playing the game purchased with Smash coin.

 

[chocolatejr9]

A working relationship with Sony is totally possible. They wanted Smash at EVO and probably still do and still will afterward. The ball is on Nintendo's side of the court.

Where was it said that Sony wanted Smash at EVO? Because no offense, but considering EVO has basically turned into a glorified Playstation ad, I HIGHLY doubt it.

 

[SPEN18]

Sakurai's insane decision to order the character select screen by when they were developed

I also dislike Ultimate's CSS ordering. While it may seem like a good idea at first, in reality it's just...not practical.

If we needed to have a single set order for the CSS, then I'd group characters by franchise like before; maybe ordering the franchises based on when they joined Smash would be kinda okay, except with third parties all together.

Maybe it's kind of overboard and wouldn't ever happen, but one feature I'd like is not just being able to reorder the CSS however we want but also being able to show/hide certain characters.

 

[Guynamednelson]

I also dislike Ultimate's CSS ordering. While it may seem like a good idea at first, in reality it's just...not practical.

How is someone new to the franchise supposed to understand it anyway? They're not gonna know when each and every character was revealed for the first time.

 

[fogbadge]

Bamco could make a platform fighter with Shonen Jump IP and they totally should. They don't need to make a video game-focused one and they don't really have the IP to do one by themselves.

the shonen jump one does sound oddly plausible. Although I’d say NB does have the ip to do their own

 

[Yamat08]

I liked the Smash debut order myself, but I do agree that there should be more options than just "show/hide Echoes".

While talking about the character select screen, here's a thought: maybe they should just let players select their costume AFTER selecting the character instead of the L/R toggle (something they already do with the Miis). Or you could think of it like mandating the optional face icon selection. I think doing it this way would help a LOT with the CSS's awful loading issues in Ultimate, and if people just wanna play with the defaults, I don't think adding one extra button press would be that big of an inconvenience. It'd also work out well if they WERE to allow more than 8 costumes per character.

 

[dream1ng]

perhaps not but the game industry throws curveballs all the time

When your argument can be summed up by the Jim Carrey "so there's a chance" gif, it's not a great argument.

 

[Chuderz]

Where was it said that Sony wanted Smash at EVO? Because no offense, but considering EVO has basically turned into a glorified Playstation ad, I HIGHLY doubt it.

This was posted on EVO's official twitter. An advanced notice that Smash wouldn't be attending EVO BEFORE they even announced the games that would be showing up. The post also reminisces about the history of Smash's attendance and makes an appeal to hopefully including it sometime in the future. On top of all of that it makes note that Nintendo was the party that declined the invitation.

Sony has all the reason to want Smash to attend the event because it brings in the most viewership numbers. There are tons of great reasons for Nintendo to play ball with Sony here for the direct benefit of Smash and future collaboration efforts and before this happened I would have said there was a strong reason for it to happen because of this but Nintendo is extremely pigheaded stupid with their games.

pic.twitter.com/7YEX1ZgG4W

— Evo (@Evo) February 26, 2022

the shonen jump one does sound oddly plausible. Although I’d say NB does have the ip to do their own

It's legitimately my dream Smash Ultimate competitor. It goes without saying that for it to be successful it'd have to be given an equal or greater budget of Smash with all the customary features and AAA gameplay to boot.

I've said before that I find Dragon Ball to be a major problem child with getting it off the ground. Are all Saiyans transforming characters? Does that make Goku better than the other Saiyans considering he has more transformations? Do you include Super material or stick with Z? Are the transformations separate characters instead like some Dragon Ball games? Dragon Ball is definitely the Mario equivalent series for this type of game but just how many characters do you include? If you go the separate character per transformation route utilizing the echo/semiclone design philosophy the amount of Dragon Ball characters would really start to pile up quickly.

I'd personally stick to Z exclusively (I like Super enough and consider a decent enough continuation of Toriyama's work with flaws so no hate) with the one exception of including Beerus and maybe Whis. Keep a static transformation on the character. I don't know if my solution is the best though.

Also transformation are a problem throughout the entire shonen genre so shows like Naruto, One Piece and Yu Yu Hakusho would have these same issues for some of if not most of their respective casts. One Piece isn't even done yet though I think Fifth Gear will be Luffy's final form but it still hasn't been developed upon as his other gears and there's no telling if he'll get some more powers and that's not even including the rest of the Strawhats and Blackbeard's gang.

 

[JOJONumber691]

They did make that JUMP Platform Fighter on DS, so it’s always plausible that if they truly wanted to, they could just casually make a Reboot to that series, potentially with the Panel System staying as well, so who knows.

 

[fogbadge]

When your argument can be summed up by the Jim Carrey "so there's a chance" gif, it's not a great argument.

and when your argument can be summed up by "they're all coming back cause it's smash" thats a terrible argument

It's legitimately my dream Smash Ultimate competitor. It goes without saying that for it to be successful it'd have to be given an equal or greater budget of Smash with all the customary features and AAA gameplay to boot.

I've said before that I find Dragon Ball to be a major problem child with getting it off the ground. Are all Saiyans transforming characters? Does that make Goku better than the other Saiyans considering he has more transformations? Do you include Super material or stick with Z? Are the transformations separate characters instead like some Dragon Ball games? Dragon Ball is definitely the Mario equivalent series for this type of game but just how many characters do you include? If you go the separate character per transformation route utilizing the echo/semiclone design philosophy the amount of Dragon Ball characters would really start to pile up quickly.

I'd personally stick to Z exclusively (I like Super enough and consider a decent enough continuation of Toriyama's work with flaws so no hate) with the one exception of including Beerus and maybe Whis. Keep a static transformation on the character. I don't know if my solution is the best though.

Also transformation are a problem throughout the entire shonen genre so shows like Naruto, One Piece and Yu Yu Hakusho would have these same issues for some of if not most of their respective casts. One Piece isn't even done yet though I think Fifth Gear will be Luffy's final form but it still hasn't been developed upon as his other gears and there's no telling if he'll get some more powers and that's not even including the rest of the Strawhats and Blackbeard's gang.

i have no idea what any of that means

 

[Chuderz]

i have no idea what any of that means

It's a post occupying the intersection that falls between hypothetical postulating and baseless speculation.

 

[fogbadge]

It's a post occupying the intersection that falls between hypothetical postulating and baseless speculation.

i meant the anime stuff

 

[Gengar84]

i meant the anime stuff

You’ve got to at least know about Goku and his Super Saiyan transformation. I assumed even people that didn’t watch anime knew about DBZ’s transformations thanks to all the memes. Sonic the Hedgehog’s Super Sonic form was directly inspired from DBZ’s Super Saiyan forms, even getting the spiky, glowing yellow hair.

 

[fogbadge]

You’ve got to at least know about Goku and his Super Saiyan transformation. I assumed even people that didn’t watch anime knew about DBZ’s transformations thanks to all the memes. Sonic the Hedgehog’s Super Sonic form was directly inspired from DBZ’s Super Saiyan forms, even getting the spiky, glowing yellow hair.

i hate memes

 

[Gengar84]

i hate memes

I’m not huge on most of them either but you still see them a lot. You can’t really avoid them if you post on forums like these. Once in a while you come across a funny one.

 

[fogbadge]

I’m not huge on most of them either but you still see them a lot. You can’t really avoid them if you post on forums like these. Once in a while you come across a funny one.

yes but my mind doesn’t retain them

 

[JOJONumber691]

Honestly I kinda want to see an Arena Fighter that crosses over JoJo’s Bizarre Adventure, Castlevania, and Demon Slayer. I’m not talking the stereotypical crossover shenanigans, I’m talking more so its concepts carried over and something original done with a couple of characters here and there showing up and interacting. I think it could be neat while we’re on the topic of anime.

 

[Gengar84]

yes but my mind doesn’t retain them

Alright, to simply things a lot, pretty much every character in Dragon Ball Z would be a transform character since they have a powered up form equivalent to Super Sonic. A lot of the characters have multiple stages of power ups but the game would probably ignore that for simplicity’s sake. If you wanted to avoid an abundance of transform characters and simplify things further, you could always go the Super Sonic route and make those transformations final smashes instead.

 

[fogbadge]

Alright, to simply things a lot, pretty much every character in Dragon Ball Z would be a transform character since they have a powered up form equivalent to Super Sonic. A lot of the characters have multiple stages of power ups but the game would probably ignore that for simplicity’s sake. If you wanted to avoid an abundance of transform characters and simplify things further, you could always go the Super Sonic route and make those transformations final smashes instead.

i see

no wonder I can’t get into anime

 

[Gengar84]

i see

no wonder I can’t get into anime

Dragon Ball is kind of an extreme case. It was one of the earlier action anime of the modern generation so they went a bit crazy with it. There are a ton of different shows of all different types so I’m sure you’d find something out there that suited your tastes if you give it a shot. I’ve been watching anime since around 2000 and there’s a lot of great stuff but also a ton of shows that aren’t my thing.

 

[Stratos]

The Super Smash Bros. series accepts only video game characters, I do not think that 4th party characters will ever make their appearance in the series.

 

[Gengar84]

The Super Smash Bros. series accepts only video game characters, I do not think that 4th party characters will ever make their appearance in the series.

We were talking about other potential platform fighters, not adding anime characters into Smash. I don’t really expect anime characters in Smash either but I wouldn’t rule it out completely. Sakurai has changed his stance on characters multiple times throughout the series already so you can never be sure.

 

[Stratos]

We were talking about other potential platform fighters, not adding anime characters into Smash. I don’t really expect anime characters in Smash either but I wouldn’t rule it out completely. Sakurai has changed his stance on characters multiple times throughout the series already so you can never be sure.

You're right.

 

[Gengar84]

I never personally understood why Goku in Smash is such a controversial topic when we’ve had plenty of non video game guest characters in other fighting games already like Darth Vader in Soul Calibur and Predator in Mortal Kombat. Mario Kart and Mario Maker even had real world guest appearances in the BMW and Baby Metal which seems even stranger to me.

 

[fogbadge]

Dragon Ball is kind of an extreme case. It was one of the earlier action anime of the modern generation so they went a bit crazy with it. There are a ton of different shows of all different types so I’m sure you’d find something out there that suited your tastes if you give it a shot. I’ve been watching anime since around 2000 and there’s a lot of great stuff but also a ton of shows that aren’t my thing.

ill stick to waiting for doctor who to swing back around to being good again if its all the same to you

 

[Gengar84]

ill stick to waiting for doctor who to swing back around to being good again if its all the same to you

Hey, whatever works for you man. Everybody has their own taste. If it were me, I would at least check out an episode of some of the most popular shows that fit your tastes before writing off an entire form of media but if that’s not something you’re interested in, I’m not going to hold it against you.

If you like Dr. Who, I’d at least take a look at Steins Gate. That was a great show that had some similar themes. Steins Gate is actually based on a video game (visual novel) so the main character might actually be eligible for Smash.

 

[Sucumbio]

ill stick to waiting for doctor who to swing back around to being good again if its all the same to you

Russell T Davies is back so I'm hopeful it'll get better. The last 2 seasons were pretty meh imho.

 

[osby]

I never personally understood why Goku in Smash is such a controversial topic when we’ve had plenty of non video game guest characters in other fighting games already like Darth Vader in Soul Calibur and Predator in Mortal Kombat. Mario Kart and Mario Maker even had real world guest appearances in the BMW and Baby Metal which seems even stranger to me.

None of the games you listed are actual crossover titles, though. There's a difference between adding a guest character to a standalone series and then breaking a crossover game's theme with a random character.

 

[Gengar84]

None of the games you listed are actual crossover titles, though. There's a difference between adding a guest character to a standalone series and then breaking a crossover game's theme with a random character.

There have been plenty of examples of guest characters in crossover games as well. Adding the TMNT into Injustice or PacMan into Street Fighter X Tekken. Sophitia and Ryu Hyabusa in Warriors Orochi are more examples of guests in crossovers. Snake already did that in Brawl where Smash was previously just a Nintendo crossover.

 

[fogbadge]

Russell T Davies is back so I'm hopeful it'll get better. The last 2 seasons were pretty meh imho.

I hope so but I’m sure it can get much worse than the last series

also Gengar84 I have seen anime I said I couldn’t get into it

 

[Gengar84]

I hope so but I’m sure it can get much worse than the last series

also Gengar84 I have seen anime I said I couldn’t get into it

Fair enough. It’s possible you were just watching bad shows. I’d say that I don’t care for about 85% of it. There are definitely great shows out there if you care enough to look but I can’t blame you for losing interest because a lot of it is admittedly pretty bad, especially these days where so many shows just copy and paste the exact same formula.

I will say that I find it kind of amusing that you are so against anime but have what looks like a Naruto profile picture. That would be like me saying that I never really liked Pokémon.

 

[HyperSomari64]

JUMP Ultimate Stars or Battle Stadium D.O.N.?

 

[fogbadge]

Fair enough. It’s possible you were just watching bad shows. I’d say that I don’t care for about 85% of it. There are definitely great shows out there if you care enough to look but I can’t blame you for losing interest because a lot of it is admittedly pretty bad, especially these days where so many shows just copy and paste the exact same formula.

I will say that I find it kind of amusing that you are so against anime but have what looks like a Naruto profile picture. That would be like me saying that I never really liked Pokémon.

well it’s Morty from gold/silver

 

[Gengar84]

well it’s Morty from gold/silver

LMAO that’s embarrassing. I probably should have known that being the Gengar guy. Your username probably should have clued me in that it was Morty. In my defense, Morty does look a lot like Naruto in a small thumbnail.

 

[Lionfranky]

I never personally understood why Goku in Smash is such a controversial topic when we’ve had plenty of non video game guest characters in other fighting games already like Darth Vader in Soul Calibur and Predator in Mortal Kombat. Mario Kart and Mario Maker even had real world guest appearances in the BMW and Baby Metal which seems even stranger to me.

There are still tons of video game characters to pull. If Final Fantasy gives Sakurai and Nintendo licensing headache, Shueisha property like Dragonball is far far worse in that regard. Dragonball right is split apart far more than Final Fantasy with foreign right holders. It's amazing that Epic somehow put Naruto in Fortnite, but Smash is different case as it puts way more details than Fortnite.

 

[Perkilator]

God, I wish copyright weren't so complicated and Sakurai could freely stick a franchise in Smash, even with his "video games only" rule in place.

 

[Gengar84]

There are still tons of video game characters to pull. If Final Fantasy gives Sakurai and Nintendo licensing headache, Shueisha property like Dragonball is far far worse in that regard. Dragonball right is split apart far more than Final Fantasy with foreign right holders. It's amazing that Epic somehow put Naruto in Fortnite, but Smash is different case as it puts way more details than Fortnite.

That makes sense. I can see why a character like Goku would be very unlikely for the reasons you described. What I don’t get is why some people are so against the idea that they’d quit Smash if he or any other non game character made it in. I’m fine if none ever do but to me, a cool character is a cool character and I don’t care what media they originated from.